Help Please!! New Car had a dent from the dealer (Pictures Posted)

[saijaz]

I bought this brand new car today. About 4 hours later when I parked the car in the driveway, I noticed an irregularity/dent in front fender. It seemed that it was dented and pulled to make it look nothing ever happened to it. If I pay attention, its very very obvious that its dented.

I took it to the dealer and the salesperson started blaming me for the dent. He says that when the dealer washed the car, there was no dent. By the way, the dent is such that there are no scratches...

Spoke to the manager and he was nicer. It seemed like a bad cop good cop theme. Manager said that nobody can prove who did this (whether dealer had the dent or I put the dent in 4 hours since purchase)

Since the dent was pulled (probably using some crowbar or something) there is a tiny paint chip (very small, you have to look very close to notice) and since the fender was pulled out, there might be some indication if its an older dent or new dent.

Does anyone know if there are people who can do some forensics to tell me if the dent and pull is an old one or new one? Manager at the dealer said he can't take the car and give me a new one but he can show it to his body shop (and probably get it fixed). I paid cash for this new car and really hate to have a car which has a re-painted fender.

Can anyone share your experience/expertise in this matter? What are my options? How can I prove that it was dealer.

Thanks, would really need your help here in this matter

[FazerRider]

can you mention what car and which dealer? thnx

[saijaz]

I bought this brand new car today. About 4 hours later when I parked the car in the driveway, I noticed an irregularity/dent in front fender. It seemed that it was dented and pulled to make it look nothing ever happened to it. If I pay attention, its very very obvious that its dented.

I took it to the dealer and the salesperson started blaming me for the dent. He says that when the dealer washed the car, there was no dent. By the way, the dent is such that there are no scratches...

Spoke to the manager and he was nicer. It seemed like a bad cop good cop theme. Manager said that nobody can prove who did this (whether dealer had the dent or I put the dent in 4 hours since purchase)

Since the dent was pulled (probably using some crowbar or something) there is a tiny paint chip (very small, you have to look very close to notice) and since the fender was pulled out, there might be some indication if its an older dent or new dent.

Does anyone know if there are people who can do some forensics to tell me if the dent and pull is an old one or new one? Manager at the dealer said he can't take the car and give me a new one but he can show it to his body shop (and probably get it fixed). I paid cash for this new car and really hate to have a car which has a re-painted fender.

Can anyone share your experience/expertise in this matter? What are my options? How can I prove that it was dealer.

Thanks, would really need your help here in this matter

Honda Accord 2008 EX V6, Brand New Car from Classic Honda in Brampton, Ontario

[boyoflondon]

When you take possession of a new car, you inspect it ..

Once you drive it off the lot, it is your word against the dealers ... there is nothing you can do. Lesson learned for the next time ;)

[JewelsT]

Hi,
You bought the new car and I think they onus is upon yourself to check the car. But if you plead enough may be they'll fix it out of goodwill but they don't have to.

Did you get a good deal on the Honda Accord?

I was just looking at the HOnda Accord 2009 4 cylinder...my salesperson will knock off $2,000 right away! He's pretty honest and can answer any question.

[T-Man]

Thats awful to hear, sorry to hear that. At this point yes its sort of your word against theirs unless you can prove through forensic or a friend who does bodywork.

In good faith, especially if there is enough gross in the deal, perhaps the manager can have his bodyshop inspect/repair it at his cost and have it charge back to their new car department.

At this point, since your salesperson was useless to you, I'd deal directly with the nicer sales manager. You said "he can show it to his body shop (and probably get it fixed)". I'd call him on Monday, thanked him for listening to your concern, then tell him that you would like to take him up on his offer to let his bodyshop look at it.

On the phone call, don't discuss price or who's paying for it etc. Just get the appointment, and get the inspection, once his bodyshop gets back to him with an estimate at his cost, he may just elect to cover it out of good faith. Good luck!

[ferkel]

sorry to hear, but you'll likely have to fix it yourself. You can complain to the jerks at Honda Canada, but they don't care since its between you and the dealer.

It could have been some one hit your car.. since it was warm today the plastic bumper popped back out. Did you park anywhere?

[saijaz]

Thats awful to hear, sorry to hear that. At this point yes its sort of your word against theirs unless you can prove through forensic or a friend who does bodywork.

In good faith, especially if there is enough gross in the deal, perhaps the manager can have his bodyshop inspect/repair it at his cost and have it charge back to their new car department.

At this point, since your salesperson was useless to you, I'd deal directly with the nicer sales manager. You said "he can show it to his body shop (and probably get it fixed)". I'd call him on Monday, thanked him for listening to your concern, then tell him that you would like to take him up on his offer to let his bodyshop look at it.

On the phone call, don't discuss price or who's paying for it etc. Just get the appointment, and get the inspection, once his bodyshop gets back to him with an estimate at his cost, he may just elect to cover it out of good faith. Good luck!

Thanks for your comments. I kinda agree that its my fault too...not inspecting the car thoroughly, However, I couldn't imagine that Honda Dealer would do something like this to their customers.
I was thinking about taking pictures specially the picture from under (the fender) where somebody tried to pull the metal so it doesn't look dented, there is clear evidence that someone pulled the metal from crowbar as metal L shaped is bent. I was thinking about sending those pictures along with compaint to Honda Canada.

Does anyone think Honda Canada would help me in this? I might risk losing whatever offer I have from the dealer. I really feel cheated by the dealer...How is it possible that Dealer didn't know about it..

[Jon Lai]

Thanks for your comments. I kinda agree that its my fault too...not inspecting the car thoroughly, However, I couldn't imagine that Honda Dealer would do something like this to their customers.
I was thinking about taking pictures specially the picture from under (the fender) where somebody tried to pull the metal so it doesn't look dented, there is clear evidence that someone pulled the metal from crowbar as metal L shaped is bent. I was thinking about sending those pictures along with compaint to Honda Canada.

Does anyone think Honda Canada would help me in this? I might risk losing whatever offer I have from the dealer. I really feel cheated by the dealer...How is it possible that Dealer didn't know about it..

To be fair, they might not be aware of the dent either. To say they purposely dented the car before giving it to you is kind of ignorant.

[Whitedart]

Thanks for your comments. I kinda agree that its my fault too...not inspecting the car thoroughly, However, I couldn't imagine that Honda Dealer would do something like this to their customers.
I was thinking about taking pictures specially the picture from under (the fender) where somebody tried to pull the metal so it doesn't look dented, there is clear evidence that someone pulled the metal from crowbar as metal L shaped is bent. I was thinking about sending those pictures along with compaint to Honda Canada.

Does anyone think Honda Canada would help me in this? I might risk losing whatever offer I have from the dealer. I really feel cheated by the dealer...How is it possible that Dealer didn't know about it..

Where did you go with the car in the 4 hours from pickup until you noticed the dent? If you did not do a full circle check of the vehicle when picked up, the dealer is not going to accept responsibility for something you did not do.

But really, this dent could have happened in any parking area.

[eastwood]

Does anyone think Honda Canada would help me in this? I might risk losing whatever offer I have from the dealer. I really feel cheated by the dealer...How is it possible that Dealer didn't know about it..

I'd say keep at them about it. I guess it is possible that the dent was repaired before the dealer got the car, but unlikely.

Years ago (mid-90s) I bought a new car. And maybe a year after I got it I was washing the car and paint started coming off a 3" section of the front bumper. From the look of it the bumper was damaged before I got the car and it was painted over. So the next time I took it in for service (not the same dealer i bought it from) I asked about it and they agreed to have it repaired at a local body shop. I was happy with that. But about 3 months later the paint started coming off again. The dealer offered to have it painted again, but I told them I'd let the dealer I bought the car from deal with it. So I wrote a letter and they refused to do anything or provide an explanation. Later I wrote another letter and this time they called me back saying they would do nothing about it. About 6 months later I was back in hte city I bought the car and popped in to the dealer to talk with the service manager. He seemed pretty helpful until he spoke with the salesman and sales manager who again refused to help. So before I left I let them know that because the damage was done before I bought the car that I'd have to inform the manufacturer. A couple hours later the service manager called me to say that they'd pay for a new bumper if I paid the labour to put it on. I agreed.

Long story short......be persistent.

[najibs]

Once you take possession of a new car it's your responsibility to make sure it's in the condition you expect it to be, when you drive it off the lot. You didn't. It's the dealer's word vs yours.

If it's something so small, as you say, then just forget about it...as the days, weeks, months and years go by, you'll get more scratches and unavoidable a dento or two here and there. Your car will not be mint forever.

Just forget about it and enjoy it. If it's going to take someone in forensics to see this 'dent' then it's not even worth the time to sweat over it. Just enjoy the car....

[CalgaryJeremyK]

A lot of this advice is poor (i.e. Give up as you didn't do a thorough job of inspecting the car). The dealerships don't make it easy to go over every panel with a fine tooth comb, and frankly from my experience they typically try to rush you through the process with a "Don't you trust us?" kind of attitude. Perhaps the dealerships should be much more clear and indicate, "Make sure you very carefully inspect the car as any faults you find afterwards will not be covered". If they don't explicitly indicate that, I think it makes sense that you would be looking for some goodwill from the dealer.

[Whitedart]

The dealerships don't make it easy to go over every panel with a fine tooth comb, and frankly from my experience they typically try to rush you through the process with a "Don't you trust us?" kind of attitude.

So you let them rush you on the pick up of a $30k+ purchase?

Many people spend 20 minutes examining a $100 electronic item in a store before they complete a purchase.

There is no reason why you can't take at least 15 minutes to go over a brand new car looking for defects before you leave the dealer's lot with it.


Perhaps the dealerships should be much more clear and indicate, "Make sure you very carefully inspect the car as any faults you find afterwards will not be covered".

Isn't that common sense for any car buyer? It is not like you can walk into the dealership like FS, BB or Walmart and exchange the car for another.

[saijaz]

Where did you go with the car in the 4 hours from pickup until you noticed the dent? If you did not do a full circle check of the vehicle when picked up, the dealer is not going to accept responsibility for something you did not do.

But really, this dent could have happened in any parking area.

We drove around for an hour to Mississauga, decided to have lunch, parked in a parking lot where there were no cars, basically it was an empty area in that lot. Ate lunch there, then went to Erin Mills Mall, I felt safe in the parking lot because parking spots are very wide, kinda like wide Costco parking area. Typically in a Mall lot, you get dings on the doors but not on front fender

I know it didn't happened in parking lots because the paint area is absolutely spotless and very smooth, with no scratches. On top of that nobody would damage my car and then try to fix it by pulling the fender out in a parking lot.

My neighbour is a mechanic with City of Mississauga and I showed it to him, he can also tell that fender was pulled out by some tool.

btw, its bent and has a very prominent wave and an area which is pulled out by some tool which is pointed. If it was a very minor, un-noticable bend/dent, I would've let it go.... its on the passenger side fender and fairly prominent.


I will take some pictures and post it tomorrow

[Ben Jr]

A lot of this advice is poor (i.e. Give up as you didn't do a thorough job of inspecting the car). The dealerships don't make it easy to go over every panel with a fine tooth comb, and frankly from my experience they typically try to rush you through the process with a "Don't you trust us?" kind of attitude. Perhaps the dealerships should be much more clear and indicate, "Make sure you very carefully inspect the car as any faults you find afterwards will not be covered". If they don't explicitly indicate that, I think it makes sense that you would be looking for some goodwill from the dealer.

No offense, but that's just as bad. If your far too timid to inspect the car you just paid $30k in fear of offending the salesperson who already has his commission than your nothing but a fool.

Years ago I bought a new Integra GSR and inspecting my new car thoroughly inside and out at the dealership with salesman in tow. Upon inspection, I discovered a dent in the small panel between the rear tail lights...had I not done that I'd be in the same situation as the OP.

Does anyone know if there are people who can do some forensics to tell me if the dent and pull is an old one or new one?

Forensics? :D way too much CSI OP

I gotta agree with the dealership here...they probably didn't even notice the dent. Hell, one of your kids could have done it in the driveway.

Chalk it up to a new lesson...you did tell them to remove the dealership decal right? :cheesygri

[najibs]

I will take some pictures and post it tomorrow

Best idea so far...

[saijaz]

So you let them rush you on the pick up of a $30k+ purchase?

Many people spend 20 minutes examining a $100 electronic item in a store before they complete a purchase.

There is no reason why you can't take at least 15 minutes to go over a brand new car looking for defects before you leave the dealer's lot with it.




Isn't that common sense for any car buyer? It is not like you can walk into the dealership like FS, BB or Walmart and exchange the car for another.


Chain of events...

-I went to this dealer on Wednesday nights and we agreed on price, I gave him $500 deposit.
-Asst Manager calls me that he located a white car and we agreed on Saturday for pickup
-Friday night I started reading on VCM (Variable Cyclinder Management), several forums that very unhappy customers who mentioned that car shakes when VCM engages and dis-engages.
- Sat morning...As soon as I went and saw Asst Manager, I told him that I would like to test drive V6 car on a highway (100km/hr or so) to experience VCM. My wife and kids were with me. Asst Manager tells me take your car, its ready. Temperature today was in positive and snow was melting, it was very messy on roads.
-Took the car on test drive on highway 410 North towards MayField. Came back and the car was covered with muddy stains (melted snow water)

Hind sight...I should have insisted on walk through before I took the car for test drive.. it was actually parked inside of their service area, he took the car out, we sat and drove off to test VCM

You're absolutely right people spend time to evaluate smaller elecronics, including myself. I just don't know what happened but I only looked at the car from where my eyes could see, front, back and drivers side. I missed passenger side completely. I noticed the dent when I parked in my driveway and as I opened my hood to check out V6 engine, I notice the wave and pointed metal....anyways, a very important lesson which I'd never forget!

[freeonboard]

I think the OP has a right to assume that there is no body damaage when he buys a new car.

[gamer123]

though the buyer should triple check the car before driving it off, its impossible to check every single inch of the car completely.

[bembol]

This is just the beginning. LOL

I can understand if OP didn't inspect or missed it on delivery day. I don't think I did on any of my purchases, I just wanted to get out and drive!

[98_XC]

Rule #1 - Dealerships don't want to take a loss, EVER.

I witnessed a driver (test driver) backing into a NEW car on the lot. The sales person looked over the car and said "no damage, let's go". My girlfriend and I looked at it and you could see small chips out of the paint behind the license plate bracket. I guarantee you the people that buy that car will notice the damage a month after purchase.

The bottom line is "s h i t" happens. Cars get banged into when they're being parked, unloaded, and simply sitting for a year. Your car is a year old (08), it's likely been moved around and rearranged in the lot.

I just bought a new vehicle too. I walked around VERY CLOSELY, enough to make my girlfriend question my mentality. The good news is, I didn't see anything wrong with it. However, that doesn't mean some dude didn't scratch anything while he was putting the vehicle together (that I haven't noticed yet )

Enjoy your new ride!

<<I didn't mean to put the smiley face on the top - how do you remove it?>>

[stuntman]

Some good will from the dealer is all you can hope for. It is a brand new car and regardless whos fault it is they should want you to be happy. It would likely come out of your pocket, maybe you can get a discount.

Dents happen, it is the first but wont be the last and depending on your state of mind you will care less about it in a few months. My older Civic has dings and dents here and there. They always seemed bigger on the day they were discovered.

Do you have a pic?

good luck

[jed]

Heres something to consider, besides laying blame.

You paint the car, and it will not stand up like the Original stuff. It just doesn't. So, decide if its bad enough to warrant any issues you may have in the future from paint chipping more so in that spot, fading irregularly, etc. Once your "warranty" is up for the repair, likely a year, you're SOL.

Then consider taking it to a paintless dent repair shop. A good shop can work miracles without bondo, sanding, primer, paint, etc., this from personal experience.

Deal with the dealer - send all the letters to Honda Canada you like, but they only built the car, transported it and will warranty it - after that its the dealer's responsibility. They can suggest to the dealer, but its entirely up to him. You have to go through the paces with the chain of command without jumping to the end. Start with the sales manager and see how it goes. If that doesn't pan out, you can move up the food chain within the dealership. Thats what they're there for. It happens all the time, and remember you can get more flies with honey than you can with vinegar. Its amazing what can happen if you're nice and reasonable, assuming you're dealing with the same on the other side. Most of the time you'll be fine.

[saijaz]

As you can see from one picture that I posted, fender was pulled from inside out


http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=83&pictureid=228

http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=83&pictureid=229

[Frankie3s]

If the dealer is offering to fix the dent then that will be your best best and if I were you, I'd take it. Here's why, 1) no one will give you another vehicle (Honda Canada or not), 2) most of the time when damages are detected on pre-delivery they are always repaired anyways which the dealer is offering to do for you and if they had done so earlier with this, you would've never had noticed it.

Lastly I bet in a month or so of parking the car in parking lots it will be dented anyways.

[vek]

Sucks, sorry to hear, OP.

Right now, the best (only?) real leverage you have is your service dollars. Dealerships are extremely interested in you coming back for routine maintenance, especially now that margins are so slim on new cars.

You might be able to get the dealership to work with you a bit on the repair if you make a point that you were hoping to have your service done with the dealership, and wanted a positive experience out of the sale to build on.