Car accident - Should I also claim insurance for hair-line crack on bumper?

[jedi1648]

My wife rear-ended another car with an estimated repair bill of over $2000 for the other car. We decided to report the accident to our insurance companies instead of me paying for it.

There is also a hair line crack on wife's car bumper (2009 Corolla) from that accident, and the estimated cost of replacing the car bumper is about $1000. I can live with this 2 inches hair line crack if my insurance claim will increase my premium.

My question is whehter I should also make the insurance claim, while the other party is making the claim? Would MY insurance claim increase MORE my future insurance premium?

Thank you.

[Anonymouse]

There are generally thresholds in terms of whether it's going to affect your rates a lot; my insurance company uses $5000.

The problem is not the crack, it's the fact that the styrofoam behind it has been compressed and it's not going to absorb energy in a future crash. That said, it's not going to absorb a LOT of energy even when it's working perfectly, so it's your call.

[COSMIC5]

My wife rear-ended another car with an estimated repair bill of over $2000 for the other car. We decided to report the accident to our insurance companies instead of me paying for it.

There is also a hair line crack on wife's car bumper (2009 Corolla) from that accident, and the estimated cost of replacing the car bumper is about $1000. I can live with this 2 inches hair line crack if my insurance claim will increase my premium.

My question is whehter I should also make the insurance claim, while the other party is making the claim? Would MY insurance claim increase MORE my future insurance premium?

Thank you.

Its already reported to your insurance company as an accident and your wife is at fault and her insurance will reflect this. If she has the accident protector, she should not see an increase in premium. If she doesn't and she's a 6 star, she more than likely will go to a 5star rating. It would depend on what your deductible is whether or not its worth claiming your damages as you'll have to pay that portion first. If you have a $1000 ded then there is nothing to be paid..if you have a $500 ded, then you are only able to claim the $500. Regardless, its recorded as an at fault whether you claim your own damages or not.

Have you spoken to your Broker and asked their advice?

[COSMIC5]

There are generally thresholds in terms of whether it's going to affect your rates a lot; my insurance company uses $5000.

The problem is not the crack, it's the fact that the styrofoam behind it has been compressed and it's not going to absorb energy in a future crash. That said, it's not going to absorb a LOT of energy even when it's working perfectly, so it's your call.

What do you mean thresholds and $5000 - can you explain please, thanks.

[Anonymouse]

What do you mean thresholds and $5000 - can you explain please, thanks.

There are thresholds for whether a claim is considered serious enough to have a major impact on the premium. A $60 000 two-car writeoff plus accident benefits is more increase-worthy than a $1000 bumper scrape. The woman who worked for the engineer affinity program I was applying to was very interested in whether the damage in my wife's accident was greater than $5k, so I assume this is a magic number.

[COSMIC5]

There are thresholds for whether a claim is considered serious enough to have a major impact on the premium. A $60 000 two-car writeoff plus accident benefits is more increase-worthy than a $1000 bumper scrape. The woman who worked for the engineer affinity program I was applying to was very interested in whether the damage in my wife's accident was greater than $5k, so I assume this is a magic number.

No, it doesn't matter the amount of the claim, it will be considered an at fault accident regardless. I don't see anywhere in my rate manuals that break up the difference between an at fault $1000 claim or a $10,000 claim...where did you hear this info?

perhaps you are referring to the amount paid out on a bodily injury claim and how this would affect you applying to a new insurer?? I have no idea what you mean...sorry

[rems]

No, it doesn't matter the amount of the claim, it will be considered an at fault accident regardless. I don't see anywhere in my rate manuals that break up the difference between an at fault $1000 claim or a $10,000 claim...where did you hear this info?

perhaps you are referring to the amount paid out on a bodily injury claim and how this would affect you applying to a new insurer?? I have no idea what you mean...sorry

+1

Your premium is dependent on your driving record.
Your driving record is dependent on the number of at-fault accidents and not how much the insurer paid out for your claim.

[DrXenon]

Actually, I have evidence to the contrary: When I applied to Meloche Monnex, the woman asked about our driving history and I told her about my wife's at-fault accident. She gave her quote, and I told her it was greater than what I was presently paying. I thanked her and before I got off the phone, she asked me if the damage was greater than $5k. When I said it wasn't, she gave me a lower quote, which I accepted.

So it's not simply the number of at-fault accidents, although for first-order analysis by simpleminded brokers, I'm sure that's what they use.

[COSMIC5]

+1

Your premium is dependent on your driving record.
Your driving record is dependent on the number of at-fault accidents and not how much the insurer paid out for your claim.


THANK YOU REMS! PPl need to be careful where they get their information and must always talk to their own broker who is lic'd in the industry...

[rems]

Actually, I have evidence to the contrary: When I applied to Meloche Monnex, the woman asked about our driving history and I told her about my wife's at-fault accident. She gave her quote, and I told her it was greater than what I was presently paying. I thanked her and before I got off the phone, she asked me if the damage was greater than $5k. When I said it wasn't, she gave me a lower quote, which I accepted.

So it's not simply the number of at-fault accidents, although for first-order analysis by simpleminded brokers, I'm sure that's what they use.

Is that in their underwriting rules? Rates aren't discretionary so maybe they decided to change their definition of at-fault instead to get your business with the lower rate.

[Anonymouse]

PPl need to be careful where they get their information and must always talk to their own broker who is lic'd in the industry...

My advice would be never to trust a party whom you don't pay out of your own pocket. Brokers work for insurance companies, because that's where the money comes from. It's the same thing when you're shopping for a mortgage. If we relied on what the bank tells us instead of what people are reporting in the excellent mortgage thread on this forum, my wife and I would have paid thousands extra in premiums to the banksters.

DrX's experience echoes my own, which was also with Meloche Monnex.

[COSMIC5]

My advice would be never to trust a party whom you don't pay out of your own pocket. Brokers work for insurance companies, because that's where the money comes from. It's the same thing when you're shopping for a mortgage. If we relied on what the bank tells us instead of what people are reporting in the excellent mortgage thread on this forum, my wife and I would have paid thousands extra in premiums to the banksters.

DrX's experience echoes my own, which was also with Meloche Monnex.

Brokers do not work for insurance companies, agents do.

[COSMIC5]

Actually, I have evidence to the contrary: When I applied to Meloche Monnex, the woman asked about our driving history and I told her about my wife's at-fault accident. She gave her quote, and I told her it was greater than what I was presently paying. I thanked her and before I got off the phone, she asked me if the damage was greater than $5k. When I said it wasn't, she gave me a lower quote, which I accepted.

So it's not simply the number of at-fault accidents, although for first-order analysis by simpleminded brokers, I'm sure that's what they use.

You are wrong my friend, doesn't matter the amount of payout...an at fault is an at fault...perhaps you are referring to a BI claim which may have to be referred to management, but rates are not determined in ONTARIO by the amount of a payout.

[Anonymouse]

an at fault is an at fault

This is manifestly not the case, since the concept of "accident forgiveness" is well known.

[COSMIC5]

This is manifestly not the case, since the concept of "accident forgiveness" is well known.

still considered an at fault...regardless of if you have the accident protector or not. If you do, you won't be charged on your insurance...but still an at fault none the less..and BTW, that only applies to your current insurer....move to another one and you'll be rated accordingly..

[Anonymouse]

With respect, we are talking about whether the at-fault accidents always result in increased premiums. I submit that they do not, because there is the concept of accident forgiveness, and it is not a huge extension to posit that a minor accident will not lead to as great an increase as a major one. There is evidence from two people on this thread that this is the case.

[Anonymouse]

Brokers do not work for insurance companies, agents do.

When I pay my insurance premium, the cheque goes to the insurance company. The insurance company kicks back a portion to the broker. My bet is that different insurance companies pay different kickbacks to brokers, and that the brokers act rationally.

[COSMIC5]

With respect, we are talking about whether the at-fault accidents always result in increased premiums. I submit that they do not, because there is the concept of accident forgiveness, and it is not a huge extension to posit that a minor accident will not lead to as great an increase as a major one. There is evidence from two people on this thread that this is the case.

All I can say is an at fault on an auto plus report is what it is..end result, rates are not determined on the amount of payout...

[DrXenon]

All I can say is an at fault on an auto plus report is what it is..end of story...

Sure, if you're switching companies and the previous insurance company won't confirm the details, but your present insurance company knows exactly what the payout was, and may act accordingly. Of course, I bet most will just hike the rate as much as they can and give the accident as an explanation.

[COSMIC5]

When I pay my insurance premium, the cheque goes to the insurance company. The insurance company kicks back a portion to the broker. My bet is that different insurance companies pay different kickbacks to brokers, and that the brokers act rationally.

Commissions are paid to both brokers and agents, but brokers are not employees of such companies, they are independant and represent the client and shops each market to find the best one for the client whereas an agent works for the company and sells only their product.

[COSMIC5]

Sure, if you're switching companies and the previous insurance company won't confirm the details, but your present insurance company knows exactly what the payout was, and may act accordingly. Of course, I bet most will just hike the rate as much as they can and give the accident as an explanation.

Details of your insurance history are on an auto plus report and are disclosed for anyone who pulls the report. They do not hide payouts, that would be unethical. CGI’s Autoplus is Canada’s largest database of automobile policy and claims information containing 40 million policy records and 30 million claims spanning more than 15 years. With only a driver’s license or policy number, CGI's Autoplus system allows insurers to access detailed and up-to-date personal automobile claims and policy information. Rates are not determined by the payout amount, but by the type of claim one has had.

[rems]

Sure, if you're switching companies and the previous insurance company won't confirm the details, but your present insurance company knows exactly what the payout was, and may act accordingly. Of course, I bet most will just hike the rate as much as they can and give the accident as an explanation.

if you don't have accident forgiveness and you get into an accident, your insurance company will have no choice but to raise your premiums. Their rules state that if you get an at fault accident, your driving record will go down.

There are premiums in place already so the insurance company will just charge whatever those rates are that match your specific situation (driving record, territory, etc...)

[Avatar]

Commissions are paid to both brokers and agents, but brokers are not employees of such companies, they are independant and represent the client and shops each market to find the best one for the client whereas an agent works for the company and sells only their product.

I deeply doubt about that. Broker always recommend the company in favor of how much commissions he/she acquired. At least it happens to mine. I end up ditch him and found one myself. Lot cheaper. Been advising ppl not to be lazy but do a research themselves.

[Insurance-Broker]

Commission amount is the same regardless of the company. Brokers can only shop between insurance companies that they represent, which could be 2, 5,10,15,etc, so you certainly get more options by dealing with an experienced broker and you can shop other insurance companies on your on.

[COSMIC5]

I deeply doubt about that. Broker always recommend the company in favor of how much commissions he/she acquired. At least it happens to mine. I end up ditch him and found one myself. Lot cheaper. Been advising ppl not to be lazy but do a research themselves.

Like ins broker stated...commissions are basically same across the board...why would a broker risk putting a client with a company with higher premium and risk losing the client? The whole idea is retention...

[brian.gerson]

I had a minor (<$3000) at-fault accident 4 years ago in Ontario and my premium didn't go up. Clearly, there are thresholds.

[rems]

I had a minor (<$3000) at-fault accident 4 years ago in Ontario and my premium didn't go up. Clearly, there are thresholds.

did you have accident forgiveness?
what was your rating before the accident?
It could be that you got bumped down from 6 rating to a 5 but an accompanying rate decrease was filed which might have offset the increase?

[brian.gerson]

did you have accident forgiveness?
what was your rating before the accident?
It could be that you got bumped down from 6 rating to a 5 but an accompanying rate decrease was filed which might have offset the increase?

Perfect rating before accident; no tickets no accidents. No accident forgiveness. My experience with Ontario insurance companies is that there is no such thing as a rate decrease; the whole system is a complete failure of the market. I pay much less out here on the Left Coast, although I have a more expensive car now.

[rems]

Perfect rating before accident; no tickets no accidents. No accident forgiveness. My experience with Ontario insurance companies is that there is no such thing as a rate decrease; the whole system is a complete failure of the market. I pay much less out here on the Left Coast, although I have a more expensive car now.

well there have been rate decreases for the past few years now. Only in the past year were companies approved for overall rate increases. And you should be paying less the more experience you have driving.
ie http://www.icbc.com/autoplan/costs/save-money
[/quote]Experienced drivers Have you been on the road for 10 years or more? You could qualify for our experienced driver savings. [/quote]