Seeking advice on cutting after bulking

[Pro]

Hey all!

I'm looking for more insight on a question. I have been asking people here and there and the answers aren't very precise.

I'm currently bulking up (12 more weeks to go) and I will cut after I'm done. Now I have read in the past that I should reach my desired weight and stay there for a while before cutting so I don't lose all that muscle quick 'n fast. So how long do I stay at my weight before I start cutting?

Please lmk, thanks in advance!

[df329]

maintain for about 4 weeks and then start cutting

i'm cutting and i ate this after the gym today :D

http://i44.tinypic.com/1fb9mv.jpg

[Pro]

ah, sounds good man - thanks!

dude I gotta say, that looks pretty nasty! The burger looks ok but I'm a fan of Wendy's ;)

Is that pop?? Shouldn't you be avoiding that stuff?

[df329]

ah, sounds good man - thanks!

dude I gotta say, that looks pretty nasty! The burger looks ok but I'm a fan of Wendy's ;)

Is that pop?? Shouldn't you be avoiding that stuff?

chocolate milk shake :cheesygri

it's absolutely delicious... best food I've had in a long time!


it's from golden star

[poedua]

Hey all!

I'm looking for more insight on a question. I have been asking people here and there and the answers aren't very precise.

I'm currently bulking up (12 more weeks to go) and I will cut after I'm done.

Now I have read in the past that I should reach my desired weight and stay there for a while before cutting so I don't lose all that muscle quick 'n fast.

So how long do I stay at my weight before I start cutting? Please lmk, thanks in advance!

Just start ' cutting ' ( :rolleyes: ) once you hit your target bulk weight 12 weeks from now - there's no need to wait.

[Pro]

Just start ' cutting ' ( :rolleyes: ) once you hit your target bulk weight 12 weeks from now - there's no need to wait.


Hmm...interesting. Some people I talk to say it's good to acclimate myself at a weight level before beginning the cut. What can I do to minimize muscle loss?

[df329]

Hmm...interesting. Some people I talk to say it's good to acclimate myself at a weight level before beginning the cut. What can I do to minimize muscle loss?

i dont think it makes a difference, but eating wise it's a lot easier if you stop stuffing your face for awhile before cutting back even more :!:

[Pro]

i dont think it makes a difference, but eating wise it's a lot easier if you stop stuffing your face for awhile before cutting back even more :!:

true true
haha i'm really not looking forward to lowering my calories!! i love eating!!
now that i'm savage hungry right now, that combo you posted earlier looks a lot better than before!! mmmmmmmmmmm milkshake

[Petden]

I have a pretty good bulking meal plan I can post, I managed to gain about 15lbs in a little less than 6 weeks.

As for cutting, I would maintain it for a short period of time, 1 week should be fine, because that in itself will be cutting (as you wont be gaining weight) then slowly, and I stress slowly cut from there. If you cut too fast you will loose too much muscle and you will feel tired and much weaker than normal.

[Pro]

I have a pretty good bulking meal plan I can post, I managed to gain about 15lbs in a little less than 6 weeks.

As for cutting, I would maintain it for a short period of time, 1 week should be fine, because that in itself will be cutting (as you wont be gaining weight) then slowly, and I stress slowly cut from there. If you cut too fast you will loose too much muscle and you will feel tired and much weaker than normal.

Please post! I would love to see what is fueling you.

[df329]

I have a pretty good bulking meal plan I can post, I managed to gain about 15lbs in a little less than 6 weeks.

As for cutting, I would maintain it for a short period of time, 1 week should be fine, because that in itself will be cutting (as you wont be gaining weight) then slowly, and I stress slowly cut from there. If you cut too fast you will loose too much muscle and you will feel tired and much weaker than normal.

15 lbs in 6 weeks is a lot of water/fat :!:

[LargeOne]

Alot depends on what stage your at or how much fat you have to loose and what your overall goals are.Do you want to look good on the beach or are you prepping for a contest? While training to gain as much muscle as possible or "bulking"a common mistake is eating as much of and any kind of food you want.Calories must still be clean and stay away from the junk food.You are trying to build muscle not cover it with layers of unwanted fat.Wendy's once a week might be fine but before you head there after the gym you might want to look into post workout sodium consumption and its effects.The list goes on but sodium is just one of the things you should cut back on.If nothing else for cardiovascular reasons as well.You wouldn't use garbage to build a house and then expect it to live in comfort would you?The same can be said for your body and nutrition.
If you can give me a few more details I might be able to help.

[poedua]

Hmm...interesting. Some people I talk to say it's good to acclimate myself at a weight level before beginning the cut.

What can I do to minimize muscle loss?

That sort of depends on what your body fat % is 12 weeks from now and how many lbs of that fat you want to lose and how quickly you want to lose it. That said, if you are trying to lose fat and you're losing a noticeable amount of muscle at the same time, then your diet is the primary suspect IMO - and it's likely out of whack in some way.

Assuming you maintain a reasonably balanced diet without too severe a caloire deficit, I'd think dropping something like 1 - 2 lbs of fat a week would a prudent approach to minimize any risk of muscle loss along the way. Again, it sort of depends on how quickly you want to lose the fat and how much fat you want to lose within whatever time frame you set for yourself.

A few questions............

- when the time comes 12 weeks from now to start losing fat, how will you go about tracking to see if your expected weight loss is due to a loss of fat or a loss of muscle - or both ?

- what is your present ( or most recent ) body fat % ?

- how will your strength training sessions change ( if at all ) once you start trying to lose that fat starting 12 weeks from now ?

[poedua]

I have a pretty good bulking meal plan I can post,


I managed to gain about 15lbs in a little less than 6 weeks.


:rolleyes:

You gained 15lbs in a little less than 6 weeks...........about 2.5 lbs of weight a week ..........for 6 weeks straight.


- How much of that 15lb gain was due to added fat and how much of that 15lb gain was due to added muscle ?

- How much did you weigh before you put on this 15 lbs anyway ?

[Mintmaster]

I've seen some pretty good arguments against the bulking/cutting approach to bodybuilding. When fat cells accumulate, they tend to divide and increase in numbers, especially around the gut. It's non-linear, so this happens in problem areas first. Then, when you burn the fat, those cells don't die; instead, your fat distribution changes, so compared to the your body shape before bulking, you have more fat in the gut and less elsewhere even if you get back to the same overall body fat %.

Muscle, however, doesn't behave this way, and all you can do is make each muscle fibre bigger. The best approach, then, is to just gain weight slowly, like maybe 10 lbs a year, keeping your BF at decent levels all the time by adjusting your caloric intake. As poedua suggests, it unlikely that much of your 15 lbs in six weeks is muscle.

Now, I haven't verified this myself, and even if I did it would be anecdotal. However, it makes sense. I see a lot of people who have a gut but are absolutely ripped everywhere else. You gotta think that they'd need to achieve 5% BF to get their trunk to look like a guy with more evenly distributed 15% BF.

[BongoBong]

I've seen some pretty good arguments against the bulking/cutting approach to bodybuilding. When fat cells accumulate, they tend to divide and increase in numbers, especially around the gut. It's non-linear, so this happens in problem areas first. Then, when you burn the fat, those cells don't die; instead, your fat distribution changes, so compared to the your body shape before bulking, you have more fat in the gut and less elsewhere even if you get back to the same overall body fat %.

Do you have some links to that research? would be interested to read on that.

[Petden]

Most of my 15lbs was fat, and most of the foods were clean. I was a smaller kid and I was looking to put on quite a bit of wiehgt and trianer afterwards, feed the muscle and starve the fat. Since then I have lost 5lbs and the rest has been turned into solid muscle. I am the exact same body fat % as I was before the bulk, (took about 3-3.5 months though).

Breakfast- 160g of cereal (vector) with 1-1.25 litres of milk
- Multivitamin
-4 pieces of toast with 2 times the serving of peanut butter per toast
-2 glases of OJ

Lunch -2 giant plates of pasta (I'm Italian so giant is GIANT) about 4 servings
-2-4 meatballs
-1 6 in. cold-meat sandwich

Snack 1 - 1 chicken sandwich

Snack 2 - usually another sandwich with cheese, to tie you over until dinner

Dinner -4 chicken breasts unbreaded
- another bowl of pasta (a different type of course)
- 2-3 fruits and vegies

Snack 3 - some leftovers, trying to maintain nutritional value

Snack 4 - Half a bag of cookies with another 1 litre of milk

My goal was between 6500-7000 calories a day. The carb intake here I believe is around 450. Most of these foods are pretty good, nothing aside for the cookies that scream murder.

[poedua]

Most of my 15lbs was fat.

I am the exact same body fat % as I was before the bulk.

My goal was between 6500-7000 calories a day.

How much did you weigh BEFORE the bulk ?

[Petden]

Before the bulk I was about 158lbs.

[poedua]

Before the bulk I was about 158lbs.

What was your body fat % before the bulk ?

[LargeOne]

Most of my 15lbs was fat, and most of the foods were clean. I was a smaller kid and I was looking to put on quite a bit of wiehgt and trianer afterwards, feed the muscle and starve the fat. Since then I have lost 5lbs and the rest has been turned into solid muscle. I am the exact same body fat % as I was before the bulk, (took about 3-3.5 months though).

Breakfast- 160g of cereal (vector) with 1-1.25 litres of milk
- Multivitamin
-4 pieces of toast with 2 times the serving of peanut butter per toast
-2 glases of OJ

Lunch -2 giant plates of pasta (I'm Italian so giant is GIANT) about 4 servings
-2-4 meatballs
-1 6 in. cold-meat sandwich

Snack 1 - 1 chicken sandwich

Snack 2 - usually another sandwich with cheese, to tie you over until dinner

Dinner -4 chicken breasts unbreaded
- another bowl of pasta (a different type of course)
- 2-3 fruits and vegies

Snack 3 - some leftovers, trying to maintain nutritional value

Snack 4 - Half a bag of cookies with another 1 litre of milk

My goal was between 6500-7000 calories a day. The carb intake here I believe is around 450. Most of these foods are pretty good, nothing aside for the cookies that scream murder.

To tell you the truth I have seen sumos eat less.Far too many carbs,that is close to the carb intake of your average competitive marathon triathlete.Meal frequency is terrible ex.last meal of the day is cookies!!!

[Petden]

I love cookies though, I tried to cut them out, but, i'd rather those than mcDicks.

and my body fat % before was 10%.

[poedua]

I love cookies though, I tried to cut them out, but, i'd rather those than mcDicks.

and my body fat % before was 10%.

Admitting that you eat half a bag of cookies simply as an evening snack - sadly - speaks for itself. :rolleyes:

You should ' clean up ' your diet as much as you can IMO.

A good start ?

Cut out BOTH cookies and mcDicks from your diet.

[LargeOne]

Admitting that you eat half a bag of cookies simply as an evening snack - sadly - speaks for itself. :rolleyes:

You should ' clean up ' your diet as much as you can IMO.

A good start ?

Cut out BOTH cookies and mcDicks from your diet.

Very true.....if you want to cut as you say you will need alot more dedication.

[Petden]

Maybe I was misunderstood. That list was when I was bulking not now, now everything is back to normal. I was asked to post my bulking list and that is what I did.

I appologize if this caused any confusion.

[TheFuteballer]

jebus f*in chris !! 7000 calories!?

I'm bulking with 3000 calories LOL (gaining about a pound of muscle a week). No cookies, no junk... pure fresh healthy foods only.

[Petden]

With my body you need a lot to gain. For whatever reason I dont gain very easily. My average daily intake is about 3300 calories. Thats not trying to bulk, just maintain my weight. If im playing rugby that day I will add an extra 300-500 calories before the game and around 600+ after the game. Most of these will come from a gorgeous fruit-protein shake that I make. It actually tastes very good.

[randomdef]

Most of my 15lbs was fat, and most of the foods were clean. I was a smaller kid and I was looking to put on quite a bit of wiehgt and trianer afterwards, feed the muscle and starve the fat. Since then I have lost 5lbs and the rest has been turned into solid muscle. I am the exact same body fat % as I was before the bulk, (took about 3-3.5 months though).

Breakfast- 160g of cereal (vector) with 1-1.25 litres of milk
- Multivitamin
-4 pieces of toast with 2 times the serving of peanut butter per toast
-2 glases of OJ

Lunch -2 giant plates of pasta (I'm Italian so giant is GIANT) about 4 servings
-2-4 meatballs
-1 6 in. cold-meat sandwich

Snack 1 - 1 chicken sandwich

Snack 2 - usually another sandwich with cheese, to tie you over until dinner

Dinner -4 chicken breasts unbreaded
- another bowl of pasta (a different type of course)
- 2-3 fruits and vegies

Snack 3 - some leftovers, trying to maintain nutritional value

Snack 4 - Half a bag of cookies with another 1 litre of milk

My goal was between 6500-7000 calories a day. The carb intake here I believe is around 450. Most of these foods are pretty good, nothing aside for the cookies that scream murder.


You call it bulking, anyone else calls it binging. that isnt a diet, thats just eating to gain 'weight'. way too much carbs, sugar, and more sugar


sorry dude, that 15lbs was ALL fat. i doubt you gained one single pound of muscle.

[randomdef]

With my body you need a lot to gain. For whatever reason I dont gain very easily. My average daily intake is about 3300 calories. Thats not trying to bulk, just maintain my weight. If im playing rugby that day I will add an extra 300-500 calories before the game and around 600+ after the game. Most of these will come from a gorgeous fruit-protein shake that I make. It actually tastes very good.

fruit protien, that fruit is just glucose which is a simple carb and converts to fat. you have an awful gameplan unless you change your goal to being a lardass. then its a great plan.

[poedua]

fruit protien, that fruit is just glucose which is a simple carb and converts to fat. you have an awful gameplan unless you change your goal to being a lardass. then its a great plan.

Both simple and complex carbs get converted to glucose. And simple carbs ( i.e dextrose ) don't automatically convert to fat.

It's ' excess ' carbs ( ditto for fat and protein ) beyond what your body requires that gets stored as fat.

[Petden]

I was always told that simple carbs are good after a workout.

[LargeOne]

Post workout you want high glycemic carbs.High glycemic means it raises insulin or gives you that insulin spike often refered to.At other times you do not want to raise insulin levels so stick with low glycemic carbs.Fructose or fruit sugar is low glycemic so a bad choice post workout.

[tallAJ]

sometimes i wonder why people still try to bulk up and end of with 50% of their weight being fat. not to say this is the case of the OP cause i dont feel like reading that many posts. why not eat clean and put on quality mass. by the time you cut cut, you much lean mass have you lost? with new methods out there, its alot easier to put on size...with 80% being lean mass.

if you think whey is nasty, that shows you right there that you are not mentally motivated to complete your task. few it as fuel and not a shake. maybe add some berries to it and not with water.

[BongoBong]

I was always told that simple carbs are good after a workout.

Well I think it depends on how you decide to define a simple carb. I believe in the working out world alot of the time a simple carb is described as a carb that has a high glycemic index (raises blood glucose levels quickly). But in science a simple carb is a monosaccharide or disaccharide. So lets say apples which have fructose (a monosaccharide) would be considered a simple sugar in the science world, but it has a low glycemic index so wouldn't be considered a simple carb in the bodybuilding world.

as far as what would be the best "simple carbs" you should eat I probably wouldnt be the most knowledgeable, but dextrose is certainly one that is high GI and recommended alot.

as far as simple carbs being converted to fat thats not true, its only when you have excess calories (which can come from any kind of carb or protein or fat) that you will gain fat.