HOT: Cheap whole-house surge suppressor .. only 42$US!

[leonk]

I'm not sure if this is the right forum but here goes.

Some of you may have noticed that Mike Holmes is really pushing a particular item to be installed in all his reno's.. the SYC-120/240TC whole-house surge suppressor.

This is the only unit that is C UL US approved on the market for residential usage. You install it on your panel, and what it does is monitor both power buses in your panel. If any of them have a power spike, in less than 5 ns, it clamps them to ground [this is much faster than a regular breaker!]. This unit can take a surge of 150,000 AMP (that's over 16.5 million volts!!), comes with lifetime warranty on the unit and items in your home!

On a recent episode of Holmes on Homes, his electrician mentioned that this unit costs 500$ installed.

If you contact the manufacturer directly, the unit cost is 150$US for certified electricians (is this what Mike Holmes' guy pays?). The cheapest I found it on eBay is 100$US.

I recently found a store online that sells it for 41.95$US

I purchased and installed it. I just ordered 7 more units (for co-workers and family) and am very satisfied with the service. So I wanted to pass tip to fellow FRDers.


item is only 41.95$US
They ship USPS to Canada
cost of shipping is their actual cost (got here in less than a week)
they accept paypal
they marked item as "commercial sample" - no customs fees!


Here's the web site: http://www.logicsolution.com/store.html

See info below on how to install this unit. :cheesygri

[Rehan]

Is it CSA approved? It doesn't say anything about that on the website.

[nornet]

Just another example of anything that comes from that guy, goods or services, tend to be considerably overpriced. I'm really unimpressed by his overbuilding and overpricing. The Holmes forums are good though.

[nornet]

Is it CSA approved? It doesn't say anything about that on the website.

I think that UL approval is accepted here. Having said that it is UL Listed, not sure what that is.

[leonk]

Here's how I installed this device in my panel. Again, if you're too scared to work in the panel, not a certified electrician, or simply don't know what the heck you're doing.. hire an electrician!!

You got the unit for so cheap.. why not splurge a little? :cheesygri

So here goes..


it is recommended that the unit be installed on its own breaker
a 30 AMP dual breaker is best (this way it covers both buses)
install breaker in panel
install unit on panel as close to new breaker as possible
cut 2 black wires just a bit longer than length to screws on breaker and strip wires
cut white wire just a bit longer than length to closest ground bar and strip wires
screw 2 black wires into breakers
screw white wire into ground
turn on breakers


and you're done!

Total cost is to you is much less than your home insurance deductible.. and now you're protected from surges generated in your home (lightning hitting your house) as well as surge coming from the mains (lightning hitting your neighbors' house, tree, etc.)

update: online instructions with picture: http://www.lightningrodparts.com/instructions.html

[leonk]

Is it CSA approved? It doesn't say anything about that on the website.

I believe it is. How else would Holmes be using them? (Holmes on Homes is a show which mostly focuses on homes in the GTA area).

Update:

According to: http://www.ul.com/marks_labels/mark/index.html

C-UL US Listing Mark

UL introduced this new Listing Mark in early 1998. It indicates compliance with both Canadian and U.S. requirements. The Canada/U.S. UL Mark is optional. UL encourages those manufacturers with products certified for both countries to use this new, combined Mark, but they may continue using separate UL Marks for the United States and Canada.

[Rehan]

http://www.sensorcentral.com/worldsupport/standards03.php says:
Based on the MRA (Mutual Recognition Agreement), cross-certification has been granted between the U.S. and Canada. When a product is certified by UL using the Canadian standards (CSA Standards), the product will have the following C-UL certification mark expressing the conformity to the CSA Standards.

[C-UL-US symbol shown] leonk mentioned it's C-UL-US approved, so that should be good enough in Canada.

[coolspot]

I have a question regarding whole home surge protectors: if the device trips while someone is out of the house (i.e. on vacation), does it automatically reset it self?

[leonk]

I have a question regarding whole home surge protectors: if the device trips while someone is out of the house (i.e. on vacation), does it automatically reset it self?

According to: http://www.lightningrodparts.com/instructions.html

"The WHOLE HOUSE ARRESTOR will re-set automatically and keep on working for many years."

That is assuming that it survived taking the lightning through it! I found one forum post online where an electrician was commenting that he had to replace a unit after it fried from having the house being hit by lightning (nothing else was lost!!).

Also, at some point, the 30A breaker will trip. That requires a manual reset.

[coolspot]

According to: http://www.lightningrodparts.com/instructions.html

"The WHOLE HOUSE ARRESTOR will re-set automatically and keep on working for many years."

That's great news! What I'm worried about is if the protector trips while I'm out... causing the pipes to freeze in the winter or fridge to melt in the summer ;)

[Drthorne]

That's great news! What I'm worried about is if the protector trips while I'm out... causing the pipes to freeze in the winter or fridge to melt in the summer ;)

you won't loose power to the rest of your home, if it trips then you won't have surge protection

[malbadon]

comes with lifetime warranty on the unit and items in your home!
Again, if you're too scared to work in the panel, not a certified electrician, or simply don't know what the heck you're doing.. hire an electrician!!


Per the warranty:
A licensed electrician or utility company representative must have properly connected the Sycom product and the connected equipment to properly wired and grounded outlets/power supplied (including compliance with electrical and safety codes of the most current National Electrical Code ANSI/NFPA 70), without the use of any adaptors, extension cords or other connectors.


Generally touching your panel is a no-no unless your licensed (varies from province to province of course, here in Alberta a homeowner can touch everything BUT the panel, and still requires a permit for whatever he touches). Per SyCom though, touching it and expecting a warranty would be completely unlikely.

[coolspot]

you won't loose power to the rest of your home, if it trips then you won't have surge protection

So when it trips, it just absorbs the power, but electricity continues to flow into your house?

[mork]

Influenced by Holmes, I had asked my builder to add a surge protector. the additional cost from them was over $1,000 so I passed. I hadn't gotten around to looking into them. Thanks for the post - ordered one and will install myself.

Interestingly, a co-worker recently had pretty much everything in their house fried by a surge.. stove (electronic panel), microwave, computers, etc. I never knew anyone first hand that had any surge that caused problems, but these guys lost everything so it really does happen.

[leonkaz]

Thanks leonk ;-)
we should've gotten a group buy ;-)

[l69norm]

Remember that these things aren't miracle devices. They only work in some particular situations like a short on a nearby power pole.

I had a near-by lightning strike a few years ago. It was so close that it vaporized the mercury in some of the window contacts of my alarm system, burned out the GFI's feeding my washrooms, took out my exterior IR sensor lights and blew out a lot of electronics gear - VCR, TV, telephones, radios, etc. I had used a lot of power bars with surge suppressors (some cheap $20 and some expensive $80 ones) and none of them worked. The power bars all had thier happy "green" light on, but the connected gear still got zapped

I never did figure out what/ where the lightning struck, as none of my neighbors had damage nor was there any obvious scorching on the exterior of the house or objects nearby.

http://www.ul.com/consumers/surge.html

Under $100 might be worth it, but I would pass on a cost of $500 or $1000

[BuildingHomes]

Just to clarify.. these things are good for surges that originate OUTSIDE of your home. It does nothing to protect sensitive equipment from surges generated within the home. Everytime a large device in the home starts up, there is a rush of current that can potentially affect other devices.

You should still protect sensitive equipment with a proper surge suppressor.. which means not one of those cheap ass $10 things from a discount store.

[leonk]

Interestingly, a co-worker recently had pretty much everything in their house fried by a surge.. stove (electronic panel), microwave, computers, etc. I never knew anyone first hand that had any surge that caused problems, but these guys lost everything so it really does happen.

The reason I initially looked for one was become the 2 houses I previously lived in, were both hit by lightning!! (Once in 1997, and another in 2001). 2 different houses, 2 different parts of the city. In both cases, I lost TV's, phones, and computers. My home insurance deductible was 500$ in each case.

I figured that one can't go wrong with this unit .. much cheaper than my deductible.

[Ven0r]

Ordered, Thanks ;)

[CanadianMoFo]

I've been looking for something like this for my home. Great price, shipping at $20 is a bit much. But overall it's still a great deal! Thanks!

CM

[virgoan]

Does anybody want to do a group buy in GTA to save on Shipping cost??

Shipping to Canada:
1 unit - $20.40
3 units - $43.80/3 = $14.60
5 units - $46.80/5 = $9.36
10 units - $52.80/10 = $5.28
20 units - $72.80/20 = $3.64


I'd buy it if we have 10 ppl interested...PM me

OP, could you please put this "group buy" on ur original post so more ppl in the GTA can see it easier? thanks!

1. Virgoan
2. Virgoan's friend
3. Notchy
4. j8lam
5. maddawg
6. 951den
7. mjl_toronto
8. hobbes778
9. bririp
10. rajchakra
11. CorradoGuy
12. dhurandhar

We got our 10 buyers!! Anybody else?

[notchy]

I'm interested

[virgoan]

1. Virgoan
2. Virgoan's friend
3. Notchy
4. j8lam
5. maddawg


Need 5 more buyers!! :D

[951den]

I am new to this Site, I am interest to buy one too, just got a new house a month ago

Thanks Guys

[CanadianMoFo]

Is the company shipping each to individual addresses as part of the buy?

[mjl_toronto]

1. Virgoan
2. Virgoan's friend
3. Notchy
4. j8lam
5. maddawg


Need 5 more buyers!! :D

I'll join in!

[virgoan]

Is the company shipping each to individual addresses as part of the buy?

Unfortunately no...they only ship to ONE address...But if you want...I can have it ship to you once I receive it (via Canada Post approximately $7 more within Canada)


update:

1. Virgoan
2. Virgoan's friend
3. Notchy
4. j8lam
5. maddawg
6. 951den
7. mjl_toronto
8. hobbes778
9. bririp
10. rajchakra
11. CorradoGuy

We got our 10 buyers!! Anybody else?

[hobbes778]

I'm interested.

[bririp]

I am interested

[rajchakra]

I am interested as well.

[CorradoGuy]

Count me in!

[dhurandhar]

I am interested.

[Cheap Cat]

Any idea on the cost to have a licensed electrician install this? Sorry, I don't mess with electricity.

I lost a VCR to a power surge during a storm and my brother who lived in the same building, 2 floors above me, lost an answering machine. My electronics are now all on surge protectors but as Mike Holmes points out this thing protects your expensive appliances, the things we never think of needing a surge protector and the things we never unplug.

[Cheap Cat]

If one item is marked as a sample so no extra charges apply at the border, would they mark 10+ as samples under a group buy? Even if they did, I don't know if CBS would buy that and the extra charges could negate the savings.

[leonk]

Any idea on the cost to have a licensed electrician install this? Sorry, I don't mess with electricity.

I lost a VCR to a power surge during a storm and my brother who lived in the same building, 2 floors above me, lost an answering machine. My electronics are now all on surge protectors but as Mike Holmes points out this thing protects your expensive appliances, the things we never think of needing a surge protector and the things we never unplug.

There are 2 extra costs for getting this installed. A new breaker (~10$ for most panels) + electrician. It took me less than 10 minutes to install this item in my panel .. so an electrician shouldn't charge more than 100$ for the job!

[t3359]

Count me in as well.

bjl

[tommyamaral]

I'm in as well

[wally_walrus]

Remember that these things aren't miracle devices. They only work in some particular situations like a short on a nearby power pole.

I had a near-by lightning strike a few years ago. It was so close that it vaporized the mercury in some of the window contacts of my alarm system, burned out the GFI's feeding my washrooms, took out my exterior IR sensor lights and blew out a lot of electronics gear - VCR, TV, telephones, radios, etc. I had used a lot of power bars with surge suppressors (some cheap $20 and some expensive $80 ones) and none of them worked. The power bars all had thier happy "green" light on, but the connected gear still got zapped

I never did figure out what/ where the lightning struck, as none of my neighbors had damage nor was there any obvious scorching on the exterior of the house or objects nearby.

http://www.ul.com/consumers/surge.html

Under $100 might be worth it, but I would pass on a cost of $500 or $1000



Were you at home at the time?

[l69norm]

Were you at home at the time?

Yes. It was a pretty heavy thunderstorm at night. There was a very bright flash, a simultaneous huge clap of thunder and a heavy "electric" odor. I figure it must have struck the ground near the electric meter.

I think the most weird thing was the alarm system contacts for several windows. The whole mercury reed section was gone - vaporized. All that was left was the plastic outer shells and some scorch marks on the window sill. Enough of a pulse was induced into the alarm wiring to do that damage.

I also had some $80 surge suppressor power bars with cable TV and telephone protections connected, however none of this worked and the VCR, TV and telephone were all taken out

Insurance covered everything ($3K) less the deductible ($300). Fortunately, I had replacement contents coverage.

[leonk]

I also had some $80 surge suppressor power bars with cable TV and telephone protections connected, however none of this worked and the VCR, TV and telephone were all taken out

First time my house was hit by lightning, the deductible was 500$. They raised the deductible on us to 1000$ after that (go figure! what are the chances of the same house being hit twice!?)

In any case.. the cheap surge suppressor/power bars I was using at the time did nothing to stop the lightning. The only item that survived was what was plugged into a UPS .. the UPS didn't do well after that though.

You can get good surge suppressors for power bars .. but don't expect the cheap ones to be any good.

I believe this thing will do better than the cheap ones because of its location. It has very short runs to the earth ground (unlike power bar that has to go through wires in your walls).

Also, the wire used seem to be a good quality one! It's 12 gauge strands. Standard electric wire is 14 gauge solid core. I believe because electricity travels on the surface of wires, this device can take a lot more juice than standard electrical wire.

[l69norm]

First time my house was hit by lightning, the deductible was 500$. They raised the deductible on us to 1000$ after that (go figure! what are the chances of the same house being hit twice!?)

In any case.. the cheap surge suppressor/power bars I was using at the time did nothing to stop the lightning. The only item that survived was what was plugged into a UPS .. the UPS didn't do well after that though..

I think the strike was so close that it wouldn't have mattered, after all it vaporized several glass enclosed mercury reed alarm switches that are on essentially a 12 VDC battery system

That does bring up another point - don't forget to protect the telephone line and cable TV wiring coming into the house as well. I think the surge suppressors HD sells have modules for this, but they are way more expensive - $200:
http://www.homedepot.ca/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/CatalogSearchResultView?D=901424&Ntt=901424&catalogId=10051&langId=-15&storeId=10051&Dx=mode+matchallpartial&Ntx=mode+matchall&recN=0&N=0&Ntk=P_PartNumber
http://www.homedepot.ca/wcsstore/HomeDepotCanada/images/catalog/21270.939-SDSB1175C_3.jpg

Sycom also has stuff for phone and cable TV:
http://74.53.140.226/~sycomsur/catalog/Residential-3-1.html
http://74.53.140.226/~sycomsur/images/products/thumbs/syc-st-130a.jpg
http://74.53.140.226/~sycomsur/images/products/thumbs/syc-vf-h.jpg

[abstract808]

Even at $40 this thing is probably overpriced for what it is - the cynic in me thinks that it's likely just a couple of MOVs. Hopefully for the price they've included a few gas discharge tubes as well. I'm a little concerned that they don't give the device rating in Joules, or even state the clamp voltage. Why are they keeping this info secret? I'd love to pry one open, but I'm not willing to spend $40 to do so.

And these things won't last forever - MOVs and GDTs degrade a little every time they absorb a surge.

And OP - where on Earth did you get "16.5 million volts" from?

[virgoan]

1. Virgoan
2. Notchy
3. j8lam
4. maddawg
5. 951den
6. mjl_toronto
7. hobbes778
8. bririp
9. rajchakra
10. CorradoGuy
11. dhurandhar
12. t3359
13. tommyamaral
14. terayon401
15. rf134a

Wow! what a great turn out!

15 units @ $41.95 = $629.25 + $62.80 = $692.05USD =~$854.50CDN

Unfortunately...this is embarrassing...I don't have that much balance on my CC...Maxed out my CC because of some recent purchases (THANKS TO RFD :D:D)....Could somebody else order it? I will help with the distribution :)

[BuildingHomes]

You can get good surge suppressors for power bars .. but don't expect the cheap ones to be any good.



Panamax has an excellent demonstration of this very thing.

They take a stove bulb, plug it into a transformer delivering 120V. Works fine.

Change the transformer to deliver 200V. The bulb gets brighter to show the increase in voltage.

They then put one of their surge supressors in the middle of the transformer and bulb and turn it on again at 120V. Works fine. Flip to 200V, bulb goes out.. signifying that no power is being let through.

They then did the same thing with a cheap $10 surge supressor. 120V, works fine. 200V, the thing goes up in smoke, and the bulb is still on!

It's a great demo and I got to watch it first hand. They have video of it, but it's locked in the dealer section of their website.

Moral of the story, cheap surge supressors DO NOTHING.

[applejuice]

count me in

1. Virgoan
2. Notchy
3. j8lam
4. maddawg
5. 951den
6. mjl_toronto
7. hobbes778
8. bririp
9. rajchakra
10. CorradoGuy
11. dhurandhar
12. t3359
13. tommyamaral
14. terayon401
15. rf134a

16. applejuice

Wow! what a great turn out!

15 units @ $41.95 = $629.25 + $62.80 = $692.05USD =~$854.50CDN

Unfortunately...this is embarrassing...I don't have that much balance on my CC...Maxed out my CC because of some recent purchases (THANKS TO RFD :D:D)....Could somebody else order it? I will help with the distribution :)

[rfd_lurker]

Unfortunately...this is embarrassing...I don't have that much balance on my CC...Maxed out my CC because of some recent purchases (THANKS TO RFD :D:D)....Could somebody else order it? I will help with the distribution :)


money up front... the only way to do group buys! I'm on the fence about joining... just bought a house and would love to have it installed. I'll let you know asap.

[Brrr]

Has anyone heard of SyCom before? Wonder how difficult it would be to claim a warranty on the unit or attached equipment?

Completely agree with the need for one of these. First thing I did when I moved into my last house, which was almost 100 years old, was install one of these. It was a CHSP Ultra from Eaton/Cutler Hammer. Lots of local resellers in T.O. About $150. Don't remember the install fee as the electrician installed it when he was ripping out the knob and tube and putting in a new loadcentre. The Ultra has a larger equipment warranty, among other things.

[virgoan]

money up front... the only way to do group buys! I'm on the fence about joining... just bought a house and would love to have it installed. I'll let you know asap.

Money up front...that sounds good...But I have no idea how much it will cost...ie...if Duty fees applies or not...taxes? and exchange rate..lots of factor here...hehe

[leonk]

Wow..

the only reason to do a group buy is to save on the cost of shipping (goes from 20$ down to about 5$). So the price difference is 15$.

I know this is RFD .. but is it worth going through the group buy hassle to save 15$ on something that's already heavily discounted??

[Cheap Cat]

Moral of the story, cheap surge supressors DO NOTHING.

I'm not sure what you mean by 'cheap', (I have $20 APC surge supressor power bars from Costco) but what about the guarantees on these things that offer to pay if your products are ruined. Anyone put in a claim? I figured if they had a guarantee they would be effective. Or is it such a rare occurance and people don't keep the proper documentation and put in claims that it is not a huge cost for them?

[BuildingHomes]

In some cases the guarantees are very specific to the type of surge that ocurred. Also, protecting against lightning is very difficult to do.. high voltages can jump gaps very easily. Best way to protect yourself against lightning is to actually unplug the devices you are concerned about.


I'm not sure what you mean by 'cheap', (I have $20 APC surge supressor power bars from Costco) but what about the guarantees on these things that offer to pay if your products are ruined. Anyone put in a claim? I figured if they had a guarantee they would be effective. Or is it such a rare occurance and people don't keep the proper documentation and put in claims that it is not a huge cost for them?

[leonkaz]

Yes. It was a pretty heavy thunderstorm at night. There was a very bright flash, a simultaneous huge clap of thunder and a heavy "electric" odor. I figure it must have struck the ground near the electric meter.



Sounds scary. I was caught by a t-storm in a tent this past summer. It was under sparsely growing fairly big trees.
I was NEVER so scared in my life :o

[abstract808]

They then did the same thing with a cheap $10 surge supressor. 120V, works fine. 200V, the thing goes up in smoke, and the bulb is still on!

This is exactly what happens when you have a suppressor that contains only MOVs. They aren't designed to handle sustained over-voltage, just brief bursts. The MOV overheats, burns out and acts like a short.

The 50 cent solution is to connect some type of thermal fuse that will disconnect power when the MOV temperature increases. The $2 solution is to use a special type of thermally protected MOV.

But those costs are of course far too high for the bargain basement manufacturers of "surge suppressors".

[tommyamaral]

Sorry guys count me out I have ordered one,Thanks Op

[curls00]

They seem to be listed at $49.95 now. :( Still cheaper than here in Canada but they just upped the price almost 20%. Damn RFD effect!

[t3359]

Money up front...that sounds good...But I have no idea how much it will cost...ie...if Duty fees applies or not...taxes? and exchange rate..lots of factor here...hehe

I think money up front, and we split the duty/taxes when picking them up from organizer.

bjl

[l69norm]

Just wanted to point out that some power panels have the option to add "click in" whole house surge suppressors, just like panel breakers. For example, Schneider Square D QO panels (QO21755SB) is $58:
http://www.homedepot.ca/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/CatalogSearchResultView?revtab=true&D=901407&Ntt=901407&recN=112102&langId=-15&Dx=mode+matchallpartial&Ntk=P_PartNumber&storeId=10051&Ntx=mode+matchall&N=0&catalogId=10051
http://www.homedepot.ca/wcsstore/HomeDepotCanada/images/catalog/21270.989-QO2175SB_3.jpg

ITE Siemens and GE panels have the same option as well, although I have no idea about the price:
Siemens:
http://www2.sea.siemens.com/Products/Residential-Electrical/Product/Surge-Protection/Circuit-Breaker-and-Transient-Voltage-Surge-Suppressor.htm
http://www2.sea.siemens.com/NR/rdonlyres/57719C85-BCA3-42FB-8EAC-2B2289B25126/0/qsatvsss.jpg
GE
http://www.geindustrial.com/cwc/Dispatcher?REQUEST=PRODUCTS&pnlid=3&famid=37&catid=86&id=thqlsurg
http://www.geindustrial.com/images/products/thqlsurg.gif

[bolmsted]

Frank from Solutions Electric who was on Holmes on Homes demonstrated this new plug in breaker based whole house surge protector on one of the later shows (the last season perhaps) after having used the kind previously mentioned by the OP on several other shows throughout the years.

Mike Holmes liked this much better and so should the rest of us!

I would be more inclined to get this sort of thing instead of mucking with hooking up wires to bus bars behind the panel cover and it would do the same thing without having to break out part of the panel side cover to install this (especially if you have no room beside the panel but there is likely required clearances for this) and then wiring up to another breaker that you would have to obtain.


edit: looks like you still need to hook up the breaker to a neutral or ground bus bar to take the excess power but you wouldn't need to touch the hot wire. would still need to shut the power off though :)

[CanadianMoFo]

Guess I'm SOL with my Federal Pioneer panel. Meh...I was concerned about running out of room in the panel anyways. I'm better off with the Sycom unit anyways. Too bad I hesitated to buy and got caught in the RFD effect.

CM

[curls00]

Just wanted to point out that some power panels have the option to add "click in" whole house surge suppressors, just like panel breakers. For example, Schneider Square D QO panels (QO21755SB) is $58:
http://www.homedepot.ca/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/CatalogSearchResultView?revtab=true&D=901407&Ntt=901407&recN=112102&langId=-15&Dx=mode+matchallpartial&Ntk=P_PartNumber&storeId=10051&Ntx=mode+matchall&N=0&catalogId=10051
http://www.homedepot.ca/wcsstore/HomeDepotCanada/images/catalog/21270.989-QO2175SB_3.jpg


I have a 5-year old Cutler-Hammer panel that has 5 knockouts remaining unused near the bottom ( 2 on one side, 3 on the other). Would this exact click-in suppressor work in my panel? I am under the assumption that these fit and hook up exactly like another breaker would in the panel... is this correct?

Edit: Also, would this provide as much protection as the one from Logical Solutions that this thread is discussing? The Home Depot one says "Secondary" surge suppressor -- secondary to what? Does this indicate an inferior protection vs. the Logical Solutions type?

Cheers,
Eric

[l69norm]

I have a 5-year old Cutler-Hammer panel that has 5 knockouts remaining unused near the bottom ( 2 on one side, 3 on the other). Would this exact click-in suppressor work in my panel? I am under the assumption that these fit and hook up exactly like another breaker would in the panel... is this correct?

Edit: Also, would this provide as much protection as the one from Logical Solutions that this thread is discussing? The Home Depot one says "Secondary" surge suppressor -- secondary to what? Does this indicate an inferior protection vs. the Logical Solutions type?

Cheers,
Eric

It attaches into the panel like any other breaker would. I don't think Cutler-Hammer is interchangable with SqD QO breakers, but some GE, ITE Siemens and other SqD breakers might be. There used to be a website that had what breakers were interchangable with what panels, but I can't find it at the moment.

The other issue is that you could have problems with home/electrical inspectors and your insurance co if they see another manufacturer's breakers inside your panel (athough sometimes you don't have a choice for an older discontinued panel). It's a lot less hassle to use the same manufacturer for both.

BTW, Culter-Hammer has thier own modular unit ($165):
http://www.homedepot.ca/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/CatalogSearchResultView?D=943213&Ntt=943213&catalogId=10051&langId=-15&storeId=10051&Dx=mode+matchallpartial&Ntx=mode+matchall&recN=0&N=0&Ntk=P_PartNumber
http://www.homedepot.ca/wcsstore/HomeDepotCanada/images/catalog/56ee57d8-196a-498b-b492-43d080dfa50b_4.jpg

"Secondary" protection is a lower level:
http://www2.sea.siemens.com/Products/Residential-Electrical/Product/Surge-Protection/You_need_a_whole_house_protection_system.htm

"Logical Solutions" is the distributor in the group buy. The unit is made by Sycom:
http://www.sycomsurge.com/

[newhope]

Is the group buy still going on? If so, please count me in! Thanks!

1. Virgoan
2. Notchy
3. j8lam
4. maddawg
5. 951den
6. mjl_toronto
7. hobbes778
8. bririp
9. rajchakra
10. CorradoGuy
11. dhurandhar
12. t3359
13. tommyamaral
14. terayon401
15. rf134a
16. applejuice

17. newhope

Wow! what a great turn out!

15 units @ $41.95 = $629.25 + $62.80 = $692.05USD =~$854.50CDN

Unfortunately...this is embarrassing...I don't have that much balance on my CC...Maxed out my CC because of some recent purchases (THANKS TO RFD :D:D)....Could somebody else order it? I will help with the distribution :)

[dmyvr]

I use the siemens one in my panel, a "slight" advantage is they also have breakers on them too so if you are tight on space, you can remove an existing breaker, and move the wires to this one, but note that you have to buy them with specific amp ratings for the breaker side.

[leonk]

Just wanted to point out that some power panels have the option to add "click in" whole house surge suppressors, just like panel breakers.

Thanks for the suggestion. These do seem to be an easier solution (if you have space problems) but I don't think they can take as much juice as the external solution.

I now installed 2 of these units.. and they're hefty! At least 1-2kg each!

According to Siemens (the maker of my box), their surge suppressor is rated @ 10,000AMPS. These units are rated @ 100,000AMPS. Also, Siemens states:

"Lightning Protection No"

Knowing how Mike Holmes likes to go way beyond code, I can now see why he pimps these so much!!

[newhope]

Just wondering, did the group buy already ordered? If not, please count me in :)

[Regin8r]

I bought the QO Square D Surgebreaker from Home Depot for $60. Looking at the specs sheet, the maximum surge current is 27kA compared to the Sycom which boasts 150kA protection.

Both are referred to as Secondary Surge Arresters, and both models only meet the UL1449 requirements. That's probably why the Sycom says for Residential and Light Commericial. The clamping voltage of Sycom is 310V vs 500V for the QO. The response time is 5ns for Sycom vs 50ns for QO.

From the Siemens literature:
"Generally accepted "credible threat" surge values from nearby lightning strikes are 500-3000A for plug-in protectors at interior locations, but 10,000A for surges at the panel.

While the Sycom seems to have 5 times surge current protection, neither will warranty against direct lighting strikes. On paper, the Sycom seems superior in all the metrics, but the Square D was available at my local HD so i went with that.

Installation took about 10 minutes.

[whodaphucru]

It attaches into the panel like any other breaker would. I don't think Cutler-Hammer is interchangable with SqD QO breakers, but some GE, ITE Siemens and other SqD breakers might be. There used to be a website that had what breakers were interchangable with what panels, but I can't find it at the moment.

The other issue is that you could have problems with home/electrical inspectors and your insurance co if they see another manufacturer's breakers inside your panel (athough sometimes you don't have a choice for an older discontinued panel). It's a lot less hassle to use the same manufacturer for both.

BTW, Culter-Hammer has thier own modular unit ($165):
http://www.homedepot.ca/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/CatalogSearchResultView?D=943213&Ntt=943213&catalogId=10051&langId=-15&storeId=10051&Dx=mode+matchallpartial&Ntx=mode+matchall&recN=0&N=0&Ntk=P_PartNumber
http://www.homedepot.ca/wcsstore/HomeDepotCanada/images/catalog/56ee57d8-196a-498b-b492-43d080dfa50b_4.jpg

"Secondary" protection is a lower level:
http://www2.sea.siemens.com/Products/Residential-Electrical/Product/Surge-Protection/You_need_a_whole_house_protection_system.htm

"Logical Solutions" is the distributor in the group buy. The unit is made by Sycom:
http://www.sycomsurge.com/

I used this one from HD, super easy to install!

[neo1973]

Is the group buy still on? If it is I am in. :)

[pmjbutler]

Thanks OP! :cheesygri

[mrmccowcow]

I'm interested in a group buy also.

[Keigotw]

It attaches into the panel like any other breaker would. I don't think Cutler-Hammer is interchangable with SqD QO breakers, but some GE, ITE Siemens and other SqD breakers might be. There used to be a website that had what breakers were interchangable with what panels, but I can't find it at the moment.

The other issue is that you could have problems with home/electrical inspectors and your insurance co if they see another manufacturer's breakers inside your panel (athough sometimes you don't have a choice for an older discontinued panel). It's a lot less hassle to use the same manufacturer for both.

BTW, Culter-Hammer has thier own modular unit ($165):
http://www.homedepot.ca/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/CatalogSearchResultView?D=943213&Ntt=943213&catalogId=10051&langId=-15&storeId=10051&Dx=mode+matchallpartial&Ntx=mode+matchall&recN=0&N=0&Ntk=P_PartNumber
http://www.homedepot.ca/wcsstore/HomeDepotCanada/images/catalog/56ee57d8-196a-498b-b492-43d080dfa50b_4.jpg

"Secondary" protection is a lower level:
http://www2.sea.siemens.com/Products/Residential-Electrical/Product/Surge-Protection/You_need_a_whole_house_protection_system.htm

"Logical Solutions" is the distributor in the group buy. The unit is made by Sycom:
http://www.sycomsurge.com/

Eaton Cutler-Hammer Whole Home Surge Protection - Standard 3-Way Protection For All Home Electronic Equipment

this one is 3,500 joules, 175,000 amps maximum surge current

the one op posted is 150,000 amps maximum surge current (after shipping is like $90 Canadian)

so is it worth it to get the Eaton Cutler-Hammer , for $96.45 more??

[l69norm]

....so is it worth it to get the Eaton Cutler-Hammer , for $96.45 more??
The HD unit is a locally available option (and also has protection for the phone/cable TV lines as well). I imagine HD in Buffalo might have it for cheaper.

BTW, Sycom has offices in Ottawa, so I imagine their unit is also locally available up here as well.

[Keigotw]

The HD unit is a locally available option (and also has protection for the phone/cable TV lines as well). I imagine HD in Buffalo might have it for cheaper.

BTW, Sycom has offices in Ottawa, so I imagine their unit is also locally available up here as well.

Cool, might get this one instead , phone and cable protection is a plus

[l69norm]

Though I would bump this thread with this find.

Intermatic AG2401 Whole House Surge Arrestor
http://www.paigewire.com/Specs/images/ag2401.jpg

Specs:
http://www.1000bulbs.com/images/PDF/AG2401C-Surge-Arrester-Specsheet.pdf
http://www.paigewire.com/Specs/ag2401.htm

For 120/240 VAC Single phase applications Also called 120/240 VAC Split phase
For installation in Category “C”, “B” and “A” locations
Service Entrance, branch panel and individual equipment applications
Parallel installation
Multi-Mode protection Line - to - Ground, Line - to - Line
NEMA 4 polycarbonate plastic enclosure
½” nipple wire entry
UV resistant
18", 12-gauge color coded leads
UL Listed to Lightning Protective Device OWHX - Listing Number 94X1
CSA Certified Listing Number LR38268
Two year product warranty


Regular US price = $29.95
Princess Auto 8188112 = $18.71

Now the best part. These appear to have arrived too late for the sidewalk sale last week, so they are now marked as 75% off. Perhaps people didn't know what these units are and passed up on them? There's about 30 in stock at the one Princess Auto I checked

Princess Auto Final price $4.68 !!!

The bad part. The specs aren't that great compared to the Sycom:
Model 1500A 3000A 5000A 10,000A 20,000A
AG2401 490V 640V 980V 1,410V 3,210V

[mork]

$5 is a steal.

I had ordered the one the OP posted and got it pretty quick and finally just installed it today. As per the instructions, I did not use a new breaker but put it on an existing 2-pole breaker (my stove). Installation took a total of maybe 5 minutes..

[wally_walrus]

Though I would bump this thread with this find.

Intermatic AG2401 Whole House Surge Arrestor
http://www.paigewire.com/Specs/images/ag2401.jpg

Specs:
http://www.1000bulbs.com/images/PDF/AG2401C-Surge-Arrester-Specsheet.pdf
http://www.paigewire.com/Specs/ag2401.htm

For 120/240 VAC Single phase applications Also called 120/240 VAC Split phase
For installation in Category “C”, “B” and “A” locations
Service Entrance, branch panel and individual equipment applications
Parallel installation
Multi-Mode protection Line - to - Ground, Line - to - Line
NEMA 4 polycarbonate plastic enclosure
½” nipple wire entry
UV resistant
18", 12-gauge color coded leads
UL Listed to Lightning Protective Device OWHX - Listing Number 94X1
CSA Certified Listing Number LR38268
Two year product warranty


Regular US price = $29.95
Princess Auto 8188112 = $18.71

Now the best part. These appear to have arrived too late for the sidewalk sale last week, so they are now marked as 75% off. Perhaps people didn't know what these units are and passed up on them? There's about 30 in stock at the one Princess Auto I checked

Princess Auto Final price $4.68 !!!

The bad part. The specs aren't that great compared to the Sycom:
Model 1500A 3000A 5000A 10,000A 20,000A
AG2401 490V 640V 980V 1,410V 3,210V



I'd rather not take the risk and order the Sycom

[Ride-On]

BTW, Sycom has offices in Ottawa, so I imagine their unit is also locally available up here as well.

Talked to the Sycom distributor a couple of days ago and have ordered a unit to be installed on Monday. Distributor was very friendly and super helpful - he'll answer any technical questions you might have. Note that there is no longer an office in Canada though and he can only sell Sycom products to contractors, not direct to consumer. He referred me to a contractor in Ottawa, who was equally helpful and friendly.

Hope that helps!