HPV Vaccine

[Raggie]

I'm just wondering if any parent here opted out of the HPV Vaccine shot for their daughter.

I opted out for my daughter. I just don't think there has been enough history to support this vaccine. The thought of testing this new drug on our children makes me uneasy. Not only that, it pushes us to assume our 13/14 year olds are already promiscuous and gives our permission for them to have sex!

Now we're hearing about the UK girl who died may have been caused by this vaccine.

Its just too unproven, seems quite dangerous, and personally, I think is unnecessary.

[Oni-kun]

I don't have a daughter nor am I female. However I read in the Toronto Star this morning that it has been ruled out that the cause of death for that girl has been the vaccine.

I have an opinion that it's a bit of a cash grab my those big pharma companies. I could be wrong but doesn't the government pay for this vaccine?

Also correct me if I'm wrong but is it possible that this vaccine uses the same vaccine technology as vaccines that we've had in the past but instead uses a different virus?

Also I don't think it promotes promiscuity. Just because you haven't doesn't mean you have to make use of it. It's important to educate young people about other types of health related risks to sexual activity. There are too many people my age (Mid twenties) who seem to have no clue on what you can and can't catch. Also it's just for protection, I mean just because you get the flu shot doesn't mean it makes it okay to rub someone elses snot in your face right? Okay not such a great analogy.

Anyway, although I have no parenting experience. Perhaps it might be a good idea to discuss this with your daughter. Talk to her about what HPV is. Evaluate the risks with her and asks her what she thinks you should do. Ultimately at her age, its your decision, but some input on her end wouldn't help. It's a good educational opportunity.

[CSK'sMom]

This is far from a "new drug". As a mother and a survivor of cervical cancer I am absolutely astounded that the GTA's vaccination rate is so low. The lowest in the country! Our daughter was done. I don't want her to go through what I did. As for promoting sexual activity or promiscuity that is hogwash to put it bluntly. Those lessons come from home with ongoing discussion, not a needle in the arm. :rolleyes: The whole premise for doing girls in grade 8 is to get them vaccinated before they are ever exposed to HPV. IIRC, the stats say that by grade 10 about 40% will have had some kind of sexual activity and been exposed. If they aren't vaccinated before becoming sexually active they can't be protected. Not only did the vaccine not kill the girl in the UK, it wasn't even the vaccine that is used here in Canada. It was Cerverix (sp?) and we use Gardisil.

My advice, talk with a cervical cancer survivor and then make the call. If you're comfortable knowing that statistically your daughter will be exposed to HPV and statistically could get cervical cancer and exactly what that entails then go ahead and decline. But please keep in mind that cervical cancer kills upwards of 30% of those diagnosed. Personally, given my experience and what I know of this vaccine I couldn't forgive myself if my daughter was diagnosed with cervical cancer and ended up with a full hysterectomy at an early age or even died.

Oni-kun, the gov't only pays for grade 8 girls to be vaccinated. If parents want their older teen girls done then they pay out of pocket for it (about $300 IIRC). Same for 20-somethings. e were willing to pay out of pocket for this vaccine for our daughter before the gov't vaccination program was implemented.

[Raggie]

First, I realize it was not the same drug as Gardasil, however, I identify it as one and the same.

In regards to Gardasil, there are too many noted possible side effects to allow my daughter to take this drug. It has only been part of the school system for a couple of years. To me, that represents a new drug being administered to our children. To be honest, I'm not sure of the statistics to prove that this drug does diminish the chances of cervical cancer. It is a foreign drug to me and one that I don't feel comfortable for my daughter.

CSK, I'm sorry to hear about your bought with cancer, but happy to hear that you are well! I come from a family of cancer survivors as well!

[ghostryder]

gives our permission for them to have sex!

YES. Just like reminding teenagers to wear their seat belts is giving permission for young drivers to speed and drive recklessly.

Its just too unproven, seems quite dangerous, and personally, I think is unnecessary.

And you're basing this on what? the Jenny Mcarthy research center's clinical trials?


Maybe you could imagine what it would be like to have this conversation when your daughter gets older:


"Mom, dad, I have cervical cancer and you'll never have any grandchildren"

[CSK'sMom]

You do realize it was around before the province implemented the vaccination program right? Did you consent to the Hep vaccinations or not? Afterall, by your reasoning it's sexually transmitted so it shouldn't be done as it promotes sexual activity. Read up in the side effects and their probabilities. Injection site soreness is the most common and that's due to it not being a live or dead virus but virus molecules...

[Raggie]

YES. Just like reminding teenagers to wear their seat belts is giving permission for young drivers to speed and drive recklessly.



And you're basing this on what? the Jenny Mcarthy research center's clinical trials?


Maybe you could imagine what it would be like to have this conversation when your daughter gets older:


"Mom, dad, I have cervical cancer and you'll never have any grandchildren"

Get a life!

[Raggie]

Thanks for the feedback, I've just been educated a bit more on this vaccine.

I'd like to hear other parents thoughts, as well as from those parents who have chosen not to give this vaccine to their children.

[Oni-kun]

It sounds like you are just looking for other parents who have made the same decision as you to re-affirm and re-assure yourself that you made the right decision. It seems your mind is set in stone about it. Are you just looking for more people to agree with you or you actually want more information? I don't mean to sound offense, I apologize if that sounded harsh.

Also as for :

First, I realize it was not the same drug as Gardasil, however, I identify it as one and the same.

In regards to Gardasil, there are too many noted possible side effects to allow my daughter to take this drug. It has only been part of the school system for a couple of years. To me, that represents a new drug being administered to our children. To be honest, I'm not sure of the statistics to prove that this drug does diminish the chances of cervical cancer. It is a foreign drug to me and one that I don't feel comfortable for my daughter....

I don't understand why you'd identify them as the same. That's like saying Tylenol and Advil are the same because they are both pain killers/for fever. But they are chemically VERY different products.

Although wikipedia isn't the best source of information. The page for Gardisil states that it's been in development since the 1980's and has been in double blinded clinical trials and proven to be effective.

Also it doesn't even contain some of the nasty things that some other vaccines that we've all had contain. It doesn't have I quote "It does not contain mercury, thiomersal or live virus or dead virus, only virus-like particles, which cannot reproduce in the human body."

It's also been deemed safe by the FDC and CDC. They are experts that know WAY more about these type of things then either of us.

As for side effects. A few weeks ago I had to get a HepB Vaccination booster shot, I read the package and there were all sorts of 'possible' nasty side effects but they occur in like 1 in <huge number> of people.

I think the MOST important thing though is not whether or not YOU feel comfortable about it. What is your daughter comfortable with? Have you discussed this with your daughter? Really it's her body and if it concerns her health she should know about it and her options. I know at the age of 12/13 I was capable of understanding something like this.

[jefguth]

I would definitely have my child vaccinated! Like it or not HPV infection is present in more than half of all adults, it has nothing to do with promiscuity, its just a fact that many of us carry the virus even if you don't develop genital warts. If it wasn't so common Pap smears wouldn't be such a routine part of preventative medicine.

[shoppingmama]

We have made the educated decision not to vaccinate for HPV. We are confident in our decision and have the support of our GP and a family member who is very prominent in the medical community. These decisions are never easy and everyone is entitled to their opinion.

[JJ23]

It sounds like you are just looking for other parents who have made the same decision as you to re-affirm and re-assure yourself that you made the right decision. It seems your mind is set in stone about it. Are you just looking for more people to agree with you or you actually want more information? I don't mean to sound offense, I apologize if that sounded harsh.

Some objective links fwiw:

http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/news/fullstory_86495.html

http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/news/fullstory_88300.html

All the best in your decision.

[D-Roc]

We will be doing this for our daughter when the time comes.

[Raggie]

It sounds like you are just looking for other parents who have made the same decision as you to re-affirm and re-assure yourself that you made the right decision. It seems your mind is set in stone about it. Are you just looking for more people to agree with you or you actually want more information? I don't mean to sound offense, I apologize if that sounded harsh.

Also as for :



I don't understand why you'd identify them as the same. That's like saying Tylenol and Advil are the same because they are both pain killers/for fever. But they are chemically VERY different products.

Although wikipedia isn't the best source of information. The page for Gardisil states that it's been in development since the 1980's and has been in double blinded clinical trials and proven to be effective.

Also it doesn't even contain some of the nasty things that some other vaccines that we've all had contain. It doesn't have I quote "It does not contain mercury, thiomersal or live virus or dead virus, only virus-like particles, which cannot reproduce in the human body."

It's also been deemed safe by the FDC and CDC. They are experts that know WAY more about these type of things then either of us.

As for side effects. A few weeks ago I had to get a HepB Vaccination booster shot, I read the package and there were all sorts of 'possible' nasty side effects but they occur in like 1 in <huge number> of people.

I think the MOST important thing though is not whether or not YOU feel comfortable about it. What is your daughter comfortable with? Have you discussed this with your daughter? Really it's her body and if it concerns her health she should know about it and her options. I know at the age of 12/13 I was capable of understanding something like this.


It is true I've already made my decision on this vaccine. I'm not hear to dissuade or persuade others about this drug. It is up to them and their own personal opinion, just as this is mine, my daughters and my family's own personal choice. When my daughter is old enough and decides to take this vaccination, she may do so. But right now at 14...mmmm...

Hepb I believe is a proven drug that has been administered for years... I have no problem with that.

I do not need to be affirmation from others to support my decision. Personally, I don't think its a problem to hear about parents opinion on this board about this drug... Like I said, I asked for other parents thoughts.... After all, it is a forum to hear others thoughts, not to persuade or deny their right to their own opinion.

[Raggie]

It sounds like you are just looking for other parents who have made the same decision as you to re-affirm and re-assure yourself that you made the right decision. It seems your mind is set in stone about it. Are you just looking for more people to agree with you or you actually want more information? I don't mean to sound offense, I apologize if that sounded harsh.

Also as for :



I don't understand why you'd identify them as the same. That's like saying Tylenol and Advil are the same because they are both pain killers/for fever. But they are chemically VERY different products.

Although wikipedia isn't the best source of information. The page for Gardisil states that it's been in development since the 1980's and has been in double blinded clinical trials and proven to be effective.

Also it doesn't even contain some of the nasty things that some other vaccines that we've all had contain. It doesn't have I quote "It does not contain mercury, thiomersal or live virus or dead virus, only virus-like particles, which cannot reproduce in the human body."

It's also been deemed safe by the FDC and CDC. They are experts that know WAY more about these type of things then either of us.

As for side effects. A few weeks ago I had to get a HepB Vaccination booster shot, I read the package and there were all sorts of 'possible' nasty side effects but they occur in like 1 in <huge number> of people.

I think the MOST important thing though is not whether or not YOU feel comfortable about it. What is your daughter comfortable with? Have you discussed this with your daughter? Really it's her body and if it concerns her health she should know about it and her options. I know at the age of 12/13 I was capable of understanding something like this.


It is true I've already made my decision on this vaccine. I'm not hear to dissuade or persuade others about this drug. It is up to them and their own personal opinion, just as this is mine, my daughters and my family's own personal choice. When my daughter is old enough and decides to take this vaccination, she may do so. But right now at 14...mmmm...

Hepb I believe is a proven drug that has been administered for years... I have no problem with that.

I do not need to be affirmation from others to support my decision. Personally, I don't think its a problem to hear about others opinion on this board about this drug... Like I said, I asked for all thoughts.... After all, it is a forum to hear others thoughts, not to persuade or deny their right, make them feel uncomfortable to their own decision or try persuade them to change their minds.

[pimom]

Both my daughters will be getting vaccinated when the time comes. I have chosen not to get them the chicken pox vaccine because they will get natural immunity anyway. The risk of serious complications from HPV is just to high, the stakes are too high for them not to get vaccined. If there was a vaccine for breast/colon/skin cancer they would be getting that too.

[JAC]

It is true I've already made my decision on this vaccine. I'm not hear to dissuade or persuade others about this drug. It is up to them and their own personal opinion, just as this is mine, my daughters and my family's own personal choice. When my daughter is old enough and decides to take this vaccination, she may do so. But right now at 14...mmmm...

She's in high school? Now is the time you should be considering it.

[chikarin]

i'm not a doctor but i play one on tv

there is no reason to not get the HPV vaccination especially when the government is offering it for free. the risk of side effects from the vaccine itself is negligible compared to getting HPV. while the vaccine will not immunize you against all types of HPV, it is always best to reduce the chance of getting it.

[jpc82]

She's in high school? Now is the time you should be considering it.

Exactly, these are the years when kids make stupid choice.

[rb]

FYI the UK girl who died had cancer - thats what killed her

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20091001/morton_091001/20091001?hub=Health

[getmail99]

FYI the UK girl who died had cancer - thats what killed her

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20091001/morton_091001/20091001?hub=Health

A person who knows she will die of cancer in the near future still wants to have a HPV vaccine?

I guess if I die after vaccination, the doctor will say that because I had pneumonia at the time I had the vaccine and died of pneumonia.

My son had a fever after vaccine and the doctor said this was normal and insisted to do the second shot. What if my son died, the doctor can say that his fever is caused by pneumonia, not by the vaccine. Nobody can prove that the fever is caused by pneumonia or vaccine!

Preventing Gardasil Vaccine Injuries & Deaths
http://www.nvic.org/NVIC-Vaccine-News/July-2009/Preventing-Gardasil-Vaccine-Injuries-Deaths.aspx

[ji_howa]

Probably didn't know she had the cancer?

As with any vaccine, the side-effects of the vaccine are far less detrimental to health than getting the infection itself.

Organizations like the one you quoted are run by a small but loud minority who believe their children were harmed by vaccines. Not a very scientific or neutral organization.

The HPV vaccine has been throughly tested, and although we cannot anticipate side-effects that may occur in the distant future, it is safe based on physiological/biological principles, and 20 years of clinical data.

The vaccine actually may not save too many lives in Canada where we have good cervical cancer screening programs, but it also prevents two HPV strains that cause genital warts.

Do you want YOUR daughter to have GENITAL WARTS????????


A person who knows she will die of cancer in the near future still wants to have a HPV vaccine?

I guess if I die after vaccination, the doctor will say that because I had pneumonia at the time I had the vaccine and died of pneumonia.

My son had a fever after vaccine and the doctor said this was normal and insisted to do the second shot. What if my son died, the doctor can say that his fever is caused by pneumonia, not by the vaccine. Nobody can prove that the fever is caused by pneumonia or vaccine!

Preventing Gardasil Vaccine Injuries & Deaths
http://www.nvic.org/NVIC-Vaccine-News/July-2009/Preventing-Gardasil-Vaccine-Injuries-Deaths.aspx

[CharlieSheen911]

This is far from a "new drug". As a mother and a survivor of cervical cancer I am absolutely astounded that the GTA's vaccination rate is so low. The lowest in the country! Our daughter was done. I don't want her to go through what I did. As for promoting sexual activity or promiscuity that is hogwash to put it bluntly. Those lessons come from home with ongoing discussion, not a needle in the arm. :rolleyes: The whole premise for doing girls in grade 8 is to get them vaccinated before they are ever exposed to HPV. IIRC, the stats say that by grade 10 about 40% will have had some kind of sexual activity and been exposed. If they aren't vaccinated before becoming sexually active they can't be protected. Not only did the vaccine not kill the girl in the UK, it wasn't even the vaccine that is used here in Canada. It was Cerverix (sp?) and we use Gardisil.

My advice, talk with a cervical cancer survivor and then make the call. If you're comfortable knowing that statistically your daughter will be exposed to HPV and statistically could get cervical cancer and exactly what that entails then go ahead and decline. But please keep in mind that cervical cancer kills upwards of 30% of those diagnosed. Personally, given my experience and what I know of this vaccine I couldn't forgive myself if my daughter was diagnosed with cervical cancer and ended up with a full hysterectomy at an early age or even died.

Oni-kun, the gov't only pays for grade 8 girls to be vaccinated. If parents want their older teen girls done then they pay out of pocket for it (about $300 IIRC). Same for 20-somethings. e were willing to pay out of pocket for this vaccine for our daughter before the gov't vaccination program was implemented.


OMG give me a freakin break! You can't be serious! Gardisil is a killer and just look at what it is doing. Do your research. Do not give this to any girls. Just for starters getting this vaccine actually quadruples your chances of getting cervical cancer. It ruins your immune system.

Please do some research. Google Dr. Tennpenny. She is an expert on it. There are plenty of other doctors out there who talk about Gardisil. Try this site. It is a Canadian site made by Doctors.

http://vran.org/

Damn it drives me nuts that people actually take this thing. You are ruining yourselves. I am so glad the rate is low of people who take this. There are many people listening to the alternative media thank God. Listen to Alex Jones once in a while.

I found the link to Dr.Tenpenny's site on the Gardisil page. For the love of God do not give this to your kids.
http://drtenpenny.com/gardasil.aspx

[lglg]

OMG give me a freakin break! You can't be serious! Gardisil is a killer and just look at what it is doing. Do your research. Do not give this to any girls. Just for starters getting this vaccine actually quadruples your chances of getting cervical cancer. It ruins your immune system.

Please do some research. Google Dr. Tennpenny. She is an expert on it. There are plenty of other doctors out there who talk about Gardisil. Try this site. It is a Canadian site made by Doctors.

http://vran.org/

Damn it drives me nuts that people actually take this thing. You are ruining yourselves. I am so glad the rate is low of people who take this. There are many people listening to the alternative media thank God. Listen to Alex Jones once in a while.

I found the link to Dr.Tenpenny's site on the Gardisil page. For the love of God do not give this to your kids.
http://drtenpenny.com/gardasil.aspx

Please show the link to where it lists Doctors as the authors on the site! I would be very interested to know since the only names listed on the website are not physicians.

Also Dr. Tenpenny is an osteopath. Osteopathy is a form of complementary medicine, emphasizing a holistic approach and the skilled use of a range of manual and physical treatment interventions in the prevention and treatment of disease. You cannot compare her to your regular family physician.

You are welcome to post your own opinions but people should do their own research and determine their conclusions from there. Information via any form of media should be treated with a grain of salt. Always check the source and their credentials.

[getmail99]

The HPV vaccine has been throughly tested, and although we cannot anticipate side-effects that may occur in the distant future, it is safe based on physiological/biological principles, and 20 years of clinical data.

Drug Makers’ Push Leads to Cancer Vaccines’ Rise
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/20/health/policy/20vaccine.html?pagewanted=1&_r=2&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss

"Merck’s vaccine was studied in clinical trials for five years, and Glaxo’s for nearly six and a half, so it is not clear how long the protection will last. Some data from the clinical trials indicate immune molecules may wane after three to five years. If a 12-year-old is vaccinated, will she still be protected in college, when her risk of infection is higher? Or will a booster vaccine be necessary?

Some experts are concerned about possible side effects that become apparent only after a vaccine has been more widely tested over longer periods."

"In receiving expedited consideration from the Food and Drug Administration, Gardasil took six months from application to approval and was recommended by the C.D.C. weeks later for universal use among girls. Most vaccines take three years to get that sort of endorsement, Dr. Harper said, and then 5 to 10 more for universal acceptance."

The vaccine actually may not save too many lives in Canada where we have good cervical cancer screening programs, but it also prevents two HPV strains that cause genital warts.

Do you want YOUR daughter to have GENITAL WARTS????????

You are telling the truth here, (I am going to point this out, ONLY TWO STRAINS) however, I don't need a vaccine to prevent genital warts. Remember, as the medical professional always say, "benefit outweigh the risk". In this case, the side effects outweigh the benefit.
We even don't know all the side effects.

Researchers Question If HPV Vaccine Is Worth the Risk
http://abcnews.go.com/Health/story?id=5620282&page=1

How about this one, editorial in the New England Journal of Medicine
Human Papillomavirus Vaccination — Reasons for Caution
http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/359/8/861

Found 51 events with Vaccine is HPV4 and Patient Died
http://www.medalerts.org/vaersdb/findfield.php?LOWAGE=&HIGHAGE=&VAX=HPV4&SEX=&VAXCNT=&STATE=&VAXMAN=&VAX_DATE_LOW=&VAX_DATE_HIGH=&VAXLOT=&ONSET_DATE_LOW=&ONSET_DATE_HIGH=&VAXDOSE=&SUB_DATE_LOW=&SUB_DATE_HIGH=&VAXROUTE=&REPORT_DATE_LOW=&REPORT_DATE_HIGH=&VAXSITE=&L_THREAT=&PRIOR_VAX=&ER_VISIT=&CUR_ILL=&HOSPITAL=&HISTORY=&X_STAY=&SYMPTOMS=&RECOVD=&LAB_DATA=&DISABLE=&OTHER_MEDS=&DIED=Yes&V_ADMINBY=&DEATH_DATE_LOW=&DEATH_DATE_HIGH=&V_FUNDBY=&PAGENO=1&action=Find&PERPAGE=10&SORTING=NONE

[JimG]

Found 51 events with Vaccine is HPV4 and Patient Died
http://www.medalerts.org/vaersdb/findfield.php?LOWAGE=&HIGHAGE=&VAX=HPV4&SEX=&VAXCNT=&STATE=&VAXMAN=&VAX_DATE_LOW=&VAX_DATE_HIGH=&VAXLOT=&ONSET_DATE_LOW=&ONSET_DATE_HIGH=&VAXDOSE=&SUB_DATE_LOW=&SUB_DATE_HIGH=&VAXROUTE=&REPORT_DATE_LOW=&REPORT_DATE_HIGH=&VAXSITE=&L_THREAT=&PRIOR_VAX=&ER_VISIT=&CUR_ILL=&HOSPITAL=&HISTORY=&X_STAY=&SYMPTOMS=&RECOVD=&LAB_DATA=&DISABLE=&OTHER_MEDS=&DIED=Yes&V_ADMINBY=&DEATH_DATE_LOW=&DEATH_DATE_HIGH=&V_FUNDBY=&PAGENO=1&action=Find&PERPAGE=10&SORTING=NONE

Found 12000 events with Cervical Cancer and Patient Died
http://www.cancer.org/docroot/CRI/content/CRI_2_4_1X_What_are_the_key_statistics_for_cervica l_cancer_8.asp

[getmail99]

The vaccine actually may not save too many lives in Canada where we have good cervical cancer screening programs, but it also prevents two HPV strains that cause genital warts.


Found 12000 events with Cervical Cancer and Patient Died
http://www.cancer.org/docroot/CRI/content/CRI_2_4_1X_What_are_the_key_statistics_for_cervica l_cancer_8.asp

So ...., see above, vaccine does not help. Your quote has nothing to do with the vaccine.
We don't know how effective is the vaccine. The doctors don't even know a booster is needed because testing is not long enough.

[88]

This a more complex issue and decision than either side is suggesting, though I do agree with those who suggest that parents do their own research before submitting their daughters to this medical treatment.

A fact that I found important (http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/709718) is that the death rate for cervical cancer is almost the same as the rate of serious adverse effects from the vaccine.

In the United States, the death rate from cervical cancer (3 of 100,000 women, according to statistics from the CDC) is currently similar to the rate of reported serious adverse events from Gardasil (3.4 of 100,000 doses distributed), Dr. Harper pointed out. "This is a sobering reality," she said. "Would a parent accept such a rate of serious adverse events if the same cancer prevention can occur with continued Pap screening? Is there any acceptable level of risk of serious adverse events, including death, to prevent genital warts?"

"The rush-to-market approach for this questionable product, with billions spent on promotion, has completely [over-ridden] good judgment, critical analysis, and clear thinking on the part of providers," Dr. Hikel writes. She asserts that this has put millions of women "needlessly at risk."

Take your time with this decision.