Costs of filing a patent

[ali123]

Hey guys, I was wondering what are the costs of filing a patent including attorney fees? and which country should I do it in, US or Canada?

Thank you, Ali

[slavka012]

ah, get-rich-quick guy! :)

Highly variable depending on the complexity of the patent. Be prepared to pay in the range of 5000-10000-15000+

File at the same time, in US and Canada

[ali123]

ah, get-rich-quick guy! :)

Highly variable depending on the complexity of the patent. Be prepared to pay in the range of 5000-10000-15000+

File at the same time, in US and Canada

I have a nice idea that's a easy money maker guranteed with the right type of promotion, although other people have thought of it, there is nothing commercially available for it yet. So I'm not sure if it's worth trying to patent.

Thank you, Ali

[slavka012]

other people have thought of it

Too bad you said that. Now you can't patent it. Read up on the term "prior art".

[Vladimir]

ya it can get costly. My uncle filed a patent, which I think was 800 or something, but then all of a sudden out of nowhere there was about another 10k of fees... which to him just wasn't worth it.
He just made the stuff on his own and sold it.. if someone else came and patent the idea he didn't care he would just stop then.

[Canucklehead]

Read my post here - http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/showthread.php?t=428789&highlight=patent

[heavyweight]

You can expect to pay about $10,000

Filing for a US patent is a MUST. Your attorney can advise you on weather of not to file for a Canadian patent as well.

If someone has already thought of the idea, you can still get a patent.
If there has already been a patent on the idea but it has expired, now you must come up with an embellishment feature in order to receive patent approval.

A patent is not always the way to go, and not always necessary.
What is the expected life of the product? If less than 5 years, than I would recommend simply bringing the product to market without a patent (this is very circumstantial and may not apply to your case).

You may spend years obtaining a patent and then anyone could take your idea, make it better with an embellishment feature, acquire their own patent, and your out of luck and most likely out of business if they know what they are doing. This has happened to me and I have learned a great lesson. Simply having a patent is no guarantee you will make money.

[ali123]

Too bad you said that. Now you can't patent it. Read up on the term "prior art".

I haven't read it but the thing is as an idea altogether it hasn't been thought of. lets just say it's a type of software

[ali123]

You can expect to pay about $10,000

Filing for a US patent is a MUST. Your attorney can advise you on weather of not to file for a Canadian patent as well.

If someone has already thought of the idea, you can still get a patent.
If there has already been a patent on the idea but it has expired, now you must come up with an embellishment feature in order to receive patent approval.

A patent is not always the way to go, and not always necessary.
What is the expected life of the product? If less than 5 years, than I would recommend simply bringing the product to market without a patent (this is very circumstantial and may not apply to your case).

You may spend years obtaining a patent and then anyone could take your idea, make it better with an embellishment feature, acquire their own patent, and your out of luck and most likely out of business if they know what they are doing. This has happened to me and I have learned a great lesson. Simply having a patent is no guarantee you will make money.

Thanks for the info, the product is not one that has a expected limited amount of life time and there are big companies in this field who can really burn me if they release the same thing because they have way more capital.

Thank you, Ali

[Wongdoe]

You can do a patent search first to see if something similar has been filed - it costs about $2000

You don;t need to file in both Canada and US right away, if you file in Canada, (and you are the first), and I believe there is a convention that protects the patent in both countries until challenged. At which point you would have to file in the other country.

Filing a patent is $10000 (at least) per country. The best bet is to do a patent search - actually, talking to a patent lawyer is the first thing you should really do.

[slavka012]

lets just say it's a type of software

Then just forget about it. First, s/w patents are not worth the trouble since they are often invalidated when tried in courts. Second, somebody somewhere probably already did it.

[ali123]

Then just forget about it. First, s/w patents are not worth the trouble since they are often invalidated when tried in courts. Second, somebody somewhere probably already did it.

Ok, I see, so I can't be sued if someone else patents it?

Thank you, Ali

[dirtmover]

Ok, I see, so I can't be sued if someone else patents it?

Thank you, Ali

Of course you can, he doesn't know what he's talking about. Microsoft, for example, have thousands of patents and will not hesitate to sue your a$$ off if you infringe.

[slavka012]

Of course you can, he doesn't know what he's talking about. Microsoft, for example, have thousands of patents and will not hesitate to sue your a$$ off if you infringe.

Yeah, right. You are an expert, I suppose? See, if you already have a s/w, no one else can patent it.

[dirtmover]

Yeah, right. You are an expert, I suppose? See, if you already have a s/w, no one else can patent it.

Do your homework, the USPTO is currently granting about 40,000 software patents per year. Admittedly there is a strong lobby against such patents but the fact is that SW can be patented and these patents are successfully defended in the courts. The fact that you think they are "not worth the trouble" is irrelevant.

[slavka012]

Do your homework, the USPTO is currently granting about 40,000 software patents per year. Admittedly there is a strong lobby against such patents but the fact is that SW can be patented and these patents are successfully defended in the courts. The fact that you think they are "not worth the trouble" is irrelevant.
I know that, but try to read again what I said -- if you develop AND PUBLISH s/w, nobody else can patent any parts of it afterwards.

And in my first post about not worth the trouble I meant that it is really a wishful thinking to imagine that an individual can successfully defend a s/w patent in court against even a small company. That is, of course, assuming -- 1. the idea is original (unlikely) and 2. he gets the patent (possible, but takes years)

[dirtmover]

I know that, but try to read again what I said -- if you develop AND PUBLISH s/w, nobody else can patent any parts of it afterwards.


I understand this but you make it sound as though it's a rule specific to software patents. The prior art restrictions apply to any invention.



And in my first post about not worth the trouble I meant that it is really a wishful thinking to imagine that an individual can successfully defend a s/w patent in court against even a small company. That is, of course, assuming -- 1. the idea is original (unlikely) and 2. he gets the patent (possible, but takes years)

Again, these same arguments could be made against patenting any invention. There is nothing special about the SW case.

It sounds as though you are against the patent system in general?

[slavka012]

I understand this but you make it sound as though it's a rule specific to software patents. The prior art restrictions apply to any invention.

Again, these same arguments could be made against patenting any invention. There is nothing special about the SW case.

It sounds as though you are against the patent system in general?

Well the OP was talking about s/w, that's why I used that field. Of course it applies to any invention.

S/w patterns however ARE a special case, due to the nature of the field. With so much stuff already done in s/w, most applications will be turned down due to their obviousness. (Which is defined as how likely it can be reinvented by somebody working in the industry. Which of course is 100%)

[toalan]

Just file the patent yourself.

What is most important is your initial filing date, doing the initial filing is easy and only costs a few hundred bucks. It gets more expensive if you want a world wide patent, just do Canada, USA and a few large countries.

As long as you initial filing date is before someone else's initial filing date then you are golden.

Once you paid your money and did the initial filing, you can take your sweet time in actually finishing up the application. I think that every 2 years you have to pay about $200 to keep the application alive.

Patents are not money in the bank, even if you have one it is upto you to pay a lawyer to sue.

I personally do not like patents, there are great ideas that deserve patents but most are just mediocre ideas patented by people who want to get rich quick. With that said, I did do an initial filing a few years back, and it was pretty easy, I never went through with the patent as the market for my idea kinda tanked. I am looking to do another patent next year, for something different.