Premium gas necessary for cars that say they need premium?

[loybond]

I just bought an 02 Maxima, and apparently, Nissan recommends 91 octane for it. Do you guys think it's really necessary?

The compression ratio is 10.0:1 on this iteration of the VQ35. The latest Maxima (09) has a compression ratio of 11:1, and Nissan recommends premium for that, and that makes a bit more sense to me.

What do you guys think?

[thephenom]

Most modern cars will adjust to regular, but you'll definitely lose fuel efficiency. So you can weight the difference between fuel efficiency vs premium gas.

[kevv]

u could get away with mid grade

[Tomy]

how long u planning to drive the car?
are u performance freak?

if u don't mind the engine knocking n losing a few ponies, get regular gas.

[loybond]

how long u planning to drive the car?
are u performance freak?

if u don't mind the engine knocking n losing a few ponies, get regular gas.

I love performance cars, but this is supposed to be a reliable daily driver. The engine shouldn't knock, that's what those sensors are for, right? I don't want to put undue burden on the engine or knock sensors, just wondering if 10.0:1 warrants premium.

[maniacshopper]

I just bought an 02 Maxima, and apparently, Nissan recommends 91 octane for it. Do you guys think it's really necessary?

The compression ratio is 10.0:1 on this iteration of the VQ35. The latest Maxima (09) has a compression ratio of 11:1, and Nissan recommends premium for that, and that makes a bit more sense to me.

What do you guys think?

you said recommended premium, so you can you regular.
But you'll find there's a cost, that fuel consumption is higher, and loss of power.

Maximas are similar to g35/g37, tweaked for optimal power output, premium I say is required not recommended.

[bembol]

I don't get it, if you have to question spending $0.13+ for Premium, why did you buy it?

[zivan56]

Give it a try and see if there is a difference. It won't do any actual damage or anything...but you will notice less power and worse mileage. Plus it's an older car...so even less of a reason to use premium...

[alamshahid]

My G35 coupe gets about 420-450km on a full tank of regular fuel. With Premium I get about 550-570km. The difference is worth the extra 10 bucks on a full tank of gas.

[jasonkwan86]

Cars with premium fuel typically run better. For example MINI's run on premium fuel in order to get as much mileage as possible. The engine was designed to run on premium as its much more refined. It may be possible to put regular fuel into the car, however the fuel efficiency drops considerably thus resulting in less mileage. So when your at the pumps, you might think your saving money with a lower grade fuel but you would end up spending more time at the pumps in the long run.

For other cars, I am not sure if it will damage the engine or not. Coopers might be ok, but I would not recommend it for a Cooper S.

[m4gician]

You bought a car for several thousand dollars. Stop trying to save dozens of dollars. Put in the gas required, use premium. That should be calculated in your cost of ownership.

[m4gician]

Edit, I'll just repost...wow the mark up of premium vs. Regular is 13.5 cents at some stations! Geeze at these prices thath 15% more...heh.

Still, you should use premium.

[XxXSnake23XxX]

I don't get it, if you have to question spending $0.13+ for Premium, why did you buy it?

this

[Tomy]

I love performance cars, but this is supposed to be a reliable daily driver. The engine shouldn't knock, that's what those sensors are for, right? I don't want to put undue burden on the engine or knock sensors, just wondering if 10.0:1 warrants premium.

jsut get premium gas and call it a day :)
mentally, ur happier :D

[skidz88]

I own this exact car, except mine is 03 but yea same thing. Don't even think about using anything less than 91(I use 94), no matter what anyone on here tells you.

On a hot day in summer you may even notice the car knock on 91, as these motors have a tendency for it. Your car would constantly knock on 87 or even 89 and down the road it would cause you major headaches. The VQ35 should always feel responsive and perky, and if it doesn't the knock sensor has detected pinging and ******** the timing back, you'll know because your car will feel much slower than it should. Use 91 octane and full synthetic oil and enjoy your VQ all the way up to 400,000km+, these motors can easily reach that.

[Pete_Coach]

I love performance cars, but this is supposed to be a reliable daily driver. The engine shouldn't knock, that's what those sensors are for, right? I don't want to put undue burden on the engine or knock sensors, just wondering if 10.0:1 warrants premium.

This is a daily driver that requires premium fuel. Yes, the cars computer system adjusts for the lower octane, it retards the timing to try and prevent knock but in doing so, it becomes less efficient and the power is decreased. Also, you will carbon up internally much faster and that will just increase the power loss and engine knock. The cycle gets worse the longer you use the lesser octane fuel.
It is not just the compression ration that determines the fuel requirement. Cylinder head, intake and exhaust design, piston shape, performance requirements, etc. It is a system that is matched to your transmission and the entire drive train and it's sensors (from the MAF to the O2) expect to "see" certain feedback. Use the premium.

[CaptSmethwick]

What pretty well everybody else here says. Your car's engine has a certain compression ratio that requires a higher octane ratio or else the ECM (or PCM) will start retarding ignition and adversely affect both performance and fuel economy.

Sadly, if you want to use regular gas, buy a car that doesn't require premium fuel - there are plenty of good ones out there.

[Carzzz]

I own this exact car, except mine is 03 but yea same thing. Don't even think about using anything less than 91(I use 94), no matter what anyone on here tells you.

Also have a VQ35DE (10.3:1 compression) on the Quest! Btw, it is require premium too, even though it is a van. The rated hp is 235 hp/240lb/ft on premium, and 230 hp/236lb on regular. I tried various grade. It doesn't knock with 87, 89, or 91! Slightly more milage with 91, but definitely not worth extra $.13/L. The power delivery is just as smooth with either 87 or 91.

I am definitely surprise see a person could get extra 100+km on premium...

[m4gician]

I own this exact car, except mine is 03 but yea same thing. Don't even think about using anything less than 91(I use 94), no matter what anyone on here tells you.

On a hot day in summer you may even notice the car knock on 91, as these motors have a tendency for it. Your car would constantly knock on 87 or even 89 and down the road it would cause you major headaches. The VQ35 should always feel responsive and perky, and if it doesn't the knock sensor has detected pinging and ******** the timing back, you'll know because your car will feel much slower than it should. Use 91 octane and full synthetic oil and enjoy your VQ all the way up to 400,000km+, these motors can easily reach that.

Dont waste your money with 94, unless you've tuned for only that. The performance gains are marginal and for the most part, your fuel economy doesn't change enough to justify 3 or 4 cents more per litre.

[skidz88]

Dont waste your money with 94, unless you've tuned for only that. The performance gains are marginal and for the most part, your fuel economy doesn't change enough to justify 3 or 4 cents more per litre.

I ping sometimes on 91, so that's my common sense reason for using 94 only. I get worse mileage with it but that doesn't bother me nor does the price of gas too much. I also have a lot of mods as well as an aftermarket Greddy engine management system, so I'll be able to fully benefit from higher octane.

[l69norm]

I just bought an 02 Maxima, and apparently, Nissan recommends 91 octane for it. Do you guys think it's really necessary?

The compression ratio is 10.0:1 on this iteration of the VQ35. The latest Maxima (09) has a compression ratio of 11:1, and Nissan recommends premium for that, and that makes a bit more sense to me.

What do you guys think?

You'll have to experiment because it depends both the car and your driving style. The minimum octane that an engine needs at any instant changes depending on load. The engine needs higher octane when it's under high loads and at high temps - like a lot of throttle at low RPM.

A car manufacturer recommends the octane level based on the lowest common denominator and all possible weather combination/conditions.

Since there's people out there that like to lug an engine (low RPM) while they are driving up a steep grades in 35C weather while pulling a trailer, Nissan has to pick an octane level to cover this situation.

If you tend not to lug engines and aren't too demanding in your driving style, you can use a lower octane level. I know a few BMW drivers that routinely uses 87 without ping/detonation issues. It's probably about a 10% horsepower penalty (i.e. about 20 hp if the engine makes 200 hp)

The only cars that truly require higher octane have turbo/supercharged engines.

[loybond]

Thanks, I appreciate the response considering you have the same car. I filled up premium for my first tank, ran fine, averaged 10.3 L/100km, which is okay... noticed that it really likes to drink a lot if you have fun with the throttle. My GTI VR6 doesn't show as much difference between feather touching the throttle and driving with a lead foot.

I put in 10 bucks of regular to see how it'd like it, and so far, I can't notice any difference at all. Doesn't sound, feel or respond any differently. I was wondering something about what you said - you said you can hear it knock, but won't the knock sensors prevent that by retarding timing?


I own this exact car, except mine is 03 but yea same thing. Don't even think about using anything less than 91(I use 94), no matter what anyone on here tells you.

On a hot day in summer you may even notice the car knock on 91, as these motors have a tendency for it. Your car would constantly knock on 87 or even 89 and down the road it would cause you major headaches. The VQ35 should always feel responsive and perky, and if it doesn't the knock sensor has detected pinging and ******** the timing back, you'll know because your car will feel much slower than it should. Use 91 octane and full synthetic oil and enjoy your VQ all the way up to 400,000km+, these motors can easily reach that.

[loybond]

Yeah, I think I saw that the VQ in the Maxima is 10.0:1, and the one in the Altima is 10.3:1, yet has lower HP/torque figures. Weird. I wonder if there are any major differences between your engine and mine?

Also have a VQ35DE (10.3:1 compression) on the Quest! Btw, it is require premium too, even though it is a van. The rated hp is 235 hp/240lb/ft on premium, and 230 hp/236lb on regular. I tried various grade. It doesn't knock with 87, 89, or 91! Slightly more milage with 91, but definitely not worth extra $.13/L. The power delivery is just as smooth with either 87 or 91.

I am definitely surprise see a person could get extra 100+km on premium...

Which car do you have?

I ping sometimes on 91, so that's my common sense reason for using 94 only. I get worse mileage with it but that doesn't bother me nor does the price of gas too much. I also have a lot of mods as well as an aftermarket Greddy engine management system, so I'll be able to fully benefit from higher octane.

I've just never had to use premium before, and this Maxima seemed like the best value at 7 grand tax in (120k on it). Drives like brand new, really surprised actually. The difference on my first tank was like $7.

[skidz88]

Thanks, I appreciate the response considering you have the same car. I filled up premium for my first tank, ran fine, averaged 10.3 L/100km, which is okay... noticed that it really likes to drink a lot if you have fun with the throttle. My GTI VR6 doesn't show as much difference between feather touching the throttle and driving with a lead foot.

I put in 10 bucks of regular to see how it'd like it, and so far, I can't notice any difference at all. Doesn't sound, feel or respond any differently. I was wondering something about what you said - you said you can hear it knock, but won't the knock sensors prevent that by retarding timing?

On this car, not entirely. Even G35s or 350z knock. You really have to strain hard but I hear it all the time when a Max/G/Z passes by me. These cars are very picky and need the care and attention of someone who knows a thing or two. They are actually excellent on gas, Nissan rates them to be around 13l/100km in the city but I'm getting like 11-12L/100km which is great. If you get throttle happy then they'll suck back a ton of gas, it's not uncommon for me to see after a spirited drive that my trip computer is reading 18L/100km.

It's your money in the end but I say go premium, if you're pinging all the time you will eventually fry your piston rings due to the heat and then you'll be burning oil.

I've just never had to use premium before, and this Maxima seemed like the best value at 7 grand tax in (120k on it). Drives like brand new, really surprised actually. The difference on my first tank was like $7.

You got a great deal. I'm at 144k right now and my car drives better than new. I owe it partly to how strict I am with maintenance. These cars are built to last, and if you care for it right there's no reason why it wouldn't last you another 10 years, and for the price there's nothing else that can really compare.

[loybond]

Thanks for the feedback, I guess I'll stick to premium then. I agree, my avg right now of 10.2 L/100km is pretty good given 3.5 L, the auto, the weight etc.

On this car, not entirely. Even G35s or 350z knock. You really have to strain hard but I hear it all the time when a Max/G/Z passes by me. These cars are very picky and need the care and attention of someone who knows a thing or two. They are actually excellent on gas, Nissan rates them to be around 13l/100km in the city but I'm getting like 11-12L/100km which is great. If you get throttle happy then they'll suck back a ton of gas, it's not uncommon for me to see after a spirited drive that my trip computer is reading 18L/100km.

It's your money in the end but I say go premium, if you're pinging all the time you will eventually fry your piston rings due to the heat and then you'll be burning oil.



You got a great deal. I'm at 144k right now and my car drives better than new. I owe it partly to how strict I am with maintenance. These cars are built to last, and if you care for it right there's no reason why it wouldn't last you another 10 years, and for the price there's nothing else that can really compare.

[z24driver1986]

you bought an expensive you should have been prepared to buy premium gas. It's not much more only couple dollars extra for the fill up.

[belgiangenius]

how long u planning to drive the car?
are u performance freak?

if u don't mind the engine knocking n losing a few ponies, get regular gas.

Most modern car have knock sensors and will compensate by retarding the timing a bit, which costs a small amount of power and efficiency.

[rems]

who knows more about the car you purchased -People on RFD or the people who designed/built it?

[KawaiiTentacleBeast]

who knows more about the car you purchased -People on RFD or the people who designed/built it?

This is going to blow your mind, but the people who designed/built the car also know about people on RFD.

That's why cars have knock sensors and why you can "chip" turbo cars for 50 extra hp. :lol:

[Donomight25]

My buddy is a car freak/mechanic. Runs a shop ect. Put my car on a dyno(?) and the difference in HP between reg and premium was about 4hp. Not alot, but a noticeable difference apparently.

Reg gas? My 90 Accord Coupe EX-R gets 500ish km's on a tank. Premium? Over 600km. I also see a huge decrease in consumption when I am city driving. Worth putting the $$ into the fuel, imo.

Bad side is I heard if you use premium for a long period of time, you could ruin your engine if you went back to regular.

[skidz88]

My buddy is a car freak/mechanic. Runs a shop ect. Put my car on a dyno(?) and the difference in HP between reg and premium was about 4hp. Not alot, but a noticeable difference apparently.

Reg gas? My 90 Accord Coupe EX-R gets 500ish km's on a tank. Premium? Over 600km. I also see a huge decrease in consumption when I am city driving. Worth putting the $$ into the fuel, imo.

Bad side is I heard if you use premium for a long period of time, you could ruin your engine if you went back to regular.


Your car is not a good example to use in this thread. 1990 Accords are designed to run on regular gas. The Maxima is not.

[rupert]

Maybe some of you will find this useful,

I have been keeping track of my fuel consumption from day 1, after 2 years of using PetroCanada 91, I avg about 465km/tank (65L tank).

I switched to Shell V-Power 91 last month, and I am on my 3rd tank, I am avging 530km/tank thus far.

[skidz88]

Maybe some of you will find this useful,

I have been keeping track of my fuel consumption from day 1, after 2 years of using PetroCanada 91, I avg about 465km/tank (65L tank).

I switched to Shell V-Power 91 last month, and I am on my 3rd tank, I am avging 530km/tank thus far.

That is a direct result of Shell not using ethanol in their V-power.

[Carzzz]

Which car do you have?
Nissan Quest 3.5L feeds with regular gas


That is a direct result of Shell not using ethanol in their V-power.

So does Petrol 2cents saving per Litre is not worth it after all?

[mau108]

Nissan Quest 3.5L feeds with regular gas




So does Petrol 2cents saving per Litre is not worth it after all?

yup, thats why I switched to Shell V power last year, am very happy with it!

Switched the RDX over from Sunoco 94 to Shell 91 no power loss and better mpg!

All grades of fuel at sunoco and most other stations have up to 10% ethanol, shell vpower is the only one that does not have any.

To the person that is using 94 in their maxima, what gas station were you pumping 91 in to get the knocking? If its Sunoco try shell vpower 91.

[skidz88]

yup, thats why I switched to Shell V power last year, am very happy with it!

Switched the RDX over from Sunoco 94 to Shell 91 no power loss and better mpg!

All grades of fuel at sunoco and most other stations have up to 10% ethanol, shell vpower is the only one that does not have any.

To the person that is using 94 in their maxima, what gas station were you pumping 91 in to get the knocking? If its Sunoco try shell vpower 91.

You mean me. I exclusively used Shell V-power in my car up until around a year ago, that's when I switched to Sunoco 94. I have advanced my car's base ignition timing and that's what I attribute the occasional knocking to when using Shell. Yea I lost some mileage when I switched over to 94 but oh well. Recently I have added even more timing and afr adjustments so my car is optimized to run on 94 now.

[Billa-786]

I've tried all 3 grades of gas on my maxima. Seems the best combo of performance/mileage is from midgrade. Wonder if this is because prior owner kept using midgradetheir entire life.

[macnut]

Seems the best combo of performance/mileage is from midgrade.

Not surprising.

What people forget is that the posted octane level is meant to be the MINIMUM octane that will be dispensed from that pump.

The better gas stations could be safely in compliance, and mid-grade might actually be around 90 rather than 89 octane.

May not be applicable so much to the smaller cut-rate stations.

So, if the car manufacturer specifies premium, they may be playing it safe, and not allowing for the fact that mid-grade is even available.

A car owner does not need to also play it safe by choosing something above premium just to make sure they have at least 91 octane.

[sampalmer21]

Maybe some of you will find this useful,

I have been keeping track of my fuel consumption from day 1, after 2 years of using PetroCanada 91, I avg about 465km/tank (65L tank).

I switched to Shell V-Power 91 last month, and I am on my 3rd tank, I am avging 530km/tank thus far.

This is so true, I recently switched over from PetroCanada (petro points were my reason for staying loyal) to Shell and my mileage increased by like 80km.

[vek]

http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/2003-07-30-premiumgas_x.htm

"All Porsche engines are designed for premium, too, but it's not available everywhere. "Our cars must be able to drive all over the world, and so we are able to run on regular," says Jakob Neusser, director of powertrain development at Porsche's research and development center in Weissach, Germany. "You don't have to feel that a mechanical problem or anything else will happen" using regular gas, even in the highest-performance, regular-production Porsches."

[hi-tech]

You mean me. I exclusively used Shell V-power in my car up until around a year ago, that's when I switched to Sunoco 94. I have advanced my car's base ignition timing and that's what I attribute the occasional knocking to when using Shell. Yea I lost some mileage when I switched over to 94 but oh well. Recently I have added even more timing and afr adjustments so my car is optimized to run on 94 now.

Do you even know what knocking is? Seems like you're just making everything you say up in order to make your self feel better for being duped by Sunoco's marketing.

[hi-tech]

I've been experimenting with the best gas on all of my family's cars lately.

We have a 2003 Mercedes E320, 2003 Honda CR-V, 2002 Acura RSX Premium, 2009 Mercedes GLK.

The Honda's run exponentially better on Shell V-Power. Sunoco is a waste in them.

The two Mercedes get slightly better gas mileage on V-Power, but have more or less the same feel as Sunoco 94. My mom occasionally throws in regular or midgrade into the E320 and it actually run pretty well on both. There is an obvious feel of effort on the part of the car that usually isnt there with V-Power.

Over all, V-Power is the way to go. Sunoco just seems to be a waste of money.

[mau108]

I've been experimenting with the best gas on all of my family's cars lately.

We have a 2003 Mercedes E320, 2003 Honda CR-V, 2002 Acura RSX Premium, 2009 Mercedes GLK.

The Honda's run exponentially better on Shell V-Power. Sunoco is a waste in them.

The two Mercedes get slightly better gas mileage on V-Power, but have more or less the same feel as Sunoco 94. My mom occasionally throws in regular or midgrade into the E320 and it actually run pretty well on both. There is an obvious feel of effort on the part of the car that usually isnt there with V-Power.

Over all, V-Power is the way to go. Sunoco just seems to be a waste of money.

why does your crv require premium? isn't 87 octane recommended?

[skidz88]

Do you even know what knocking is? Seems like you're just making everything you say up in order to make your self feel better for being duped by Sunoco's marketing.


LOL Who are you to tell me what I know? Like I really care what some random person from this place says to me.

How can you tell me I'm making everything up? Idiot.

[hi-tech]

why does your crv require premium? isn't 87 octane recommended?

required and recommended are two different things. But like I said, its better to know how the cars run on all the different gases available.

[hi-tech]

LOL Who are you to tell me what I know? Like I really care what some random person from this place says to me.

How can you tell me I'm making everything up? Idiot.

Because you're acting like your daily driver nissan is some ultra tuned 9 second beast that can't run on anything but 94 for some reason, while cars that are actually tuned for high octane gas like mercedes and bmw seem to run fine on 91 and even 89.

[skidz88]

Because you're acting like your daily driver nissan is some ultra tuned 9 second beast that can't run on anything but 94 for some reason, while cars that are actually tuned for high octane gas like mercedes and bmw seem to run fine on 91 and even 89.


I'm posting straight facts on MY car which YOU know absolutely nothing about.