Carrying a knife (illegal?)

[AMDCanuck]

Just curious if anyone can settle an argument me and a few co-workers have been having.

Is it legal to carry a knife in canada?

We have come to the compromise that a small pocket knife is probably fine, but over a certain size is illegal. But we actually have nothing to base this on.

Anyone know the actual law? Or where to find it?

[xpoint9]

I know where this thread is going to end up.

[UrbanPoet]

If you ever end up using it as a weapon to injure someone... then it'll probably work heavily against you in court depending on the situation.

Most of the time either giving them the money, or running as fast as possible will do the trick.

[Shaner]

http://laws.justice.gc.ca/en/C-46/

Read section 3: Firearms and other weapons

[Peckerwood]

The limit is six inches...open carry on the hip in plain view.

The definition deals primarily with whether or not it is being carried as a weapon, in which case it must be openly carried. If it is not being carried as a weapon then it can literally be anywhere.

But if you are carrying a SealTac blade under your shirt in a shoulder strap or stuffed into the pants be prepared to either have it confiscated or arrested due to Police intervention; should you actually ever get stopped.

There is nothing wrong with carrying a hunting knife etc on the hip.

[pupazzo]

http://images.encyclopediadramatica.com/images/e/eb/Brbrambogreyhoudn.jpg

[FerrisB]

tasteless image

horrible.

[BornRuff]

I'm pretty sure that the law in Ontario states that anything over 15cm is considered a consealed weapon, and therefore not legal to carry around.

You also can not carry "automatic" knives, aka switchblades. The knife can't have any sort of way of exposing the blade with the push of a button, or really any other method of opening it other than manually opening it.

And to add the obligitory unsolicited advice, carrying a knife is asking for trouble. Your more likely to get yourself in trouble or have the knife used against you that for it to help you in any situation. Pulling a knife on someone is a great way to escalate a situation.

[Peckerwood]

If I remember correctly if it exceeds 5 inches from blade tip to handle it's illegal to carry in public. Below that is fine. (repeating what I heard so don't me on that)
I think this is incorrect in the measurements...if it was correct then I would have been arrested numerous times when in Van carrying a knife in plain view in front of VPS ;) (unless of course thy just didn't care...which is entirely possible)

I distinctly remember being told by an RCMP officer that the limit was on blade length as 6 inches...that was 15 years ago, so it is possible that definitions have changed

[kingfencer]

i was at jane/finch, a women pulled out a knife in front of her house and 5 cop cars swarmed her.

[Bazooka Joe]

No gravity, spring or centrifugal openers (switchblades, spring assisted, butterfly knives).

Can't carry at or on the way to a public meeting, concealed or "for a dangerous purpose".

Basically it's up to the officer's discretion if they want to give you a hard time about it. I've asked cops in the past and they've told me anything under 3.5" in your pocket and you're good to go 99% of the time. Theoretically they could charge you for that even under the right circumstances though. There is no federal law concerning blade length.

[Peckerwood]

Spring assisted is only illegal if the spring is attached directly to the handle.

If it is attached to the blade then it is legal.

[Emancipated]

Regarding the charges, are you marred for life? I don't know what being charged with a deadly weapon carries in terms of the permanency of your record. It would be bad to have a record trying to find employment.

[corrupt123]

Funny all the definitions of exactly what mechanics are allowed. I was told once (unreliable source) that anything that can be opened with one hand isn't allowed. But the no gravity/centrifugal/spring definition seems more correct.

On the other hand, I have a knife with about a 4" blade that has a little "nub" on the blade, and as a result it can be opened pretty easily (and quickly) with one hand. I don't carry it though, I found it in florida and I just keep it in my room for random ****.

[laptop-tech]

Its illegal for most people, unless your religion forces you to carry one all the times.

[UrbanPoet]

htugh....

ugh...
I think next up is some loser that makes a flash game where you go around killing people on greyhound buses, like ppl did after those other tragedies... Since when did people get SO offensive?

[Shaner]

The limit is six inches...open carry on the hip in plain view.



Spring assisted is only illegal if the spring is attached directly to the handle.

If it is attached to the blade then it is legal.

You have recently posted a lot of information on what weapons are legal/illegal, yet not one time did you post a credible source, or any source for that matter. I posted a link to the Criminal Code, and nowhere in the CCC does it have a blade length limitation (unless I missed it). It also doesn't say anything about a spring being attached to the handle vs. the blade.

So if you have a link to case law that backs up what you're saying, please post a link, otherwise stop passing your posts off as fact all the time.

[Peckerwood]

You have recently posted a lot of information on what weapons are legal/illegal, yet not one time did you post a credible source, or any source for that matter. I posted a link to the Criminal Code, and nowhere in the CCC does it have a blade length limitation (unless I missed it). It also doesn't say anything about a spring being attached to the handle vs. the blade.

So if you have a link to case law that backs up what you're saying, please post a link, otherwise stop passing your posts off as fact all the time.
And the link you posted stated it clearly.

Reading FTW ;)
"prohibited weapon" means

(a) a knife that has a blade that opens automatically by gravity or centrifugal force or by hand pressure applied to a button, spring or other device in or attached to the handle of the knife, or

Therefore...Spring assist knives are only illegal if the spring is attached to the handle. This is why the Leek knife is legal for sale in Canada...and also why this Regina store hasn't been shut down:
http://www.knifezone.ca/
http://www.knifezone.ca/folding/index6.htm

Enjoy

As for the prior post about 6 inches being legal, I already quantified my post by telling my source...an RCMP officer...15 years ago. He could have been wrong...obviously.

[night_roller]

http://www.knives4wholesale.com/83859394.jpg

:twisted:

I think these knifes are perfectly legal and great fun for the whole family.

Especially in the Toronto wilderness with all those pesky squirrels, stop eating my damn bird seed.

[Peckerwood]

http://www.knives4wholesale.com/83859394.jpg

:twisted:

I think these knifes are perfectly legal and great fun for the whole family.

Especially in the Toronto wilderness with all those pesky squirrels, stop eating my damn bird seed.
Obviously a switchblade and prohib...spring is in the handle.

That and the company is in Florida

[Shaner]

And the link you posted stated it clearly.

Reading FTW ;)

Therefore...Spring assist knives are only illegal if the spring is attached to the handle.



That's not what the CCC says at all. It specifically states they are illegal if they can be opened by gravity or centrifugal force, regardless of where the spring attaches to.

[Peckerwood]

That's not what the CCC says at all. It specifically states they are illegal if they can be opened by gravity or centrifugal force, regardless of where the spring attaches to.
You do realize that I quoted that directly from your link right? Right out of the Criminal Code
PART III
FIREARMS AND OTHER WEAPONS
Interpretation

Definitions

84.(1) In this Part and subsections 491(1), 515(4.1) and (4.11) and 810(3.1) and (3.11),

"prohibited weapon" means

(a) a knife that has a blade that opens automatically by gravity or centrifugal force or by hand pressure applied to a button, spring or other device in or attached to the handle of the knife, or

(b) any weapon, other than a firearm, that is prescribed to be a prohibited weapon;

[Shaner]

You do realize that I quoted that directly from your link right? Right out of the Criminal Code

Yes, I do, but you're not reading it correctly. This is what the CCC says:

"prohibited weapon" means

(a) a knife that has a blade that opens automatically by gravity or centrifugal force or by hand pressure applied to a button, spring or other device in or attached to the handle of the knife, or

It's not an "and" situation, it's an "or" situation, meaning either point will cause a weapon to be considered prohibited.

If a knife can be opened by centrifugal force, that fact alone will cause it to be prohibited.

You're also reading the last point incorrectly. The point about the spring being attached to the handle has to do with hand pressure. It specifically says "hand pressure applied to a button, spring or other device attached to the handle..."

Your point about a knife being legal simply because the spring is attached to the blade is incorrect. The CCC doesn't distinguish between a spring being attached to the handle or the blade. The section of the CCC I quoted talks about a button or spring being pressed which is attached to the handle.

[BornRuff]

This seems to be a pretty good run down of the knife laws in Canada.

http://www.cutleryscience.com/reviews/canada.html

It seems to essentially say that the knife laws in Canada are very subjective. Blade length restrictions are decided upon by local athorities, and it really comes down to weather or not the knife is considered a tool or a weapon, which is really totally up to whoever you are dealing with.

[Peckerwood]

I am aware what "or" means...and that it is not an "and" situation.

"or by hand pressure applied to a button, spring or other device in or attached to the handle of the knife"

Could also be read as "or by hand pressure applied to a buttonin or attached to the handle of the knife"; "or by hand pressure applied to a spring in or attached to the handle of the knife"; "or by hand pressure applied to an other device in or attached to the handle of the knife"

The button, spring, or other device MUST be IN or ATTACHED to the handle. Key words there...The spring on the Leek knife is not IN or ATTACHED to the handle. It is attached to the blade...it is in the blade.

But failing that...the only foreseeable solution is obviously to call the RCMP and report each and every store in Canada that is selling Ken Onion Leek knives leave it in there capable hands. Perhaps you can also call Canada Border Services and tell them that they are allowing prohibited weapons to enter Canada and be sold by those very same stores.

I am sure they will be happy to hear your call :)

[Shaner]

I am aware what "or" means...and that it is not an "and" situation.

"or by hand pressure applied to a button, spring or other device in or attached to the handle of the knife"

The button, spring, or other device MUST be IN or ATTACHED to the handle. Key words there...The spring on the Leek knife is not IN or ATTACHED to the handle. It is attached to the blade...it is in the blade.

But failing that...the only foreseeable solution is obviously to call the RCMP and report each and every store in Canada that is selling Ken Onion Leek knives leave it in there capable hands. Perhaps you can also call Canada Border Services and tell them that they are allowing prohibited weapons to enter Canada and be sold by those very same stores.

I am sure they will be happy to hear your call :)

Where did I say the Leek knife is illegal? I don't even know what the hell a Leek knife is. My only point was that a knife that can be flicked open is illegal, regardless of any spring that attaches to the handle or blade.

[Peckerwood]

Where did I say the Leek knife is illegal? I don't even know what the hell a Leek knife is. My only point was that a knife that can be flicked open is illegal, regardless of any spring that attaches to the handle or blade.
The Leek knife is a spring assisted knife...and by your interpretation is should be a prohib weap. BUT...not one store has been shut down or forced to stop selling them...simply because they are not illegal.

Hence...your interpretation must be incorrect...otherwise the RCMP must be incorrect, the Crown must be incorrect, and the CBSA must be incorrect.

[Shaner]

The Leek knife is a spring assisted knife...and by your interpretation is should be a prohib weap. BUT...not one store has been shut down or forced to stop selling them...simply because they are not illegal.

Hence...your interpretation must be incorrect...otherwise the RCMP must be incorrect, the Crown must be incorrect, and the CBSA must be incorrect.

It's not my interpretation, it's specifically spelled out in the CCC. I don't understand the debate on this.

I did just now read up on the Leek knife, and it's obvious why it's not illegal. There's a tension bar that prevents the knife from being flicked open. Manual pressure must be applied to the "thumb stud" in order for it to be opened. From a closed position, it can't be flicked open, which was my only point in the first place.

Anyway, the OP's question has been answered, so I'm done with this thread.

[Peckerwood]

I did just now read up on the Leek knife, and it's obvious why it's not illegal. There's a tension bar that prevents the knife from being flicked open. Manual pressure must be applied to the "thumb stud" in order for it to be opened.
The tension bar acts both as a holding device as well as a spring assist...the inside of the blade has a cam that compresses the bar and then as it closes it loosens up slightly to keep it closed. Once the thumb stud of the blade is pressed in, the tension bar bends in the other direction and throws open the blade.

So despite the fact that it quite conveniently circumvents the definition in the CCC it is still a spring assisted knife.
From a closed position, it can't be flicked open, which was my only point in the first place.
Then your point was incorrect...see video

Demo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oKnUK1rMO7s

Kershaw Ken Onion Leek 1660BB
http://www.knifezone.ca/kershaw/leeksmokeblkblu.htm

[Peckerwood]

The spring on the Leek knife is not IN or ATTACHED to the handle. It is attached to the blade...it is in the blade.
I must concede that I was incorrect in the above.

I have taken apart my Leek, and found that the tension/torsion bar(spring) is located alongside the liner in the handle.

Therefore the interpretation in the case of the Leek series of knives must be in the definition of what exactly the tension/torsion bar(spring) happens to be. They must not see it as a spring; despite the fact that springs can be both flat, coiled, or curved.

Strange :confused:

[IBOPM]

AFAIK, for a spring assisted knife to be legal here it must not be able to be opened without manual pressure on the blade. I have a Spyderco blade that opens in similar fashion to many thumb stud spring assisted knives. I can open it very quickly with one hand, and to the untrained eye it looks like I am flipping it open with centrifugal force. But I am actually pushing the blade (through the trademark spyderco opening) so that the blade opens up approximately 20%. And then the inertia takes the rest of the blade to 50%. At which point the spring assists the rest of the opening.

That little thumb pressure that made the knife get to 20% is what keeps it legal.

[Ebola]

It's the torsion bar that makes the difference.

We seize centrifugal force and switchblade knives everyday.

[Peckerwood]

It's the torsion bar that makes the difference.

We seize centrifugal force and switchblade knives everyday.
So how is the "torsion bar" different from any other pin stock spring. From what I see the bar is basically a piece of pin stock bent to act like a spring for both closing and for opening.

There are many types of springs made in this method, from this type of material.

The trigger return spring of the Sig P220,P226,P225, P228 all come to mind. They use a piece of pin stock which is bent to give a curve, with a hook at either end. The "torsion" bar of the Leek knife is much the same with a curve, and a hook at either end. Pressure in both cases is applied laterally to the hooks, with the body bending in the middle.

I sense a loophole in the definition

[fakishan]

10 years ago, in high school, I was taught that the limit was 3 inch for the blade. (Quebec)

[UrbanPoet]

That's not what the CCC says at all. It specifically states they are illegal if they can be opened by gravity or centrifugal force, regardless of where the spring attaches to.

There are definitley loop holes by definition...
Much like the reason why some people have AR-15 restricted rifles with 10 round magazines (built with glock frame to accept glock magazines).

Also the reason why some people have Bull Pup style rifles in Canada.

[Shaner]

There are definitley loop holes by definition...


By all means, point out these loop holes to me using an official source...

[darkprince]

But why are butterfly knives illegal?

They don't have a spring...

[Peckerwood]

By all means, point out these loop holes to me using an official source...
I have to agree with Shaner on this point.

There is no official stance on Bullpup rifles...just Bullpup Stocks(prohib)

With AR15's though there are 10 round mags out for them considering that companies have manufactured an AR15 pistol...and the RCMP have classified it as such. But the only mag that I am aware of is a 10 round 223 magazine.

There are some threads on it in CanadianGunNutz.com

As for the Glock conversion, I don't know enough about it to comment.
But why are butterfly knives illegal?

They don't have a spring...
They use two pivoting points on the blade and the centrifugal force of the split handles to open

Hence Centrifugal force in the definition

[i6s1]

There are definitley loop holes by definition...
Much like the reason why some people have AR-15 restricted rifles with 10 round magazines (built with glock frame to accept glock magazines).


Those are LAR 15 pistol mags. It's very fortunate they also work in AR15s.

[selpats]

I haven't had any issues with carrying a knife in my back pocket, I have done it for YEARS.

http://www.outdoorpros.com/images/prod/6/Heckler--Koch-14460BT-rw-12969-3018.jpg

[UrbanPoet]

By all means, point out these loop holes to me using an official source...

I'll show you a Canadian Gun store website that'll have them for sale...

edit:
http://www.questar.ca/deals/LAR15_mag_ruling.htm
There we go.

This effectively shows there are 'loop holes' in the CCC.

[cheepino]

Can i carry a pocket knife (3 inch blade) concealed in my jacket? or does it has to be showing?

[gekkexx]

Are Swiss Army knives legal to carry around?

I ask because I have a friend who carries a Swiss Army knife (actually I got it for him as a present) around with his car keys and they were stopped at the border entering the US and for some reason (I don't know the full story), their vehicle was searched. But when the border guard saw the knife, he was like put the keys on the ground and step away. And then subsequently asked him why he carries around a Swiss Army knife in the first place.

[Serbtastic]

http://mirror.altrec.com/images/shop/photos/SPY/31_d.jpg
I carry a Spyderco Delica with me at all times and never had a problem.

[cheepino]

do you carry them latched on your clothing so that it is visible? or do you keep in inside your pocket concealedly?

[tcc13]

I carry one of these and say I use it for work. :cheesygri
Leatherman Skeletool CX
http://bensimages.com/Skeletool_Img1.jpg

[rommelrommel]

I'll show you a Canadian Gun store website that'll have them for sale...

edit:
http://www.questar.ca/deals/LAR15_mag_ruling.htm
There we go.

This effectively shows there are 'loop holes' in the CCC.

Uh, that's not a loophole. That's a 10 round pistol mag, that happens to fit in several rifles. Just like the CX4 carbine and Glock conversion MecTec carbines that acccpt legal pistol mags.

In Canada it is the magazine itself that is legal/illegal, what you put it in has no bearing.

[cheapmeister]

why not start a new trend and carry a hammer?

[dphythian]

do you carry them latched on your clothing so that it is visible? or do you keep in inside your pocket concealedly?

It is illegal in Canada to carry a "weapon" concealed. It is not illegal to carry a "tool" in your pocket. I carry my Kershaw cliped in my front right pocket, if I'm not wearing a jacket all you can see is the clip and the top 3/4 inch of the knife. My knife is not a weapon, it's a tool for opening boxes and cleaning my nails.

[laptop-tech]

It is illegal in Canada to carry a "weapon" concealed. It is not illegal to carry a "tool" in your pocket. I carry my Kershaw cliped in my front right pocket, if I'm not wearing a jacket all you can see is the clip and the top 3/4 inch of the knife. My knife is not a weapon, it's a tool for opening boxes and cleaning my nails.

Based on your comments, this guy in the picture could claim his knife is also a tool and not a weapon.

http://www.madslauritzen.com/images/content/Big_knife.jpg

[cheapmeister]

Damn that is a big tool :lol: (pic :arrowu:)

[cheepino]

Morning bumping!

[gei]

It seems to me that if you're the type of person who feels it necessary to carry around a knife (ie you're a loser... start fights with people... associate with other people who start fights and carry knives) then you probably really do need to carry a knife.

If you're intelligent, don't hang around questionable people, and don't resort to fighting, then you probably won't need a knife and won't carry one around.

[cheepino]

^^
"I would rather carry a tool and not use it, than need a tool and not have it"

[Peckerwood]

^^
"I would rather carry a tool and not use it, than need a tool and not have it"
My sentiments exactly.

I don't start fights, but I have been known to finish them. And I would rather have something handy that could greatly increase the efficiency of my defense.

[cechlin]

why not start a new trend and carry a hammer?

lol funny story

a group of "bloods" tried jumping some of my friends on our way to a party, one of the "blood" girls was carrying a hammer.

[Peckerwood]

Just two nights ago the neighbour downstairs threatened to fck us up...but first he "had to get his hammers".

Once he realized there were three guys up here he backed down pretty quick. Instead he went back to beating up his chick...who in turn kicked him out last night. Now he is living with his Mom again.

:lol:

[Throwback24]

lol funny story

a group of "bloods" tried jumping some of my friends on our way to a party, one of the "blood" girls was carrying a hammer.

I'd laugh and continue to laugh as I walk away. What a joke lol. Not trying to sound like Mr.Randy Savage, but residing in a low-income neighborhood for a good portion of my life, if someone wants to either jump you or rob that's what'll happen. If there's ever any dialogue I just laugh and walk away.

[Becks]

Are Swiss Army knives legal to carry around?

I ask because I have a friend who carries a Swiss Army knife (actually I got it for him as a present) around with his car keys and they were stopped at the border entering the US and for some reason (I don't know the full story), their vehicle was searched. But when the border guard saw the knife, he was like put the keys on the ground and step away. And then subsequently asked him why he carries around a Swiss Army knife in the first place.

What ethnicity was your friend? I was searched by US border officials and detained because I was carrying a resume.

[jperras]

There are no restrictions on blade length as long as you can justify why you are carrying it. Protecting yourself is not a justified reason though.

[gei]

It seems to me that if you're the type of person who feels it necessary to carry around a knife (ie you're a loser... start fights with people... associate with other people who start fights and carry knives) then you probably really do need to carry a knife.

If you're intelligent, don't hang around questionable people, and don't resort to fighting, then you probably won't need a knife and won't carry one around.

I don't start fights, but I have been known to finish them. And I would rather have something handy that could greatly increase the efficiency of my defense.

Thanks. You've proven my point exactly.

I don't start fights either. And if someone tried to start one with me (although I don't see why they would...), I would roll my eyes and walk away. I have better things to do.

[Peckerwood]

Thanks. You've proven my point exactly.
Nope...all you've done is argued yourself into obscurity

I don't start fights either. And if someone tried to start one with me (although I don't see why they would...), I would roll my eyes and walk away. I have better things to do.
To clarify, when I say "start fights", I am not referring to a verbal thrashing from some unrelated pedestrian. Rather I am referring to be dragged to the ground and bootf*cked until i can no longer refuse to give up what little money I may or may not have.

When you are in something like that, you really don't have many options to engage in minuscule verbiage and/or an equally irrelevant rolling of the eyes. Yet again all you have done is shown you are capable of sticking your foot deep past the ankle to the point of potential tonsillectomy...but thanks for playing.

Oh yeah...:rolleyes: