Is this racial discrimination?

[jjfz3000]

I'd wanted to take an easy elective so my friend who's from France suggested to me that I should take a first-year language course. But I hesitated a bit because even though I’m Chinese, I ‘ve forgotten all about writing Chinese characters (most words have 4-6 “strokes”... eg. writing the letter “t” 3 times in random rectangular formations). However, I can at least understand Chinese and the course might be useful if I wanted to go back to China to do business.

I logged on to our course registration page and checked to the list of Chinese courses. To my surprise however, Chinese courses are segregated into two groups: so-called “heritage” and “non-heritage” courses. If a student’s parents are Chinese then he/she must take the “heritage” version containing harder material (more word to memorize and etc.) and stereotypical Chinese history like Confucius, the agricultural calendar, the 12 zodiac animals, and “Shaolin Martial Arts”. Seriously, if you want to understand Chinese culture it is way better to teach students about the Long March and Cultural Revolution.

But it’s discrimination because only Chinese has heritage/non-heritage courses. All other languages allow natives to take the easiest one.

[dmdsoftware2]

I'd wanted to take an easy elective so my friend who's from France suggested to me that I should take a first-year language course. But I hesitated a bit because even though I’m Chinese, I ‘ve forgotten all about writing Chinese characters (most words have 4-6 “strokes”... eg. writing the letter “t” 3 times in random rectangular formations). However, I can at least understand Chinese and the course might be useful if I wanted to go back to China to do business.

I logged on to our course registration page and checked to the list of Chinese courses. To my surprise however, Chinese courses are segregated into two groups: so-called “heritage” and “non-heritage” courses. If a student’s parents are Chinese then he/she must take the “heritage” version containing harder material (more word to memorize and etc.) and stereotypical Chinese history like Confucius, the agricultural calendar, the 12 zodiac animals, and “Shaolin Martial Arts”. Seriously, if you want to understand Chinese culture it is way better to teach students about the Long March and Cultural Revolution.

But it’s discrimination because only Chinese has heritage/non-heritage courses. All other languages allow natives to take the easiest one.

You don't mention what university, but I know UofT has two introductory courses for EVERY language/cultural course. One for those who know the language or culture and one for those who are completely new to it.

Friend and I wanted to take a 1st year French class, but we couldn't take the same course because I had 10 years of French in elementary and high school (even though I can't speak/understand/write a single word).

[jjfz3000]

You don't mention what university, but I know UofT has two introductory courses for EVERY language/cultural course. One for those who know the language or culture and one for those who are completely new to it.

Friend and I wanted to take a 1st year French class, but we couldn't take the same course because I had 10 years of French in elementary and high school (even though I can't speak/understand/write a single word).

In BC French is mandatory from Grade 4 to Grade 8. Were you in French immersion or just taking mandatory classes?

[dmdsoftware2]

In BC French is mandatory from Grade 4 to Grade 8. Were you in French immersion or just taking mandatory classes?

mandatory

[RussiaRulez]

It is odd, but it's unavoidable.

[Aznsilvrboy]

I'd wanted to take an easy elective so my friend who's from France suggested to me that I should take a first-year language course. But I hesitated a bit because even though I’m Chinese, I ‘ve forgotten all about writing Chinese characters (most words have 4-6 “strokes”... eg. writing the letter “t” 3 times in random rectangular formations). However, I can at least understand Chinese and the course might be useful if I wanted to go back to China to do business.

I logged on to our course registration page and checked to the list of Chinese courses. To my surprise however, Chinese courses are segregated into two groups: so-called “heritage” and “non-heritage” courses. If a student’s parents are Chinese then he/she must take the “heritage” version containing harder material (more word to memorize and etc.) and stereotypical Chinese history like Confucius, the agricultural calendar, the 12 zodiac animals, and “Shaolin Martial Arts”. Seriously, if you want to understand Chinese culture it is way better to teach students about the Long March and Cultural Revolution.

But it’s discrimination because only Chinese has heritage/non-heritage courses. All other languages allow natives to take the easiest one.

lol...are you kidding me? Long March and Cultural Revolution should be taught instead of Confucianism? The Long March and Cultural Revolution are what happened in the last century out of 5000 years of Chinese history, and no way does it have even close to as much influence on Chinese culture than Confucianism, the 12 zodiac animals and the agricultural calendar. FYI, a lot of Chinese holidays are celebrated based on the Chinese aka agricultural calendar and traditionally, Chinese people celebrate their Chinese calendar birthdays.

[dragon_drift]

yeah, it's pretty bs. I'm 3rd generation Chinese Canadian, I don't know how to write, speak properly, or comprehend as well, and I still have to take the hard course. I was gonna take the heritage one, but I'll probably get pwned by the rest of the class.

[fyre]

yeah, it's pretty bs. I'm 3rd generation Chinese Canadian, I don't know how to write, speak properly, or comprehend as well, and I still have to take the hard course. I was gonna take the heritage one, but I'll probably get pwned by the rest of the class.

this is basically what happened to me and I had to drop it, my advice would be to not bother unless you're willing to actually pick up a new language

[Rx-87]

I'd wanted to take an easy elective so my friend who's from France suggested to me that I should take a first-year language course. But I hesitated a bit because even though I’m Chinese, I ‘ve forgotten all about writing Chinese characters (most words have 4-6 “strokes”... eg. writing the letter “t” 3 times in random rectangular formations). However, I can at least understand Chinese and the course might be useful if I wanted to go back to China to do business.

I logged on to our course registration page and checked to the list of Chinese courses. To my surprise however, Chinese courses are segregated into two groups: so-called “heritage” and “non-heritage” courses. If a student’s parents are Chinese then he/she must take the “heritage” version containing harder material (more word to memorize and etc.) and stereotypical Chinese history like Confucius, the agricultural calendar, the 12 zodiac animals, and “Shaolin Martial Arts”. Seriously, if you want to understand Chinese culture it is way better to teach students about the Long March and Cultural Revolution.

But it’s discrimination because only Chinese has heritage/non-heritage courses. All other languages allow natives to take the easiest one.


What are you going on about?? They teach you history for a reason, to show you the progress of how a massive empire moved into modernity revolving around the cultural aspects that we now often associate Chinese people with.

If you want to just learn Mandarin as is, go do it outside of a Uni environment then.

lol...are you kidding me? Long March and Cultural Revolution should be taught instead of Confucianism? The Long March and Cultural Revolution are what happened in the last century out of 5000 years of Chinese history, and no way does it have even close to as much influence on Chinese culture than Confucianism, the 12 zodiac animals and the agricultural calendar. FYI, a lot of Chinese holidays are celebrated based on the Chinese aka agricultural calendar and traditionally, Chinese people celebrate their Chinese calendar birthdays.

Agree, to learn about that stuff its best to learn what led up to these influences. A lot of it is quite confusing but it helps with learning where how the language developed etc.

[ggs]

asking on msg boards is definitely not the best route, why not bring it up with your school's academic board?

[UWO Engineer]

Is this racial discrimination?

No

[teknoluv]

lol...are you kidding me? Long March and Cultural Revolution should be taught instead of Confucianism?
The Cultural Revolution in particularly is of UTMOST importance to understanding GENERATIONS of Chinese PEOPLE who make up the bulk of the population. While Confucianism has helped shaped the social and political landscape of China for some 2,500 years, few ordinary Chinese truly understand what Confucius taught, and his teaching has minimal (or even negligible) influence in the last 60 years, during which China "awakes".

[Genetics2009]

No

+1. It's not racial discrimination at all. I'm 2nd generation Chinese Canadian, and I know exactly how you (OP) feel. But you have to understand that the university is trying its best to make sure that every student deserves a fair evaluation. I know a few people in my year who tried to get into the easy class by faking that they can't speak Chinese, while their English is marginally understandable at best. IMO, those people deserve the blame. They ruined it for all of us. On the other hand though, the fact that you considered taking Chinese opposed to, for instance, Spanish shows that you have advantage than non-Chinese students in the class. The way I see it, if you really have an interest in the language, the history and the culture, then man up and take the more challenging course. If you are looking an easy 4.0, then look elsewhere.

[Aznsilvrboy]

The Cultural Revolution in particularly is of UTMOST importance to understanding GENERATIONS of Chinese PEOPLE who make up the bulk of the population. While Confucianism has helped shaped the social and political landscape of China for some 2,500 years, few ordinary Chinese truly understand what Confucius taught, and his teaching has minimal (or even negligible) influence in the last 60 years, during which China "awakes".

The Cultural Revolution was only 1.5 - 2 generations ago, what "generations"?

[Rishi]

Here at UT for example, there are literally thousands of students who speak fluent Chinese, many of whom speak it as their first language (we have over 1,000 students directly from China and many more who are recent immigrants). This is the not the case for any other language group. It would obviously be unfair to allow people to take an entry-level course in a language they have already mastered, so the options are simply not offering Chinese courses, or discriminating by background.

[Genetics2009]

Here at UT for example, there are literally thousands of students who speak fluent Chinese, many of whom speak it as their first language (we have over 1,000 students directly from China and many more who are recent immigrants). This is the not the case for any other language group. It would obviously be unfair to allow people to take an entry-level course in a language they have already mastered, so the options are simply not offering Chinese courses, or discriminating by background.

I completely agree with you. This is the best the universities can do to accommodate every person's request.

[AcidBomber]

at UT i believe you also need to go for an interview. But you can obviously fake it. however, during the course, the professor has the right to remove you from the class if he/she feels that your prior knowledge is above the classroom material being taught.
Maybe you should go talk to the department at your university.


and no, it's not discrimination.

[freeonboard]

I'd wanted to take an easy elective so my friend who's from France suggested to me that I should take a first-year language course. But I hesitated a bit because even though I’m Chinese, I ‘ve forgotten all about writing Chinese characters (most words have 4-6 “strokes”... eg. writing the letter “t” 3 times in random rectangular formations). However, I can at least understand Chinese and the course might be useful if I wanted to go back to China to do business.

I logged on to our course registration page and checked to the list of Chinese courses. To my surprise however, Chinese courses are segregated into two groups: so-called “heritage” and “non-heritage” courses. If a student’s parents are Chinese then he/she must take the “heritage” version containing harder material (more word to memorize and etc.) and stereotypical Chinese history like Confucius, the agricultural calendar, the 12 zodiac animals, and “Shaolin Martial Arts”. Seriously, if you want to understand Chinese culture it is way better to teach students about the Long March and Cultural Revolution.

But it’s discrimination because only Chinese has heritage/non-heritage courses. All other languages allow natives to take the easiest one.

i would not put up with it. id go back to china.

[teknoluv]

The Cultural Revolution was only 1.5 - 2 generations ago, what "generations"?
That's if you think it (Cultural Revoltiuon) affected only 1 generation at a time. People from pre-teens to retired seniors were heavily involved, and its resonance remains until even today arguably.

[Aznsilvrboy]

That's if you think it (Cultural Revoltiuon) affected only 1 generation at a time. People from pre-teens to retired seniors were heavily involved, and its resonance remains until even today arguably.

Even so, how does the Cultural Revolution out influence that of the Chinese Calendar, the 12 zodiacs AND Confucianism (Not to mention Confucious is one of the the most well known philosophers in this world).

[teknoluv]

Even so, how does the Cultural Revolution out influence that of the Chinese Calendar, the 12 zodiacs AND Confucianism (Not to mention Confucious is one of the the most well known philosophers in this world).
Chinese culture does NOT build on the lunar calendar or Feng Shui. As for Confuciansim, please refer to my earlier post in this thread. I don't want to repeat myself.

[Aznsilvrboy]

Chinese culture does NOT build on the lunar calendar or Feng Shui. As for Confuciansim, please refer to my earlier post in this thread. I don't want to repeat myself.

No one said Chinese culture builds on lunar calendar, and Feng Shui was not once mentioned in this thread until you just brought it up now. You dismissed Confucianism as having minimal influence in the past 60 years, how so? Confucianism is the cornerstone of how a Chinese society functions, and have been so for thousands of years. Some years from now, the "Cultural Revolution" will be nothing more than a significant "event" which happened in the early days of the "People's Republic", much like the "Tiananmen Square incident", it's effects will be rendered minimal as time goes on as Chinese culture will be rebuilt and there will be new historical sites and antiques. All while Confucianism lives on throughout the values of future Chinese societies.

[gman]

I don't know what the course supposed to teach.

If it is about Chinese history, culture revolution is a tiny bit of it.
If it is about Chinese culture, does culture revolution represent Chinese culture? Even the current one?
Does any entry level of Chinese course in the world teach culture revolution?

IMO, there is no point to teach culture revolution if Confucianism was not taught (or at least briefly mentioned) before that because one of the main themes of culture revolution is against Confucianism.

[teknoluv]

Confucianism is the cornerstone of how a Chinese society functions, and have been so for thousands of years.
This is EXACTLY where the myth lies. Confucianism has NEVER been the "cornerstone" of the Chinese social landscape. True, it has played a leading in the "tactics" of the "kings", but MOST Chinese people were either slaves or peasants, and were NOT educated; and the intellectuals (jokingly translated as "staff") only made up a negligible percentage of the population.

It's the ruling elites throughout history who selectively use *SOME* of Confucius' teachings to contain if not suppress the exploited. But the truth is, ordinary folks KNOW NOTHING about Confucius, who simply had no influence on how they interact with each other, except perhaps with their rulers, whom they bowed to reluctantly.

It's sad that the people are totally neglected when "high culture" is discussed. But while lyrical poetry and calligraphy does have their roles, the contribution of peasants and slaves in shaping how the society actually works is often overlooked in DEFINING what Chinese culture is all about.

By the way, 12 zodiacs? Give me a break.

[teknoluv]

I don't know what the course supposed to teach.

If it is about Chinese history, culture revolution is a tiny bit of it.
If it is about Chinese culture, does culture revolution represent Chinese culture? Even the current one?
Does any entry level of Chinese course in the world teach culture revolution?

IMO, there is no point to teach culture revolution if Confucianism was not taught (or at least briefly mentioned) before that because one of the main themes of culture revolution is against Confucianism.
To be honest, I don't know either if the Cultural Revolution should be "taught" in entry level Chinese studies classes. But to totally dwarf it when compared to the the Chinese lunar calendar or the "12 zodiacs" is plain ridiculous.

More importantly, history is NOT just about the past, but how what happened in the past is RELEVANT to here and now. (History 101) So if anybody is interested in knowing more about China or its people (a.k.a. so-called "culture"), he or she should learn more about the Cultural Revolution which DEFINES GENERATIONS of Chinese people you meet today, instead of Confucianism which few even know its "skin and hair".

FYI: The Cultural Revolution has been taught as early as Secondary 3 (Grade 9) Chinese History in Hong Kong since the early 1990s.

[jjfz3000]

To be honest, I don't know either if the Cultural Revolution should be "taught" in entry level Chinese studies classes. But to totally dwarf it when compared to the the Chinese lunar calendar or the "12 zodiacs" is plain ridiculous.

More importantly, history is NOT just about the past, but how what happened in the past is RELEVANT to here and now. (History 101) So if anybody is interested in knowing more about China or its people (a.k.a. so-called "culture"), he or she should learn more about the Cultural Revolution which DEFINES GENERATIONS of Chinese people you meet today, instead of Confucianism which few even know its "skin and hair".

FYI: The Cultural Revolution has been taught as early as Secondary 3 (Grade 9) Chinese History in Hong Kong since the early 1990s.

Yeah. My point is that the curriculum should not be too stereotypical. No one in China is going to say dude I'm a snake and you're a rat then I can't love you.