-*-LOST-*---------Season 5------------

[ladybug193]

After such a LONG wait for season 5, LOST is starting Wednesday at 8 p.m EST!
A link to watch full episodes online is listed below.

Full Episodes (as they are aired)
http://www.cucirca.com/2007/05/12/watch-lost-online/

First there will be a 1 hour clip show, then two new episodes which are titled:

5x1 - Because You Left
5x2 - The Lie

Continuing episodes are

5x3 - Jughead
5x4 - The Little Prince
5x5 - This Place is Death
5x6 - The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham
5x7 - 316
5x8 - LeFleur
5x9 - Namaste
5x10 - He's Our You

5x11 - Whatever Happened Happened
5x12 - Dead Is Dead
5x13 - Some Like It Hoth
5x14 - The Variable
5x15 - Follow The Leader
5x16/17 - The Incident

You can see all of the season 5 trailers here
http://abc.go.com/primetime/lost/index?pn=index

The new season will be adding quite a few new characters and removing some, no doubt.
It looks to be another excellent season of LOST entertainment!

OK, so tell me that I'm not the only one that's just thrilled that it's FINALLY back :D

[AzN_RiverdaleCI]

can't wait! totally forgot about lost!

[RayK]

love this show

[brocoli]

Completely caught up. Watched all 4 seasons and am ready for this one! WOOOOOOO!

[cmackie]

This show completely jumped the shark before the end of season 2.

http://guestofaguest.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/12/jump_the_shark.png

[zod]

This show completely jumped the shark before the end of season 2.

http://guestofaguest.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/12/jump_the_shark.png

I also didn't like season 2, season 3 was ok, but I really really liked last season. I'd recommend it to anyone that gave up in the 2nd season.

[originalnutta]

This show completely jumped the shark before the end of season 2.

http://guestofaguest.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/12/jump_the_shark.png

How so?

[AzN_RiverdaleCI]

I actually forgot what happened last season, can someone recap link me or explain quickly?

[djjosee]

Two days and counting! :D

[mecassa]

Looks like there will be no breaks in between eps! Excellent!

[RayK]

I actually forgot what happened last season, can someone recap link me or explain quickly?

I'll try and recap the main points of the end of Season 4 for you:


Oceanic Six (Jack, Kate, Hurley, Sayid, Sun, Aaron) got off the island

In addition, Frank (the pilot) and Desmond get off the island as well (everyone was resuced by Penny)

Freighter explodes with Jin still on it

Sawyer jumped from the helicopter and when he reaches the island he realizes that the freighter has exploded (thinks his friends are dead)

Ben moved the island, and as a result can never return to it

Locke is now the leader of the Others

In the flash forward we find out Locke is the one in the casket and Ben tells Jack everyone has to go back to the island together

[AzN_RiverdaleCI]

I'll try and recap the main points of the end of Season 4 for you:


Oceanic Six (Jack, Kate, Hurley, Sayid, Sun, Aaron) got off the island

In addition, Frank (the pilot) and Desmond get off the island as well (everyone was resuced by Penny)

Freighter explodes with Jin still on it

Sawyer jumped from the helicopter and when he reaches the island he realizes that the freighter has exploded (thinks his friends are dead)

Ben moved the island, and as a result can never return to it

Locke is now the leader of the Others

In the flash forward we find out Locke is the one in the casket and Ben tells Jack everyone has to go back to the island together


thanks I am now caught up.

[markj]

thanks for the recap they better have a damn good reason to go back to the island...

[Badman]

I was reading the preview of season 5 and they said to understand it much better you should watch the season finally of season 4.

Can't wait for this show.

[idk-bart]

so is this like prison break then? are they gonna be getting out and going back on to the island season after season? :cheesygri

[ladybug193]

Nice recap RayK :)

I'm so pumped for this season:D. I think we are going to see a lot of the connections finally coming together....espescially considering there's only one season left after this.
Anyone else think that Juliette and Sawyer are going to get together?

55 minutes and counting until show start time...:lol::lol::lol:

[Nikita]

After such a LONG wait for season 5, LOST is starting Wednesday at 8 p.m EST!
First there will be a 1 hour clip show, then two new episodes which are titled:

5x1 - Because You Left
5x2 - The Lie



The next upcoming seven episodes are titled:
5x3 - Jughead
5x4 - The Little Prince
5x5 - This Place is Death
5x6 - The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham
5x7 - 316
5x8 - LeFleur
5x9 - Namaste
5x10 - He's Our You

You can see all of the season 5 trailers here
http://abc.go.com/primetime/lost/index?pn=index

The new season will be adding quite a few new characters and removing some, no doubt.
It looks to be another excellent season of LOST entertainment!

OK, so tell me that I'm not the only one that's just thrilled that it's FINALLY back :D

I don't see any trailers on the site, just full episodes and it says they're only available within the U.S....:cry:

Or is there another link to trailers that I'm just not seeing on the site??

NVM...found it..lol, yeah I can't even wait another 45 minutes...yep, I'm hooked!

[djjosee]

It's go time!

[originalnutta]

Nice recap RayK :)

I'm so pumped for this season:D. I think we are going to see a lot of the connections finally coming together....espescially considering there's only one season left after this.
Anyone else think that Juliette and Sawyer are going to get together?

55 minutes and counting until show start time...:lol::lol::lol:

If Sawyer and Juliette hook up, then Sawyer will have gotten a hat trick.

And Jack is still 0-3. Well in the present at least.

[felix]

Is it slightly freezing for anyone else watching on Rogers HD? It happens between cuts (eg. right before commercial break)

[Rosico]

wow, the first two episodes are all over the place...

[felix]

I think the show has actually gotten better since they introduced the time travelling theme. I started watching at the end of season 3 or 4 I think, because the first season was pretty slow when I tried to watch it due to the hype.

Who is the old lady Ben was talking to at the end?

[billdozer]

Who is the old lady Ben was talking to at the end?

We've seen her before, in Desmond's timeflashes

http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Flashes_Before_Your_Eyes

My guess is she's Daniel's mother that Desmond has to meet up with.

[billdozer]

yep it was doing that all night for me...stupid rogers hd...charging more but still give crappy service

lost is too much for me, this first two ep had so much information and mystery

WOAH. Has LOST gotten to RFD? Your post says you posted this at 11:59PM....yet it's only 11:26PM......... :eek:

[N_Raged]

lost is too much for me, this first two ep had so much information and mystery
People don't choose to watch LOST. LOST chooses its viewers.


And more about time travel, check out RFD's time anomalies:
http://raged.n.googlepages.com/RFDLOST.jpg

[TechRock]

Is it slightly freezing for anyone else watching on Rogers HD? It happens between cuts (eg. right before commercial break)

yep it was doing that all night for me...stupid rogers hd...charging more but still give crappy service

lost is too much for me, this first two ep had so much information and mystery

[Hoodwink]

I found these two episodes solved a lot of the stories and it's setting the show up for more action. Perfectly fine with me.

[channy]

Is it slightly freezing for anyone else watching on Rogers HD? It happens between cuts (eg. right before commercial break)
This happens to me as well, it's not just LOST though, this happens with several other ABC shows too, I guess the channel is messed (atleast for me anyway)

[RayK]

yea ABC is messed up like that, always slightly freezes, thats why i waited to watch it on timeshifting, ABCW...

[rdtx2002]

This show completely jumped the shark before the end of season 2.


i question your viewing habits.

[Badman]

amazing episode.

Now there's the "other" others:lol:

[idk-bart]

amazing episode.

Now there's the "other" others:lol:

lol @ at the chopping the hand off to show we're serious part. what kind of noob interrogation technique is that.

[IronMan08]

This show has gone down the crapper, they were consistent with flashbacks, but not consistent with explaining things such as the smoke monster and bs.
The Office and 24 remain the last of tv's best, along with House.

The rest of the great shows are on HBO: Dexter, The Shield etc.

[Lucky 24]

This show has gone down the crapper, they were consistent with flashbacks, but not consistent with explaining things such as the smoke monster and bs.
The Office and 24 remain the last of tv's best, along with House.

The rest of the great shows are on HBO: Dexter, The Shield etc.

Speak for yourself. Last season was critically acclaimed and yesterday's premiere drew raving reviews from the majority of the entertainment press. It's great to have a show on T.V. that is so riveting and has the production values of a motion picture.

[IronMan08]

Speak for yourself. Last season was critically acclaimed and yesterday's premiere drew raving reviews from the majority of the entertainment press. It's great to have a show on T.V. that is so riveting and has the production values of a motion picture.

So you follow in the footsteps of critics and the 'majority of the entertainment press.' I read the 'majority' of what they said. And it looked like they were paid off to say some of the things they said.
What production values of a motion picture were you referring to? The cheesy air plane crash? The evaporating island? The lack of a progression in plot?
The first 3 seasons were stellar in creating tension and suspense, and the 4th I can give the writers a break due to the strike.
But if they don't deliver in these last two season's, this series was definitely an utter waste of time.

ABC - 1
IronMan08 - 0

[originalnutta]

So you follow in the footsteps of critics and the 'majority of the entertainment press.' I read the 'majority' of what they said. And it looked like they were paid off to say some of the things they said.
What production values of a motion picture were you referring to? The cheesy air plane crash? The evaporating island? The lack of a progression in plot?
The first 3 seasons were stellar in creating tension and suspense, and the 4th I can give the writers a break due to the strike.
But if they don't deliver in these last two season's, this series was definitely an utter waste of time.

ABC - 1
IronMan08 - 0

You like the Office and 24. One dimensional shows that are taken at face value and gratify the viewer within a scene or episode. All action without any story. I need something to fill that void too, which is why i watch The Shield, 24 and Prison Break.

I don't need the press to tell me how great season 4 was. I gathered that information from fellow LOST fans, and by watching it myself.

As for the press being paid off, that's just speculation. I could say that the majority of Obama voters were paid off.

Clearly you have a different taste in movies and TV shows. There's no need to watch LOST anymore.

[originalnutta]

This show has gone down the crapper, they were consistent with flashbacks, but not consistent with explaining things such as the smoke monster and bs.
The Office and 24 remain the last of tv's best, along with House.

The rest of the great shows are on HBO: Dexter, The Shield etc.

They were consistent with flashbacks, but not with giving us resolutions to every question, thus ending the show?

[IronMan08]

You like the Office and 24. One dimensional shows that are taken at face value and gratify the viewer within a scene or episode. All action without any story. I need something to fill that void too, which is why i watch The Shield, 24 and Prison Break.

I don't need the press to tell me how great season 4 was. I gathered that information from fellow LOST fans, and by watching it myself.

As for the press being paid off, that's just speculation. I could say that the majority of Obama voters were paid off.

Clearly you have a different taste in movies and TV shows. There's no need to watch LOST anymore.

Well when you gather information from fans, you are absorbed into a bias.
All I was saying is that there's this huge build up to LOST, and if it disappoints, I won't be as disappointed as you guys who are riding strong with the program.
Similarily how "Soprano" fans were destroyed with that last episode.
And right now the writers of Lost are promising that the conclusion of this series will be memorable, remarkable all that nonsense. They also ranted on how they knew where the story was going from the beginning.
I highly doubt that, because as I said they maintained consistency with respect to flashbacks, but in other areas of the show they lacked.
Hence why I think the show's going down the crapper now.
And yes The Office and 24 are 1 dimensional. That's what I want from a TV show. I don't want to be dragged into something like Lost again where I continuously watch and every week I find out that a character in the show, knew another character in the show before they crashed on the island.
Utter bull.
And 24 and The Shield do have stories, they actually commence at the beginning of the season and they conclude at the end.
That's how it's supposed to be with the odd cliffhanger, not a cliffhanger and a couple of head scratchers at the end of each episode and season.

And FYI Muppet: Prison Break got cancelled. A show with a title that shouldn't have gone more than 2 seasons. I'm surprised they ran it that long.
IronMan08 - 1
You - 0

[rtto5588]

What's with keeping score? Did you but a ball in a hoop or a puck in the net?

I don't care what anyone says, I think Lost is still a stellar show compared to what's out there. I agree with Ironman about consistency, but what show doesn't have some inconsistencies throughout the whole run of the series.

The premiere was good. My favorite character in Lost is Desmond. I'm just sad he only had one scene, but I'm sure we'll see him get a whole episode devoted to him this season like previous. Can't wait.

[belowzeros]

what a great premiere...so juicy. hopefully the pace keeps up the whole season and they don't save the unloading of secrets for the last year.

[SAN66]

Prediction - Faraday opens the chamber and this is where the smoke monster comes from. The chamber is obviously open in the future as this is where Ben went to move the island.

[RestIsHistory]

Stupid question but which Season 5 episode aired first. s05e01? or s05e02?

I watched online s05e02 first.

[IronMan08]

s05e01
then
s05e02

[SAN66]

Stupid question but which Season 5 episode aired first. s05e01? or s05e02?

I watched online s05e02 first.

There was a s05e00 which was a recap, then a 2 hour premiere which would either be listed as S05e01 in full or split into s05e01 and s05e02.

I would think it slightly confusing watching the second half of the 2 hour premiere before the first, no?

[ptownplayer]

Well when you gather information from fans, you are absorbed into a bias.
All I was saying is that there's this huge build up to LOST, and if it disappoints, I won't be as disappointed as you guys who are riding strong with the program.
Similarily how "Soprano" fans were destroyed with that last episode.
And right now the writers of Lost are promising that the conclusion of this series will be memorable, remarkable all that nonsense. They also ranted on how they knew where the story was going from the beginning.
I highly doubt that, because as I said they maintained consistency with respect to flashbacks, but in other areas of the show they lacked.
Hence why I think the show's going down the crapper now.
And yes The Office and 24 are 1 dimensional. That's what I want from a TV show. I don't want to be dragged into something like Lost again where I continuously watch and every week I find out that a character in the show, knew another character in the show before they crashed on the island.
Utter bull.
And 24 and The Shield do have stories, they actually commence at the beginning of the season and they conclude at the end.
That's how it's supposed to be with the odd cliffhanger, not a cliffhanger and a couple of head scratchers at the end of each episode and season.

And FYI Muppet: Prison Break got cancelled. A show with a title that shouldn't have gone more than 2 seasons. I'm surprised they ran it that long.
IronMan08 - 1
You - 0

Dude...if all you want from TV is a 1 dimensional show then why are you watching a show like lost in the first place and then coming on to lost appreciation thread and dissing the show??

Im a huge fan of both 24 and Lost ...but I must say that last season and the first two episodes of this season have raised the bar past 24...LOVED the Lost season premiere...and no, shows do not have to begin at the season and conclude at the end of the season...thats what makes lost great...also why does everything have to explained?..ie the black smoke monster..do you need everything to be wrapped up in a nice little box with a pretty little bow on top? ...and no Soprano fans were not destroyed??? by the end of sopranos...the last season of sopranos was probably my favourite season.

[RestIsHistory]

There was a s05e00 which was a recap, then a 2 hour premiere which would either be listed as S05e01 in full or split into s05e01 and s05e02.

I would think it slightly confusing watching the second half of the 2 hour premiere before the first, no?

Yes it was quite confusing.

Was wondering when Daniel had left the group and who was the old lady.

Eztv had Lost s05e02 listed first so I thought s05e02 aired first.

[SAN66]

Yes it was quite confusing.

Was wondering when Daniel had left the group and who was the old lady.

Eztv had Lost s05e02 listed first so I thought s05e02 aired first.

Just remember in the future S (for season) # E (For episode) #, so Episode 1 will always air before episode 2. On occasion some networks air shows out of order, sometimes you don't notice in a non serial type show, but for a show like lost its incredibly noticeable.

[felix]

It looks like the sci-fi fans agree that the last couple seasons were better than the first few. :-0

[originalnutta]

Well when you gather information from fans, you are absorbed into a bias.
All I was saying is that there's this huge build up to LOST, and if it disappoints, I won't be as disappointed as you guys who are riding strong with the program.
Similarily how "Soprano" fans were destroyed with that last episode.
And right now the writers of Lost are promising that the conclusion of this series will be memorable, remarkable all that nonsense. They also ranted on how they knew where the story was going from the beginning.
I highly doubt that, because as I said they maintained consistency with respect to flashbacks, but in other areas of the show they lacked.
Hence why I think the show's going down the crapper now.
And yes The Office and 24 are 1 dimensional. That's what I want from a TV show. I don't want to be dragged into something like Lost again where I continuously watch and every week I find out that a character in the show, knew another character in the show before they crashed on the island.
Utter bull.
And 24 and The Shield do have stories, they actually commence at the beginning of the season and they conclude at the end.
That's how it's supposed to be with the odd cliffhanger, not a cliffhanger and a couple of head scratchers at the end of each episode and season.

And FYI Muppet: Prison Break got cancelled. A show with a title that shouldn't have gone more than 2 seasons. I'm surprised they ran it that long.
IronMan08 - 1
You - 0Yeah but fans can also change their minds about the show.
Lots of people said they didn't like season 2, or 3 or 4 or whatever.

And like if LOST doesn't give answers, then don't worry about it, since you won't be watching anymore to care.

The producers of the show maintained consistency? I didn't know that they were obliged to maintain a consistency with revelations and flashbacks. Was their a quota? Apparently season 6 should have fewer flashbacks and flashforwards. The show is a sci-fi mystery. The mysterious part being that answers are not given to the viewer right away. I know thinking might hurt many TV viewer's brains, but true LOST fans enjoy it. Which is why the show is a hit. As far as the show going down the crapper, that's your entitled opinion. But you certainly can't speak for the masses that tune in every week.

You might want a one dimensional show, but i prefer something that makes me think, discuss and search for clues and answers.

As far as 24 and The Shield commencing and concluding within a season, i didn't know there was a rule book as to how a show was supposed to be laid out. LOST is a hit, because almost every episode ends in a head-scratcher and cliffhanger. It's clearly doing something right.

And yes i know Prison Break got cancelled. I didn't want it to go past the first season.

Muppet - 1
IronMan08 - 0

[originalnutta]

Dude...if all you want from TV is a 1 dimensional show then why are you watching a show like lost in the first place and then coming on to lost appreciation thread and dissing the show??

Im a huge fan of both 24 and Lost ...but I must say that last season and the first two episodes of this season have raised the bar past 24...LOVED the Lost season premiere...and no, shows do not have to begin at the season and conclude at the end of the season...thats what makes lost great...also why does everything have to explained?..ie the black smoke monster..do you need everything to be wrapped up in a nice little box with a pretty little bow on top? ...and no Soprano fans were not destroyed??? by the end of sopranos...the last season of sopranos was probably my favourite season.


The Sopranos had gone on longer than the producers would have wanted it to. Because of the fans they dragged it out to another season. I wasn't the biggest Sopranos fan, but i have seen every episode and was impartial as to how it ended. It could have just ended with them sitting at the diner and then credits. Wouldn't have made a difference. I guess everyone wanted some gunshots and fireworks.


With LOST i'm almost certain that we will not be given all the answers to our questions at the series finale. But i don't mind. I prefer chatting to my friends about it and coming up with our own answers. For Ironman08's sake, Hollywood should make a LOST movie, which tells you everything that is about to happen, and then gives you the answers right away, so you don't have to do any thinking. Starring The Rock, Angelina Jolie, and Shia LeBeef.

[ptownplayer]

For Ironman08's sake, Hollywood should make a LOST movie, which tells you everything that is about to happen, and then gives you the answers right away, so you don't have to do any thinking. Starring The Rock, Angelina Jolie, and Shia LeBeef.

...and directed by Michael Bay:lol:

[originalnutta]

...and directed by Michael Bay:lol:

*American Flag slowly swaying in the background*

[belowzeros]

Was wondering when Daniel had left the group and who was the old lady.


that's the problem with a show like LOST that is very serial.

you've actually seen the old lady before so it was an omg moment :) season3 i think

[belowzeros]

It looks like the sci-fi fans agree that the last couple seasons were better than the first few. :-0


imho it got pounds better when they got their full Series order and new when the show would end. Then you can plan out the plot with great detail and not have to drag crap on and pad infinitely. Shows are much better when there is a structure like that, 24, The Wire, yadda yadda

[IronMan08]

lawl.

[Slapshot747]

Interesting start to season 5 .. Nobody knows what or where there going with this show and thats why i like it. I like 24 as well but in the end we all know jack will save the day and will survive..

As for Lost.. I want to know how they get back to Island. why Locke had to die. and hurley and what those numbers are all about. Can anyone predict how this will all end in season 6? i think not and thats why people are watching . great show..

[Lucky 24]

Interesting start to season 5 .. Nobody knows what or where there going with this show and thats why i like it. I like 24 as well but in the end we all know jack will save the day and will survive..

As for Lost.. I want to know how they get back to Island. why Locke had to die. and hurley and what those numbers are all about. Can anyone predict how this will all end in season 6? i think not and thats why people are watching . great show..

I don't think you will ever get a real explanation about the numbers...you may see them appear again, but I don't think they writers are really interested in actually explaining why they are so powerful. Some mysteries are better left unexplained. Now the smoke monster is something I think everyone would like to know more about.

[felix]

imho it got pounds better when they got their full Series order and new when the show would end. Then you can plan out the plot with great detail and not have to drag crap on and pad infinitely. Shows are much better when there is a structure like that, 24, The Wire, yadda yadda
That's true. Shows like Terminator suffer from not knowing when the show will be cancelled. It's too bad because it has so much potential.

[goJays]

old lady IF I REMEMBER correctly was shown 2 times. first time with Claire, telling her to not go on that flight (or the other way around). second time, talking to desmond about his voyage around the world.

can someone confirm?

[RayK]

old lady IF I REMEMBER correctly was shown 2 times. first time with Claire, telling her to not go on that flight (or the other way around). second time, talking to desmond about his voyage around the world.

can someone confirm?


I think she was only in the desmond episode

http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Ms._Hawking

[djjosee]

Bump

There's an episode at 9 pm and then another at 10 pm ... does anyone know if they are two new episodes or is one of them a repeat.

[ladybug193]

I'm pretty sure it's just episode 3- 'The Jughead', but maybe someone else can verify. I checked the website but it only shows the one episode, although last week there were 2 and the website only showed the first one. Even if one of them is a rerun, I'll probably watch it anyways, lol.
I re-watched both episodes 1 and 2 on Youtube to make sure I didn't miss anything.

So now we've seen Daniel travelling back and forth in time quite frequently. 'Whatever' he is, he's not aging just like Richard...hmmmm. Poor Charlotte...I hope she's not going to have a meltdown like some of the others who ended up with bloody noses and lost their minds.

[lemailme]

Yep

First episode is The Lie, repeat
Second one is the new one Jughead

[RayK]

Totally Awesome episode!

[brocoli]

I knew that was Widmore! I liked this episode as well. Saw some sides of people we haven't seen before.

[kgen]

Damn, this season is starting out so much better and coherent than the last! Ten dollars says the nuclear bomb comes into play before the end of the season!

[skeletor]

And yes i know Prison Break got cancelled. I didn't want it to go past the first season.



well it was supposed to be 3 seasons originally.. this should be the end where they take down the company and the family skeletons are done with.

[MrDisco]

wow i'm thoroughly confused now.

[Broli's Mom]

Ten dollars says the nuclear bomb comes into play before the end of the season!

I would say it is the reason why the island travels back and forth through time.

[gflux]

Hmmm. So if that was Widmore in '54 and lets say he's at least 20 - he's got to be over 70 right now - but he doesn't look like it. Dun! Dun! Dunnn!

Anyone notice that Locke gives the watch to Alpert and he doesn't get it back? Where does the watch come from then? Time paradox!

I loved that Desmond and Penny name their son Charlie. :cry:

[RayK]

Hmmm. So if that was Widmore in '54 and lets say he's at least 20 - he's got to be over 70 right now - but he doesn't look like it. Dun! Dun! Dunnn!

Anyone notice that Locke gives the watch to Alpert and he doesn't get it back? Where does the watch come from then? Time paradox!

I loved that Desmond and Penny name their son Charlie. :cry:

I don't understand what you mean? Did I miss something about a watch? or are you talking about the compass?

[rtto5588]

has to be referring to the compass.

[ptownplayer]

Hmmm. So if that was Widmore in '54 and lets say he's at least 20 - he's got to be over 70 right now - but he doesn't look like it. Dun! Dun! Dunnn!

Anyone notice that Locke gives the watch to Alpert and he doesn't get it back? Where does the watch come from then? Time paradox!

I loved that Desmond and Penny name their son Charlie. :cry:


Dude..he's still old looking I have an uncle in his 70's and they look about the same age. Also it was Alpert who gave Locke the compass in the first place.

[brocoli]

Dude..he's still old looking I have an uncle in his 70's and they look about the same age. Also it was Alpert who gave Locke the compass in the first place.

Exactly. It doesn't seem like it now but I bet that compass is what restores Richard's faith in the island, just like how John needed his faith restored. Richard goes to the hospital in 2 years and when he sees John Locke being born as promised it reminds him how important his mission is and that the island needs his help more than ever.

It was also cool to see that Richard was the leader of the others at 1 point in time. He has always seemed like a concierge to the leader (Ben) but here it shows him as number 1.

I have what I believe a really good theory, but it would take forever to type... considering it takes me forever just to explain it to my g.f. We both believe I have it right though!

[originalnutta]

Exactly. It doesn't seem like it now but I bet that compass is what restores Richard's faith in the island, just like how John needed his faith restored. Richard goes to the hospital in 2 years and when he sees John Locke being born as promised it reminds him how important his mission is and that the island needs his help more than ever.

It was also cool to see that Richard was the leader of the others at 1 point in time. He has always seemed like a concierge to the leader (Ben) but here it shows him as number 1.

I have what I believe a really good theory, but it would take forever to type... considering it takes me forever just to explain it to my g.f. We both believe I have it right though!If you ever get the time i'd like a PM.

Tonight's episode was great, and i believe i'm a bit closer to figuring out the end game.

And a possibility....

Obviously Widmore got off the island so either Richard told him, or Widmore took the information for himself that was intended for John.

[KelvinK]

going back to 501-502.. anyone remember where the scientist says "stop.. if u drill any further we're all doomed" or something along those lines?

i think the hydrogen bomb was buried down there behind that wall... it has to be right?

[felix]

Richard goes to the hospital in 2 years and when he sees John Locke being born as promised it reminds him how important his mission is and that the island needs his help more than ever.

Oh, you're right. I recall the episode where we saw Alpert visit John Locke as a baby in the hospital.

What about when Alpert visited Locke as a kid in his home? He asked the kid which of these items belonged to him? I think he took the knife and he got it wrong? What was that about?

[Broli's Mom]

Going out on limb here, but wouldn't it be weird if David Faraday's mother turns out to be Eloise Hawking?

Eloise is the older lady with white hair that first refused to sell Desmond a ring in season 3 and is now the woman working with Ben in the church.

[gflux]

Going out on limb here, but wouldn't it be weird if David Faraday's mother turns out to be Eloise Hawking?

Eloise is the older lady with white hair that first refused to sell Desmond a ring in season 3 and is now the woman working with Ben in the church.

I thought it was pretty obvious that it is her.

[Ryan]

What about when Alpert visited Locke as a kid in his home? He asked the kid which of these items belonged to him? I think he took the knife and he got it wrong? What was that about?


I always figured that he actually got it right and Alpert was just spooked.

In chronological order it would be (can't remember the exact years):

1952 Locke arrives in the past, meets Alpert tells him he is their leader.
1954 Alpert is at the hospital and sees Locke born.
1958 Alpert does the test with a young Locke to confirm that the older Locke he met has traveled through time and is their leader.
2004 All of the stuff on the island happens and Alpert accepts Locke as the leader of the Others.

[belowzeros]

man i was diggin that episode. it was over as soon as it began for me and that's when you know it's a rockin good LOST.

[billdozer]

Daniel's labrat's name was Eloise. Eloise Hawking is the ring lady/person who can locate the island. Ellie is the name of the girl in 1954 with the gun, the one Daniel was giving weird looks to (as if he's looking at his young mother).

Therefore, Eloise is Daniel's mother, and my guess is his father is........Charles Widmore!

[belowzeros]

Obviously Widmore got off the island so either Richard told him, or Widmore took the information for himself that was intended for John.


I was thinking maybe they kicked him off and exiled him for killing the Other (when Sawyer and Juliette were questioning them). He seemed to want to keep John quiet and not blurt out that fact like it was a nono. The others seem to value life so maybe it's a cardinal sin. Sure the Others attack everyone but it's always to defend the island and after people are warned to scram first. They don't seem to draw first blood so I don't think they would kill Widmore as punishment. It would explain why Widmore and the Others are at such odds now that we know he was definitely one of them.

[thelefteyeguy]

it's a small world (island) afterall :idea:

[Nikita]

man i was diggin that episode. it was over as soon as it began for me and that's when you know it's a rockin good LOST.

LOL...I think that with every opisode...'yikes, it's over already...dammit!' That's the sign of a great show IMO!

[originalnutta]

LOL...I think that with every opisode...'yikes, it's over already...dammit!' That's the sign of a great show IMO!

Most episodes start with a "WTF" and end with "WTF???!!!!!?"

:lol:

[originalnutta]

Ok, let me go over the revelations in this episode...

- Desmond and Penny name their son Charlie
- Eloise Hawking ( Ellie ) is Daniel's mom.
- "Jones" who is part of the Others, gets off the island and is Charles Widmore
- Daniel seems to know about Miles' powers.
- Richard Alpert was told by Locke to go see him being born.
- Richard Alpert also tests John to see if he is their leader.
- Alpert does not travel through time, and is ageless.
- It's possible that Daniel is Widmore's son. Might also be Penny's twin.


all i can think of, for now.

[cmx1o1]

wow, what an episode!

WTF count: at least 10+ :lol:

[Kranberry]

wow, what an episode!

WTF count: at least 10+ :lol:

Problem I had with this episode was Jin. Didn't make sense to me. The people in the helicopter, if I recall correctly, headed back to the island after the ship exploded. Don't know how long they travelled from the helicopter to the island (at a specific heading) and the island disappeared before they got there. How was Jin on the exploding ship able to get within the boundaries of the island before it disappeared beating a helicopter?

So you are right WTF 10+ but a bad WTF...

[RayK]

Problem I had with this episode was Jin. Didn't make sense to me. The people in the helicopter, if I recall correctly, headed back to the island after the ship exploded. Don't know how long they travelled from the helicopter to the island (at a specific heading) and the island disappeared before they got there. How was Jin on the exploding ship able to get within the boundaries of the island before it disappeared beating a helicopter?

So you are right WTF 10+ but a bad WTF...

Maybe the islands time radius is larger horizontally than vertically? So maybe Jin, who was in the water was within the radius, but the helicopter which was way above the island wasn't?

[malbadon]

This weeks episode was sort of a "more of the same" from last week, I did love the fact that Jin, who finally learned English, gets picked up by people who spoke French. But then was disappointed that Danielle already knew english. Would have been funny having him spend an episode right back at the 'noone understands me' stage.

Best lines of this episode were both Sawyers.
"Thank you Lord!"
5 seconds later:
"I take that back!"

[gflux]

This is also the 2nd time Jin has been lost out in the water, only to be found by complete strangers. :D

[winstona]

I am glad to see Jin back. He is one of my favourite characters.

[SAN66]

Problem I had with this episode was Jin. Didn't make sense to me. The people in the helicopter, if I recall correctly, headed back to the island after the ship exploded. Don't know how long they travelled from the helicopter to the island (at a specific heading) and the island disappeared before they got there. How was Jin on the exploding ship able to get within the boundaries of the island before it disappeared beating a helicopter?

So you are right WTF 10+ but a bad WTF...

Maybe because the helicopter was traveling on the 305 bearing which seems to be immune to the timey wimey effects and Jin being flung, likely not on a 305 bearing, from the freighter probably got caught in the timey wimey field.

[AzN_RiverdaleCI]

way to go with the spoilers of "Jin" guys, good thing i watched the whole thing before going into this thread.

[idk-bart]

way to go with the spoilers of "Jin" guys, good thing i watched the whole thing before going into this thread.

that's the whole point of this thread, and i dont get why you're complaining, you did the right thing.

[-=Wraith=-]

way to go with the spoilers of "Jin" guys, good thing i watched the whole thing before going into this thread.

...that's why you shouldn't click on this thread before you watch the week's episode

what are you complaining bout anyways lol? They aren't "spoilers" if you already know about it.

[belowzeros]

good thing i watched the whole thing before going into this thread.


duh. lol =p


great ep but my brain is kinda starting to bake from all the new content and stuff to think about. Is wishing for the old slow lost so we have time to process so wrong >.>

sawyer stole that ep talking to god lol...so good

[jadoocian]

I don't think they should have brought Jin back right away. It's more powerful when someone returns after a longer period of time like that black guy whos name i can't remember right now. Jin was 'dead' for like 4 episodes or something!

my real problem with this is, the boat fully exploded while jin is on it... htw could he have not blown up with it..??

[SAN66]

I don't think they should have brought Jin back right away. It's more powerful when someone returns after a longer period of time like that black guy whos name i can't remember right now. Jin was 'dead' for like 4 episodes or something!

my real problem with this is, the boat fully exploded while jin is on it... htw could he have not blown up with it..??

The island didn't want him to die *cue creepy suspense music* Ooooooo

[rdtx2002]

Jin will most likely be the key that gets Sun back to the island

[Kranberry]

Maybe the islands time radius is larger horizontally than vertically? So maybe Jin, who was in the water was within the radius, but the helicopter which was way above the island wasn't?

Possible possible. But the radius is more than just time, it is the protection of the island making it invisible / visible to those within and without of the radius. So I agree planes flying over would not see the island. However, what gets me is the boat should be anchored near the edge of the field in order to make it close to travel to the island by boat / helicopter, etc. The island residents can also see the boat (by the burning smoke). Plus the helicopter saw the island AND the glowing white light so they must be somewhat within the confines of the island. Not sure how much of the island they saw while heading back. To me, it still is a plot hole.

Maybe because the helicopter was traveling on the 305 bearing which seems to be immune to the timey wimey effects and Jin being flung, likely not on a 305 bearing, from the freighter probably got caught in the timey wimey field.

No that wouldn't make sense. The heading is to protect the tunnel to get from one field to another. i.e. if you head any other heading from island to ocean the field forces you back to the island. If you head any other heading from ocean to island the field forces you away from the island.

[slowtyper]

To me, it still is a plot hole.




Possibly for now, I'm almost positive it will be explained eventually. There have been so many things people say are "plot holes" until they get to the next few episodes or next season. At this point I have a lot of trust in the writers.

[funnypanks]

Oh, you're right. I recall the episode where we saw Alpert visit John Locke as a baby in the hospital.

What about when Alpert visited Locke as a kid in his home? He asked the kid which of these items belonged to him? I think he took the knife and he got it wrong? What was that about?

it was to test if locke was indeed the same person, when u see alpert visiting locke with the knife, one of the items was the compass that locke passed to alpert, he was hoping locke would choose the compass confirming that he was the same locke that visited him in 1952. which would also explain why alpert was so dissappointed that locke chose the knife.

[gflux]

it was to test if locke was indeed the same person, when u see alpert visiting locke with the knife, one of the items was the compass that locke passed to alpert, he was hoping locke would choose the compass confirming that he was the same locke that visited him in 1952. which would also explain why alpert was so dissappointed that locke chose the knife.

It could have also been a test to see whether he was unstuck in time like Desmond. If he was then he would have chosen compass.

[ladybug193]

It could have also been a test to see whether he was unstuck in time like Desmond. If he was then he would have chosen compass.

Exactly what I was thinking. At the time when John was shown the compass, it hadn't yet been given to him.
Naturally he would choose the knife....remember this scene? http://www.blinkx.com/video/john-locke-knives-lost/V8k8Sehg51LqBCHrHKL8og

[1yellowdog]

Here are my theories.
The island is the LOST island of Atlantis. The wheel Ben used to move the island, we saw it in an X-Ray encased in rock made me thing that. The wheel had been there for a very long time it seemed. Atlantis just dissappeared one day so perhaps it just moved instead.
John Locke is not dead. He's paralysed by those spiders that bit Nikki and Paolo on season 2 I think it was. He would never willinging leave the island for fear of being unable to walk again so this would be the most plausible way of getting him off the island.

I wonder if there is an explanation or any significance to Vincent, Walts dog. Why bother having him there at all?

[rilhouse]

I wonder if there is an explanation or any significance to Vincent, Walts dog. Why bother having him there at all?

yes, i'm sure that vincent plays some major role in lost.

[jokadeska]

Here are my theories.
The island is the LOST island of Atlantis. The wheel Ben used to move the island, we saw it in an X-Ray encased in rock made me thing that. The wheel had been there for a very long time it seemed. Atlantis just dissappeared one day so perhaps it just moved instead.
John Locke is not dead. He's paralysed by those spiders that bit Nikki and Paolo on season 2 I think it was. He would never willinging leave the island for fear of being unable to walk again so this would be the most plausible way of getting him off the island.

I wonder if there is an explanation or any significance to Vincent, Walts dog. Why bother having him there at all?

I believe they said the Locke talked to them before he died. So I don't think he was bitten. Rather he died, after talking to the ones who left the island for some unknown reason yet...

[Rosico]

Thoughts on tonight's episode?

Sheppard's a jerk is one that comes to mind :razz:

Pretty awesome pacing though!

[SAN66]

So I'm confused Christian is Jacob? Or Jacob appears as Christian?

Next we're going to find out that Christian used to be on the island too.

[billdozer]

I loved how Ben snapped at Sun and Jack and completely shut them up. Ungrateful gits.

[Rosico]

I loved how Ben snapped at Sun and Jack and completely shut them up. Ungrateful gits.

So true,

Oh really Jack, you're going to do what? That's right. Sit down. ;)

In a way, I'm happily surprised that Jack has become a secondary character.

[MasterAvatar]

I believe they said the Locke talked to them before he died. So I don't think he was bitten. Rather he died, after talking to the ones who left the island for some unknown reason yet...

I think that once they bring him back to the island, the magical healing forces will bring him back to life.

[1yellowdog]

So true,

Oh really Jack, you're going to do what? That's right. Sit down. ;)

In a way, I'm happily surprised that Jack has become a secondary character.

Exactly, I haven't liked Jack since the early season's, he's so weak when it comes right down to it. That's why I love this show, I hope it makes people see to dig deeper and not judge on the superficial stuff.
We saw so many of the characters we were wary of in the beginning turn out to be the stronger ones.
Imagine what a Jedi Mind F*ck it would be if Ben turned out to be a good guy in the end. Wrap your minds around that one kiddies :twisted:

I was a bit dissappointed with last nights episode. I was surprised they had to toss a severed arm out there even. Charlotte Lewis dying threw me too but I have no idea what purpose her character really played, these secondary characters just have never tugged at my heart strings at all. The only one with any merit would be Miles but I think that has more to do with the incredible Ken Leung than the script. Would Benjamin Linus be the same without Michael Emmerson? I highly doubt it.
So again it is confirmed that Faraday was on the island before, I don't think too many people saw him in the mine in a few episodes back. I they'd have blinked they would have missed him. Like Richard Alpert, he doesn't age.
The meeting at the church at the end made me think that there is still some religious significance to all of this.
I think Jacob (how's that for a good ole biblical name) has manifested as Christian, I don't think Jacob is Christian. Interesting how John accepts he has to sacrifice his life for the greater good. Heavy stuff.

[Nikita]

So Sun makes it clear that they've been off the island for 3 years now. What the hell have those that stayed on the island been doing all this time...just walking around enduring the time flashes?? Nobody on the island seems to have aged at all and they're still just hiking around the island. I mean c'mon in three years you'd think they would have at least built themselves some decent shelter and stuff...:confused: Or are we supposed to believe that no time has passed on the island??

[N_Raged]

So Sun makes it clear that they've been off the island for 3 years now. What the hell have those that stayed on the island been doing all this time...just walking around enduring the time flashes?? Nobody on the island seems to have aged at all and they're still just hiking around the island. I mean c'mon in three years you'd think they would have at least built themselves some decent shelter and stuff...:confused: Or are we supposed to believe that no time has passed on the island??
Well what we're shown of the island is still shortly after the boat blew up. We don't know what happened over the three years yet. There was only that one flash where there was that bag of chips from an indian air liner in the others' canoe and all the dharma beer was gone.

[SAN66]

So Sun makes it clear that they've been off the island for 3 years now. What the hell have those that stayed on the island been doing all this time...just walking around enduring the time flashes?? Nobody on the island seems to have aged at all and they're still just hiking around the island. I mean c'mon in three years you'd think they would have at least built themselves some decent shelter and stuff...:confused: Or are we supposed to believe that no time has passed on the island??

Considering the island is unstuck in time. Time doesn't necessarily factor into it.

- 3 Years pass in the real world while Ben, Lock et all do their thing to get everyone to go back.
- The island flashes through time. X hours pass.
- Eloise "locates" the island as it flashes to the current time frame and the losties travel back to it.

In the real world 3 years have passed. On the island not so much.

[RayK]

I was a bit dissappointed with last nights episode. I was surprised they had to toss a severed arm out there even.

I enjoyed that...If you remember, I forget exactly which season it was, but Danielle was leading the group to the Black Rock and said that they were in the area where her group got sick and Montand lost his arm...so it was cool that they finally showed how that happened...

[Nikita]

Well what we're shown of the island is still shortly after the boat blew up. We don't know what happened over the three years yet. There was only that one flash where there was that bag of chips from an indian air liner in the others' canoe and all the dharma beer was gone.

Considering the island is unstuck in time. Time doesn't necessarily factor into it.

- 3 Years pass in the real world while Ben, Lock et all do their thing to get everyone to go back.
- The island flashes through time. X hours pass.
- Eloise "locates" the island as it flashes to the current time frame and the losties travel back to it.

In the real world 3 years have passed. On the island not so much.

Well then, aren't the losties who stayed on the island going to be surprised when the six who left return and tell them it's now three years later....lol.

[Krox]

So again it is confirmed that Faraday was on the island before, I don't think too many people saw him in the mine in a few episodes back. I they'd have blinked they would have missed him. Like Richard Alpert, he doesn't age.
The meeting at the church at the end made me think that there is still some religious significance to all of this.


I'm not sure Faraday was on the island before. It could simply be that he jumps back in time when the Orchid was being constructed. It would have to a be future him since he tries and warns his g/f (child) not to come back to island since she will die. He is probably trying to prevent her death which he just witnessed.

[rilhouse]

I'm not sure Faraday was on the island before. It could simply be that he jumps back in time when the Orchid was being constructed. It would have to a be future him since he tries and warns his g/f (child) not to come back to island since she will die. He is probably trying to prevent her death which he just witnessed.

sounds right. but it also doesn't make sense since faraday knows that the future can't be changed so his gf would die no matter what. she is key in getting lock off the island, she was the only one that knew about "the well". therefore she must return to the island to save it and die.

[belowzeros]

So Sun makes it clear that they've been off the island for 3 years now. What the hell have those that stayed on the island been doing all this time...


they've established a couple or few times already that time passes differently on the island, it's eluded to that they are in some kind of bubble on the island outside normal/timespace

one explicit example I can remember is when Faraday did his missile tests

so what the heck was with that temple where the smoke monster hides out. and why were the scientists changed when they went down. I'm starting to believe the theory that they are on atlantis, they seem to be pushing us that way anyway.

So are Charlotte and Faraday maybe brother/sister? I was wondering if Eloise is both their mothers and Whidmore their father. Charlotte's story about leaving the island could fit that scenerio. And there is always the chance that she isn't really dead. No one really dies on that island >.>

[felix]

Is anyone else thinking that Charlotte knows how to speak Korean because Jin/Sun somehow taught her as a child in the next few flashes? Or is that too obvious.

[1yellowdog]

Is anyone else thinking that Charlotte knows how to speak Korean because Jin/Sun somehow taught her as a child in the next few flashes? Or is that too obvious.


That's an awesome theory!

[MrDisco]

Is anyone else thinking that Charlotte knows how to speak Korean because Jin/Sun somehow taught her as a child in the next few flashes? Or is that too obvious.

after this last ep that sounds very likely!

man this show needs a massive flow chart to get all the time lines sorted out.

[originalnutta]

Is anyone else thinking that Charlotte knows how to speak Korean because Jin/Sun somehow taught her as a child in the next few flashes? Or is that too obvious.

when would they have taught her Korean as a child??

Now that Sun is on the island with Jin? And because they are flashbacking / time travelling?

[belowzeros]

another brain melting episode with new mysteries...


so anyone think that the rest of the 6 were allowed their piece of flesh on Ben on condition they returned to the island? Or Ben just had a date with someone we don't know about yet. What happened to aaron? ...bug eyes is up to his usual self I think.

i was wondering why Jin was in a Darma uniform...if the flashes are so quick how did he have time to be adopted and accepted by Darma and be employed etc. maybe the 6 returned has fixed time or something, or stretched the flashes again...or maybe Jin just stole the truck lol >.>

[mariokarter]

I think john locke is going to be ressesitated in the next episode in a similair manner to the way christian was. Remember in the church Ben was spewing some crap (foreshadowing) about how someone made a sacrifice or something and was resesatated?

[originalnutta]

I think john locke is going to be ressesitated in the next episode in a similair manner to the way christian was. Remember in the church Ben was spewing some crap (foreshadowing) about how someone made a sacrifice or something and was resesatated?

Doesn't your browser support spell check?

And i don't think Christian was resuscitated. I don't remember Ben saying anyone was resuscitated.

[belowzeros]

I think john locke is going to be ressesitated in the next episode in a similair manner to the way christian was. Remember in the church Ben was spewing some crap (foreshadowing) about how someone made a sacrifice or something and was resesatated?


John probably replaces Christian as the manifestation of Jacob. They seem to revere Jacob as their current leader (everyone's face goes blank and white when John recants something Jacob) and John for some reason is chosen to be the new Avatar.

[gflux]

and by resuscitated do you actually mean resurrected?

[-=Wraith=-]

*POSSIBLE SPOILER*

So i'm guessing those other 3 ppl in the cabin of the plane survived too? They're all from other tv shows/movies

cop = New Amsterdam detective
flight attendant = The Unit command ops woman
male passenger = from Traitor and Vantage Point

Usually if guest stars have been on other shows, they stick around for a bit lol

[SAN66]

John probably replaces Christian as the manifestation of Jacob. They seem to revere Jacob as their current leader (everyone's face goes blank and white when John recants something Jacob) and John for some reason is chosen to be the new Avatar.

I dunno Jacob is not really "there", he can communicate, but never interacts with anyone. Looking at the preview for next week, it looks like John is interacting with people and not just appearing as an apparition.

I liked the Foucault Pendulum in the episode, we had one at my school, indicates the earth rotation, not for locating mysterious islands, unless the island alters the earths rotation :-P But still pretty cool.

[belowzeros]

I dunno Jacob is not really "there", he can communicate, but never interacts with anyone. Looking at the preview for next week, it looks like John is interacting with people and not just appearing as an apparition.

yeah probably unlikely but would have a been a good story line =p

i think they've obviously fallen back in time somehow since Jin was there staring them in the face. maybe that is how they explain away Locke's resurrection.

[billdozer]

Is the male passenger who spoke to Jack the "hobbit" from The Office? (Ryan's clubbing friend)

[originalnutta]

Is the male passenger who spoke to Jack the "hobbit" from The Office? (Ryan's clubbing friend)

no.

[1yellowdog]

I think john locke is going to be ressesitated in the next episode in a similair manner to the way christian was. Remember in the church Ben was spewing some crap (foreshadowing) about how someone made a sacrifice or something and was resesatated?

John was asked by Christian to sacrifice his life for the good of the island. Ben asked Jack, the man of science, to take a leap of faith. Deep stuff.

I'm curious as to how Sayid ended up in handcuffs and Hurley got out of jail to both be on the right plane. I'm also wondering, why wasn't Walt tracked down to be on that plane too? And yes, what did Kate do with Aaron????

[felix]

I'm curious as to how Sayid ended up in handcuffs and Hurley got out of jail to both be on the right plane. I'm also wondering, why wasn't Walt tracked down to be on that plane too? And yes, what did Kate do with Aaron????
There will probably be a flashback about this. Probably has something to do with Ben getting beaten up.

[ladybug193]

I think Kate left Aaron with Sawyer's ex (I can't remember her name) and their child in Alabama, for some reason. We still haven't been shown Kate going to see them although I'm sure it happens, as per Sawyers request.

Anyone else notice that when Jack asks Ben how he can read, he says that his mother taught him? His mother dies soon after he is born.

I'm very curious as to whom Ben had to go and see 'to tie up some loose ends' although apparently it doesn't seem to work out so well for him....all bloodied and beaten.

[SAN66]

I think Kate left Aaron with Sawyer's ex (I can't remember her name) and their child in Alabama, for some reason. We still haven't been shown Kate going to see them although I'm sure it happens, as per Sawyers request.


I think she left Aaron with Claires mom, makes the most sense to me. Goes to her, explains that Clair was alive when they arrived on the island and that its Claires baby.

[ladybug193]

I think she left Aaron with Claires mom, makes the most sense to me. Goes to her, explains that Clair was alive when they arrived on the island and that its Claires baby.

That was the first person that came to mind, however it seems a little too obvious for LOST. I don't think she would give him to her because she doesn't want to lose him permanently.

[RayK]

Anyone else notice that when Jack asks Ben how he can read, he says that his mother taught him? His mother dies soon after he is born.

I'm very curious as to whom Ben had to go and see 'to tie up some loose ends' although apparently it doesn't seem to work out so well for him....all bloodied and beaten.

I think that was just Ben being Ben, not a mistake by the writers...

Speculation: (highlight to read)

I think the loose ends that Ben had to tie up was maybe trying to kill Penny. He told Widmore that he would, who knows what happened though...maybe Desmond got a hold of him haha

[originalnutta]

Keep in mind that Desmond has to be shipwrecked again to get back on the island.

I'm also assuming that Ben talked Sun and Kate into going, also he probably had something to do with Sayid being arrested.

But why is Sayid going to Guam? Military wants some intel?


Great episode again. We are almost halfway done this season. :(

But every episode has been awesome. :)

[1yellowdog]

I think Kate left Aaron with Sawyer's ex (I can't remember her name) and their child in Alabama, for some reason. We still haven't been shown Kate going to see them although I'm sure it happens, as per Sawyers request.

Anyone else notice that when Jack asks Ben how he can read, he says that his mother taught him? His mother dies soon after he is born.

I'm very curious as to whom Ben had to go and see 'to tie up some loose ends' although apparently it doesn't seem to work out so well for him....all bloodied and beaten.


I actually missed that and thought he was just being sarcastic to Jack but yes, another example of how Ben cannot be trusted. Christian told John as much, Sayid told Hurley not to trust Ben. We are being led to believe Ben cannot be trusted and yet I'm not sure what to believe anymore :lol: I'm just enjoying the ride.

[Trodge]

when would they have taught her Korean as a child??

Now that Sun is on the island with Jin? And because they are flashbacking / time travelling?

Because Jin is in the 70's and he's working for Dharma...

[jokadeska]

That was the first person that came to mind, however it seems a little too obvious for LOST. I don't think she would give him to her because she doesn't want to lose him permanently.

But this speculation makes sense as to why she told Jack to never ask about Aaron. Hence, she may have decided to give him up and doesn't want to regret this decision later on...

[MrDisco]

I think she left Aaron with Claires mom, makes the most sense to me.

Maybe he's with Ben. He was after him for some reason.

And where's my explanation for the4-toed statue?! :)

edit: and did anyone translate the hieroglyphics that surrounded the smoke monster's den/hole?

[ladybug193]

edit: and did anyone translate the hieroglyphics that surrounded the smoke monster's den/hole?

In the Secrets and Recaps video,they give the translations. It's about 7 minutes in.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mTm-o9qDMjg&sdig=1

[MrDisco]

In the Secrets and Recaps video,they give the translations. It's about 7 minutes in.


Thanks never seen that before. That guy is pretty good.

What's a Cerebus fence?
What is the temple?

[ladybug193]

I agree, he is pretty good. I found his videos randomly while searching YouTube last year.
There is a link in the original post to the main page for all of his videos this season (1 for each episode). Tons of tidbits and info that you wouldn't normally catch. There were ones for last season but apparently YouTube has been getting strict with copyrighted music content (background music!) in videos and removing them.

[jokadeska]

What's a Cerebus fence?
What is the temple?

Cerverus is the monster that is the guardian of the underworld i believe...

[MrDisco]

Cerverus is the monster that is the guardian of the underworld i believe...

Cerebus, and yes it's commonly a 3-headed dog. I was referring to the Cerebus Fence which the guy in the video mentions. I'm guessing he means the sonic (?) fence we saw in an earlier season which kept the smoke monster out (or in).

[ladybug193]

Cerebus, and yes it's commonly a 3-headed dog. I was referring to the Cerebus Fence which the guy in the video mentions. I'm guess he means the sonic (?) fence we saw in an earlier season which kept the smoke monster out (or in).

Yes, he's referring to that fence. I didn't notice that he called it a "cerberus fence". The temple he's talking about is the one that Jin, Rousseau and the others just came across. This is the place where Ben originally told the 'Others' and Alex and Rousseau to go to. He said it was the "last safe place on this Island".

[originalnutta]

Yeaa good episode for tomorrow.


The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham.

Gonna have a few people over, so we can discuss and nerd it up.

[Rosico]

I finally figured out that the new guy on the plane was also in Three Kings (he was the Iraqi torturer to Marky Mark!).

[gflux]

Jeremy Bentham Wikipedia entry (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeremy_Bentham) - just some background for you folks who may not know who he is - I sure didn't. He was very big into the philosophy of "the ends justify the means". Which is also a big theme of the Watchmen graphic novel/movie (who the Lost writers are huge nerd-fans over).

[qubikal]

I finally figured out that the new guy on the plane was also in Three Kings (he was the Iraqi torturer to Marky Mark!).

Yep.. he's also a main character in Traitor..
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0846548/

[jadoocian]

bump for new episode in 25 min :)

[Slapshot747]

Good episode tonight. Still wondering how Locke can come back to life.. Well i guess will find that out along with jacks Dad as well. There is going to be a few episodes off the island to tie all the loose ends. what makes hurley get on the plane. Why does Kate give up the Kid. Who beats the crap out of Ben before he boards the plane. And who is the real bad guy in this saga?.. Ben or Whitmore?... Looking forward to next weeks episode already.

[jadoocian]

Good episode tonight. Still wondering how Locke can come back to life.. Well i guess will find that out along with jacks Dad as well. There is going to be a few episodes off the island to tie all the loose ends. what makes hurley get on the plane. Why does Kate give up the Kid. Who beats the crap out of Ben before he boards the plane. And who is the real bad guy in this saga?.. Ben or Whitmore?... Looking forward to next weeks episode already.

im thinking the island is key to locke comin back to life.

first time he landed, he was paralyzed from the waist down, and then all of a sudden he can walk.

this time he was dead, now he's alive. makes sense i think...


wat i found ******** was how ben saves locke from killing himself, then goes on to kill him 2 minutes later. wtf's the point of that

[mariokarter]

I think john locke is going to be ressesitated in the next episode in a similair manner to the way christian was. Remember in the church Ben was spewing some crap (foreshadowing) about how someone made a sacrifice or something and was resesatated?

Called it.


Now, I'm thinking the reason Ben stopped John killing himself before murdering him was that he needed the name of faraday's mother, eloise hawking.

[idk-bart]

yeah basically ben wanted some juicey info from john before he dies. it's kind of obvious ben's a bad guy now, or atleast a sociopath.

[rdtx2002]

wat i found ******** was how ben saves locke from killing himself, then goes on to kill him 2 minutes later. wtf's the point of that

maybe someone needs to inflict the 'damage' before he can get fixed on the island..

Locke didn't jump out the window to be paralyzed. Happened because someone deceived him. Maybe Ben was just try to play within the Rules

[Ryan]

Maybe you can't go back to the island if you commit suicide?


More likely though, Ben just needed the name.

[gflux]

I'm pretty sure Widmore and Ben are both bad guys. They're just driven by their selfish desire to get control of the island. I find it strange that Widmore hasn't tried to get back onto the island in the time that Ben was off the island though.

Not a big surprise the Locke came back to life when they reached the island.

[winstona]

Widmore said that he always have people monitor the entrance gate from the Island. So why did me miss out on catching Ben (after he moved the Island last season) and killing him?

[brocoli]

Best episode of the season so far. I'm gonna go watch it again...

[jokadeska]

yeah basically ben wanted some juicey info from john before he dies. it's kind of obvious ben's a bad guy now, or atleast a sociopath.

Didnt it seem more like Ben already knew about Hawkings but decided to kill Locke after Ben found out that Locke also knew about Hawkings? How did Locke even know about Hawkings? Did Charles tell him?

To me, it seemed like Ben did all he did so he himself could get back to the island. So i would guess he's the bad guy.

[winstona]

Didnt it seem more like Ben already knew about Hawkings but decided to kill Locke after Ben found out that Locke also knew about Hawkings? How did Locke even know about Hawkings? Did Charles tell him?

To me, it seemed like Ben did all he did so he himself could get back to the island. So i would guess he's the bad guy.

Christian Sheppherd told Locke to go find Eloise Hawkings in LA before he moved the Island

[gflux]

Widmore said that he always have people monitor the entrance gate from the Island. So why did me miss out on catching Ben (after he moved the Island last season) and killing him?

Good point. Did they ever reveal why Ben was wearing a parka when he appeared in the desert? I don't think I saw him put one on when he moved the donkey wheel.

[magnum]

Widmore said that he always have people monitor the entrance gate from the Island. So why did me miss out on catching Ben (after he moved the Island last season) and killing him?

But did you notice it took some time before Widmore's men picked up Locke. It could have been the same thing with Ben. He could left before Widmore could get there.

[SAN66]

Widmore said that he always have people monitor the entrance gate from the Island. So why did me miss out on catching Ben (after he moved the Island last season) and killing him?

When Ben materialized in the desert men came for him and he killed them. Couldn't it be assumed that he did so because they were Witmore's men? Especially since Witmore was expecting Ben when he payed him a visit.

[winstona]

When Ben materialized in the desert men came for him and he killed them. Couldn't it be assumed that he did so because they were Witmore's men? Especially since Witmore was expecting Ben when he payed him a visit.

Ahhh....This makes sense now! Thanks!

[Tijuana]

At certain frames, like at the end of one, does it freeze for you guys? Im on Rogers and basically whenever there is a big scene change or before a commercial, it basically just freezes and then continues.

[RayK]

At certain frames, like at the end of one, does it freeze for you guys? Im on Rogers and basically whenever there is a big scene change or before a commercial, it basically just freezes and then continues.

Yup this happens to me all the time with ABC HD, I always watch Lost at 12am now on ABCW HD cause it really annoys me...

[rilhouse]

Good point. Did they ever reveal why Ben was wearing a parka when he appeared in the desert? I don't think I saw him put one on when he moved the donkey wheel.

they showed ben putting on the parka before he went down to the wheel. it would seem to indicate that ben did not know where he would end up after he left the island - could be somewhere cold or hot so better to have a jacket.

[ptownplayer]

At certain frames, like at the end of one, does it freeze for you guys? Im on Rogers and basically whenever there is a big scene change or before a commercial, it basically just freezes and then continues.

Yes! ...so annoying. Also they have been running overtime for the last three weeks so my pvr has been missing the last minute of the show..I even set it to go till 10:05 and it still missed the last 30 seconds.

[gflux]

they showed ben putting on the parka before he went down to the wheel. it would seem to indicate that ben did not know where he would end up after he left the island - could be somewhere cold or hot so better to have a jacket.

Oh - now I remember, the area with the donkey wheel is covered in ice and snow.

[RayK]

But Ben left the island and returned numerous times without the woman?

I think that's because he knew the bearing of 305 (i think) to get to and from the island...so he could leave and come back via the submarine or maybe some other way and still return...but once he moved the island the bearing changes and he obviously thought that there was no way to return to the island once you move it...I guess he didn't know about the Dharma station in LA which shows how to get back to the island at any time and the windows to do so.

[winstona]

At certain frames, like at the end of one, does it freeze for you guys? Im on Rogers and basically whenever there is a big scene change or before a commercial, it basically just freezes and then continues.

I am having this same problem on Rogers ABC HD channel. Very annoying...

[jokadeska]

I am having this same problem on Rogers ABC HD channel. Very annoying...

Got the same problem myself. Also, the timing is off.. Changed it to add addition 5 mins off at end and still cuts off 1 min early :mad:

[AzN_RiverdaleCI]

I don't get it.

Can someone please explain to me why Ben killed Locke? Seriously, he was gonna kill himself but Ben had to kill Locke? :S purpose? :S

[AzN_RiverdaleCI]

O YEAH whatever happened to PB, it used to be on Mondays /w 24 and Heroes and House would be on Tues, but now its on Mondays and PB is like nowhere...updates?

[Tijuana]

it got canceled I heard.

Plot went to the crapper after Panama

No it was going fine, they have about 5 episodes left that will air in april. They should of fully ended it this season, instead they are gonna have to cut it short.

[belowzeros]

Lost season 5 = prison break season 3

we run out of story lines >

I know lets crash a second plane on the island ....

Que Giant Lost Theme. /


hey get out of our thread hater! =p this season has been awesome >.>


I am having this same problem on Rogers ABC HD channel. Very annoying...

Rogers fails at anything related to cable, internet, home phone and wireless....I'll bet the freezing is from them dubbing over Canadian commercials and they are doing it horribly. par for the course


I loved the ep. I wonder if Ben knew about Eloise's role, her relation to Faraday or at least guessed at it and Locke went and confirmed it. Another pretty spooky dead pan "who cares" from him on the last episode when they were talking about the tail passengers. Oh and now we know he coldly and flat out lied to Jack when Jack asked if he had seen John before his death...I was expecting that, well played.

Locke's moment of reflection on the rope was great, you could see him doubting everything for even half a second. If he was a true believer to his core his leap of faith would have had him jump instantly. The faith over science stuff this season is heady, anyone get the fact that the church is OVER the hidden lab...nicely done.

can't wait for next week

[originalnutta]

Lost season 5 = prison break season 3

we run out of story lines >

I know lets crash a second plane on the island ....

Que Giant Lost Theme. /

ugh.

picard.jpg.

[skeletor]

ugh.

picard.jpg.

I'll do the honours with epic picard.

Lost season 5 = prison break season 3

we run out of story lines >

I know lets crash a second plane on the island ....

Que Giant Lost Theme. /


http://i.neoseeker.com/mgv/308920-kspiess/920/28/facepalm_display.jpg

[belowzeros]

I don't think Matthew Abaddon is dead either. Whether by medical rescue or something mythical he's gonna be back. I think there is more to him than we're told so far and I don't think he's in Widmore's back pocket. Likely something heaven and hell about him.

[originalnutta]

I don't think Matthew Abaddon is dead either. Whether by medical rescue or something mythical he's gonna be back. I think there is more to him than we're told so far and I don't think he's in Widmore's back pocket. Likely something heaven and hell about him.




I thought he was back on LOST only to tie up his character's story line.

He is a regular on Fringe, so i don't know if he was meant to be on LOST as a long term character.

Would be cool if he was related to Ms. Klugh. (sp?)

They both looked creepy.

[belowzeros]

I thought he was back on LOST only to tie up his character's story line.

yeah I would agree (great Fringe character too) except that his name is too constructed for him to just be Locke's cab driver.

Religion was really subtle in the first season, I think unless you had that particular upbringing a lot of the innuendo was lost. With religion being such a heavy undertow throughout since tho and nothing being left to chance in LOST I think Matthew needs to come back in some stronger way.

The obvious Matthew aside his last name is a very dark evil spiritual reference. Like Jacob Abaddon is another hebrew word but his translates to destruction or ruinous. In greek it means The Destroyer. And if nothing happens by chance in Lost Matthew hasn't played a significant enough role yet if he is indeed supposed to be such a dark force.

"And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon." (Revelation 9:11)

when one of the Angels lets him out of the well,

"there arose a smoke out of the pit, as the smoke of a great furnace; and the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit."

is he smokie? :o


If they had to dump his character because of commitments to Fringe that would be tragic but not the first time I guess. Another MAJOR character is said to auditioning for fall pilots for major roles and that would take them off the show for the last season.

[belowzeros]

He's needed on the East Coast for Fringe .... Just like Richard and when he was doing Cane in 2007.


actually Fringe is leaving New York because tax incentives dried up, they moved to Vancouver...that commute just went from 4 hours to 1.0-1.5 wootwoot

[Trodge]

I don't get it.

Can someone please explain to me why Ben killed Locke? Seriously, he was gonna kill himself but Ben had to kill Locke? :S purpose? :S

Ben needed info from Locke, he couldn't let him die without it. I don't knew about Hawking. Once he got the name and knew that Hawking would be able to get Ben back and once again be the leader of the others. He had to kill him, Ben is very jealous of Locke. Plus he knows Widmore has been in contact with him. This isn't the first time Ben has killed Locke in a moment of jealousy. Ben shot him once he found out that Jacob talked to Locke.

[Trodge]

Widmore said that he always have people monitor the entrance gate from the Island. So why did me miss out on catching Ben (after he moved the Island last season) and killing him?


I agree, that really bothers me. If I'm Widmore and I'm a gazillionaire...I'm buidling the camera and having people watch it ALL the time...wouldn't you want to know who's coming back from this invisible, moving, time travelling, healing island? You're darn tootin ya do...LOL...

[Trodge]

Didnt it seem more like Ben already knew about Hawkings but decided to kill Locke after Ben found out that Locke also knew about Hawkings? How did Locke even know about Hawkings? Did Charles tell him?

To me, it seemed like Ben did all he did so he himself could get back to the island. So i would guess he's the bad guy.


I think the opposite, he knew of her. But I don't think he realized that she was the key to getting back to the island.

[Trodge]

But Ben left the island and returned numerous times without the woman?


He did? I don't recall him actually leaving the island until he spins the donkey wheel.

A while back I was thinking, anyone that leaves can't come back.

But then I remembered that Ethan and Richard were off the island recruiting Juliet. Plus Charlotte, Daniel and Miles have all come back. That's if you buy into the fact that all 3 of them were born on the island.

[Trodge]

Is the male passenger who spoke to Jack the "hobbit" from The Office? (Ryan's clubbing friend)

He was in Vantage Point, starring Matthew Fox...

[Trodge]

John was asked by Christian to sacrifice his life for the good of the island. Ben asked Jack, the man of science, to take a leap of faith. Deep stuff.

I'm curious as to how Sayid ended up in handcuffs and Hurley got out of jail to both be on the right plane. I'm also wondering, why wasn't Walt tracked down to be on that plane too? And yes, what did Kate do with Aaron????

Ben's lawyer said Hurley would be out by morning...I'm guessing Charlie is the one that told Hurley to get on the plane...he was carrying a guitar...

[Trodge]

Loved the episode, but I've got some issues with timing...

A few episodes ago, Farraday meets with Desmond outside the hatch and tells him to go see his mother. We flash foreward to the present and Desmond wakes up with the memory, it appears that it's new, because technically, it just happened.

Now we've got Widmore talking to Locke and he asks Locke how long ago did you first meet me. Locke's response, 4 days ago. Widmore is blown away by this news. Excuse me, according to the previous example, you should have only had this memory for 4 days as well. So if that's the case, how do you konw to send Abbadon to the hospital to meet Locke and get him to go to Australia to go on the walkabout?

The whole Farraday meeting Desmond outside the hatch blows my mind as well. Desmond comes out wearing all his gear. So he hasn't seen Kelvin go outside with the rip and he hasn't figured out that the sickness is a scam and Kevlin is lying to him. He doesn't follow Kelvin to the boat and kill him. So why doesn't Farraday meeting him screw up everything?

[mariokarter]

When ben arrives in Tunisia it is day time, and he leaves during the day.

When locke arrives in tunisia it is also daytime, but widmores men don't get their until the night.

I think the guys ben encountered were just random dudes, they showed up way to early (given that it takes widmores men half a day) and didnt have a truck to take ben back.

Also maybe widmore just didnt care to capture Ben. We know that the rules wont let Ben kill widmore, maybe the reverse is true also?



Did anyone else get the feeling that something really bad happened to Aaron and that that is why Kate wanted to go back to the island, to escape from the situation?

[SAN66]

Loved the episode, but I've got some issues with timing...

A few episodes ago, Farraday meets with Desmond outside the hatch and tells him to go see his mother. We flash foreward to the present and Desmond wakes up with the memory, it appears that it's new, because technically, it just happened.

Now we've got Widmore talking to Locke and he asks Locke how long ago did you first meet me. Locke's response, 4 days ago. Widmore is blown away by this news. Excuse me, according to the previous example, you should have only had this memory for 4 days as well. So if that's the case, how do you konw to send Abbadon to the hospital to meet Locke and get him to go to Australia to go on the walkabout?

The whole Farraday meeting Desmond outside the hatch blows my mind as well. Desmond comes out wearing all his gear. So he hasn't seen Kelvin go outside with the rip and he hasn't figured out that the sickness is a scam and Kevlin is lying to him. He doesn't follow Kelvin to the boat and kill him. So why doesn't Farraday meeting him screw up everything?

Desmond had never met Farraday in the present timeline, this is why Farraday asserts that the Losties cannot contact him. Since Desmond is unstuck in time though, Farraday contacts him and present day Desmond remembers the encounter.

Widmore and Locke's encounter was always part of the past, this does not alter the present.

The only confusing one I see is Rouseau's encounter with Jin in the past (Again always part of the past). She should have recognized him in the present, but we never get that. Then again Rouseau is crazy.

[shawn99]

Rouseau is crazy

Bingo, she goes mental!

[Trodge]

Desmond had never met Farraday in the present timeline, this is why Farraday asserts that the Losties cannot contact him. Since Desmond is unstuck in time though, Farraday contacts him and present day Desmond remembers the encounter.

Widmore and Locke's encounter was always part of the past, this does not alter the present.

The only confusing one I see is Rouseau's encounter with Jin in the past (Again always part of the past). She should have recognized him in the present, but we never get that. Then again Rouseau is crazy.

Desmond does meet Farraday in the present timeline, Farraday explains how constants work and gets him to trip through time. So this would be a result of him turning the key. Strange.

[rilhouse]

Loved the episode, but I've got some issues with timing...

A few episodes ago, Farraday meets with Desmond outside the hatch and tells him to go see his mother. We flash foreward to the present and Desmond wakes up with the memory, it appears that it's new, because technically, it just happened.

Now we've got Widmore talking to Locke and he asks Locke how long ago did you first meet me. Locke's response, 4 days ago. Widmore is blown away by this news. Excuse me, according to the previous example, you should have only had this memory for 4 days as well. So if that's the case, how do you konw to send Abbadon to the hospital to meet Locke and get him to go to Australia to go on the walkabout?

The whole Farraday meeting Desmond outside the hatch blows my mind as well. Desmond comes out wearing all his gear. So he hasn't seen Kelvin go outside with the rip and he hasn't figured out that the sickness is a scam and Kevlin is lying to him. He doesn't follow Kelvin to the boat and kill him. So why doesn't Farraday meeting him screw up everything?

Farraday said that the "rules don't apply to Desmond". Which people are assuming is because he is unstuck in time. Who knows....

[Rosico]

I think one of the neatest bits no one is talking about is how Widmore claims he was the leader of the Others till Ben tricked him into leaving?!

Now that will be a great episode!

Also love how the survivors of crash 2 found a dharma station so quickly. That took an entire season for crash 1 folks!

[felix]

How did Locke know that Christian was not Hurley or Kate's father?

[belowzeros]

How did Locke know that Christian was not Hurley's father

Hurley being Mexican he was just going for the obvious.


or Kate's father?

Christian: "Say hello to my son for me."

[felix]

Christian: "Say hello to my son for me."
Oops, you're right.

How do we know Hurley is Mexican? (sorry missed the first few seasons)

[AzN_RiverdaleCI]

his mother and father were shown.

edit: Oops, you're right.

How do we know Hurley is Mexican? (sorry missed the first few seasons)

[gflux]

Oops, you're right.

How do we know Hurley is Mexican? (sorry missed the first few seasons)

His last name is Reyes.

[gill2k]

I think one of the neatest bits no one is talking about is how Widmore claims he was the leader of the Others till Ben tricked him into leaving?!

Now that will be a great episode!

Also love how the survivors of crash 2 found a dharma station so quickly. That took an entire season for crash 1 folks!

That's cuz they crash landed on Hydra island (the small one by the MAIN island) where Jack, Kate, and Sawyer where jailed in Season 3. There's only one station on that island: Hydra Station.

I also don't think that plane crashed. Looked like Frank managed to land it on the runway the Others (and Kate plus Sawyer) were building in Season 3.

[originalnutta]

Oops, you're right.

How do we know Hurley is Mexican? (sorry missed the first few seasons)

sigh. watch the first few seasons.

i dont know how anyone can appreciate this show, having missed even one episode.

[originalnutta]

That's cuz they crash landed on Hydra island (the small one by the MAIN island) where Jack, Kate, and Sawyer where jailed in Season 3. There's only one station on that island: Hydra Station.

I also don't think that plane crashed. Looked like Frank managed to land it on the runway the Others (and Kate plus Sawyer) were building in Season 3.
Doesn't look like a runway. Maybe the end of an unfinished one.

Perhaps he did land it, but had to steer off the path. http://lost.cubit.net/archives/2009/02/5x07---ajira-plane-crash-in-th.php#more

[RayK]

Doesn't look like a runway. Maybe the end of an unfinished one.

Perhaps he did land it, but had to steer off the path. http://lost.cubit.net/archives/2009/02/5x07---ajira-plane-crash-in-th.php#more

http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Runway

check the two pictures on that site, its of the runway being built when kate and sawyer were there...and the ajira crash...looks pretty similar, but might not be

[jadoocian]

bump for new episode in 7 hours :)

[originalnutta]

ill be back in 36 hours.

Lately the newsgroups are slow to upload the HD version.

[jokadeska]

sigh. watch the first few seasons.

i dont know how anyone can appreciate this show, having missed even one episode.

They could watch one of those review episodes which talks about what went on..
but I agree, each eps is a must watch to fully see how well this show is presented and linked.

[jeffyjaixx]

They're back!

[Rosico]

Can't believe Horace would booze up and play with tnt over a stupid ankh - dude, the guy was murdered, it's not like they broke up.

That said, great episode but I wish Faraday would snap out of it (and hopefully not become a weird pedo)

[gill2k]

OMG! We finally got to see the statue. :D

[jadoocian]

the commercials said all new episode 2 weeks from tonight.

does that mean theres no new episode next week?
wtf man

[TechRock]

tony is you husband michelle...not peter

[AzN_RiverdaleCI]

aha Lefleur.

[gill2k]

tony is you husband michelle...not peter

LOL.. that was my first reaction too when they showed her. I guess after her career in CTU, she needed a nice vacation.

[Unicron]

best non reality show right now imo

love all the time travel, egyptian (I think Atlantis) stuff on this show

http://i42.tinypic.com/210zqsh.jpg

http://www.nilecommerce.net/images/statues/colored/sekhmet-cremeL.jpg

[MrDisco]

man what a complete mind-warp that ep was.

looks like they're really tying in the Egyptian mythology now. Why does Stargate keep popping in my head...

[mariokarter]

lol i think that has been the first episode in like three seasons that actually answered more questions than it asked!

pretty much all makes sense, daniel builds darma inititive stuff, tells charlotte to never come bac, she learns korean from jin etc


so,should young Ben and his father be arriving at the island soon? And what happens when they "catch up" with what has already happened (the others taking over the darhma initiative)? And now that locke is back...its wierd, locke was born in the 50s and its the 70s so locke has already been visited by richard alpert...so is richard alpert eagerly awaiting his return? the whole richard locke thing is wierd, one is always clueless and being led by the other and it alternates.

[winstona]

best non reality show right now imo

love all the time travel, egyptian (I think Atlantis) stuff on this show

http://i42.tinypic.com/210zqsh.jpg

http://www.nilecommerce.net/images/statues/colored/sekhmet-cremeL.jpg

I was almost in tears when I finally saw that damn statue last night! So the Island was once Egyptian...nice. I am eagerly waiting for young Ben to meet up with Sawyer and crew in the upcoming episodes...should be great!!

[idk-bart]

lol i think that has been the first episode in like three seasons that actually answered more questions than it asked!

pretty much all makes sense, daniel builds darma inititive stuff, tells charlotte to never come bac, she learns korean from jin etc


so,should young Ben and his father be arriving at the island soon? And what happens when they "catch up" with what has already happened (the others taking over the darhma initiative)? And now that locke is back...its wierd, locke was born in the 50s and its the 70s so locke has already been visited by richard alpert...so is richard alpert eagerly awaiting his return? the whole richard locke thing is wierd, one is always clueless and being led by the other and it alternates.

i think john locke is not in the same time, because the people on that plane saw kate, sun, jack, and hugo disappear when the flash occured. which sort of implies that those 4 time travelled - and now we know they're back in the 70's. meanwhile, the rest of the people on that plane are probably still on the present day time line. this might be part of the unpredictableness that hawkings was talking about. same place, different times.

[Ryan]

i think john locke is not in the same time, because the people on that plane saw kate, sun, jack, and hugo disappear when the flash occured. which sort of implies that those 4 time travelled - and now we know they're back in the 70's. meanwhile, the rest of the people on that plane are probably still on the present day time line. this might be part of the unpredictableness that hawkings was talking about. same place, different times.

That makes some sense since the Darma station that they showed in the previous episode was abandoned.

[ctc027]

i think john locke is not in the same time, because the people on that plane saw kate, sun, jack, and hugo disappear when the flash occured. which sort of implies that those 4 time travelled - and now we know they're back in the 70's. meanwhile, the rest of the people on that plane are probably still on the present day time line. this might be part of the unpredictableness that hawkings was talking about. same place, different times.

That might be the group that shot at Saywer and company when they were canoeing to the Orchid station?

[mariokarter]

i think john locke is not in the same time, because the people on that plane saw kate, sun, jack, and hugo disappear when the flash occured. which sort of implies that those 4 time travelled - and now we know they're back in the 70's. meanwhile, the rest of the people on that plane are probably still on the present day time line. this might be part of the unpredictableness that hawkings was talking about. same place, different times.

yeah that makes sense. But what about Ben, we know hes supposed to show up sometime soon, his father argued with horace.

[musdy]

Looks like Kate's back to screw everything up for Sawyer.

[gill2k]

yeah that makes sense. But what about Ben, we know hes supposed to show up sometime soon, his father argued with horace.

We'll definitely see young Ben pretty soon *checks cast list on IMDB for next episode* ;)

[gflux]

I think it'd be hilarious if they all get killed when Ben betrays and massacres the Dharma Initiative. But they'll probably go forward in time (via the donkeywheel?) to meet up with Locke before that happens.

[idk-bart]

That might be the group that shot at Saywer and company when they were canoeing to the Orchid station?

yes, i think so, if you check back on that scene they showed a bottled water with ajiara airline logo on it. and now we know those canoes are with the new plane survivors. so it was a flash forward into the future.

now, why did the plane people chase down and open fire at the people who stayed on the island from the past? seems kind of aggressive... i dont know, maybe they really want their canoe back? lol

[mariokarter]

I think it'd be hilarious if they all get killed when Ben betrays and massacres the Dharma Initiative. But they'll probably go forward in time (via the donkeywheel?) to meet up with Locke before that happens.

I'm betting that the rest of the seasonn will be about them trying to resync themselves with the present (locke and co) and that it will happen in the season finally, possibly right before the massacre and via the wheel.


also one other random thing now is that from both perspectives, those who stayed on the island, and those who just returned, three years has passed since they last saw eachother. What about Locks though? It has only been days though right? On the island before he used the donkey wheel it was days for sure. And from Tunisia onwards for him it has also just been days right? When he first makes contact with the oceanic six they all seem to make refrence to the fact that 3 years have passed and their livs have now changed and they can't go back. its just wierd that for him it will only seem like a little while. Like think from Jacks perspective, he will be told that locke left the island three years ago, but he only made contact with him recently and years after he had left the island.

[MrDisco]

random thought: does Richard use eyeliner, or kohl, due to Egyptian influence?

[Unicron]

random thought: does Richard use eyeliner, or kohl, due to Egyptian influence?

i read on a fansite that they think RIchard Alpart is RA

the sun god RA

and that he sort of looks egyptian lol

[skeletor]

http://www.freewebs.com/houseofanubis/anubis2.bmp

http://www.thegreenhead.com/imgs/lifesize-egyptian-anubis-sculpture-1.jpg

he's holding the ankh... that necklace symbol in the last episode.. also the huge statue they saw in the last flash looks like it's holding ankh symbols in both hands as well if you look closely to the picture previously posted above.

[EGee6]

Richard Alpart is one handsome dude


...no homo

[skeletor]

MOAR THEORIESSSSSSS

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h265/ceruleansyzygy/14194.jpg

[MrDisco]

i read on a fansite that they think RIchard Alpart is RA


Interesting, but I can't see the show introducing real deities (plus i doubt conservative America would stand for it :P).

On a lighter note, how about Phil's girlfriend Rosie? Let's hope we see more of her :)

MOAR THEORIESSSSSSS

woah nice find! That would fit nicely with the Others and their quest to get women to safely deliver babies. Maybe they used to worship this god and when women started dying they destroyed the statue in anger.

edit: actually I like this guess better "The Greek god Tawaret was the protector of pregnancy. When the statue was up, Juliet delivered the baby, but when the statue was down the babies of course all died."

[Unicron]

Richard Alpart is one handsome dude


...no homo

he's got pretty cool eyes for a guy

no homo either

[gill2k]

Thanks for posting the pic!

Now that the statue's been show, the whole Egyptian motifs from past episodes (mostly the hieroglyphics in the temple where Smokie is) are now starting to make sense.

[1yellowdog]

I'm wondering how Juliets intervention with the new birth will alter the future now.
Also thought about Daniel running after the very young Charlotte and how it must appear not in a good light to casual observers.
There's been a strong Egyptian influence since the heiroglypics were introduced when the "numbers" weren't keyed in to computer after Desmond ran off in an earlier season. The Atlanteans were supposedly way more advanced a society than even the Egyptians but maybe they borrowed from the Egyptians???? I agree that it would look too much like Stargate if they stuck with the Egyptian theme but Richard Alpert sure has the pharoah look going for him......
I guess we will just have to stay tuned.

[Evilz29]

MOAR THEORIESSSSSSS

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h265/ceruleansyzygy/14194.jpg

I think it's an Anubis

http://mythsoftheworld.net/egypt/images/anubis1big.jpg

See that that thing in the statues hand? It was also on that necklace that Paul had

[gflux]

I think it's an Anubis

http://mythsoftheworld.net/egypt/images/anubis1big.jpg

See that that thing in the statues hand? It was also on that necklace that Paul had

That symbol is an anhk - it represents eternal life. Maybe Richard Alpert is Egyptian!

[originalnutta]

Amazing show as always.

This season is just chugging on through. full steam ahead.

:lol: @ Sawyer calling Richard, the guy with the eyeliner.

[billdozer]

I'm wondering how Juliets intervention with the new birth will alter the future now.
Also thought about Daniel running after the very young Charlotte and how it must appear not in a good light to casual observers.
There's been a strong Egyptian influence since the heiroglypics were introduced when the "numbers" weren't keyed in to computer after Desmond ran off in an earlier season. The Atlanteans were supposedly way more advanced a society than even the Egyptians but maybe they borrowed from the Egyptians???? I agree that it would look too much like Stargate if they stuck with the Egyptian theme but Richard Alpert sure has the pharoah look going for him......
I guess we will just have to stay tuned.

Well Daniel said whatever happens now, happens. Before Charlotte died, she told Daniel she remembers a man telling her never to come back to the island, and that man was Daniel. So whatever happens on the island "now" (1974-1977), already happened before 815 crashed in 2004.

[LeeBear]

Interesting, but I can't see the show introducing real deities (plus i doubt conservative America would stand for it :P).

On a lighter note, how about Phil's girlfriend Rosie? Let's hope we see more of her :)



woah nice find! That would fit nicely with the Others and their quest to get women to safely deliver babies. Maybe they used to worship this god and when women started dying they destroyed the statue in anger.

edit: actually I like this guess better "The Greek god Tawaret was the protector of pregnancy. When the statue was up, Juliet delivered the baby, but when the statue was down the babies of course all died."

I think the statue is more symbolic then actually causing the babies to die. Lost has always mixed science and religion into the show but nothing is really by chance. My theory of why the babies are dying is because of the buried bomb. The bomb is probably leaking radiation throughout the island, hence why in the future/present all the babies are dying and not in the past when Juliet delivered the baby. Also explains why Claire and Sun were able to have there babies because they probably weren't on the island long enough to have affected there pregnancy.

-LeeBear

[SeeYouNextTime]

that last ep. was a total sleeper. :mad: The only thing that made it bearable was the last 10 seconds.

[originalnutta]

that last ep. was a total sleeper. :mad: The only thing that made it bearable was the last 10 seconds.

riiiiiiiiiiiiight.

[thelefteyeguy]

that last ep. was a total sleeper. :mad: The only thing that made it bearable was the last 10 seconds.

seriously?...there's been lots of activity on this thread over this episode :confused:

[mariokarter]

if anything i think the last 10 seconds were the most boring. As soon as sawyer got the call i think we all pretty much figured out what was going happen.

[gflux]

if anything i think the last 10 seconds were the most boring. As soon as sawyer got the call i think we all pretty much figured out what was going happen.

Goodness. How did you ever make it through 10 seconds of boredom?

[MrDisco]

I think the statue is more symbolic then actually causing the babies to die.

Good point.

I disagree with the radiation theory though. Shouldn't it cause the women and men to show the affects as well? (hair loss, etc).

[SAN66]

Good point.

I disagree with the radiation theory though. Shouldn't it cause the women and men to show the affects as well? (hair loss, etc).

Low dose radiation could affect fetal development but show little affect to full grown adults.

Still, I think there's more to it than just the nuke. Maybe a combination of radiation emanating from Jughead and the mysterious radiation that lets you time travel/heals people.

[belowzeros]

:lol: @ Sawyer calling Richard, the guy with the eyeliner.


lol that was an awesome bit wasn't it. I chuckled with great pleasure.

+1 not into men but Richard is well cast


I think the statue is more symbolic then actually causing the babies to die. Lost has always mixed science and religion into the show but nothing is really by chance. My theory of why the babies are dying is because of the buried bomb. The bomb is probably leaking radiation throughout the island, hence why in the future/present all the babies are dying and not in the past when Juliet delivered the baby. Also explains why Claire and Sun were able to have there babies because they probably weren't on the island long enough to have affected there pregnancy.

Lost actually leans more toward Faith than Science and the Dharma initiative does at some higher level as well. Look at the church where the lampost is hidden, the church is OVER the science lab...not an accident for sure. I don't think the bomb has anything to do with delivering babies, you would see a lot more illness other than a dead birth...we'd probably have 5 headed zombies running around the island if it was radiation at fault. More than likely some change in faith or something altered the link to religion on the island. I wouldn't be surprised if it was something as simple as the statue being destroyed if it is indeed the Egyptian god of Fertility.



Someone mentioned above that this episode answered more than it asked...I don't see how that's possible. This episode was another mind bender.

[spike-spiegel]

Richard Alpert gets off the island in the series finale and becomes Mayor of Gotham City. :cheesygri

[LeeBear]

Low dose radiation could affect fetal development but show little affect to full grown adults.

Still, I think there's more to it than just the nuke. Maybe a combination of radiation emanating from Jughead and the mysterious radiation that lets you time travel/heals people.

Is there actual proof that the island heals people? I'm thinking the writers might use Locke's in wheel chair before crash then being able to walk again to throw viewers off. Locke being able to walk after the crash could be a different John from before he was in a wheel chair switching place with the wheel chair John. Remember when Sawyer saw Claire give birth to Aaron, in theory if he went back to the beach he could of ran into himself right? Remember it might not just be the characters we see that are jumping around through time. That would kinda also explain why Jack's dead is alive on the island even though he was dead on the plane. Its another version of him that they are seeing much like the walking John could be another version.

-LeeBear

[belowzeros]

Is there actual proof that the island heals people?-LeeBear


ummm...hehe :)


Locke raising from the dead is a pretty good healer trick.

Locke walking after the plane crash after he was doomed to a wheelchair for the rest of his life.

beyond that though Rose is probably the most obvious with her "miracle" Cancer cure.

there are probably others but those are the slap me in the face obvious ones.

Christian is a ghost, the manifestation of Jacob. Others aside from Hurley, Locke and Claire can't even see him. Claire was probably dead when she sat with him anyway since we have been programmed to believe that Hurley sees dead people.

[gill2k]

Sun able to get pregnant is another miracle. Jin was infertile before they came to the island.

[Nikita]

random thought: does Richard use eyeliner, or kohl, due to Egyptian influence?

LOL...no, I think that's just his natural look. I remember him being on another show, the name of which I forget, that only lasted one season before the writer's strike, with Jimmy Smits....same eyeliner look.

I think the statue is more symbolic then actually causing the babies to die. Lost has always mixed science and religion into the show but nothing is really by chance. My theory of why the babies are dying is because of the buried bomb. The bomb is probably leaking radiation throughout the island, hence why in the future/present all the babies are dying and not in the past when Juliet delivered the baby. Also explains why Claire and Sun were able to have there babies because they probably weren't on the island long enough to have affected there pregnancy.

-LeeBear

I believe Claire's baby lived because it wasn't conceived on the island and Sun's because it wasn't born on the island.

[MrDisco]

LOL...no, I think that's just his natural look

It is, but within the context of the show they could use it as a plot point.

I remember him being on another show

'Cane'

[Rosico]

Does anyone think Claire is coming back? They never really handled her 'death/disappearance'

[mariokarter]

Does anyone think Claire is coming back? They never really handled her 'death/disappearance'

I hope so. I cant really see the actor settling for just kind of wandering away to to some random shack. She would at least demand a full blown death like Charlie's or somethin.

[originalnutta]

Does anyone think Claire is coming back? They never really handled her 'death/disappearance'

She is coming back. So far we know she is Jack's half sister and is with Christian Shepherd, hanging out at Jacob's hut.

Im pretty sure TPTB will explain their situation.

[belowzeros]

they actually released her from a full schedule commitment, now she's just listed on the payroll as a bit part player (i forget what they actually call it). It means she's released from having to be available from daily on set commitments and is free to pursue other engagements without penalty.

it doesn't mean she can't come back for a cameo but they've essentially released her from a major role.

[civ@uw]

they actually released her from a full schedule commitment, now she's just listed on the payroll as a bit part player (i forget what they actually call it). It means she's released from having to be available from daily on set commitments and is free to pursue other engagements without penalty.

it doesn't mean she can't come back for a cameo but they've essentially released her from a major role.

That's only for this season. Next season she is part of the full cast.

[jadoocian]

Can anyone confirm there is no new episode tomorrow night?

[winstona]

Can anyone confirm there is no new episode tomorrow night?

In last week's preview after the episode, it is already mentioned that the next episode will be two weeks away.

You can also check TV.com:

http://www.tv.com/lost/show/24313/episode_guide.html

I usually go here to check out if a certain show will air new episode or just re-runs...

[gflux]

Can anyone confirm there is no new episode tomorrow night?

They definitely mentioned it in the last episode. I thought the whole point of delaying the start of the season to January was to stop having repeats. :mad:

[idk-bart]

They definitely mentioned it in the last episode. I thought the whole point of delaying the start of the season to January was to stop having repeats. :mad:

chill out man, it's just one week.

[AzN_RiverdaleCI]

chill out man, it's just one week.

can't chill out, they stopped showing for a long time and came back Jan now they're gonna skip a week! what is this!

[spawn582]

i checked abc.com and it looks like they are airing last week's enhanced ep tonight. why not show a new ep? u think they were showing some 2hr special or something but they are showing lost, just not a new ep. stupid.

[belowzeros]

wow so much QQ =p

it's a heavy sweeps week next week not this one...money talks peoples

[jadoocian]

wow so much QQ =p

it's a heavy sweeps week next week not this one...money talks peoples

???

[ladybug193]

The Episode 7 Secrets and Recaps video is up for anyone jonesing for some LOST tonight.....like me :lol:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WfHRkrSVQFE&feature=sdig&et=1236768057.97

[1yellowdog]

Why did Richard Alpert and his group want Pauls dead body? Paul was part of the Dharma Initiative wasn't he? I don't understand why they'd want his dead body, the other 2 that killed him were part of Richards group so I guess I understand why they'd want those bodies returned but Paul too?????

[rilhouse]

Why did Richard Alpert and his group want Pauls dead body? Paul was part of the Dharma Initiative wasn't he? I don't understand why they'd want his dead body, the other 2 that killed him were part of Richards group so I guess I understand why they'd want those bodies returned but Paul too?????

i assume to show his people that they got revenge.

[originalnutta]

Why did Richard Alpert and his group want Pauls dead body? Paul was part of the Dharma Initiative wasn't he? I don't understand why they'd want his dead body, the other 2 that killed him were part of Richards group so I guess I understand why they'd want those bodies returned but Paul too?????
We dont know. We can assume to show they got revenge. But im thinking it's something supernatural and freaky. Zombie Paul!

[gflux]

Wooo! Good episode even though it didn't go anywhere. The preview for next week looks really intriguing.

[1yellowdog]

That felt like the fastest hour of my life, great episode, riveting.
So any bets as to who will take out young Ben before he plots against the Dharma group?

[Handa]

Wooo! Good episode even though it didn't go anywhere. The preview for next week looks really intriguing.

Well not really, we know that Sun and Jin aren't in the same time period. THAT should throw another curve ball into the ever-curvey series.

Any theories as to why? I think it had to do with the fact that Sun had her baby off the island and that small Ben is there in the past, therefore the island's weird 'time-correction' wouldn't let those two go back in time.

[Unicron]

this show rockssssssssssssssssssssssss

such a good episode

[mariokarter]

lol sawyer put jack in his place, stupid workman, way to fail the aptitude test.

I knew it about young Ben.

So how did sayid make it back?

and it seems that the others are made up of at least more members of the DI than just Ben, ie ethan.

[jadoocian]

someone remind me what happened to faraday

[Unicron]

someone remind me what happened to faraday

i don't know for sure

i think he's working in the mining area now?

[gflux]

Anyone notice the woman in the shadows behind Sun when she was talking to Christian? It looked like the red headed woman that died in front of Faraday but it could be Clair too.

[idk-bart]

Anyone notice the woman in the shadows behind Sun when she was talking to Christian? It looked like the red headed woman that died in front of Faraday but it could be Clair too.

omg that is just creepy.

i think faraday kamakaze'ed right into the infinite energy pocket in the mines in an attempt to time travel. because james said he wasn't "there" anymore - didn't say he was dead.

btw, love that scene when sun lied to ben and smacked him right in the head when he wasn't looking. it's almost like sun is turning into a female version of ben! he got a nice taste of his own medicine.

[MrDisco]

What a terrific episode.

Anyone notice the woman in the shadows behind Sun when she was talking to Christian? It looked like the red headed woman that died in front of Faraday but it could be Clair too.

i had to go back and watch that scene. That's F*$#@&^) creepy!

I think it's Clare.

[Unicron]

What a terrific episode.



i had to go back and watch that scene. That's F*$#@&^) creepy!

I think it's Clare.

http://i40.tinypic.com/2w6tl5c.gif

[M.D.]

terrific episode, love how sawyer is running tings now.

[MrDisco]

Something which I found interesting was how James refers to the Dharma commune as 'my people', the same line Richard uses for the hostiles.

[winstona]

Anyone notice the woman in the shadows behind Sun when she was talking to Christian? It looked like the red headed woman that died in front of Faraday but it could be Clair too.

Good eyes! I totally missed it, I gotta have to rewatch this tonight.

I like how Jack and Sawyer switch roles...I am interested to see how Jack copes with this new "non-leadership" role and how Sawyer further develops into the leader of the group.

[Tijuana]

Wasn't the baby the lady was having suppose to be ben?

[gflux]

Wasn't the baby the lady was having suppose to be ben?

Ben was born in America. There was an episode that showed a couple whose car was parked on a road, the woman gives birth to Ben and she dies. His father resents him from that day on.

So Ethan was conceived and born on the island. My bet is that the Others kidnap him while he's still a child because he's special.

[adeel]

Well not really, we know that Sun and Jin aren't in the same time period. THAT should throw another curve ball into the ever-curvey series.

Any theories as to why? I think it had to do with the fact that Sun had her baby off the island and that small Ben is there in the past, therefore the island's weird 'time-correction' wouldn't let those two go back in time.

I think your theory makes sense for Ben, but I dont see the same application for Sun, but who knows.

lol sawyer put jack in his place, stupid workman, way to fail the aptitude test.

I knew it about young Ben.

So how did sayid make it back?

and it seems that the others are made up of at least more members of the DI than just Ben, ie ethan.

LOL it was funny to see Sawyer do that. I bet he's been waiting years.

http://i40.tinypic.com/2w6tl5c.gif

I remember noticing somethin when watching, but I didn't really think it could be a person. I was discussing with a friend after the show last night...we concluded that Christian Sheppard must be alive on the island, similar to how Locke came back to life, since I believe Sun and Frank would have seen him...meaning he probably isnt a ghost/spirit of some kind.

Good eyes! I totally missed it, I gotta have to rewatch this tonight.

I like how Jack and Sawyer switch roles...I am interested to see how Jack copes with this new "non-leadership" role and how Sawyer further develops into the leader of the group.

I think Sawyer has really matured over these 3 years. Too bad Kate is back to ruin it all...

[gflux]

I remember noticing somethin when watching, but I didn't really think it could be a person. I was discussing with a friend after the show last night...we concluded that Christian Sheppard must be alive on the island, similar to how Locke came back to life, since I believe Sun and Frank would have seen him...meaning he probably isnt a ghost/spirit of some kind.

I didn't like this theory when I first heard it: Christian is the smoke monster or Smokey is manipulating Christian's body -- but it makes sense in this last episode. When Sun and the pilot get to the dock, something big is moving the trees, then they hear whispers (which always seem to come before seeing the monster) and then they see someone moving in the Dharma house.

[Rosico]

Any ideas about how the 'times' will come back together (if at all)?

And although Sawyer is the leader now, I bet we'll see the writers bring Jack back after a while - Matthew Fox is the highest paid actor on the show I think.

Although, that was a wicked exchange they had: I think, you react.

[mariokarter]

Any ideas about how the 'times' will come back together (if at all)?



Pasters will be ejected into the present. otherwise there will be duplicate Bens.

[ladybug193]

Um....WOW....Ben just got smoked.....

[SAN66]

WTF? Temporal causality anyone? You think young Ben just isn't dead? Like he can't die as a child?

One thing that always struck me as odd, in the flashback where Ben kills the Dharma initiative, Ben looks like old Ben, at youngest in his 30's, but then you'd think the Dharma initiative (Presently in the Mid 70's) might update a few things in the 15-20 years or so that they were there. It would put the Death of Dharma in the 90's.

[AzN_RiverdaleCI]

lol Sayid had teh balls to kill a kid.

[N_Raged]

paradox!

[1yellowdog]

I had a feeling this was going to happen, just didn't know who would do it. It was a toss up between Sayid and Sun but since Sun is still in the present I guess it had to be Sayid. I wonder who sets the bus on fire, hopefully young Bens body is in it.

[SAN66]

I had a feeling this was going to happen, just didn't know who would do it. It was a toss up between Sayid and Sun but since Sun is still in the present I guess it had to be Sayid. I wonder who sets the bus on fire, hopefully young Bens body is in it.

Ben set the truck on fire to create a diversion to break Sayid out of jail, I thought that was pretty apparent.

[Nitram]

They can't kill him off....his fate is sealed...things must happen the way they did with Dharma and the Others.

Its not the first time someone dead has been brought back to life by the island ;)

[1yellowdog]

Ben set the truck on fire to create a diversion to break Sayid out of jail, I thought that was pretty apparent.

I thought there was only 1 bus.

[1yellowdog]

They can't kill him off....his fate is sealed...things must happen the way they did with Dharma and the Others.

Its not the first time someone dead has been brought back to life by the island ;)

Acckk, you're probably right :(

[jadoocian]

yeah i was thinking since locke is alive on the island miraculously, same thing could happen to ben.

[SAN66]

I thought there was only 1 bus.

They've already shown two buses together at the same time, dunno if there's more.

[idk-bart]

yeah there's no way young ben is dead, the gunshot wound could easily be non-fatal. or the island could keep him alive. i'm just a little disappointed that sayid didn't go for the definitive headshot after young ben was down. that's what i would've done.

[mariokarter]

wasn't the greatest episode. Just illustrated that yet again the plot on this show makes no sense. but I guess Ben has to live.

[Unicron]

WOW :-0

didn't expect that to happen at the end tonight...

was thinking sayyid would take and raise Ben so he wouldn't become a douche bag

i wonder what happens to Future Ben now...

[MrDisco]

kind of a meh episode. Why Sayid didn't put a second bullet in Ben's head is beyond me. They build up the whole back story on how he's a killer yet he just runs off into the jungle. :confused:

[winstona]

kind of a meh episode. Why Sayid didn't put a second bullet in Ben's head is beyond me. They build up the whole back story on how he's a killer yet he just runs off into the jungle. :confused:

Totally agree. If Sayid really wanted to kill young Ben, he should have at least made sure that Ben is really dead by firing a few more shots.

There can be a few explanations though...May be he is in a hurry to get away? Or may be he feels uncomfortable shooting a kid cold blooded even though it is someone he hates.

Who knows...may be that gun he took from Jin just shoots tranqualizers and not real bullets...I didn't seen any blood BTW.

[Smiss]

I'm guessing that the island is going to heal Ben??

I can't remember a time where I've ever seen a kid get shot and/or killed on TV or in a movie... the wow factor was definately there.

[takusan]

I just cant understand why sayeed didnt just go along with sawyers plan and choose to live with the dharma guys.

He had a chance to kill Ben before - why now??

[fajer]

I just cant understand why sayeed didnt just go along with sawyers plan and choose to live with the dharma guys.

He had a chance to kill Ben before - why now??

Because his fate was to be on that plane, get captured and get young Ben to release him then shoot him.

[jadoocian]

didn't faraday say that you shouldn't mess around with anything in the past as it will screw things up in the future. ie. there are not multiple universes, rather time is like a string- one string, not many strings. so this should really mess things up if somehow ben is dead (which I'm sure he isn't)


Can someone remind me what happened to Faraday and Desmond?

[winstona]

didn't faraday say that you shouldn't mess around with anything in the past as it will screw things up in the future. ie. there are not multiple universes, rather time is like a string- one string, not many strings. so this should really mess things up if somehow ben is dead (which I'm sure he isn't)

I guess he never told Sayid about it :)



Can someone remind me what happened to Faraday and Desmond?

Desmond did not go back to the island with the Oceanic 6. Faraday still hasn't showed up in the show yet after the Losties went back to the 70s. It is still a mystery where he is.

[gflux]

I guess he never told Sayid about it :)

Desmond did not go back to the island with the Oceanic 6. Faraday still hasn't showed up in the show yet after the Losties went back to the 70s. It is still a mystery where he is.

We see Faraday in the mines in the season premier flashback. What has happened to him since? No one knows just yet.

[mariokarter]

it was implied that faraday was sent to the 70s with the rest of the losties but then that something happened to him and he might no longer be there/alive. It was in a conversation when the two lostie groups are reunited in the 70s.

[gflux]

I think what Sawyer meant was the Faraday just distanced himself away from them - not that he died or anything - because of his connection to the redhead. It's obvious that he doesn't die because he has some sort of relationship with a woman in the future, as uncovered by Desmond - although if Sayid does indeed kill Ben then the future could be rewritten. For all we know he may have also traveled off the island via the sub.

[belowzeros]

yeah there's no way young ben is dead, the gunshot wound could easily be non-fatal. or the island could keep him alive. i'm just a little disappointed that sayid didn't go for the definitive headshot after young ben was down. that's what i would've done.


Sayid the great Executioner...why in the hell didn't he double or triple tap his target? baloney I say...probably for TV violence ratings

now with only one gunshot young ben is sure to survive >.>

gg Sayid

[Handa]

I think what Sawyer meant was the Faraday just distanced himself away from them - not that he died or anything - because of his connection to the redhead. It's obvious that he doesn't die because he has some sort of relationship with a woman in the future, as uncovered by Desmond - although if Sayid does indeed kill Ben then the future could be rewritten. For all we know he may have also traveled off the island via the sub.

The future CAN'T be rewritten, at least not in the sense of time travel as we know it on LOST. Faraday said 'whatever happens, happens' so as far as I'm concerned, there is no way Benjamin Linus dies. This probably just hardens him or will heal him miraculously (a la Locke) so he thinks he's even more special than he already thinks he is. Either way I don't believe Linus will be dead in the future. Remember, time travel is wonky on this show, it's not like the Back to the Future style time travel that we all know and loved from the 80s, this is a new special style... it's a post-modern style of time travel :)

Ahh I loved last night's ep, the guy that plays Sayid is such a good actor. And I also love the way Phil is nervous around Sawyer (aka, Lafleur) 'Take your lunch Phil...' haha that was a great scene.

[gflux]

The future CAN'T be rewritten, at least not in the sense of time travel as we know it on LOST. Faraday said 'whatever happens, happens' so as far as I'm concerned, there is no way Benjamin Linus dies.

That's what Faraday says (and his research) but what if he's wrong? Just because a character says something that doesn't necessarily mean it's true. Also, his research on time travel wasn't tested on the island so it's entirely possible that time travel works different there.

[gill2k]

My head is starting to hurt with this "Whatever happened, happened" business ever since I started thinking about the ending to last night's episode.

I say screw Faraday and his theory. BRING ON ALTERNATE TIMELINES!!!! ;)

[belowzeros]

I say screw Faraday and his theory. BRING ON ALTERNATE TIMELINES!!!! ;)


Literature and Religion weigh heavily on lost...last night the book that young Ben handed to Sayid would make you proud :)

[1yellowdog]

yeah there's no way young ben is dead, the gunshot wound could easily be non-fatal. or the island could keep him alive. i'm just a little disappointed that sayid didn't go for the definitive headshot after young ben was down. that's what i would've done.

I disagree, since Sayid was the shooter, I really think he would shoot to kill given his mindset and the target.

kind of a meh episode. Why Sayid didn't put a second bullet in Ben's head is beyond me. They build up the whole back story on how he's a killer yet he just runs off into the jungle. :confused:

I think he was sure he finished him off and had other places to go.

Totally agree. If Sayid really wanted to kill young Ben, he should have at least made sure that Ben is really dead by firing a few more shots.

There can be a few explanations though...May be he is in a hurry to get away? Or may be he feels uncomfortable shooting a kid cold blooded even though it is someone he hates.
Who knows...may be that gun he took from Jin just shoots tranqualizers and not real bullets...I didn't seen any blood BTW.

It seemed to me he was looking forward to killing Ben so he could prevent what happens in the future, maybe not so much for the Dharma Group but for all the killings of Whitmores people he made Sayid do when he was off the island.

I'm guessing that the island is going to heal Ben??

I can't remember a time where I've ever seen a kid get shot and/or killed on TV or in a movie... the wow factor was definately there.

I was wondering why they kept having warnings about scenes of violence, when we have seen other people being shot. It was only Ben after all :twisted: I was cheering, Ben is a psycho after all.

I just cant understand why sayeed didnt just go along with sawyers plan and choose to live with the dharma guys.

He had a chance to kill Ben before - why now??

I was surprised he didn't want to hang out with the Dharma group either, but I think he had just had enough and when he figured out what his destiny was he decided there was no time like the present when he had his opportunity. When you're really pissed at someone like Sayid was you just get tunnel vision.

Sayid the great Executioner...why in the hell didn't he double or triple tap his target? baloney I say...probably for TV violence ratings

now with only one gunshot young ben is sure to survive >.>

gg Sayid

I really think he thought he had killed him. Why would he run off otherwise if he had just wounded him? He wanted to kill the little creep, not put a scare into him.

[spawn582]

I really think he thought he had killed him. Why would he run off otherwise if he had just wounded him? He wanted to kill the little creep, not put a scare into him.

i haven't rewatched it or anything but from what i remember, didn't he shoot ben right at the heart. that should "end" somebody and why he ran off afterwards.

[slowtyper]

It seemed to me he was looking forward to killing Ben so he could prevent what happens in the future, maybe not so much for the Dharma Group but for all the killings of Whitmores people he made Sayid do when he was off the island.


They were obviously trying to show that Sayid had trouble doing it.

[gill2k]

Literature and Religion weigh heavily on lost...last night the book that young Ben handed to Sayid would make you proud :)

Yeah I noticed that.

And the reason I'm for alternate timeline(s)...

Ever since we got to the 2nd half of the season beginning with the Dharma stuff, to me, it's starting to feel like they're just showcasing what leads up to the purge, etc. We already know how that turned out. Give me something new. The last two episodes, I'm finding it hard to cheer for Jack, Sawyer, Kate, Hurley, etc. in the past (the 70's) when I know they're just there to serve their purpose just so things we already know happened should happen, despite of how they try to change things.

Would it not be more interesting if Faraday is not completely right, or that Sun and Frank are stuck in an alternate future and the Losties in the 70s have to do some work to get things back the way they were or else the world will end? Or wouldn't it be more interesting if the future CAN be changed to some degree? There's already a couple of hints to things like that - Dharma Ville looks completely out of whack in 2007, Ben's "he changed the rules!" disbelief after he saw his daughter get killed by Keamy, Mrs. Hawking to Desmond in the jewelery shop: "You have to go to that island and push the button or we're all gonna die!"

I'd love to see the writers to really pursue that aspect of time travel even further.

[jokadeska]

They were obviously trying to show that Sayid had trouble doing it.

I thought they were trying to show Sayid had no problem with the killing. In fact, he wasn't sure what to do after killing everyone. He was a born killer and thats why he didn't even have any problem killing the child version of ben.

[gflux]

I thought they were trying to show Sayid had no problem with the killing. In fact, he wasn't sure what to do after killing everyone. He was a born killer and thats why he didn't even have any problem killing the child version of ben.

Hmmm. I'm pretty sure they showed a few moments of struggle before he pulled he trigger.

[1yellowdog]

I thought they were trying to show Sayid had no problem with the killing. In fact, he wasn't sure what to do after killing everyone. He was a born killer and thats why he didn't even have any problem killing the child version of ben.

I agree that he was a born killer, especially since he had no problem killing chickens as a little kid. He seemed unsure as to what to do next when Ben had no use for him anymore.

Hmmm. I'm pretty sure they showed a few moments of struggle before he pulled he trigger.

I didn't think of him as hesitating, I saw that as him making sure he didn't miss :lol:

[1yellowdog]

Yeah I noticed that.

And the reason I'm for alternate timeline(s)...

Ever since we got to the 2nd half of the season beginning with the Dharma stuff, to me, it's starting to feel like they're just showcasing what leads up to the purge, etc. We already know how that turned out. Give me something new. The last two episodes, I'm finding it hard to cheer for Jack, Sawyer, Kate, Hurley, etc. in the past (the 70's) when I know they're just there to serve their purpose just so things we already know happened should happen, despite of how they try to change things.

Would it not be more interesting if Faraday is not completely right, or that Sun and Frank are stuck in an alternate future and the Losties in the 70s have to do some work to get things back the way they were or else the world will end? Or wouldn't it be more interesting if the future CAN be changed to some degree? There's already a couple of hints to things like that - Dharma Ville looks completely out of whack in 2007, Ben's "he changed the rules!" disbelief after he saw his daughter get killed by Keamy, Mrs. Hawking to Desmond in the jewelery shop: "You have to go to that island and push the button or we're all gonna die!"

I'd love to see the writers to really pursue that aspect of time travel even further.

I see what you're saying and I agree a little. I have to admit that it gets tedious continually being strung along each week but an hour of Lost, even a crappy episode (relative to the other episodes) are better than many, many hours watching other tv shows, IMO. The characters and the development of those characters over the seasons have me hooked, even the ones I don't like.

[deezz]

didn't faraday say that you shouldn't mess around with anything in the past as it will screw things up in the future. ie. there are not multiple universes, rather time is like a string- one string, not many strings. so this should really mess things up if somehow ben is dead (which I'm sure he isn't)

Actually, what Faraday said was that you can't change things. Whatever has already happened, whatever you do in the past to try to change those things, the universe will auto-correct itself. So even if Ben is dead, the people that Sayid killed, and everything that happened to the Losties would probably still all happen in some shape or form.

I have my doubts about Ben being dead though, since the Island is so good at healing people. And if Sayid even missed by a millimeter, then he would have a chance. I wouldn't be surprised if in the next episode, Grown Up Ben confronts Sayid, and shows him a scar on his chest or something :)

I must admit that my jaw DROPPED when Sayid shot him...I wasn't expecting that...I've NEVER seen a kid shot on TV before!!!! That was crazy! Next week's episode, or the one after that (whichever one goes back to that sub-plot, usually it's every other) will be very interesting to see :)

I continue my love affair with this show!!

I want Jack to be running things again though, I liked it better when he was in charge...haven't seen much Jackface lately lol

[jokadeska]

I think Faraday meant that everything already happened in the past and nothing can be changed. ie. in their "present" time in the 2000s, all the things they are doing in the 70s already occured.

Its like the time paradox, where lets say you go back in time and you kill your father. But since you killed your father, you would never be born and thus unable to go back to kill your father.

So basically nothing can be changed even if you go back in time.

[jcon]

Things can't be changed.

Penny is dead, and Ben is responsible, if Ben does die then someone else must kill Penny. She is still dead.


I think, as a poster already said, the Island will save lil' Ben.

[SAN66]

Things can't be changed.

Penny is dead, and Ben is responsible, if Ben does die then someone else must kill Penny. She is still dead.


I think, as a poster already said, the Island will save lil' Ben.

Whoa whoa, did I miss something, when did Penny die?

Sayid cannot kill Young Ben because Sayids reason for killing young Ben is the fact that Old Ben made him kill people. If young Ben dies Sayid is never made to kill by Old Ben and thus has no reason to kill young Ben. Its a paradox in itself.

[gflux]

I think, as a poster already said, the Island will save lil' Ben.

Probably right but I hope the writers don't take this easy route.

[jcon]

Whoa whoa, did I miss something, when did Penny die?

Ben killed her as revenge for his daughter's death, before he boards the plane to Guam. It's not shown but it is implied.

[jcon]

Probably right but I hope the writers don't take this easy route.

I don't think that there is any way around, tbh.

Ben is key character and his life has been paramount to the 'islanders' and the Island.

I don't know how a paradox like lil' Ben's death would be handled otherwise.

[deezz]

Whoa whoa, did I miss something, when did Penny die?

Sayid cannot kill Young Ben because Sayids reason for killing young Ben is the fact that Old Ben made him kill people. If young Ben dies Sayid is never made to kill by Old Ben and thus has no reason to kill young Ben. Its a paradox in itself.

It's a mere fan speculation, not even actually implied yet on the show, that Desmond kicked Ben's ass before boarding the plane for trying to kill Penny. Some people think that he succeeded, and that that's gonna get Desmond back to the island. Ben's reason for killing Penny was revenge for Whidmore's people killing Ben's "daughter." Not a bad theory, but I'd prefer to just watch the show and see what happens :)

I too hope the writers don't take the easy paradox route :D

[RayK]

It's a mere fan speculation, not even actually implied yet on the show, that Damien kicked Ben's ass before boarding the plane for trying to kill Penny. Some people think that he succeeded, and that that's gonna get Damien back to the island. Ben's reason for killing Penny was revenge for Whidmore's people killing Ben's "daughter." Not a bad theory, but I'd prefer to just watch the show and see what happens :)

I too hope the writers don't take the easy paradox route :D

Desmond?

[deezz]

Desmond?

Geezus who the hell's Damien?!?! LOL thanks fixed.

[jcon]

It's a mere fan speculation, not even actually implied yet on the show, that Damien kicked Ben's ass before boarding the plane for trying to kill Penny. Some people think that he succeeded, and that that's gonna get Damien back to the island. Ben's reason for killing Penny was revenge for Whidmore's people killing Ben's "daughter." Not a bad theory, but I'd prefer to just watch the show and see what happens :)

Actually there is quite a bit of circumstantial evidence that implies him killing Penny.

1) He said he was going to kill her as revenge for his daughters death.
2) They (he and Sayid) had killed everyone on the list that he needed killed.
3) He went to the harbour, after finding out Desmond was in town and we see him there covered in blood.

I actually don't think they need Desmond back on the Island, he wasn't part of the plane crash. We could easily find out that Ben killed Desmond and Penny, and their son, but I find that unlikely. Rather we'll see Desmond come back for revenge.

The circumstantial evidence is there, but it may be misdirection for some other reason.

[deezz]

Actually there is quite a bit of circumstantial evidence that implies him killing Penny.

1) He said he was going to kill her as revenge for his daughters death.
2) They (he and Sayid) had killed everyone on the list that he needed killed.
3) He went to the harbour, after finding out Desmond was in town and we see him there covered in blood.

I actually don't think they need Desmond back on the Island, he wasn't part of the plane crash. We could easily find out that Ben killed Desmond and Penny, and their son, but I find that unlikely. Rather we'll see Desmond come back for revenge.

The circumstantial evidence is there, but it may be misdirection for some other reason.

3 is a very good point, but, I can't for the life of me remember when Ben brought up your point #1, was it last season?? That'd be very interesting if he did....coupled with #3 it makes for a very compelling speculation :D

And yes, misdirection is everywhere.....makes watching the show fun!! :D

[deezz]

Actually there is quite a bit of circumstantial evidence that implies him killing Penny.

1) He said he was going to kill her as revenge for his daughters death.
2) They (he and Sayid) had killed everyone on the list that he needed killed.
3) He went to the harbour, after finding out Desmond was in town and we see him there covered in blood.

I actually don't think they need Desmond back on the Island, he wasn't part of the plane crash. We could easily find out that Ben killed Desmond and Penny, and their son, but I find that unlikely. Rather we'll see Desmond come back for revenge.

The circumstantial evidence is there, but it may be misdirection for some other reason.

3 is a very good point, but, I can't for the life of me remember when Ben brought up your point #1, was it last season?? That'd be very interesting if he did....coupled with #3 it makes for a very compelling speculation :D

And yes, misdirection is everywhere.....makes watching the show fun!! :D

I'm just wondering when Alpert is gonna take a bigger role, I mean, he was Mayor of Gotham already geez!! lol

[Radiohead]

3 is a very good point, but, I can't for the life of me remember when Ben brought up your point #1, was it last season?? That'd be very interesting if he did....coupled with #3 it makes for a very compelling speculation :D

And yes, misdirection is everywhere.....makes watching the show fun!! :D

I'm just wondering when Alpert is gonna take a bigger role, I mean, he was Mayor of Gotham already geez!! lol

I don't recall which episode it was but after getting off the island sometime, Ben breaks into Widmore's apartment and essentially vows to him he will kill Widmore's daughter (Penny) in retribution for Keamy killing Alex and changing the rules of the game.

[mariokarter]

yes I can verify all three points also.

[deezz]

I don't recall which episode it was but after getting off the island sometime, Ben breaks into Widmore's apartment and essentially vows to him he will kill Widmore's daughter (Penny) in retribution for Keamy killing Alex and changing the rules of the game.

Oh yeeeeeaaaaahhhh! I remember that!! Thanks Radiohead!

I personally don't wanna see her go...she's so sweet, and hot, well, the top 3/4's of her face is hot....there's something up with her mouthal area....overall still hot though :)

[jadoocian]

I personally don't wanna see her go...she's so sweet, and hot, well, the top 3/4's of her face is hot....there's something up with her mouthal area....overall still hot though :)

wow....does anyone else feel that way...:confused:

[deezz]

^about her being sweet? or about 3/4 of her face being hot?

OMG I just hit 1001 posts!!! I'm officially a Deal Addict woohoooo!!! How appropriate since I'm a huge Lost fan too yaaaaay!

[jcon]

She always reminded me of Taylor Dayne

http://images.uulyrics.com/cover/t/taylor-dayne/album-taylor-dayne-greatest-hits.jpg

[deezz]

yeah you're right about that.....but she had that mouth thing going on too lol...

[deezz]

yeah you're right about that.....but she had that mouth thing going on too lol...

[malbadon]

Probably right but I hope the writers don't take this easy route.

I don't consider it the easy route, its the most sensible route. The island will bring him back to life, exactly like it brought Locke back to life in present timeline when his coffin landed on the island (and he'd been dead, what, weeks at that point?). Ben coming back to life will be what convinces Richard that Ben is special and will allow him to join the Others (thus eventually becoming their leader).

What happens has already happened, exactly as Faraday said. "Something" turned Ben from someone Alpert was likely only going to use as a tool to get access to Dharma into someone Alpert allows to replace him as leader of the Others. This is the start of Ben's 'connection' to the island.

[SAN66]

That was a decent episode, mostly filler as nothing really happened or was unexpected.

Though something confuses me and I don't see it discussed anywhere. This Carole lady, Aarons grandmother is Claires mom, but isn't Claires mom dead?

[winstona]

Not entirely impressed with the episode...So Richard's magical memory wiping ability is the reason why Ben never recognize any of the Losties in 2004...hmmm.

[Unicron]

Last few seconds were AWESOME

I really think The Island is Atlantis and these temples they go into are some sort of "magic"

If anyone reads about stuff on Atlantis on google theres stuff about Temples and how Atlanteans used them to do stuff we'd call magic

[gflux]

Not entirely impressed with the episode...So Richard's magical memory wiping ability is the reason why Ben never recognize any of the Losties in 2004...hmmm.

Yes. How convenient.

Kind of weird how Kate is all friendly with Ben's dad. I wonder if that'll lead anywhere.

[SAN66]

Not entirely impressed with the episode...So Richard's magical memory wiping ability is the reason why Ben never recognize any of the Losties in 2004...hmmm.

It could be that Richard makes young Ben unstuck in time (ala Desmond) to save him. When future Ben wakes up he remembers being shot the same way Desmond ends up with a new memory when Faraday visits him at the hatch.

[RayK]

That was a decent episode, mostly filler as nothing really happened or was unexpected.

Though something confuses me and I don't see it discussed anywhere. This Carole lady, Aarons grandmother is Claires mom, but isn't Claires mom dead?

No, Claire's mom was in a coma before the crash...she then attends Christians funeral so we find out she woke up from the coma, (thats when she tells Jack about Claire being his half sister).

[SAN66]

No, Claire's mom was in a coma before the crash...she then attends Christians funeral so we find out she woke up from the coma, (thats when she tells Jack about Claire being his half sister).

Yes I forgot about that. Seems a little convenient though. I think there's more to her waking up from her coma than we yet understand because she was essentially a vegetable, enough so that Christian recommended unplugging her.

[belowzeros]

Not entirely impressed with the episode...So Richard's magical memory wiping ability is the reason why Ben never recognize any of the Losties in 2004...hmmm.



no didn't you guys pay attention to the Miles/Hurley exchanges :) (which were so goddam funny kuddos to those two for some great scenes)...what happened, hasn't happened yet. Ben probably wakes up with the memories in front of Locke but I don't think he had them in 2004 yet. But who really knows...only the writers, there are some holes in the theory as Hurley keenly pointed out.

But like the above poster mentioned Desmond received a new memory from Farady so I think that's most likely what's happened to future Ben.

[MrDisco]

no comments on the line Richard uses - something about not having to answer to Charles or Eli (sp?)

[belowzeros]

no comments on the line Richard uses - something about not having to answer to Charles or Eli (sp?)


that was good stuff too, that was definitely one of the episode critical moments that I was going huh what wait hang on a sec...until the last scene hits you like a ton of bricks lol.


oh and to all the Naysayers...I told ya he should have shot young Ben at least twice in the chest and once in the head =p noob assassin.

[mariokarter]

kind of stupid episode, all it did was establish what we already had.

[belowzeros]

anyone else find it fascinating that it's the castaways who have ultimately shaped Ben to what he is in the present. Because Jack wouldn't operate on him he had to go to Richard where he ultimately loses his innocence and if you read behind the lines likely his humanity. If Juliette hadn't pressed Sawyer that wouldn't have happened..they all played their parts in condemning Ben.

Can't wait to see what Widmore meant by "there is a war coming" although based on the novel young Ben handed Sayid I think I have an idea. But it's convoluted spiritual me-generation Mysticism from the 70s that I can't see them throwing at a mainstream audience...but then again who knows they've strung us along this far and the Dharma initiative has to play a greater role than just observers I think.

and I can't believe I just noticed tonight that the Ajira flight was number 316 >.>

[MrDisco]

kind of stupid episode, all it did was establish what we already had.

i disagree.

1. it showed what Kate did with Aaron before leaving the mainland (as well as fill in the back story with Clementine)
2. it showed that Jack's inaction is what set in motion the rise of Ben (or you could view it as the Island determining Ben's fate)
3. it revealed Richard has other people who he has to answer to
4. it hinted that being an 'Other' may have bigger differences other than just being indigenous to the Island.
5. We see another mysterious structure

So while it wasn't a big 'WOAH' episode, it still had quite a bit to keep the story moving along.

[jokadeska]

no comments on the line Richard uses - something about not having to answer to Charles or Eli (sp?)

Anyone know who Eli is?

[b233314]

Anyone have a clue what Jack's role on the island is? Obviously his dad and sister have key roles in the purpose of the island and that bloodline means Jack will inevitably take that role as well....I'm assuming they are "the keepers" of the island.

[adeel]

Anyone know who Eli is?

Eli maybe Ellie...who may be Eloise Hawking (sp?)...the old lady they visited off the island who explained how they could get back....she is Farraday's mom and on the island at some point in her youth....

[Unicron]

Anyone have a clue what Jack's role on the island is? Obviously his dad and sister have key roles in the purpose of the island and that bloodline means Jack will inevitably take that role as well....I'm assuming they are "the keepers" of the island.

I like the new Jack

he's like the old Sawyer, doesn't care about stuff, just there hanging out....no stress or pressure man

Old jack was a jackass, New Sawyer is pretty cool though

[winstona]

I think Jack is more like John now...He finally believes in the Island's powers.

When asked why he is back to the island, his answer was somewhere along the lines of "I don't know, I just know I am supposed to..." I think this cool epecially when it is coming from Jack who believed in nothing but science.

[1yellowdog]

I think Jack is more like John now...He finally believes in the Island's powers.

When asked why he is back to the island, his answer was somewhere along the lines of "I don't know, I just know I am supposed to..." I think this cool epecially when it is coming from Jack who believed in nothing but science.

That's what I was thinking too, Jack has become the new John. He is now actually able to open his mind to other possibilities other than what he can see or touch.

[1yellowdog]

no didn't you guys pay attention to the Miles/Hurley exchanges :) (which were so goddam funny kuddos to those two for some great scenes)...what happened, hasn't happened yet. Ben probably wakes up with the memories in front of Locke but I don't think he had them in 2004 yet. But who really knows...only the writers, there are some holes in the theory as Hurley keenly pointed out.

But like the above poster mentioned Desmond received a new memory from Farady so I think that's most likely what's happened to future Ben.

Miles and Hurley addressed a topic I think most of us in this thread have pondered :cheesygri

[belowzeros]

• next week in the episode "dead is dead," ben summons the smoke monster for a "meeting." see what one lost expert has to say about ol' smokey's origins.


:-0

[Unicron]

new episode tonight, lets pump it up!!!!!!!!

:!::!::!::!::!:

[AzN_RiverdaleCI]

yoo that sawed off theft thing was HAX

how did he do that?

"Anyone else have a problem?!?!"

[Rosico]

Gah! PVR cut off the final couple of minutes. I saw Ben and his daughter talking then it cut out. What did I miss (spoiler alert I'm sure)?!

[AzN_RiverdaleCI]

Gah! PVR cut off the final couple of minutes. I saw Ben and his daughter talking then it cut out. What did I miss (spoiler alert I'm sure)?!

Anyone ?

My PVR cut out too.



Spoiler: Daughter told Ben to follow and listen to John Locke, she mentioned first how she knew Ben wanted to kill John Locke again.

[G-Yo]

Gah! PVR cut off the final couple of minutes. I saw Ben and his daughter talking then it cut out. What did I miss (spoiler alert I'm sure)?!


Anyone ?

My PVR cut out too.

[MrDisco]

for those who complained about last week eps, holy cow this ep was completely WTF?!

Anyone ?


Monster Alex grabs Ben and chokes him against a pillar. She orders Ben not to kill John (or she'll hunt him down and destroy Ben) and that he must obey his every decision and follow him. She makes him swear to this and then she disappears. At that moment John then suddenly calls out with a rope and throws it down the opening. He asks Ben what happened, Ben looks up gravely says 'it let me live'.

LOST

[1yellowdog]

But why did Smokey let him live?
I think it might be because he was genuinely remorseful, considering what a callous individual Ben is. Although he does seem to have a soft spot for young children like Alex as a baby and Charlie.

[Unicron]

DAMN IT

ABC cut off the end

Last i saw was Ben's Daughter choking ben up against the wall saying that he knows Ben is planning to kill Locke, stay away from Locke....thats it

what else happened?

[MrDisco]

what else happened?

uh....


http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8562588&postcount=388

[mariokarter]

wow this episode was amazing. see what im talking about when i said last one stunk. I don't think Alex is alive, it was just a manifestation of the monster telling ben the conditions of letting him live. the parralles between rousseau's and penn's child was cool. I also got the feeling that Ben was not only being judged for letting Alex die, but also for wanting to selfishly kill Penny when the island never wanted that to happen.

one thing that doesn't make sense. Adult Ben can remember visiting the temple and wiping out the dharma initiative. Plus, we know he is returned to the DI after being heeled and before wiping it out. Why doesn't he remember the losties then? I mean what Richard initially said seemed to suggest that the break in his memory would occur as soon as he took him but that doesn't seem so as adult ben clearly can remember returning to the DI (he tells locke about it before he shoots him at the grave). So, given that Ben can remember that far back, does that mean that the losties have to be injected into the future before ben is returned to the DI?

[bisk]

one thing that doesn't make sense. Adult Ben can remember visiting the temple and wiping out the dharma initiative. Plus, we know he is returned to the DI after being heeled and before wiping it out. Why doesn't he remember the losties then? I mean what Richard initially said seemed to suggest that the break in his memory would occur as soon as he took him but that doesn't seem so as adult ben clearly can remember returning to the DI (he tells locke about it before he shoots him at the grave). So, given that Ben can remember that far back, does that mean that the losties have to be injected into the future before ben is returned to the DI?

I think the other losties will be gone from the DI before Ben heals up and returns from the Others' camp. Remember at this point he's in a hut healing up and hasn't returned home yet...

[SAN66]

one thing that doesn't make sense. Adult Ben can remember visiting the temple and wiping out the dharma initiative. Plus, we know he is returned to the DI after being heeled and before wiping it out. Why doesn't he remember the losties then? I mean what Richard initially said seemed to suggest that the break in his memory would occur as soon as he took him but that doesn't seem so as adult ben clearly can remember returning to the DI (he tells locke about it before he shoots him at the grave). So, given that Ben can remember that far back, does that mean that the losties have to be injected into the future before ben is returned to the DI?

I still think Adult Ben, when he wakes up to Locke, he's remembered the past and is somewhat unstuck in time like Desmond, he's just not playing his cards.

I can't believe they killed Ceasar, I as expecting more out of his character.

[Ryan]

Does anyone think that Locke is actually the smoke monster or maybe his body possessed by the monster? They seemed to tease that idea a bit in this ep.

[jcon]

Does anyone think that Locke is actually the smoke monster or maybe his body possessed by the monster? They seemed to tease that idea a bit in this ep.

That's what I'm thinking. He's not really 'alive' just like Christian and Alex.

I'm really curious to find out how Richard fits into all this. Is he not really 'alive' either?

[skeletor]

I didn't like Ceasar, if he's gone then good..

this episode was pretty epic... Anything Locke/Ben oriented is amazing.

[jcon]

New variables introduced in this episode:

Ben remains alive be will be subservient to Locke... but for how long?

Penny is alive! Will Desmond seek revenge for the attempted murder?

The group from the plane obviously have some agenda and knowledge of the island. What's their role in this?

Just when we're starting to like Whitmore, the rug gets pulled out from under us? Who's the bad guy now?

Will we see the 70's Losties dead in a pit or return to the present?

[jokadeska]

[QUOTE=jcon;8564134]

Just when we're starting to like Whitmore, the rug gets pulled out from under us? Who's the bad guy now?
QUOTE]

I'm guessing it the new group of ppl from the plane.
I'm guessing they are "infected" like the french group earier.

Interesting question of "what lies underneath the shadow of the statue?"

[jcon]

[QUOTE=jcon;8564134]

Just when we're starting to like Whitmore, the rug gets pulled out from under us? Who's the bad guy now?
QUOTE]

I'm guessing it the new group of ppl from the plane.
I'm guessing they are "infected" like the french group earier.

Interesting question of "what lies underneath the shadow of the statue?"

That, or they're completely unrelated to the island, but they have something devious in that case that they're trying to protect.

[Unicron]

[QUOTE=jcon;8564134]

Just when we're starting to like Whitmore, the rug gets pulled out from under us? Who's the bad guy now?
QUOTE]

I'm guessing it the new group of ppl from the plane.
I'm guessing they are "infected" like the french group earier.

Interesting question of "what lies underneath the shadow of the statue?"

infected with what?

and yes that question was weird....

[mariokarter]

Does anyone think that Locke is actually the smoke monster or maybe his body possessed by the monster? They seemed to tease that idea a bit in this ep.

eah especially considering the episode is titled dead is dead.

[brocoli]

It's Atlantis. Egyptian ruled. Just in "our" time. think about it

crazy episode

[skeletor]

New variables introduced in this episode:

Ben remains alive be will be subservient to Locke... but for how long?

Penny is alive! Will Desmond seek revenge for the attempted murder?

The group from the plane obviously have some agenda and knowledge of the island. What's their role in this?

Just when we're starting to like Whitmore, the rug gets pulled out from under us? Who's the bad guy now?

Will we see the 70's Losties dead in a pit or return to the present?

He beat the crap out of Ben on the dock.. considering nobody got killed it doesn't make sense for him to go back all the way to the island just to own Ben some more since Penny and their son are safe.. there has to be another reason probably related to whitmore

[jcon]

He beat the crap out of Ben on the dock.. considering nobody got killed it doesn't make sense for him to go back all the way to the island just to own Ben some more since Penny and their son are safe.. there has to be another reason probably related to whitmore

Unless he's worried that Ben will try again.

Maybe we've seen the last of Desmond...

[jcon]

It's Atlantis. Egyptian ruled. Just in "our" time. think about it

I like that theory. Lots of circumstantial evidence to support it as well.

[jokadeska]

I like that theory. Lots of circumstantial evidence to support it as well.

Seems so too.

This guy's theories are pretty interesting too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kXArT07FgvQ

[Nikita]

Gah! PVR cut off the final couple of minutes. I saw Ben and his daughter talking then it cut out. What did I miss (spoiler alert I'm sure)?!

Spoiler: Daughter told Ben to follow and listen to John Locke, she mentioned first how she knew Ben wanted to kill John Locke again.

It was a lot more intense than you make it sound. She told him to do whatever Locke says or she will hunt him down and kill him herself. She really took control in this exchange, I way like yayy you go girl, it's your turn! LOL. You could see he was scared of her.....oooh I liked seeing that fear in him!

Oh, and how is that a spoiler since it was posted after the show??

But why did Smokey let him live?
I think it might be because he was genuinely remorseful, considering what a callous individual Ben is. Although he does seem to have a soft spot for young children like Alex as a baby and Charlie.

I assumed that, like others with the Smoke Monster, it was simply because he looked it in the proverbial eye. Since season one, if you didn't run from it, didn't show fear of it, but stood your ground and looked at it, you were safe. And I don't belive for one second he has a soft spot for anybody but himself! He has his own agenda and absolutely everything he does is for some nefarious reason or another...he is just pure evil IMO...and plays it so well!

[SAN66]

Maybe we've seen the last of Desmond...

I don't think so Eloise said the island isn't done with him. My guess, Desmond and family sail off towards wherever, but end up getting sucked into the island (just like Desmond the first time but slightly different), same way the losties made it back.

I also think Widmore is going to make it back to the island (maybe pursuing them?)

[N_Raged]

Desmond is my favourite character and Ben is a close second. You gotta wonder what was in that grocery bag that stopped the bullet :lol:. I am relieved Penny didn't die.

Since the monster is a 'judge', I guess Eko failed?

[belowzeros]

I'm guessing it the new group of ppl from the plane.
I'm guessing they are "infected" like the french group earier.
Interesting question of "what lies underneath the shadow of the statue?"

I don't think they are infected. I think maybe perhaps Whidmore had another squad in the wings ready to embark to the island. They are coveting a cache of guns after all. Perhaps in haste of getting them on the plane they were given that code phrase to identify each other.

So Widmore was off and on the island as Ben noted in their convo, Widmore would expect Ben to get back to the island after killing Penny. A man of his means could probably piece together the when and how.


I still think Adult Ben, when he wakes up to Locke, he's remembered the past and is somewhat unstuck in time like Desmond, he's just not playing his cards.

Perhaps but I think that the present and past timelines are evolving together at the same time. So Ben only would receive knowledge as things happened and we don't know that he has been returned to the DI yet. He's still laid up healing.


That's what I'm thinking. He's not really 'alive' just like Christian and Alex. I'm really curious to find out how Richard fits into all this. Is he not really 'alive' either?

I found it really interesting that we finally got a timestamp on aging in the Others camp. We finally saw Widmore aging during events with the Others. And at the same time we saw Richard not age. So now we know that Richard is something else and perhaps supernatural. Although I realize we see Richard the same in the 70s and the present but now we know that Widmore didn't start to age when he left the island.

[RayK]

I don't think they are infected. I think maybe perhaps Whidmore had another squad in the wings ready to embark to the island. They are coveting a cache of guns after all. Perhaps in haste of getting them on the plane they were given that code phrase to identify each other.

I'm hoping the other people on the plane (Iliana) are descendants of the original island inhabitants (Egyptians?). Maybe the statue she referred to is the 4-toed statue, and since there is only a foot left, the only way to know what is in the shadow of it is if she had knowledge of the time when the statue was still standing...

It would be a lot more interesting than the same Widmore's people on the boat from last season.

Does anyone think that Locke is actually the smoke monster or maybe his body possessed by the monster? They seemed to tease that idea a bit in this ep.

yea I was thinking that too, Ben calls the smoke monster and instead Locke appears out of the bushes...Then when Ben falls into the hole Locke leaves and we see the smoke monster, then the smoke monster leaves and Locke reappears. He also has a lot more knowledge of the island since he came back to life. The only difference I see is that he still looks and acts like a normal person, whereas Christian, Yemi, Alex etc. when possessed by smokey (speculation) had a really weird look about them, and acted strangely.

[mariokarter]

watched it again and have some more thoughts

1) how do the other come to accept ethan?

2) Now that Sun, Ben, and Locke are on the main island, will they meet up with present day richard and the others?

3) i dont think cesar and co are widmore's, else they wold know why locke knows so much about the island.

4) Now that we know the monster is more than just some random moneter and a crucial component of the island, doesnt it seem wierd that the DI and others can contain it with the fence? I mean the whole idea is that if the island wants it to happen it will, but this seems like they have some control over it, and it isnt just the islands fate.

[AzN_RiverdaleCI]

Cesar got OWNED, that was ballin as ever. Ben with a sawed off is bad ass!

Also wth, I was sure that Ben shot desmond, unless he missed cause ben got owned by desmond.

[mariokarter]

if you look closely Ben actually hit his groceries and it just slamed him against the car a bit.

[belowzeros]

4) Now that we know the monster is more than just some random moneter and a crucial component of the island, doesnt it seem wierd that the DI and others can contain it with the fence? I mean the whole idea is that if the island wants it to happen it will, but this seems like they have some control over it, and it isnt just the islands fate.


There are actually more than one smokey monster and the Darma initiative called them Cerberus I, II, III, IV, etc..

If you remember when the blast doors came down in the swan on the door was a map of the pods and they noted Cerebrus (IV i think) was out of control. I'm thinking that one that can't be controlled is from the temple that does all the judging.

[GemInite]

when i watched Alex's eyes looked black so I just assumed it was the smoke monster. Remember in season 3? Smokey appeared as Eko's brother.

The difference is Ben felt remorse for his sins but Eko didn't. Ben was spared.

[rilhouse]

if you look closely Ben actually hit his groceries and it just slamed him against the car a bit.

desmond could have been saved by his can of beans. as mentioned, the island is not done with him yet. :twisted:

[mariokarter]

when i watched Alex's eyes looked black so I just assumed it was the smoke monster. Remember in season 3? Smokey appeared as Eko's brother.

The difference is Ben felt remorse for his sins but Eko didn't. Ben was spared.

interesting theory! thogh im not sure the island cares about sins/whatever that occured prior to the island.

[fosterz]

I think the other losties will be gone from the DI before Ben heals up and returns from the Others' camp. Remember at this point he's in a hut healing up and hasn't returned home yet...

Even if the losties left the DI somehow, wouldn't the rest of the dharmites talk about them in Ben's presence. And now that we know that Ben's taking care of Alex, does he just drop by his old village to initiate the purge? The writers would have to come up with something special to convince viewers on this one.

[mariokarter]

Even if the losties left the DI somehow, wouldn't the rest of the dharmites talk about them in Ben's presence. And now that we know that Ben's taking care of Alex, does he just drop by his old village to initiate the purge? The writers would have to come up with something special to convince viewers on this one.

I think he wipes out the DI shortly BEFORE getting alex.

[fosterz]

I think he wipes out the DI shortly BEFORE getting alex.

If you follow the lost timeline at lostpedia, they say that Alex was born in 1989 (means Ben was 24 at the time of her kidnapping), and the purge occurred in 1992. So if anything the DI were wiped after he got Alex. On a related note, didnt Ben look much younger and goofier while grabbing Alex from Danielle.

[1yellowdog]

watched it again and have some more thoughts

1) how do the other come to accept ethan?

2) Now that Sun, Ben, and Locke are on the main island, will they meet up with present day richard and the others?

3) i dont think cesar and co are widmore's, else they wold know why locke knows so much about the island.

4) Now that we know the monster is more than just some random moneter and a crucial component of the island, doesnt it seem wierd that the DI and others can contain it with the fence? I mean the whole idea is that if the island wants it to happen it will, but this seems like they have some control over it, and it isnt just the islands fate.

1) why wouldn't they accept Ethan? He was born on the island and Ben would have had an opportunity to brain wash him since birth.

2) interesting.... but it just made me realize Jack, et al never met Richard and you'd think he would have made an appearance at some point during Jack/Sawyer/Kates capture in one of the earlier seasons (when Michael and Walt escaped by boat). Ben was in total charge which makes me think Richard was not on the island or alive at that point.

3) But Charles Whitmore has no knowledge that John is the new chosen one, I suspect they are his people. Why would a bounty hunter take Sayid on a flight to Guam instead of flying directly to the U.S.

interesting theory! thogh im not sure the island cares about sins/whatever that occured prior to the island.

I tend to think the island does care or why else would the key characters all have such skeletons in their closets - other than Hurley. It seems to me that the island brought those people all together that day on the same plane for a reason which is ??????? Redemption is my favourite but it's just a theory.

[jcon]

1) why wouldn't they accept Ethan? He was born on the island and Ben would have had an opportunity to brain wash him since birth.

2) interesting.... but it just made me realize Jack, et al never met Richard and you'd think he would have made an appearance at some point during Jack/Sawyer/Kates capture in one of the earlier seasons (when Michael and Walt escaped by boat). Ben was in total charge which makes me think Richard was not on the island or alive at that point.

3) But Charles Whitmore has no knowledge that John is the new chosen one, I suspect they are his people. Why would a bounty hunter take Sayid on a flight to Guam instead of flying directly to the U.S.



I tend to think the island does care or why else would the key characters all have such skeletons in their closets - other than Hurley. It seems to me that the island brought those people all together that day on the same plane for a reason which is ??????? Redemption is my favourite but it's just a theory.

1) I don't they just accept anyone into the group, born on the island or not.

2) We do see Richard in the 'present'. He is alive, but we didn't know his significance at the time.

3) He was in the US, they were flying out of LA. He was being 'extradited'
for his crimes in Guam.

[Stoe99]

3) But Charles Whitmore has no knowledge that John is the new chosen one, I suspect they are his people. Why would a bounty hunter take Sayid on a flight to Guam instead of flying directly to the U.S.



Yes he does, remember about 3-4 episodes back when he has the camera set up in the desert and sees Locke there and meets him in the hospital? He sent that black guy to help Locke bring everyone back to the island

[Vashin]

malcolm in the middle girl

[mariokarter]

2) interesting.... but it just made me realize Jack, et al never met Richard and you'd think he would have made an appearance at some point during Jack/Sawyer/Kates capture in one of the earlier seasons (when Michael and Walt escaped by boat). Ben was in total charge which makes me think Richard was not on the island or alive at that point.


weve definitly seen Richard in the present. I'm pretty sure most of the main characters you mentioned have. For example, if i recall correctly, kate and jack are both there when richard shoots the army guy whos fighting with Ben.

[spike-spiegel]

Does anyone think that Locke is actually the smoke monster or maybe his body possessed by the monster? They seemed to tease that idea a bit in this ep.

That's what I'm thinking. He's not really 'alive' just like Christian and Alex.

I'm really curious to find out how Richard fits into all this. Is he not really 'alive' either?


I think Locke might be the new Christian.
Richard is probably some ancient Egyptian entity... with eyeliner. :lol:


New variables introduced in this episode:

Ben remains alive be will be subservient to Locke... but for how long?

Penny is alive! Will Desmond seek revenge for the attempted murder?

The group from the plane obviously have some agenda and knowledge of the island. What's their role in this?

Just when we're starting to like Whitmore, the rug gets pulled out from under us? Who's the bad guy now?

Will we see the 70's Losties dead in a pit or return to the present?


Desmond is my favourite character and Ben is a close second. You gotta wonder what was in that grocery bag that stopped the bullet :lol:. I am relieved Penny didn't die.

Since the monster is a 'judge', I guess Eko failed?


I think "what lies underneath the shadow of the statue?" is what they ask to identify who is in on their convert mission (for Widmore?). And are they referring to the four-toed statue???????

Eko did not ask repentance because he felt he did what he had to do to protect his brother.

How did Desmond not die? The island must not be done with him either.

[ladybug193]

This is a bit OT, but coincidentally bizarre so I thought I'd share.

The LOST YouTube blogger (Seanie B) that I added a link to in the original post(for his excellent recap videos), has been exposed for plagiarism. Apparently some of the videos are copied almost word for word from a couple of other sources. It's pretty convincing. What a shame!

http://www.sl-lost.com/2009/04/12/lost-video-blogger-seanie-b-accused-of-plagiarism/#comments
http://www.docarzt.com/lost/lost-news/lost-video-recaps-exposed/
http://digg.com/d1ocGP

Edit: I removed the links from the original post, as it is not ethical to promote this activity.

Back on topic:

This Wednesdays episode looks to be pretty interesting. "Some Like It Hoth" will hopefully finally answer many of the questions of why Miles is there. I can't wait to hear what the dead people have to say :lol:

[rilhouse]

This is a bit OT, but coincidentally bizarre so I thought I'd share.

The LOST YouTube blogger (Seanie B) that I added a link to in the original post(for his excellent recap videos), has been exposed for plagiarism. Apparently some of the videos are copied almost word for word from a couple of other sources. It's pretty convincing. What a shame!

http://www.sl-lost.com/2009/04/12/lost-video-blogger-seanie-b-accused-of-plagiarism/#comments
http://www.docarzt.com/lost/lost-news/lost-video-recaps-exposed/
http://digg.com/d1ocGP

Edit: I removed the links from the original post, as it is not ethical to promote this activity.

Back on topic:

This Wednesdays episode looks to be pretty interesting. "Some Like It Hoth" will hopefully finally answer many of the questions of why Miles is there. I can't wait to hear what the dead people have to say :lol:

wow, i really enjoyed the video recaps, i still hope he continues regardless. any alternative video recaps out there?

[jokadeska]

wow, i really enjoyed the video recaps, i still hope he continues regardless. any alternative video recaps out there?

same here. I don't really mind him copying others. He just made a video recap of the show. I don't think he ever says that everything is his idea...

[jokadeska]

interesting episode as usual. So the "what lies underneath the shadow of the statue" group is neither part of witmore or ben's group. Any guesses on who they are?

[MrDisco]

another fantastic episode.

I assumed the guys in the van were Others.

anyone see the Egyptian lesson on the blackboard. why do i get the feeling the writers are just messing with us?

[Unicron]

this is probably the best show ever invented

along with...office bbc, arrested development, heroes season 1, buffy, angel, supernatural, true blood



What lies in the shadow of the statue??? The hall of records...

[mariokarter]

So are we to understand the Dan was successfully transported to the 70s with the rest of the losties, and then left for some reason (like they all hinted he did when Jack and co. arrived) and is only now returning again?

They don't seem to think there is a problem with 2 miless.

I think we also learned some more details about miles' ability to talk to ghosts. Seems he needs to be able to make visual contact with the corpse to actually "talk" to it. Otherwise he only can tell the circumstances surronding the death.

cool episode though.

[SAN66]

So are we to understand the Dan was successfully transported to the 70s with the rest of the losties, and then left for some reason (like they all hinted he did when Jack and co. arrived) and is only now returning again?

They don't seem to think there is a problem with 2 miless.


Dan was with the group on the island when it was moving through time, he stayed in the 70's when the island stopped moving through time, don't see why he wouldn't be transported. He's been there 3 years, don't see any reason why he wouldn't go do research off island.

Whats wrong with 2 miles'?

[Eric888]

Well the problem with the 2 Miless is that it shouldn't be able to happen based on what happened with Charlotte. As soon as they flashed to a period where her younger self was there, she disappeared. This suggests that a) Miles shouldn't be able to exist in the period where he already is, and b) that Ben should have a difficult time catching up with the other Losties due to the fact that his younger self is there as well.

[ephemera]

So are we to understand the Dan was successfully transported to the 70s with the rest of the losties, and then left for some reason (like they all hinted he did when Jack and co. arrived) and is only now returning again?

They don't seem to think there is a problem with 2 miless.

I think we also learned some more details about miles' ability to talk to ghosts. Seems he needs to be able to make visual contact with the corpse to actually "talk" to it. Otherwise he only can tell the circumstances surronding the death.

cool episode though.

I think Miles needs to be within a certain radius of the body to speak to it.
But I think Miles seeing himself thru the window throws their timeline string theory out the window. Unless he is special like desmond too.
I was laughing with Dr Chang and Miles and Hurly in the backseat being a smartass. The Dr saying he likes country and the look miles gives him is priceless. I guess Miles was a metalhead or something in his teen years.

I also enjoyed Naomi making an appearance. :cheesygri

[Ryan]

Well the problem with the 2 Miless is that it shouldn't be able to happen based on what happened with Charlotte. As soon as they flashed to a period where her younger self was there, she disappeared. This suggests that a) Miles shouldn't be able to exist in the period where he already is, and b) that Ben should have a difficult time catching up with the other Losties due to the fact that his younger self is there as well.

She disappeared because she was dead.

[MrDisco]

Whats wrong with 2 miles'?

Anyone remember the online video that featured the Dr.Chang conducting bunny experiments? He seemed to have made quite a huge fuss about not letting the two bunnies see each other. That's what I was reminded of when Miles sees his younger self.

[gflux]

I assumed the guys in the van were Others.


Yeah, that threw me off. I originally thought that the new people on the island that said "What's in the shadow of the statue?" where working for Widmore. But when the guys in that the van said that now I'm no so sure. They could be Others but then how could the new crash survivors be Others as well? ...and they didn't even know who Ben was. Could it be a third faction fighting the island? Pretty unlikely.

[jokadeska]

Yeah, that threw me off. I originally thought that the new people on the island that said "What's in the shadow of the statue?" where working for Widmore. But when the guys in that the van said that now I'm no so sure. They could be Others but then how could the new crash survivors be Others as well? ...and they didn't even know who Ben was. Could it be a third faction fighting the island? Pretty unlikely.

Yea seems like its another group to me. Maybe they are part of Darma initiative?

[gflux]

Could be but it doesn't seem their style.

I just read that the guy driving the van that Miles got thrown into is the same guy in the present that's helping that mercenary chick on the Island.

[slowtyper]

I'm pretty excited about the introduction of this third faction, either a new group or the new reincarnation of Dharma.

Yes the guy driving the van who kidnapped miles is on the Island with Iliana.

[slowtyper]

Well the problem with the 2 Miless is that it shouldn't be able to happen based on what happened with Charlotte. As soon as they flashed to a period where her younger self was there, she disappeared. This suggests that a) Miles shouldn't be able to exist in the period where he already is, and b) that Ben should have a difficult time catching up with the other Losties due to the fact that his younger self is there as well.


This is wrong, there is nothing wrong with being in the same timeline as yourself in another time. Sawyer and group flashed to witness Claire's birth which means there were two Sawyers (and others) on the island at that time with no problems.

[gomyone]

This is a stretch but I think the people in the van (along with Iliana and Ceasar etc) are part of sect of people who are descendents of the original inhabitants of the island. I also think the original inhabitants of the island hail from ancient Egypt - the "portal" in Tunisia might have been their way onto the island originally.

Also loved the Star Wars references in last night's episodes. but I think Hurley got one of his facts wrong - Luke got his arm cut off BEFORE he knew that Vader was his father - not after like he suggested LOL! :lol:

[jcon]

he "portal" in Tunisia

You mean "Stargate"? :lol::razz:

[mariokarter]

This is wrong, there is nothing wrong with being in the same timeline as yourself in another time. Sawyer and group flashed to witness Claire's birth which means there were two Sawyers (and others) on the island at that time with no problems.

That makes sense....but still, what if you killed your younger self? ****ing time travel.

[belowzeros]

I think we also learned some more details about miles' ability to talk to ghosts. Seems he needs to be able to make visual contact with the corpse to actually "talk" to it. Otherwise he only can tell the circumstances surronding the death.

I think you were reading too much into those scenes. He's done a Q&A with ghosts a few times before sight unseen.


anyone see the Egyptian lesson on the blackboard. why do i get the feeling the writers are just messing with us?

Or how about another John 3:16 reference. This time on the microwave when the show opened.

[jokadeska]

That makes sense....but still, what if you killed your younger self? ****ing time travel.

That is the reason why Dan said you can't change the past. You can't kill your younger self when you travel back in time because it didn't happen.
The things they are doing in the past already happened in their time line.

[Kerlo]

That is the reason why Dan said you can't change the past. You can't kill your younger self when you travel back in time because it didn't happen.
The things they are doing in the past already happened in their time line.

This can also explain why some people weren't able to be killed in the 'present' . . . because they still had things to do in the past . . .

So really, it's not the island's "conscious thoughts" preventing people from dying, it's history.

On a side note, I think smokey can only take the form of dead people . . . except for Walt . . . because he's special. :P

As well, I believe that the "dead" people that Hurley keeps seeing and talking to is really just Smokey. Smokey probably can be anywhere it wants to be without any restrictions on distance.

[1yellowdog]

This can also explain why some people weren't able to be killed in the 'present' . . . because they still had things to do in the past . . .

So really, it's not the island's "conscious thoughts" preventing people from dying, it's history.

On a side note, I think smokey can only take the form of dead people . . . except for Walt . . . because he's special. :P

As well, I believe that the "dead" people that Hurley keeps seeing and talking to is really just Smokey. Smokey probably can be anywhere it wants to be without any restrictions on distance.


Hmmm, so when Hurley sees and talks to Charlie it isn't really Charlies ghost but Smokey?

[1yellowdog]

So are we to understand the Dan was successfully transported to the 70s with the rest of the losties, and then left for some reason (like they all hinted he did when Jack and co. arrived) and is only now returning again?

They don't seem to think there is a problem with 2 miless.

I think we also learned some more details about miles' ability to talk to ghosts. Seems he needs to be able to make visual contact with the corpse to actually "talk" to it. Otherwise he only can tell the circumstances surronding the death.

cool episode though.


Suspension of disbelief???? :twisted:

[1yellowdog]

another fantastic episode.

I assumed the guys in the van were Others.

anyone see the Egyptian lesson on the blackboard. why do i get the feeling the writers are just messing with us?

This was probably my most favourite episode of the season so far. Ken Leung is so perfect as Miles.

[jokadeska]

Hmmm, so when Hurley sees and talks to Charlie it isn't really Charlies ghost but Smokey?

I personally think that Hurley is just half crazy...

[belowzeros]

I'm pretty excited about the introduction of this third faction, either a new group or the new reincarnation of Dharma.

Yes the guy driving the van who kidnapped miles is on the Island with Iliana.

yep good catch, his character's name is Bram. I wonder if they are indeed a third faction, maybe Acolytes or something of the like.


The episode's title is great. Some Like It Hot hints at the the Jack Lemmon/Tony Curtis comedy from 1960 I think. Lots of great comedic moments between Miles and Hurley.

Then you have Some like it Hoth pointing to the obvious Star Wars parallels. Hurley as Chewbacca (his Empire re-write was so damn funny with Chewie as the hero and not Han). Miles as Han, a hired gun with a hint of nobility who changes allegiances if the price is right. Sawyer as Lando trying to hold his Cloud City together as it crumbles around him. Dr. Chang is probably supposed to be Vader but then that could make Miles Luke. I wonder who the Emperor is...I think the true baddie or governing power is still hidden from us.

It was interesting that we saw the introduction of the black Dharma jumpsuits for the first time. Or even more so, Jack wiping the Egyptian glyphs off the board systematically maybe hinting at what they are doing to the timeline and maybe indeed it can be changed.

I've been wondering lately if Miles is actually dead. In a flashback I think he was wearing a similar shirt to Dead Charlie that visited Hurley in the funny farm a while ago.

pretty deep episode :confused:

[Shewolf]

I missed a couple of seconds when Miles got grabbed, but can someone please explain why the people in the van are not part of Ben's group? When the guy in the van told Miles he was 'on the wrong side' I assumed that meant he worked for Ben...

I'm curious to know why Dr. Chang kicked his wife and baby out...do you think 'future Miles' somehow causes his own father to kick them out in 1977?

[slowtyper]

Suspension of disbelief???? :twisted:

Should not apply to that concept.

[Krox]

I missed a couple of seconds when Miles got grabbed, but can someone please explain why the people in the van are not part of Ben's group? When the guy in the van told Miles he was 'on the wrong side' I assumed that meant he worked for Ben...

I'm curious to know why Dr. Chang kicked his wife and baby out...do you think 'future Miles' somehow causes his own father to kick them out in 1977?

Maybe he kicked them out so they wouldn't be there when Ben kills the Dharma group.

[gflux]

I'm curious to know why Dr. Chang kicked his wife and baby out...do you think 'future Miles' somehow causes his own father to kick them out in 1977?

I'm pretty sure it's adult Miles that tells her to escape before the Other's attack.

[jcon]

I'm pretty sure it's adult Miles that tells her to escape before the Other's attack.

But then who does it originally?


I suspect that Dr. Chang does everything in his power to make them leave, to save them. Likely he has to be harsh, otherwise Miles' mother would not leave.

[gill2k]

Good guess on Miles being the reason his mother and his younger got kicked out.

I'm also guessing the "incident" Chang refers to in the video is having future Miles and young Miles getting in close proximity to each other (like the experimental bunnies did) and causing some kind of destruction.

[belowzeros]

But then who does it originally?


I suspect that Dr. Chang does everything in his power to make them leave, to save them. Likely he has to be harsh, otherwise Miles' mother would not leave.


Well if adult Miles is the one that does it that will be way trippy. Course if Miles is actually a ghost even more so.

So the guy that Miles identified in the restaurant was Felix. Back last season during the Oceanic 815 coverup stuff Mr. Friendly told Michael all about the fake plane and the documents. So did Mr. Friendly kill Felix and snatch all his stuff and Widmore's plans? Or did he kill him to prevent him from reporting to Widmore and ratting out Ben who could have also been behind the fake plane? Pretty subtle but I think we were supposed to pick up on something here.

[Praetorian]

is it a new episode tonight?

[SAN66]

is it a new episode tonight?

Just one of their what happened since last season specials.

[belowzeros]

offweek

[jadoocian]

wat kind of BS episode was this?! jesus

[Aj23]

So there was no actual new episode tonight? That sucks, as I look forward to every Wednesday for lost:(

I guess that's why I couldn't find it through the private torrent site I usually get my episodes from when I don't get a chance to watch them.

[1yellowdog]

wat kind of BS episode was this?! jesus

:lol: exactly. My reaction was What the......
It was kind of nice to walk down memory lane though. But I was itching for more on Miles and his dad and what Faraday has been up to.

[ctc027]

It was nice that they put the season in a linear time line.

[rilhouse]

looking forward to next weeks episode "the variable". should be interesting to compare it to the season 4 episode "the constant" which was a VERY good episode. :D

[mariokarter]

looking forward to next weeks episode "the variable". should be interesting to compare it to the season 4 episode "the constant" which was a VERY good episode. :D

best episode since season 1 foe shoe.

[N_Raged]

nooo why did that have to happen?! :(
Hope they can bring him back like they did Ben.

[Mattones]

:cheesygriThis was a WICKED episode! I LOVED EVERY MINUTE OF IT!

[markj]

awesome ep instant classic

[MrDisco]

man...what a mind trip that ep was. anyone have a new updated flowchart for the Lost timeline? :P

[mariokarter]

Why do you need an updated flow chart? Everything there fits fairly obviously into what we already know.

That was an amazing episode though. So what do you think about faraday's new theory, that you can change the future? Thus far it doesn't seem to be panning out as faraday is dead, charlottte still dies, and I doubt that the losties will prevent the breach of drilling into the energy.

really an amazing episode though, every minutes was great, on par with season and that episode with desmand last season.

[Handa]

looking forward to next weeks episode "the variable". should be interesting to compare it to the season 4 episode "the constant" which was a VERY good episode. :D

I didn't even realize there was an episode called THE CONSTANT! Amazing!

Anyway, what a great episode... Sad to see Faraday go, but you never know if he won't be back or not, especially with that silly temple meddling in the affairs of dead vs. living people.

So what are your thoughts on next weeks ep? The LOSTies trying to undo whatever happened so as to negate their plane crash etc... I think it won't work to be honest, because there's something that Faraday didn't take into account. Obviously, because there's a whole OTHER season :)

[Unicron]

the end got cut off again....

it doesn't even show credits for some reason

it was at the part where Daniel is at the camp and has gun pointed at Richard and gives a countdown....Richard is like you don't want to do that...

then...the next tv show comes on :mad:

[rilhouse]

yup, great episode. i don't think DF is dead, the island still needs him!

[gill2k]

yup, great episode. i don't think DF is dead, the island still needs him!

To quote one episode title, "Dead is Dead" when it comes Faraday:

And you thought the next grave was going to be Juliet's... Wrong!

Time-traveling expert Daniel Faraday (nicknamed "Twitchy" by Sawyer) has become the latest Lostie to bite the big one, leaving the 1970's Dharmaville outcasts to fend for themselves just when they need him most.

Executive producers Carlton Cuse and Damon Lindelof commend Jeremy Davies for pulling off an increasingly bizarro role--and taking the news of his firing better than any of their previous island victims.

“For us, Faraday really was the cornerstone of the fifth season--he really shined,” says Lindelof. "I can’t imagine what Season 5 would have looked like without Jeremy Davies. When you think about all the crazy stuff that had to come out of that guy’s mouth, for him to be as interesting and emotional and poetic as he was is really extraordinary."

Lindelof and Cuse say they were impressed by how gracefully Davies dealt with his dismissal. While disappointed to be losing a paycheck, the actor saw his departure as essential to their storytelling. Lindelof says, "When Carlton and I called Jeremy to explain what was going to be happening with Faraday, we’ve never had a more awesome exit interview with somebody on the show.”

“It was an incredibly painful thing to kill this beloved character," Cuse adds, "but we feel that’s what this show has to do. His death is kind of the culminating event in the entire season. It really ends one chapter and commences the start of the final chapter of the entire series. Once we explained that to Jeremy, while he was personally saddened that his full-time status on Lost was coming to an end, he put the story above his own personal self.” (Hmmm...notice Cuse's wording: "full-time status".)

So why was now the right time to do him in?

"When we kill off a character we want the audience to say, ‘How dare you!,’ not, ‘It’s about time,’” explains Lindelof, who was particularly impressed with Davies' final scenes. “He has never been better than he was in 'The Variable.'"

Michael Emerson, who plays Ben, praises Davies as “a great sensitive guy who got deep into his character. He really lived it.” (And died it!)

Around the set, Terry O’Quinn (John Locke) will miss Davies and the music that always accompanied him. “Most actors walk around with headphones, but Jeremy would walk around holding a miniature boom box," recalls O'Quinn. "He always wanted to provide music for everyone--whether they wanted it or not. Everybody would go, ‘What’s up with this dude?’”

O'Quinn remembers the time Davies brought his boom box out into the water during an action scene. “We were out paddling in a canoe with me, Ken Leung (Miles), Josh (Sawyer), Jeremy and Elizabeth (Juliet) and we ended up flipping a half mile out to sea. The first thing I thought of when I came up was, 'I hope Jeremy’s f---ing boom box went to the bottom--and it did. But he replaced it real quick.”

Davies won't be so easily replaced. Do you think Faraday was killed off too soon? Or were you tired of his time-traveling jargon?


We may see him in flashbacks but that's it for Dan.

Another one bites the dust!

Last night's episode was awesome! Now we're setup for a conflict between those that believe in Whatever Happened, Happened vs. Free Will.

[skeletor]

the end got cut off again....

it doesn't even show credits for some reason

it was at the part where Daniel is at the camp and has gun pointed at Richard and gives a countdown....Richard is like you don't want to do that...

then...the next tv show comes on :mad:

LOL!!!! That totally blows... you need to get a new system :P or just start downloading the eps

[Aj23]

Just watched it after downloading the episode. It was actually pretty good, but wish I didn't have to wait two weeks for it. Now the waiting begins for another 7 days.

[skeletor]

Remember guys MAY 13 is the 2 hour season finale..

only 2 more nights of LOST LEFT!!!!!!!!!!!!

then the FINAL SEASON!

[Kerlo]

I could tell that something bad was probably going to happen to Farraday when he was at the piano (with his brain injury) speaking to his mother. The older Eloise actress is awesome in this scene! She conveyed the "fighting back the tears" and the determination that she had make him go to the island. You could tell from her emotions that something bad was going to happen to him.

She was the writers foreshadowing character the entire episode with the book inscription, her weird emotions, etc.

I think that the past cannot be changed unless they use Desmond. Farraday probably made a mistake that they are the actual variables . . . I think that Desmond is the key to getting them back as it seems like the past can be changed through him.

Now what I didn't see coming was that CW was is Farraday's father. Reminds me of Star Wars for some reason . . . :razz:

[belowzeros]

by the time Lost is over I really hope they answer the big question behind Lost. all this mini games and mini battles stuff is great to watch but it's tiresome. I want to know what is ultimately really going on here on they better not stiff us >.>

[gill2k]

Well I for one, am glad, this whole time travel bizness is winding down. I am seriously soooo bored of "Whatever happened, happened". I mean, what was the point in all of us seeing the Dharma stuff when we already know what happens in the end? I am thrilled that it provided answers as to "how" those things happened (and to verify relationships like Chang being Miles' dad), but does anyone feel like the 1977 stuff dragged on a bit too long? It felt like the last two episodes before "The Variable" have just been filler material.

And poor Dan, his character has grown on me. The actor plays his weird/nerdy yet compassionate mood so damn good. I hope we see him in more flashbacks (like his time at Ann Arbor).

[jcon]

Well I for one, am glad, this whole time travel bizness is winding down. I am seriously soooo bored of "Whatever happened, happened". I mean, what was the point in all of us seeing the Dharma stuff when we already know what happens in the end? I am thrilled that it provided answers as to "how" those things happened (and to verify relationships like Chang being Miles' dad), but does anyone feel like the 1977 stuff dragged on a bit too long? It felt like the last two episodes before "The Variable" have just been filler material.

And poor Dan, his character has grown on me. The actor plays his weird/nerdy yet compassionate mood so damn good. I hope we see him in more flashbacks (like his time at Ann Arbor).

The only thing I'm tired of is the Sawyer - We didn't need your help - line.

Unless I'm forgetting most people on the plane wanted to leave the island including Sawyer and Juliet. However, because of the islands vanishing act, only the Oceanic 6 left.

Time travel ensues, Kate, Hurley, Jack, etc., go back to the island to help them or at least try. Why so angry at them?

I think this particular issue that I have, is part of a larger issue with the show (and quite frankly most TV shows and movies), that no one ever says anything to clarify the situation. They can easily explain why they came back, or whatever else gets misconstrued, but they remain silent. It just seems like lazy writing to me. Hmmm... we must prolong the storyline and create conflict, so no one is allowed to speak up and answer simply questions...

/rant

[deezz]

I agree with jcon, Sawyer sucks as a team lead! One of the reasons why I loved this "team" was seeing Jack lead it. It was awesome to see the guy lead people with purpose, reason, and logic. Locke's leadership was too wishy washy for me, and Sawyer all season has really just been saying "leave it to me!" but hasn't done shite! The hell is his plan?? He doesn't have one! I mean, well he didn't have one up until everyone got discovered, then it's, "Okay, we're gonna hotwire a submarine who's with me?" That took all season to plan?! Don't get me wrong, I definitely enjoyed seeing the nicer side of him all season, but he's just a crappy leader.

This was an amazing episode too, and if Faraday's really dead, I will sorely miss him!! His acting was awesome. 'The Constant' has gotta still be my favourite episode of all time, but this one is definitely up there. At this point, I just love any episode that gives me some damn answers lol.

Can't wait for next week!

Well I for one, am glad, this whole time travel bizness is winding down. I am seriously soooo bored of "Whatever happened, happened". I mean, what was the point in all of us seeing the Dharma stuff when we already know what happens in the end? I am thrilled that it provided answers as to "how" those things happened (and to verify relationships like Chang being Miles' dad), but does anyone feel like the 1977 stuff dragged on a bit too long? It felt like the last two episodes before "The Variable" have just been filler material.

And poor Dan, his character has grown on me. The actor plays his weird/nerdy yet compassionate mood so damn good. I hope we see him in more flashbacks (like his time at Ann Arbor).

Not me, I'm totally digging this time travel bizness!! Mainly, in the hope that they provide a REALLY DAMN GOOD explanation. Because when Faraday said that things could be changed, that really interested me....but...we'll see how it goes...as always....I'll be waiting lol. Namely, if they can change the past, then what happens to everyone at the present moment? Will they be the only thems when/if they get "back to the future." See, now there was a couple movies that got time travel right! (Let's just pretend the third one didn't happen heh)

[fosterz]

Dont be surprised if Jack goes ahead and causes the "Incident" due to his hotheadedness. Jack acts on impulse without thinking about consequences. I think he needs a father-figure like Locke to hold onto his leash, and the writers maybe preparing Jack to do something completely irrational for the upcoming war. What happened, happened so the only thing the characters can influence is the war in the future.

[MrDisco]

What a fantastic season this has been. That ep was just wow.

[gflux]

What a fantastic season this has been. That ep was just wow.

Yeah my jaw dropped when Alpert said that he remembered the Losties dying. It dropped again with Locke said he was going to kill Jacob. So many good moments in the episode.

"All right dude, we're from the future. Sorry."

[^*^BATMAN^*^]

I am somewhat upset about the time travel paradox that they created. Having Richard tell locke about that he will have to die, ect, ect. Locke telling richard to tell himself in technically the past what to do is a paradox. It is an infinit loop of events, but the problem is that how did it start? Think of it in terms of a circle, it has to start somewhere. John was told by Richard what to do, to get everyone back to the island, but for richard to tell him that, John was already back, and had already done it. Stupid paradoxes. I think the writes are getting sloppy.

[winstona]

I am somewhat upset about the time travel paradox that they created. Having Richard tell locke about that he will have to die, ect, ect. Locke telling richard to tell himself in technically the past what to do is a paradox. It is an infinit loop of events, but the problem is that how did it start? Think of it in terms of a circle, it has to start somewhere. John was told by Richard what to do, to get everyone back to the island, but for richard to tell him that, John was already back, and had already done it. Stupid paradoxes. I think the writes are getting sloppy.

I am confused too. Although it looks cool, it really doesn't make sense. I guess Locke just needs to make sure that the events happen as they should.

I assume the reason why Locke needs to kill Jacob is because his purpose in the island is to take his place as the new Jacob (thus wearing Christian's shoes)...I have a feeling he is now a ghost just like Christian after he was dead.

[jokadeska]

I am somewhat upset about the time travel paradox that they created. Having Richard tell locke about that he will have to die, ect, ect. Locke telling richard to tell himself in technically the past what to do is a paradox. It is an infinit loop of events, but the problem is that how did it start? Think of it in terms of a circle, it has to start somewhere. John was told by Richard what to do, to get everyone back to the island, but for richard to tell him that, John was already back, and had already done it. Stupid paradoxes. I think the writes are getting sloppy.

I think they are basing it on one of the time theories which is time goes in a loop. Its a time loop and not time line. Thats one of the theories so its not really a sloppy job by the writers...

[Unicron]

This is one of the best tv shows ever invented!

[Unicron]

Richard Alpert has cool eyes for a guy

NOT GAY

[mariokarter]

cool episode, last one was still better i think though. Yeah I noticed that loop earlier. Maybe the losties do die. Faraday still died and existed in 2007. But its weird, how is Ben's gas attack going to work into this? Its supposed to still be years later right? So we know that it means the bomb doesn't kill everyone, maybe just Jack, Jin, and Said, as the rest of the DI still needs to be around to be killed by Ben.

But will they detonate the Bomb at the dig site, and change the future like Faraday said is possible? Or will things just proceed as they already have?

[winstona]

cool episode, last one was still better i think though. Yeah I noticed that loop earlier. Maybe the losties do die. Faraday still died and existed in 2007. But its weird, how is Ben's gas attack going to work into this? Its supposed to still be years later right? So we know that it means the bomb doesn't kill everyone, maybe just Jack, Jin, and Said, as the rest of the DI still needs to be around to be killed by Ben.

But will they detonate the Bomb at the dig site, and change the future like Faraday said is possible? Or will things just proceed as they already have?

Faraday has just proven that you can't change the past because he still has to die no matter how hard he tried to change things...Whatever happened, happened.

Therefore, I am almost certain that they can't stop the drilling by detonating the bomb and most people will survive in Dharma land.

[belowzeros]

that was one of the episodes that truly made me do a wtf...i finally have no idea what is going on lol >.>

two hour season finale next week i think woot

[Unicron]

Someone on the IMDB forums mentioned how Jacob could be a metaphor for GOD/Government/Control

I feel like Jacob is a metaphor for God. No one can see him, but this massive group of people believe in him and follow what he supposedly tells them to do because Richard (a prophet, perhaps?) says he commands these things.

That being said, when John Locke speaks of killing him, does that indicate he wants to destroy the idea of God? When concerning concepts of Destiny and Fate, it's not a far cry from this need to break away from the vicious loops, and revert back to Free Will.

Just some observations. Any other thoughts?

.....that's cool


I wonder what Lost is really about....

THIS SHOW RULES

[Unicron]

that was one of the episodes that truly made me do a wtf...i finally have no idea what is going on lol >.>

two hour season finale next week i think woot

People on IMDB were confused about Richard being in both 1970's and current date

Whats so confusing about that?

Richard Alpert doesn't age....maybe thats what throws most people off

I was alive in 1990, and I'm alive now....i exist now like i did then but I aged because I don't have super powers Like Richard Alpert or I'm not on the island

[AzN_RiverdaleCI]

what would killing Jacob achieve?

[mariokarter]

i really think this episode also gave strong indications that Locke just is a manifestation of the island.

[1yellowdog]

Someone on the IMDB forums mentioned how Jacob could be a metaphor for GOD/Government/Control



.....that's cool


I wonder what Lost is really about....

THIS SHOW RULES


At the time I also thought Jacob was a metaphor for God.
There have been a lot of hidden metaphors in the show and I too am wondering what the big reveal will be all about. I think when we do find out we'll want to rewatch all the shows again with a new perspective.

[spawn582]

At the time I also thought Jacob was a metaphor for God.
There have been a lot of hidden metaphors in the show and I too am wondering what the big reveal will be all about. I think when we do find out we'll want to rewatch all the shows again with a new perspective.

oh yeah. i'll be waiting for a complete series box set once it ends.

[belowzeros]

I wonder what the heated conversation between Widmore and Eloise that we weren't allowed to hear was about. Maybe they split up...the bomb or me and the island type stuff.

I read a pretty interesting post somewhere that Richard could be a "Pan" type character or lesser god or agent to Gods or powers that be. His new Labyrinth reveal under the island certainly lends to that hehe. Or maybe Richard Alpert = Ra Egyptian god? The writers have said after all he is intentionally named after someone famous. How did he make fire when he was soaking wet btw?

Oh new character next week, that baddie from Dexter. The drunk wife abuser who dies in prison, can't remember his real name.

[Kenny Blankenship]

People on IMDB were confused about Richard being in both 1970's and current date

Whats so confusing about that?

Richard Alpert doesn't age....maybe thats what throws most people off

I was alive in 1990, and I'm alive now....i exist now like i did then but I aged because I don't have super powers Like Richard Alpert or I'm not on the island

plus, you find him attractive

[Unicron]

plus, you find him attractive

NO HOMO

http://i39.tinypic.com/143kmfo.jpg

[gflux]

what would killing Jacob achieve?

Who knows? But it the tells us something about the Island: it doesn't like Jacob or has no use for him.

[rascal]

But will they detonate the Bomb at the dig site, and change the future like Faraday said is possible? Or will things just proceed as they already have?

Maybe them detonating the bomb at the dig site is part of what makes the future the way it is, rather than the digging the DI was doing. Just like when they returned, shot Ben as a kid and then took him to the Others to save him, it seemed to make him what he became in the future (Richard told them then that if they took him, he would be different, he would be one of them). It always seemed to me like they were supposed to come to the past to make the future the way it is currently, rather than change things.

[markom]

Who knows? But it the tells us something about the Island: it doesn't like Jacob or has no use for him.

Jacob is probably Locke.

[azn_dan]

Jacob is probably Locke.

no way... maybe jacob is richard..? He must have been through time shifting alot, since he never ages in any of the years. Be it 30 years ago or the present day. But it's lost so who knows.

[markom]

no way... maybe jacob is richard..? He must have been through time shifting alot, since he never ages in any of the years. Be it 30 years ago or the present day. But it's lost so who knows.

Could be Richard, but I am confident it is someone we already know. Perhaps this season finally will reveal this.

[Jonavin]

Could be Richard, but I am confident it is someone we already know. Perhaps this season finally will reveal this.

It's Jack's dad.

[matdwyer]

Why has claire been gone for so long???? :-0

[belowzeros]

Why has claire been gone for so long???? :-0


budget lol

[1yellowdog]

It's Jack's dad.

John Locke thinks Jacob is Jacks dad (Christian) but I don't think he is.
I think that in the end Christian will be alive and Jack and he will get the opportunity to reconnect - it just sounds like something a U.S. show would do.

[1yellowdog]

Richard Alpert has cool eyes for a guy

NOT GAY

NO HOMO

http://i39.tinypic.com/143kmfo.jpg

Ahhh yes but would you still find him attractive if he didn't have such lush eyelashes????? :twisted:

[1yellowdog]

no way... maybe jacob is richard..? He must have been through time shifting alot, since he never ages in any of the years. Be it 30 years ago or the present day. But it's lost so who knows.

In the last episode Ben mentioned that Richard was a guide of sorts.
Like an angel maybe? Sounds bad but I'm really thinking outside the box here. :lol:

[belowzeros]

you're all wrong. there is a new character actor next week on the roster so I think Jacob is a new face ;)

[Kerlo]

what would killing Jacob achieve?

Wasn't there an episode where Locke went to go see Jacob in the shack and Jacob said "save me" or "help me" or something?

Maybe this is the way that he's going to "save" Jacob. For all we know, Richard (or the island) could be holding him prisoner and he just wants to die to go to the afterlife.
:confused:

but . . . I still think that Locke and Christian are Smokey.

Smokey seems to be sentient . . . . It's possible that Smokey gains the memories of those that died or are dead on the island and that really it is trying to turn things back to "normal" for the island (aka it's home). Maybe killing Jacob is part of it's grand scheme.

[ladybug193]

I'm fairly certain that the producers have said that we have seen Jacob but he has not had a speaking part. Yes, I know we saw him in the cabin, but I think they were referring to another time.
I'll have to search for the link to that info.

[1yellowdog]

It's Vincent!
I knew there was a reason there was a dog in the show!
:twisted:

[Unicron]

LETS GET THIS PARTY STARTED EARLY!


I am ordering pizza and probably drink Dr.Pepper instead of water to celebrate

[Aj23]

Man, I need to wait until tomorrow to watch today's episode. That's one thing that sucks about my stupid satellite that always goes down. I could watch it around 20 minutes after its done, but it takes a while to download and by then it's too late for me when I need to wake up early in the morning.

[Unicron]

Man, I need to wait until tomorrow to watch today's episode. That's one thing that sucks about my stupid satellite that always goes down. I could watch it around 20 minutes after its done, but it takes a while to download and by then it's too late for me when I need to wake up early in the morning.

its on justin.tv in the entertainment section sometimes but it will be in a small screen

what sucks about my local cable tv is they always seem to cut off the end, like past 2 episodes the end always gets cut off by 2 minutes so i didn't even know Locke wanted to kill jacob or what happened after Farady got shot, i had to download the episodes after...

I heard its 1 hr recap, 2 hr season finale? Is that true? ......3 HOURS OF LOST...wooooooooooooooooo

[Unicron]

http://www.justin.tv/djtec

check it out

[Unicron]

Smoke monster seems to be able to appear as anyone who died on Island....so that makes him Christian....Last we saw Jacob he said HELP ME! so I think Smoke Monster is hurting Jacob, Locke is a puppet of smoke monster?

Smoke monster has that much power

I wonder if those OTHER OTHERS....the one who grabbed chinese guy in Van probably refer to the Smoke monster as what Lies in the shadow of Statue

[Unicron]

They showed the Full Statue again

Richard also says Jacob gave him the ability to not age

http://i39.tinypic.com/2ynru4x.jpg
http://i44.tinypic.com/5n5fet.jpg
http://i40.tinypic.com/bgw76x.jpg
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[Unicron]

i don't really like how Jacob appears to all these people and changes their lives

he seems like a real douchebag

[Johan Liebert]

Second Biggest WTF next to 24! Good episode.

[Mattones]

Who is really Locke? hmmm

[RayK]

head explode.

[Unicron]

I thought it was okay, I like all the mysterious egyptian stuff they go into but this one didn't really talk more about it

Richard said something, can anyone translate what he said?

[Unicron]

Who is really Locke? hmmm

Locke is dead

The Smoke Monster can take the shape of anyone who dies,

what we saw with Ben was the Smoke monster

The two guys at the beginning of the show.....jacob and that other guy, that other guy is the Smoke monster

[N_Raged]

That blew me away, just wow. This season has been very satisfying.

And <3 Juliet. Curious how Jacob never visited her.

[SAN66]

Who is really Locke? hmmm

My guess is locke is a manifestation of smokey, smokey was the same guy at the beginning. Smokey is not allowed to kill Jacob so he had to use a proxy, Ben. The mural in the temple depicted smokey facing off against Anubis. Jacob is the manifestation of Anubis (notice he lives in the very same statue).

[Mattones]

My guess is locke is a manifestation of smokey, smokey was the same guy at the beginning. Smokey is not allowed to kill Jacob so he had to use a proxy, Ben. The mural in the temple depicted smokey facing off against Anubis. Jacob is the manifestation of Anubis (notice he lives in the very same statue).


While i was sitting on the throne just now i just thought the exact same thing but not the smokey just that guy. hehe:cheesygri

[AzN_RiverdaleCI]

Juliet <3 <3 <3

[Unicron]

Locke actually died when Ben hanged him

When lockes body arrived on Island, Smoke monster was able to take that form I guess

Kinda sucks because then it means the Locke character was just a puppet the whole time, the part where he was turning the wheel and Christian (Smoke monster) told him he needed to do this....he was being played

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[astrotrain]

Locke actually died when Ben hanged him

When lockes body arrived on Island, Smoke monster was able to take that form I guess

Kinda sucks because then it means the Locke character was just a puppet the whole time, the part where he was turning the wheel and Christian (Smoke monster) told him he needed to do this....he was being played


I thought christian was a manifestation of Jacob all this time?

[oasis100]

the black smoke controls everything..it can be anything at any time.

looks like everyone was just a pawn.

[Unicron]

I thought christian was a manifestation of Jacob all this time?

That line around the cabbin was broken

the people who burn the cabin, before they do they mentioned something being used

The Smoke monster who can take form of any dead person has been playing everyone, Christian = Smoke Monster

Locke = Smoke Monster

the guy at the beginning of the episode who says he wants to kill jacob = Smoke monster

he found loophole with Ben

the whole thing is a mind trip...i'm not really sure yet if i like the way it all played out

[astrotrain]

That line around the cabbin was broken

the people who burn the cabin, before they do they mentioned something being used

The Smoke monster who can take form of any dead person has been playing everyone, Christian = Smoke Monster

Locke = Smoke Monster

the guy at the beginning of the episode who says he wants to kill jacob = Smoke monster

he found loophole with Ben

the whole thing is a mind trip...i'm not really sure yet if i like the way it all played out

I agree I also remember smokey pretended to be Ben's daughter telling him not to kill Locke but to follow his orders.

One thing is Richard did not look shocked when he saw Locke's dead body that maybe something bad will happen to his master Jacob inside the statue with the fake Locke.

Since Richard follows Jacob and is commander of the "Others" Jacob must have told him of Smokey and his powers so I would assume he would have tried to rush back to protect his master.

Another thing is since the "Others" are Jacob's people why did Ben have this special relationship with Smokey? That is from previous seasons he can call upon smokey and such. I find that odd. Moreover if the Others are Jacob's people who are Smokey's clan?

[RayK]

I thought it was okay, I like all the mysterious egyptian stuff they go into but this one didn't really talk more about it

Richard said something, can anyone translate what he said?

Richard answered the question of "what lies in the shadow of the statue" with:

"The one who will save/guard/serve us all"

[MrDisco]

damn this was an awesome season. the reviewers said our minds were going to be blown and i for one am quite satisfied.

here's something i'll throw out there as I watching the show - forget the smoke monster. what if we put jacob as god and the other man in the intro as the devil (light vs dark if you go by the clothes they wear). the devil lies to ben to get him to kill god and goes through hell (lol) to play out the end game.

(more likely i'm way off. that type of anne rice setup would have conservative america howling in protest).

guess the obvious answer to the riddle is 'jacob'. anyone find a translation for what they said? edit: i see the answer was posted above me. fits perfectly.

[llcooljayce]

Don't you guys see the religious parallels?

Jacob is God. He was there to tell Kate not to steal by giving her another chance. He gave Sawyer a pen to help him with his grief and he killed Siyid's wife (the Lord works in mysterious ways)

The devil is the guy at the beginning of the episode, wearing black to Jacob's white. The devil can take many forms including those who are dead. This is how he convinces Ben to kill Jacob. Ben's daughter tells Ben that he must do EVERYTHING that Locke tells her (ie, everything the devil tells him to).

That's why we see that Jacob gives Ben the choice at the end ... whether to listen to Locke and kill Jacob or to walk away ... I imagined a devil on Ben's right shoulder and an angel on his left.

I see Richard as Moses ... old man that seems to live forever.

Also Ben goes off about how he has never seen Jacob (God) before but he reveals himself the moment that Locke (the Devlil) requests it ... which pisses off Ben to the point that he kills Jacob (God).

Also, let's not forget that the Oceanic 7 got back on the plane Ajira flight 316 .... (John 3:16 - For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son).

Perhaps the survivors of Flight 815 represent Jesus and his tempations ...

Thoughts?

[llcooljayce]

Richard answered the question of "what lies in the shadow of the statue" with:

"The one who will save/guard/serve us all"

What language was that? I though Spanish but it was really fast

[llcooljayce]

Nevermind ... it was Latin

[GSter]

what an awsome season ender...WOW.

ill be spending the whole night reading the forums again.....such a loser.

[LoveRFD]

When will the final season be aired? Last night's finale was awesome!

[oasis100]

Season 6 starts in 2010..

[spawn582]

Season 6 starts in 2010..

that's a really LOOOOOONG wait :(

[Kenny Blankenship]

LETS GET THIS PARTY STARTED EARLY!


I am ordering pizza and probably drink Dr.Pepper instead of water to celebrate

Hope you weren't hung over from your big party.

[adeel]

Amazing episode...really liked the parallels to God and the Devil...Jacob seemed like a really nice guy....subtle meetings in many of the castaways lives...i enjoyed that....

Fight between Jack and Sawyer was one for the ages...that's been building up for years (I think?). Its funny because despite their beliefs and feelings towards each other you can really see that they could easily become really good friends after all of this.

Hurley and Miles were at their best in their limited scenes once again...

I thought it was really heartwarming how the LOSTIES (for lack of a better word...Sawyer, Kate, Juliet, Miles etc) rallied around Jack at the end to get things done...was probably more about making sure he wasnt killed than letting him blow them all up but it was cool to see the team rush in and help him take on the Dharma Initiative...and them covering each other

I shed a manly tear when Sawyer lost Juliet to the electromagnetism

And the revelation that in fact Locke was dead the whole time....wow! I was shocked I thought maybe the new Others were carrying Jacob's body. Too bad Ben killed him...I felt like Jacob had alot to offer from an explanation perspective...perhaps we haven't seen the last of him? But then again maybe island doesn't have mystical healing properties...

Now we are left to see what happened re: the hydrogren bomb. Its going to be an epic series finale! Too bad we have to wait so damn long.

[ephemera]

the finale was fantastic. So many twists. Didn't see them coming. Hate the fact I have to wait 8 or 9 months for season 6. I felt kinda sad for Ben.

Now we know clearly who/what the smoke monster is too.

Oh can we conclude that richard (ricardus) IS from the Black Rock? The captain being Magnus.

I can now watch season 5 over and over again for more clues.

[winstona]

Has it ever been confirmed that the Locke/Christian spirits are the smoke monster? I am not sure why people assumed this when in fact it has never been confirmed in the show. They can be ghosts as far as I am concerned...

Yeah Locke is dead but he will live on as a ghost on the island so he is not really dead..:)

[Unicron]

Has it ever been confirmed that the Locke/Christian spirits are the smoke monster? I am not sure why people assumed this when in fact it has never been confirmed in the show. They can be ghosts as far as I am concerned...

Yeah Locke is dead but he will live on as a ghost on the island so he is not really dead..:)

the beginning of the episode with Jacob and the other guy in the black shirt that talk they had by the Statue and then later at the end of the episode with Locke (The same guy in the black shirt) has the same talk with Jacob again about finding the Loophole

The Smoke monster also took the form of Bens daughter, we see the smoke monster surround Ben...read his memories or something and then his Daughter appears behind him and tells him to follow Locke

[Unicron]

Hope you weren't hung over from your big party.

i feel gross whenever i eat too much junk food

[chaingunsofdoom]

He gave Sawyer a pen to help him with his grief and he killed Sayid's wife (the Lord works in mysterious ways)

I saw it as him saving Sayid so that he could get back to the island. The slight delay of getting directions... he and Hurley were both visited by Jacob post 'return from the island'.

[Unicron]

Anyone else cheering for Jack during the fight?

Sawyer was cool when he wasn't the leader douchebag and Mr.Braniac

I also didn't like Jack when he was the leader and now that Jack was the underdog and workman I was cheering for him to beatup Sawyer AND he basically had Sawyer but then Sawyer cheap shotted him in the penis :(

[Kenny Blankenship]

Sawyer cheap shotted him in the penis :(

It's okay because he said "That's my purse, I don't know you"

[winstona]

the beginning of the episode with Jacob and the other guy in the black shirt that talk they had by the Statue and then later at the end of the episode with Locke (The same guy in the black shirt) has the same talk with Jacob again about finding the Loophole

The Smoke monster also took the form of Bens daughter, we see the smoke monster surround Ben...read his memories or something and then his Daughter appears behind him and tells him to follow Locke

If the smoke monster is the guy/entity who is trying to kill Jacob then why is it on Jacob's side all along? The smoke monster appeared to be helping the "Others" and can be summoned by their leader (Ben did it last season and in this one too). The ultimate leader of the "Others" is Jacob so the smoke monster should be under his control as well...

[Unicron]

If the smoke monster is the guy/entity who is trying to kill Jacob then why is it on Jacob's side all along? The smoke monster appeared to be helping the "Others" and can be summoned by their leader (Ben did it last season and in this one too). The ultimate leader of the "Others" is Jacob so the smoke monster should be under his control as well...

I don't remember the smoke monster ever helping the others

This part is only my theory but I think Ben summoning smoke monster because Smoke monster was under control at this time

The Cabin, They panned the camera to the line being broken around the cabin, maybe the cabin was a prison or something and once the smoke monster was set free he was back to wanting to kill jacob

[Unicron]

It's okay because he said "That's my purse, I don't know you"

:confused:

[winstona]

I don't remember the smoke monster ever helping the others

This part is only my theory but I think Ben summoning smoke monster because Smoke monster was under control at this time

The Cabin, They panned the camera to the line being broken around the cabin, maybe the cabin was a prison or something and once the smoke monster was set free he was back to wanting to kill jacob

Ben summoned the smoke monster last season to attack the team from the Freighter. That made me believe the smoke monster is on the "others" side...May be I am wrong...

[Unicron]

Ben summoned the smoke monster last season to attack the team from the Freighter. That made me believe the smoke monster is on the "others" side...May be I am wrong...

i'm not sure either

[Unicron]

I don't like Sawyer that much

He has Juliet already and Juliet sees him checking out Kate

And then he beats up Jack but only because he used cheap tricks to kick in the privates

I was on justin.tv lastnight and all the girls are like OH GOD SAWYER NO or some crap and I mean SO Sawyer looks all cool for chicks but the guy is a douchebag...and I saw news the other night of a lady who got her face shot off and she had a face transplant and she forgives the guy who did this to her, reminds me of Sawyer...girls still like him even if he shoots your face off

[gflux]

If the smoke monster is the guy/entity who is trying to kill Jacob then why is it on Jacob's side all along? The smoke monster appeared to be helping the "Others" and can be summoned by their leader (Ben did it last season and in this one too). The ultimate leader of the "Others" is Jacob so the smoke monster should be under his control as well...

I don't think that's quite true. The smoke monster is like some sort of untamed animal that's protecting her territory (the island). Also, the Others used the sonic fence to keep it out of Othersville so it seems like that can't really control it.

[Ryan]

I don't think that's quite true. The smoke monster is like some sort of untamed animal that's protecting her territory (the island). Also, the Others used the sonic fence to keep it out of Othersville so it seems like that can't really control it.

I'm not sure it's best to think of it as a wild animal. I think that there are more than 2 groups here (good/evil, dharma/others/crash survivors, etc) and each has their own interests that sometimes align. They keep referring to the 'rules,' my guess is bringing those mercs in was very much against the rules and that's why they could call smokey in to take care of them.

[belowzeros]

head explode.

+1


finally a show that caters to it's fans and isn't out there only for ratings. well there have been others but I'm feeling very satisfied with LOST right about now. Now as long as they don't screw with us too much in the final season all is right with the world. Oh the only one thing that didn't do it for me was Juliet falling down the forever well and not being dead at the bottom but I can forgive lol.

all ABC needs really is for DC to let Diana of Themyscira appear on LOST, hot leotard and all hehe.

[N_Raged]

I don't like Sawyer that much

He has Juliet already and Juliet sees him checking out Kate

And then he beats up Jack but only because he used cheap tricks to kick in the privates

I was on justin.tv lastnight and all the girls are like OH GOD SAWYER NO or some crap and I mean SO Sawyer looks all cool for chicks but the guy is a douchebag...and I saw news the other night of a lady who got her face shot off and she had a face transplant and she forgives the guy who did this to her, reminds me of Sawyer...girls still like him even if he shoots your face off
Are you forgetting the crap life that James has had to live through? He's the way he was for a reason. I have much more respect for him than I do Jack.

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[belowzeros]

here's something i'll throw out there as I watching the show - forget the smoke monster. what if we put jacob as god and the other man in the intro as the devil (light vs dark if you go by the clothes they wear). the devil lies to ben to get him to kill god and goes through hell (lol) to play out the end game.


I don't think you are far off at all. One of the joys of LOST is that you have to be able to read a lot into the lore that they spell out for you. Whether it comes from Literature or Religion I think that LOST's real meaning is peppered throughout the show and you have to be able to pick up it's subtleties through interpertation.

I probably don't think that smokey was the dark figure in the opening but probably a guardian or servant of his ie Cerberus. Or perhaps Smokey is a guardian of the island and actually neutral. Smokey could even be a third player on the Island or a Demigod to the other two, sorta like how now I'm sure Richard is Pan to the whole theatre.

With all the reveals and insight last night it's almost time to rewatch the entire season. I've been wondering all morning what Christian and Claire are and if that was just Jacob's evil counterpart in their forms like it was with Locke. Christian did appear to Locke but Christian always seemed to do Jacob's work in those instances as Jacob seemed to be working his Army and not playing them. dun dun dunnn

[RayK]

My theory is also that the black shirt guy from the beginning is the smoke monster. His duty is to protect the island, hence him not wanting Jacob to bring people to the island because they always come and fight etc. This is also the reason why he can't kill Jacob himself, because there is some rule that we don't know about but it seems to be that he also has to protect Jacob or something like that. That's why he needed a loophole to kill Jacob (getting Ben to kill him instead). At the end he says something along the lines of how much effort it took for him to get his plan to work, which leads me to believe he was also taking the form of Christian, Ben's daughter etc.

I am really hoping that we see more Jacob next season, I was disappointed when we were introduced to him only to see him die in the same episode.

Also, you can see some parallels between the story of Jacob and Esau if anyone is interested in looking that up.

[MrDisco]

anyone else concerned that with one season left there are too many loose threads to tie up?

-Smoke monster/Jacob/Man in grey - who/what are they?
-Where's the back story to Libby and Hurley in the psych ward?
-What happened to Walt when he was taken?
-What's with the Egyptian mythology?
-How does the statue get destroyed?
-Who built the statue?
-What infected Rousseau's companions?
-What does that Richard do to young Ben when he takes him in the temple and why can't Ben go back to being 'normal'?

Some other stuff that was probably already explained
-How does Locke get the use of legs back? How does Rose
-Why couldn't the women bear children (radiation sickness from the bomb?)
-What was that drug Desmond was injecting when he was in the hatch?
-Did they drop the whole backstory to the DeGrootes (founder of Dharma)

[Unicron]

Are you forgetting the crap life that James has had to live through? He's the way he was for a reason. I have much more respect for him than I do Jack.

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Sawyer sucks and is a cheapskate, he had to beat jack by kicking in the privates and then he used a stick against him to

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[lead]

My theory is also that the black shirt guy from the beginning is the smoke monster. His duty is to protect the island, hence him not wanting Jacob to bring people to the island because they always come and fight etc. This is also the reason why he can't kill Jacob himself, because there is some rule that we don't know about but it seems to be that he also has to protect Jacob or something like that. That's why he needed a loophole to kill Jacob (getting Ben to kill him instead). At the end he says something along the lines of how much effort it took for him to get his plan to work, which leads me to believe he was also taking the form of Christian, Ben's daughter etc.

I am really hoping that we see more Jacob next season, I was disappointed when we were introduced to him only to see him die in the same episode.

Also, you can see some parallels between the story of Jacob and Esau if anyone is interested in looking that up.

could be right but both characters have left the island. But only the non-jacob has manipulated and lied to get core cast to return. I'd say the answer to the question what lies in the shadow of the statue is the true name of this non jacob. "Lies" probably isn't refering to a postion but his nature. Remember Jacob lived inder the foot and the non-jacob lived behind the statue in the cabin in the jungle.

Everything really goes back to the first couple of episodes. Walt had a comic book that was about the island. We all remember Walt is semi-all knowing.It had pictures of polar bears running thru the jungle and a far away shot of the island as a floating mass with a force field dome around it. I still think it is a space ship that crashed landed hundreds of thousands of years ago( became known by travellers as atlantis etc). Heck ben turned a giant mechanical lever to move the island. We've seen it can warp thru time? Darma hits a large engery mass like an energy core(engine) etc. Perhaps lost refers to the ship crashing too. Jacob and the other guy its original survivors(spirits). Just a guess anway but regardless it has to come back to Walt anyway. How does a kid who can either manipulate reality or predict it have a comic book which has an entire story of the island on it.

[SAN66]

could be right but both characters have left the island. But only the non-jacob has manipulated and lied to get core cast to return. I'd say the answer to the question what lies in the shadow of the statue is the true name of this non jacob. "Lies" probably isn't refering to a postion but his nature. Remember Jacob lived inder the foot and the non-jacob lived behind the statue in the cabin in the jungle.

When have we seen the non-Jacob character leave the island? We've seen his manipulation on people who have left the island, but thats all I can recall.

[lead]

When have we seen the non-Jacob character leave the island? We've seen his manipulation on people who have left the island, but thats all I can recall.

as christian at the hospital and at jack's apartment. As far as we have been led to believe Jacob has never taken the form of anyone other than the one we have seen. While non-jacob who is now locke has been both christian and claire. That may lead us to assume that everyone hurly saw that was dead was non-jacob. Kate seeing claire etc. In fact I think each time a dead cast appeared they said "don't come back!" and each one of them had died on the island or had their body brought to the island. Non-jacob seems to only be able to animate the dead from bodies on the island. Jacob would appear as jacob and either give advice ask for help or in the case of Sayeed, save him. It was never as manipulative as the other would.

[RayK]

as christian.

If your referring to when Jack sees him at the hospital I don't think we can be sure that was him, it is possible Jack was just hallucinating

[Swaps]

could be right but both characters have left the island. But only the non-jacob has manipulated and lied to get core cast to return. I'd say the answer to the question what lies in the shadow of the statue is the true name of this non jacob. "Lies" probably isn't refering to a postion but his nature. Remember Jacob lived inder the foot and the non-jacob lived behind the statue in the cabin in the jungle.


Great discussion going on here!

I have to disagree with this theory though - the answer, as stated by Richard, was "he who protects us". Since he follows Jacob, it must be him. (not to mention that the fact that he lives in the statue leads to him being the simplest answer).

And for those who think that there is an overriding good vs. evil theme - am I the only one who thinks that Jacob is still the "evil" one as between him and the one who was with him at the beginning of the episode?

First of all, the other one seemed to loathe the violence that followed those who visited the island. Furthermore, Jacob visiting all the future island-dwellers while they are at their weakest points seems more opportunistic than anything - hell, he was even responsible for Sayid's woman's death!

[Kerlo]

I just watched the finale and it was AWESOME!

Something tells me that next season, we'll probably learn about the origins of the island, but we will still have many questions unanswered that we should be able to "extract" from the previous seasons. I somehow doubt the writers are going to reveal things in a monologue. It goes against the whole structure of this series.

BTW, remember how Richard said that he saw the Losties die in the past? It's possible that whatever happened in the incident wasn't their death but could've looked like it.

Jacob's "dying" words were "They are coming" . . . I don't think this has to do with the "what lies in the shadow of the statue" people outside the statue coming in but probably of those who were trapped in the past Jack, Kate, Sawyer . . . maybe even Juliet and Sayid . . . . coming back to the present.

I also think that Jacob knew that Ben was going to try to kill him. What is the purpose of recruiting those "what lies in the shadow of the statue" people? I sincerely doubt it was to prevent his own death . . . . When Miles got picked up by them in the street, why were they trying to prevent him from going to the island? Why did they ask him the "lies in the shadow" question expecting him to know the answer??

Not only that, Jacob CONVINCED Hurley to get back on the plane!

my brains hurt . . .

[belowzeros]

as christian at the hospital and at jack's apartment. As far as we have been led to believe Jacob has never taken the form of anyone other than the one we have seen. While non-jacob who is now locke has been both christian and claire. That may lead us to assume that everyone hurly saw that was dead was non-jacob.

well we really don't know who Christian and Claire are yet. We only know for sure that Locke was the character dressed in black. We don't even know that smokey is the character in black. They could be Jacob after all and not the character in Black.


And for those who think that there is an overriding good vs. evil theme - am I the only one who thinks that Jacob is still the "evil" one as between him and the one who was with him at the beginning of the episode?

First of all, the other one seemed to loathe the violence that followed those who visited the island. Furthermore, Jacob visiting all the future island-dwellers while they are at their weakest points seems more opportunistic than anything - hell, he was even responsible for Sayid's woman's death!

Great little theories. That would certainly be a holy mfer season finale twist hehe.

I like the idea of a spaceship too earlier posted. Pretty cool :) I dunno if it would fly on network tv tho hehe...never know.

[jadoocian]

im sure this was pretty obvious but didn't see anyone mention this..

whenever jacob met one of the losties earlier in their lives, he either gave them something, or touched them.

He gave kate a lunchbox
sawyer a pen
jack the chocolate bar
he touched hurley in the cab and gave him a guitar

all 4 of these guys end up traveling back in time

he touched sun and jin at the same time when they were married
he touched locke when locke fell from the building

[twitchyzero]

wow, so the finale was more action packed then the entire season.

It answereed many questions yet opened many more new ones.

I really hope the producer will answer EVERYTHING in the last 17 episodes.

Clarifcation needed on:

polar bears, what happened to claire, magical healing, why ben had tumor, sterility, who Libby really was(sp), that guy that tried to convince Hurley to leave his institution many times.

Also, I think all the assumptions people are drawing about the smoker's monster is still premature. Because i clearly remember in Season 1, jack found his dad's coffin in the middle of the forest, but his body wasn't inside. So i think people dismissing Christian as the smokey could be off.

[Kerlo]

Locke: Backgammon is the oldest game in the world. Archaeologists found sets when they excavated the ruins of ancient Mesopotamia. Five thousand years old. That's older than Jesus Christ.

Walt: Did they have dice and stuff?

Locke: [nods] But their dice weren't made of plastic. Their dice were made of bones.

Walt: Cool.

Locke: Two players. Two sides. One is light. One is dark.

[MrDisco]

Because i clearly remember in Season 1, jack found his dad's coffin in the middle of the forest, but his body wasn't inside. So i think people dismissing Christian as the smokey could be off.


That would be simple to explain. The Grey Man/smoke monster could have found the coffin first and took the body.

[lead]

Great discussion going on here!

I have to disagree with this theory though - the answer, as stated by Richard, was "he who protects us". Since he follows Jacob, it must be him. (not to mention that the fact that he lives in the statue leads to him being the simplest answer).

And for those who think that there is an overriding good vs. evil theme - am I the only one who thinks that Jacob is still the "evil" one as between him and the one who was with him at the beginning of the episode?

First of all, the other one seemed to loathe the violence that followed those who visited the island. Furthermore, Jacob visiting all the future island-dwellers while they are at their weakest points seems more opportunistic than anything - hell, he was even responsible for Sayid's woman's death!

I never knew what Richard said since I didn't know latin. But thanks for posting the response. Appreciate it.

The reason I haven't followed that Jacob may be the bad guy theory was because the non-Jacob was the one responsibile for Locke's death. He outwardly lied to Sun when Ben called him on it. Then told Ben we have to basically kill everyone else from the plane.

[gflux]

Clarifcation needed on:

polar bears
They were just animals that Dharma was conducting their hippy experiments on.

what happened to claire
maybe she's got the same "virus" that Rouseau's crew had?

magical healing
Magnetics are said to have healing properties by some people and the island has this in spades

why ben had tumor
he just had a tumor - the island doesn't prevent sickness

sterility
could be the magnetic propeties of the island or the nuke

who Libby really was(sp)
she was just some woman who had a nervous breakdown when her husband died

that guy that tried to convince Hurley to leave his institution many times.
Abaddon? The guy who worked for Widmore and got killed by Ben?

Also, I think all the assumptions people are drawing about the smoker's monster is still premature. Because i clearly remember in Season 1, jack found his dad's coffin in the middle of the forest, but his body wasn't inside. So i think people dismissing Christian as the smokey could be off.
Well we now know that no one on the island has come back from the dead - ever - according to Richard Alpert.

[lead]

god there is so much theory on the internet about this show. Quite detailed too. Check out the timeloop theory of lost:

3 videos parts 1 to 3,a very imaginative theory.
http://www.timelooptheory.com/video_theory.html

[mariokarter]

So who was on the beach with jacob at the beginning of the episode when the ship (the black rock?) was arriving?

[gflux]

So who was on the beach with Jacob at the beginning of the episode when the ship (the black rock?) was arriving?

Some people are calling him Esau. Some people think he's the smoke monster. I think he and Jacob are somehow connected - maybe brothers. They definitely have some freaky powers though.

[mariokarter]

Some people are calling him Esau. Some people think he's the smoke monster. I think he and Jacob are somehow connected - maybe brothers. They definitely have some freaky powers though.

yeah I think him being the smoke monster makes sense. Jacob is in need of help from people, but from what? As we saw in this episode, from smoke monster locke that wants to kill him. So it makes sense that this guy is the smake monster as he did say on the beach he wanted to kill jacob.

[Kerlo]

Did anyone else get the feeling that Juliet may have been pregnant? The way she had her hand by her stomach and stuff in this episode?

Some people are speculating that she's pregs with twins and that they are Jacob and Esau. . . S6 would focus on the origins of the island and Jacob and "Esau's" conflict.

[rilhouse]

oh snap, great finale. :D

[gflux]

yeah I think him being the smoke monster makes sense. Jacob is in need of help from people, but from what? As we saw in this episode, from smoke monster locke that wants to kill him. So it makes sense that this guy is the smake monster as he did say on the beach he wanted to kill jacob.

Also, when Locke and Ben went to the temple to put Ben on "trial", Locke "goes for help" when Ben falls down into the basement and then the smoke monster appears. When that scene is over and the smoke monster goes away, Locke shows up.

[lead]

Also, when Locke and Ben went to the temple to put Ben on "trial", Locke "goes for help" when Ben falls down into the basement and then the smoke monster appears. When that scene is over and the smoke monster goes away, Locke shows up.

Locke was also surprised to hear that Ben saw his daughter when he was judged!

At this time I don't think the 2 are the same.

[AzN_RiverdaleCI]

it's a trap!

[jokadeska]

Did anyone else get the feeling that Juliet may have been pregnant? The way she had her hand by her stomach and stuff in this episode?

Some people are speculating that she's pregs with twins and that they are Jacob and Esau. . . S6 would focus on the origins of the island and Jacob and "Esau's" conflict.

But doesn't Esau look much older than Jacob? It is interesting that the rule for Easu and Jacob not being able to kill each other also applied to Ben and Witmore. So maybe they don't have to be related by blood.

[Kerlo]

Locke was also surprised to hear that Ben saw his daughter when he was judged!

At this time I don't think the 2 are the same.

Actually i'm beginning to think that smokey may not be "Esau" this is due to the fact that Jacob seems to be mortal, with the blood and all . . . Wouldn't smokey have to be mortal as well? I can't see smokey bleeding. . . . As well, the Ben's daughter said not to try to kill Locke and do whatever Locke said. Why would it be necessary for her/smokey to say that about itself? Smokey seems very unkillable to me.

But doesn't Esau look much older than Jacob? It is interesting that the rule for Easu and Jacob not being able to kill each other also applied to Ben and Witmore. So maybe they don't have to be related by blood.

Yeah that Juliet thing was a wild shot in the dark, but also Juliet's flashback is the only one not to have Jacob in it . . . . I still think there is a lot about Juliet that we don't know, I always felt she was hiding information from the rest of the Losties.

I'm beginning to think that the whole Jacob/Ben death thing is an act. If Ben/Whitemore are bound by the same rules as Jacob/'Esau' then Ben would have to know the history behind this binding. The "shock" of seeing Locke brought back to life showed by both Richard and Ben seemed a little bit contrived. "We have seen many things on this island, but dead is dead" or something to that effect.

[twitchyzero]

also Juliet's flashback is the only one not to have Jacob in it . . . . I still think there is a lot about Juliet that we don't know, I always felt she was hiding information from the rest of the Losties.


Negative.

IIRC, in season 4, Juliet was recruited through a 'secret Science experiment' where Dharma hired her as a researcher. Richard was the one that did the recruiting

[kitty]

Okay, since we're listing stuff that needs to be explained, here's mine. However, I'm willing to bet that a good number of these will never get answered, because the producers forgot about or abandoned them.

1) Who do the skeletons in the season 1 caves belong to?
2) Why was there a glass eye in the Dharma station that the tailies found? I'm assuming it's Mikhail's.
3) Who is continuing to make the Dharma supply drops?
4) Why did the blast doors close during a supply drop?
5) Why does Kate see her horse?
6) We saw Rose & Bernard, but where are the other survivors (i.e. non-main characters)?
7) Who was shooting at the Losties when they were paddling the canoe in season 5?
8) How was Eko able to confront the smoke monster?
9) Why did the Others kidnap certain members of the Oceanic 815, like Cindy + the kids? How do they brainwash them into joining up? Why didn't said kidnap victims time-jump in season 5?
10) How did Desmond survive the nuclear explosion that destroyed the Swan? Or is he dead, like Locke?
11) Why did island bring Yemi's plane to the island? Surely not just so that it could recreate a virtual version for Eko.
12) Where is this box that Ben used to bring Anthony Cooper to the island?

[lead]

Okay, since we're listing stuff that needs to be explained, here's mine. However, I'm willing to bet that a good number of these will never get answered, because the producers forgot about or abandoned them.

1) Who do the skeletons in the season 1 caves belong to?
2) Why was there a glass eye in the Dharma station that the tailies found? I'm assuming it's Mikhail's.
3) Who is continuing to make the Dharma supply drops?
4) Why did the blast doors close during a supply drop?
5) Why does Kate see her horse?
6) We saw Rose & Bernard, but where are the other survivors (i.e. non-main characters)?
7) Who was shooting at the Losties when they were paddling the canoe in season 5?
8) How was Eko able to confront the smoke monster?
9) Why did the Others kidnap certain members of the Oceanic 815, like Cindy + the kids? How do they brainwash them into joining up? Why didn't said kidnap victims time-jump in season 5?
10) How did Desmond survive the nuclear explosion that destroyed the Swan? Or is he dead, like Locke?
11) Why did island bring Yemi's plane to the island? Surely not just so that it could recreate a virtual version for Eko.
12) Where is this box that Ben used to bring Anthony Cooper to the island?

well lots of those questions beg the specifics better answered by those who studied the show vs watching it. However as to how desmond survived? go back a page to the time loop theory link I posted. The more I think about it that's the best theory yet on how the show has gone down the time travel route.

I might wager a guess and change my spaceship concept instead to the creation of the island by dharma investigation and whitmore funding. Resulting in an ontological paradox.

They learned from the island to build a giant time machine on an island. They send 2 pilots(atleast) for its first experimental attempt.

They end up hundreds/thousands of years in the past, with the 2 pilots becoming known as jacob and the non-jacob. They then wait and plot till they catch up to current day on how to prevent this from happening or 1 wants to change it the other doesn't, leading to centuries of chess like conflict to save the island or destroy it (since both can neither die till they come to their own time).

Thus the island they built is what they learned from? An ontological paradox where information from the future influences or is created in the past with no true origin.

How's that for a guess? Totally the time loop theory convinces me it has to go something like that. It just explains things to much with out magic or religion or spaceships.

[originalnutta]

Watched all of Season 5 yesterday. From start to jaw dropping finish.

I have pretty much the same questions as you guys, but most are just trivial things that i doubt will ever be answered.

But of course i'd like to find out about the Black Rock, which was referenced in the finale, and when Richard was building a ship in a bottle.

Getting a glimpse into some ancient history of the island would be just crazy.

I'd also like to see the statue being built and torn down.

I'm going to have to watch this season again, to see how "Locke" tricks everyone to get to Jacob.

[originalnutta]

This all reminds me of a Star Trek episode where some aliens use the Enterprise or some other ship as a observation lab.
Cant remember if it was TNG, or Voyager.


But the aliens would go into one person and observe, and see if they crew would solve a dire situation in time.


I got that impression from Esau and Jacob, when they talked about people coming to the island and them making progress till the end.

[belowzeros]

im sure this was pretty obvious but didn't see anyone mention this..

whenever jacob met one of the losties earlier in their lives, he either gave them something, or touched them.



I didn't catch up past your post but actually yea he touched ALL of them in some way, not just buy giving them something but laying hands on them.

Doc Jensen summed it up in his weekly LOST post pretty well. I'm still wondering if that was all a smoke screen though and he is actually the baddie. Interesting stuff.

[belowzeros]

Locke was also surprised to hear that Ben saw his daughter when he was judged!

At this time I don't think the 2 are the same.



I was actually thinking the same thing and convinced myself that that had clinched him not being smokie. But then I started thinking down the path that he commented about how much effort he had gone to when talking with Jacob. The whole thing with Ben could have been an elaborate step in settting him up to obey locke-resurrected and kill Jacob.

So there are definitely two distinct sides, Unnamed was doing bang up acting as resurrected-Locke or he was genuinely suprised about Ben's encounter. Either way great writing for a finale leaving us guessing so many seemingly concrete ways.

[belowzeros]

Yeah that Juliet thing was a wild shot in the dark, but also Juliet's flashback is the only one not to have Jacob in it . . . . I still think there is a lot about Juliet that we don't know, I always felt she was hiding information from the rest of the Losties.

Her flashback was odd and definitely on purpose. I wouldn't be suprised though if it was just to show us how irrational and hotheaded she could be. She did that on the sub and she did it again at the well.


Okay, since we're listing stuff that needs to be explained, here's mine. However, I'm willing to bet that a good number of these will never get answered, because the producers forgot about or abandoned them.

1) Who do the skeletons in the season 1 caves belong to?

I'm calling it, Rose and Bernard! That cave is very close to their little romantic hideaway :)


8) How was Eko able to confront the smoke monster?

Umm Eko got his butt handed to him because he wouldn't accept his sentence. Smokie judged him like Ben but Eko lost that one :) Cerberus is a judgement machine or animal w/e.


10) How did Desmond survive the nuclear explosion that destroyed the Swan? Or is he dead, like Locke?

That's a good one...He got punted up in the air if I remember right. Still I don't think he had his thermal underwear on hehe


11) Why did island bring Yemi's plane to the island? Surely not just so that it could recreate a virtual version for Eko.

Like Esau mentioned Jacob probably drew them to the island to learn observe and evolve the state of things.

[billdozer]

it's okay because he said "that's my purse, i don't know you"

koth!

[thomsonst780]

Don't you guys see the religious parallels?

Jacob is God. He was there to tell Kate not to steal by giving her another chance. He gave Sawyer a pen to help him with his grief and he killed Siyid's wife (the Lord works in mysterious ways)

The devil is the guy at the beginning of the episode, wearing black to Jacob's white. The devil can take many forms including those who are dead. This is how he convinces Ben to kill Jacob. Ben's daughter tells Ben that he must do EVERYTHING that Locke tells her (ie, everything the devil tells him to).

That's why we see that Jacob gives Ben the choice at the end ... whether to listen to Locke and kill Jacob or to walk away ... I imagined a devil on Ben's right shoulder and an angel on his left.

I see Richard as Moses ... old man that seems to live forever.

Also Ben goes off about how he has never seen Jacob (God) before but he reveals himself the moment that Locke (the Devlil) requests it ... which pisses off Ben to the point that he kills Jacob (God).

Also, let's not forget that the Oceanic 7 got back on the plane Ajira flight 316 .... (John 3:16 - For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son).

Perhaps the survivors of Flight 815 represent Jesus and his tempations ...

Thoughts?

No.

I see jacob and anti-jacob as manifestations of freewill versus destiny.

makes more sense that way; destiny trying to destroy freewill.

our castaways are just chess pieces for those 2 to play with.

all the religious stuff you are reading into it is too simplistic; just like in real life...religion is a bunch of hooey.

[Maxman]

This show is awesome - but cumbersome. When it finally ends, I'll have to rent all six seasons, lock myself in the house for a month and try to figure it out.

My thoughts - its about redemption. All the characters have fatal flaws. The plane crashed - killing all aboard - but the Islanders are in purgatory. They have the chance to make better decisions, and find redemption - sacrifice themselves for the greater good - ie. Charlie. Once they do, they are taken from the island to heaven or hell. They are placed in situations that test their makeup. Everything else is backrgound noise to distract us from the moral lessons.

And the final episode - my guess is that they solve the "time travel" and elecrto-magnetic issues, are back on the plane when it crashes and the all actually die- fade to black.

Remember how there is a second plane at the bottom of the ocean, and Jack et al think that its a plant. Well, its actually an alternate timeline, likely the one that they are on now. And they aren't corpses dug up by Charles Widmore - they are the actual passengers.

Widmore, Eloise, et al, are responsible for ensuring that the blip in the timeline - Jack et al - is corrected. Kinda like god's angels!

But, then again, maybe its all a dream sequence, and they'll end it with Bob Newhart in bed with Kate, telling her she should wear more sweaters. No that would be hilarious!

Max

[shaolinmonk]

just got caught up.. can't wait for this to all end lol

[Churo1]

The appearance of "Christian" in Jacob's cabin was Man No.2 all along. When Illana discovers the cabin, she notes that "someone else has been using it". Man No.2 has been using Christian and Locke for his own ends. He calls upon the dead for aid in his quest to kill Jacob. He took Christian's appearance to trick Locke into leaving the island, dying, and returning. At this point he assumed Locke's appearance into tricking Ben into killing Jacob. It was planned all along.

[originalnutta]

http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/showthread.php?t=689096&highlight=lost

[Kenny Blankenship]

http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/showthread.php?t=689096&highlight=lost

lol

Swing and a Thread miss...