Flash Equipment

[xtracrispy123]

So after our last RFD meet, I've decided to buy myself some flash equipment :)

Can anyone tell me if it's better to buy a shoot-through umbrella, or a reflector umbrella?

Requisite dealextreme links:

$15 reflector
http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.14409

$6 shoot-through
http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.5123

[ldam]

I prefer the shoot through because it should give a slightly softer light than the reflector. Or look for a convertible one and do both.

Unrelated - Hey, you're the guy in MaRs, right? do you have a window seat in your office? I'm facing south towards the parking garage. If you get bored, look for a window with a printout of a bird on it (keeps the pigeons away) on East 14th. That's me. Bring out that telephoto.:D

[x21hx]

i ended up buying both umbrellas at dealextreme when i first started a year ago....but after a few months I wasn't happy with how soft the light was...so I picked up a 43" white shoot thru on ebay for $20...and for me the difference was substantial....if i were to do it again...i'd just jump to the 43" shoot thru....the collapsible with the cover did peak my interest but didn't want to spend the extra $....typically I like to shoot head/shoulder shots and I've used my silver reflective brolly maybe twice?...the 33" white shoot thru @ dealextreme ones just sit there...i'm really happy with the 43"

so my vote is for the white shoot thru brolly but maybe not the 33" on dealextreme....altho keep in mind for group portraits you may want a silver reflective umbrella...

** just know that the bigger and closer the light to your subject, the softer it is..so with a white shoot thru you can get in very tight to the model even though it does eat up more light, but you can work at a closer distance which may mean you don't need that much power to begin with..and keep in mind the color plays a role as well...as silver will give a more contrasty specular look than a white brolly which would prob be softer

[ryan_lau100]

i prefer shoot through... as above poster said its a bit softer.

i have 3 reflective umbrellas but havent used them once yet lol

problem with shoot through is you lose a lot of light... but its ok for one or two faces

[faken]

I'm looking into get the Sb600 as my next purchase. But I've been looking around on DX and FocalPrice.. some of their prices are only $20+. How much better is the SB600 comparable to these lower end quality flashes?

I don't know how often I'd use the flash though..If I had it I would probably use it a lot.

[xtracrispy123]

I prefer the shoot through because it should give a slightly softer light than the reflector. Or look for a convertible one and do both.

Unrelated - Hey, you're the guy in MaRs, right? do you have a window seat in your office? I'm facing south towards the parking garage. If you get bored, look for a window with a printout of a bird on it (keeps the pigeons away) on East 14th. That's me. Bring out that telephoto.:D

MaRS I am, but I face north :P
I sold all my lenses to rebuild, and the longest range I have right now is 55mm... FAIL!

[CSAgent]

i ended up buying both umbrellas at dealextreme when i first started a year ago....but after a few months I wasn't happy with how soft the light was...so I picked up a 43" white shoot thru on ebay for $20...and for me the difference was substantial....if i were to do it again...i'd just jump to the 43" shoot thru....the collapsible with the cover did peak my interest but didn't want to spend the extra $....typically I like to shoot head/shoulder shots and I've used my silver reflective brolly maybe twice?...the 33" white shoot thru @ dealextreme ones just sit there...i'm really happy with the 43"

so my vote is for the white shoot thru brolly but maybe not the 33" on dealextreme....altho keep in mind for group portraits you may want a silver reflective umbrella...

** just know that the bigger and closer the light to your subject, the softer it is..so with a white shoot thru you can get in very tight to the model even though it does eat up more light, but you can work at a closer distance which may mean you don't need that much power to begin with..and keep in mind the color plays a role as well...as silver will give a more contrasty specular look than a white brolly which would prob be softer

Got a link for those eBay ones? There are so many... Thanks!

I've been using the silver and also white reflective ones, they're great for portraits and small group shots - but the light isn't soft at all. I usually have to underexpose a little and then correct it later on in Photoshop.

[Paranoidandroid]

Don't mean to hijack the thread but I'm planning to get a flash unit as well. How does everyone feel about the 270EX? Does the 430EX's performance justify the significantly higher price? Thanks :D

[CSAgent]

Don't mean to hijack the thread but I'm planning to get a flash unit as well. How does everyone feel about the 270EX? Does the 430EX's performance justify the significantly higher price? Thanks :D

Hey dude nice meeting ya last night! Aside from Golden Turtle, have you tried Pho Fuzion? Heard good things about that place...:lol:

270EX is an ok beginner entry level flash, with output from full to 1/64. With that said, it doesn't have the master/slave function that the 430ex and 580ex do. You also get less power output versus the big guns. Don't skimp on the flash dude, I'd go with a 430ex or a 580ex.

With the 580ex, you get much more control over your flash with custom functions, a lower power output and faster recycling time. The 270ex has a on paper 3.9 seconds recycle time... which in real world translates to one or two more seconds.

Get a 580ex mark 1 or 2, and you won't regret it! Trust me! ;)

[sfu_engineer]

I agree. Bigger the umbrella the better! Bigger = softer if you can move it closer to the subject. Also why shoot through can get softer light as you can position it closer to your subject. The bad part about shoot through that people don't always realize is that the back of the umbrella now lights up and causes flare in your camera lens if you're not careful!

The flash is important! Don't cheap out and get some crappy no-name flash that will explode and take your eye out. If you're ONLY interested in manual off camera flash the old Nikon SB25/SB26/SB28/SB80DX work very well as they are relatively cheap, with manual control, and have a PC sync socket to connect with off camera triggers.

Regarding whether or not to get the Canon 270EX vs the 430EX/580EX etc ... you lose substantial amount of light shooting through an umbrella. Also the further away the subject is the more light you lose (ie. when you're shooting groups of people), and if you ever wanted to stop down to a smaller aperture (you'd need more power!). More power is better. I'd go with a 430EX at a minimum. Disregard what I said if you plan on using hard flash only without an umbrella as then all flashes become super powerful.

[ldam]

Got a link for those eBay ones? There are so many... Thanks!


Here's one

http://cgi.ebay.ca/4-White-Translucent-Umbrella-Brolly-46-Arc-NEW_W0QQitemZ360203990034QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_Def aultDomain_0?hash=item53ddd4b412

I've never bought from them before. They're in London, I think. I'm considering buying a backdrop from them.

The umbrellas work out to roughly $10-11 each.


Regarding the flash - one of the important things for me with the 580 is the wheel. I hate pushing the recessed buttons on the 430ex. The pc socket is really handy as well.

[sfu_engineer]

You're right ldam! The buttons on the 430EX are such a pain. Wheel is better on the 580EX but it also costs significantly more and might not be worth it for someone new into flash photography. I use flash quite extensively (and prefer to bring along the 430EX based on its smaller size.

[CSAgent]

Here's one

http://cgi.ebay.ca/4-White-Translucent-Umbrella-Brolly-46-Arc-NEW_W0QQitemZ360203990034QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_Def aultDomain_0?hash=item53ddd4b412

I've never bought from them before. They're in London, I think. I'm considering buying a backdrop from them.

The umbrellas work out to roughly $10-11 each.


Regarding the flash - one of the important things for me with the 580 is the wheel. I hate pushing the recessed buttons on the 430ex. The pc socket is really handy as well.

Hm damn I only really need one... I may have to organize a group buy for this. Thanks ldam!

As for the 580ex being a bit more expensive, keep in mind you can find some used ones on Craigs or RFD for $300-$350. I don't like to double buy, I'd figure if I'm going to get something that I'm going to use quite extensively such as an external flash, I will get the best there is. A solid, good flash will last you for years if you take care of it.

[Lulz]

only yesterday i understood how important flash is especially in portraits.

i mean the difference was night and day.
silly me thinking that i could achieve the same effect by bumping ISO to 3200 =)

having a flash you can get so much more creative.

[faken]

So i have a D60. what's the next best thing to an Sb600? I don't want it to hit my wallet too hard :P. I just bought my 35mm..

[kay188]

So i have a D60. what's the next best thing to an Sb600? I don't want it to hit my wallet too hard :P. I just bought my 35mm..

I would say SB800.

[tiijei]

I would say SB800.

Problem with that one is that its discontinued. Finding a cheap and mint one is difficult and most newish ones are almost or in some instance more expensive than the SB-900. If your lucky you can see a mint one for sale for around $400 but the condition depends on their version of the dictionary (or just the meaning of mint condition). :cheesygri .

[Paranoidandroid]

Hey dude nice meeting ya last night! Aside from Golden Turtle, have you tried Pho Fuzion? Heard good things about that place...:lol:

270EX is an ok beginner entry level flash, with output from full to 1/64. With that said, it doesn't have the master/slave function that the 430ex and 580ex do. You also get less power output versus the big guns. Don't skimp on the flash dude, I'd go with a 430ex or a 580ex.

With the 580ex, you get much more control over your flash with custom functions, a lower power output and faster recycling time. The 270ex has a on paper 3.9 seconds recycle time... which in real world translates to one or two more seconds.

Get a 580ex mark 1 or 2, and you won't regret it! Trust me! ;)
well I'm definitely not in the market for a 580EX :lol: I'm leaning towards a 430EX right now. appreciate your input

nope I haven't tried Pho Fuzion yet, but I'll be sure to check it out

[xtracrispy123]

Well, I bought my SB-600 today at Aden.

Most expensive light bulb I ever purchased :) The guy working there was so... old and talkative. Friendliness is one thing but I stood there for a solid 20 minutes holding my visa waiting for him to punch it in :P

As for cheaper alternative flashes: I hear with nikons, it's best to stick with a nikon flash as they communicate more parameters with the body.. like current lens focal length, exposure, etc etc.

Looking forward to trying some strobist!

[tiijei]

As for cheaper alternative flashes: I hear with nikons, it's best to stick with a nikon flash as they communicate more parameters with the body.. like current lens focal length, exposure, etc etc.


Yeah the Nikon cls (creative lighting system or something like that). The only other flash other than the nikon flashes (Sb-600, sb-800 and sb-900) which work with nikon cls is the nissin di866 (well they said it works, I can't say 100% since I haven't tried it personally).

[xtracrispy123]

Hey guys, I have a question about the light modifiers.

What's the main difference between a softbox and a shoot-through umbrella?

If both have the objective of diffusing light, would the result look similar?

I ask because there are some compact soft boxes which look easier to carry around than the umbrellas.

[sfu_engineer]

Hey guys, I have a question about the light modifiers.

What's the main difference between a softbox and a shoot-through umbrella?

If both have the objective of diffusing light, would the result look similar?

I ask because there are some compact soft boxes which look easier to carry around than the umbrellas.

Softboxes have softer light and since the back is covered they will not flare into the lens. The light from the softbox is softer because a larger portion of the lit surface is closer to your subject compared to the convex-shaped nature of the shoot-through umbrella.

CLS for Nikon flashes is definitely nice and MUCH better than the Canon wireless system. But if you're doing setup portraits with off camera flash any old flash with manual powered settings and preferably a PC-sync would be fine. I picked up used Nikon SB25/26 for $50-80 from BH before which work great.

[N_Raged]

Hey guys, I have a question about the light modifiers.

What's the main difference between a softbox and a shoot-through umbrella?

If both have the objective of diffusing light, would the result look similar?
1. The shape of the light. For example you'll see catchlights (reflections) in your model's eyes: A big white rectangle vs a veiny jagged circle. Softboxes are better at this sort of thing.

2. Softboxes are designed to direct all light forward. While shoot-through umbrellas spill light everywhere to the side and backwards.

3. Most softboxes are made to be mounted on studio strobes. You can get modding yourself a speedlight/flash mount or there might be existing mounts out there.