Good University for Business

[Matpan]

Hey guys, Im going into grade 12 and my marks are roughly 83%, what would be a suitable university for me to go to in Ontario for business, Im not exactly sure what i want to do though, maybe marketing or even some type of engineering. i know that i want to make some big bucks, if that helps? :P haha.
Thanks guys.

[HockeyFan]

Hey guys, Im going into grade 12 and my marks are roughly 83%, what would be a suitable university for me to go to in Ontario for business, Im not exactly sure what i want to do though, maybe marketing or even some type of engineering. i know that i want to make some big bucks, if that helps? :P haha.
Thanks guys.

Most of the good business schools have higher average cutoffs so i'm not sure if 83% is enough, even though it's a good average.

[adehbone]

Marketing and Engineering are on total different sides of the spectrum.
You need a 86+ to get into WLU or any top school.

"my marks are roughly 83%" != "i know that i want to make some big bucks"

Work at raising your average to begin with.

[Jeff18]

WLU all the way./

+1 to that :cheesygri do you go there? I'll be there next year.

Also the cutoffs for many universities went up this year. Work harder next year, i think you'll need mid 80s to low 90s

[DeltasInTheSky]

Cut-offs are ridiculous nowadays, with an 83% - kids are scrapping to get into UTM Commerce. Some get '1st Year Studies in Business'.

Just get into Engineering, do the bare minimum, walk out with a degree with minimal exertion and financial impact.

[samm]

Cut-offs are ridiculous nowadays, with an 83% - kids are scrapping to get into UTM Commerce. Some get '1st Year Studies in Business'.

Just get into Engineering, do the bare minimum, walk out with a degree with minimal exertion and financial impact.

what kind of advice is this? most students do better in courses they enjoy. whats the point of getting a degree and hating what you do?

+1 WLU, Queens, Western

[NiftyScent]

Remember, money isn't everything. I had that same mentality that I wanted to make millions of bucks a year back when I started high school. When I came out, of high school, my goal was just to study what I like and make a comfortable living out of it.

Anyways, yeah keep working hard in Grade 12. You can improve alot if you just study a little bit more. I slacked off during the first three years and had mid 80s. During grade 12 this year, I pushed it up to mid 90s to be competitive (I will be going into business this September (Schulich BBA)). Cut-offs for business are getting higher and higher every year from what I've seen. You need atleast low 90s for Schulich, Ivey or Queens PLUS good ECs and essays. I also know a few people who've been rejected from UTSG Commerce with low 90s as well (although I know people who got in with mid 80s as well).

Other schools such as WLU or UTSC: Co-op BBA require marks at around mid to high 80s.

But it is a undergrad. Visit the university fair in September and visit the campuses. Pick a place that you feel comfortable in most importantly.

[Free Willy]

What's the cutoff for Schulich these days?

[NiftyScent]

What's the cutoff for Schulich these days?
Minimum 90s from people I've spoken too.

[hitender_s]

I think ur best bet would be either ryerson for ur bcomm or York (Atkinson). Both have very exceptional degrees. Good thing about Atkinson is that it paves tv way for ur MBA degree since u can get into schulich quiet easily for ur MBA.

[rey1867]

I think ur best bet would be either ryerson for ur bcomm or York (Atkinson). Both have very exceptional degrees. Good thing about Atkinson is that it paves tv way for ur MBA degree since u can get into schulich quiet easily for ur MBA.

I think you're throwing around the word exceptional a little too casually

[Code of Conduct]

Minimum 90s from people I've spoken too.

It was about 92.4% for this upcoming year. The admin is trying to bump it up over the years (e.g. three years ago it sat around 90.6%).

[Rishi]

I think ur best bet would be either ryerson for ur bcomm or York (Atkinson). Both have very exceptional degrees. Good thing about Atkinson is that it paves tv way for ur MBA degree since u can get into schulich quiet easily for ur MBA.
Worry about getting an undergrad and a job before you start contemplating an MBA.

[Sniper001]

Hey guys, Im going into grade 12 and my marks are roughly 83%, what would be a suitable university for me to go to in Ontario for business, Im not exactly sure what i want to do though, maybe marketing or even some type of engineering. i know that i want to make some big bucks, if that helps? :P haha.
Thanks guys.
With marks like that, there is no way you will be able to make it into a top tier business school (Ivey, Queens, Schulich). WLU also has a pretty high cutoff of 87%, however, it would be slightly easier to get into based on the prerequisites. UofT has a cutoff of 86%. I will most likely be applying to all the universities above except for Ivey (tuition is insane).

With marks roughly in the low 80's zone, I'd recommend Brock co-op. Low 80's can hardly land you into a decent university, so either bump those marks up or start looking into Brock/Ryerson/York (non Schulich) for business.

[hitender_s]

I think you're throwing around the word exceptional a little too casually

What's wrong? They do have exceptional degrees and I'm not even regretting saying that. Not as good as Queen's/Schulich etc. etc. but that wouldn't mean they're that bad . This is why I mentioned the word "exceptional" and not "amazing, best, incredible".

[Rishi]

What's wrong? They do have exceptional degrees and I'm not even regretting saying that. Not as good as Queen's/Schulich etc. etc. but that wouldn't mean they're that bad . This is why I mentioned the word "exceptional" and not "amazing, best, incredible".
ex·cep·tion·al (ĭk-sĕp'shə-nəl) pronunciation
adj.

1. Being an exception; uncommon.
2. Well above average; extraordinary: an exceptional memory. See Usage Note at exceptionable.
3. Deviating widely from a norm, as of physical or mental ability: special educational provisions for exceptional children.

Ryerson and Atkinson are none of those things.

[wqzmbshz]

go to UTSG, get top grades, and go to Rotman to do your MBA. Min salary 100k per year.

[zoltorg]

McGill Desautels Business School cutoff is in the 90%s also. With 83 maybe try some one elses plan, go into arts, pwn U0 then switch into business no sweat.


Have you thought of Economics instead?

[brucemeng]

go to UTSG, get top grades, and go to Rotman to do your MBA. Min salary 100k per year.

Actually, pg13 of their recent brochure lists min salary at 40k.

[Rishi]

go to UTSG, get top grades, and go to Rotman to do your MBA. Min salary 100k per year.
I wouldn't tie your undergrad to a potential MBA. It goes undergrad -> job -> MBA, you've got to have the first two before you worry about the third.

[chauchau]

What's the cutoff for Schulich these days?

When I got in, they said minimum was 90 + ECs. However, obviously, they are always exceptions. My average personally was 95 but defintiely inflated.

Business schools will be constantly competitive.

WLU, Ivey, Schulich and Queen's Commerce.

[Rishi]

When I got in, they said minimum was 90 + ECs. However, obviously, they are always exceptions. My average personally was 95 but defintiely inflated.

Business schools will be constantly competitive.

WLU, Ivey, Schulich and Queen's Commerce.
In 5-8 years, I guarantee you all those schools will be taking kids with 85. Right now there's an business enrollment boom, but there is no job market to support current enrollment levels. Once a few graduating classes get out in the workforce and realize it's not easy pickings you'll see enrollment return to pre-2000 levels. Business is picking up the "undecided" crowd right now and that is the biggest group of high school grads.

[DeltasInTheSky]

When I got in, they said minimum was 90 + ECs. However, obviously, they are always exceptions. My average personally was 95 but defintiely inflated.

Business schools will be constantly competitive.

WLU, Ivey, Schulich and Queen's Commerce.

S you're telling me that you turned down Schulich (Queen's and Ivey, presumably) for Arts and Business at Waterloo. Or you didn't get in...

I hope for the latter :confused:

[Rishi]

S you're telling me that you turned down Schulich (Queen's and Ivey, presumably) for Arts and Business at Waterloo. Or you didn't get in...

I hope for the latter :confused:
In my opinion, no degree is "better" than another. It can be more rigorous, have higher employment rates or salaries for grads, have lower class sizes, lots of objective things, but whether it is "better" will always be a subjective thing based on the specific criteria of certain person. Hell, some people come from wealthy families and go to university just to have a degree, with no career pressure attached.

[adehbone]

Most of those programs you named have had 90+ employment ratios for many years now, there is no "business boom" as you like to say it, unlike the "dot-com" age these people aren't making a million 3 years out of undergrad.

They are starting at the bottom in an entry level position and working their ways up.

[commie]

go to UTSG, get top grades, and go to Rotman to do your MBA. Min salary 100k per year.

If only life was this easy. :)



In 5-8 years, I guarantee you all those schools will be taking kids with 85. Right now there's an business enrollment boom, but there is no job market to support current enrollment levels. Once a few graduating classes get out in the workforce and realize it's not easy pickings you'll see enrollment return to pre-2000 levels. Business is picking up the "undecided" crowd right now and that is the biggest group of high school grads.

Queen's, Ivey, and Schulich undergrad businessalways had high entrance requirements relative to other programs..its not something new.
Even back in the mid 90's when everyone was doing IT and Engineering, and the business programs were less in demand.
Grades are raising has more to do with the ever inflated high school marks and how easy high school has become.....A 90 average today is probably worth about a 80 back in the 1980's....

[Rishi]

Most of those programs you named have had 90+ employment ratios for many years now, there is no "business boom" as you like to say it, unlike the "dot-com" age these people aren't making a million 3 years out of undergrad.

They are starting at the bottom in an entry level position and working their ways up.
I agree there's no business boom, but that's not what I said. There's a business enrollment boom and I don't know the reason for that, but it's definitely there.

[commie]

I agree there's no business boom, but that's not what I said. There's a business enrollment boom and I don't know the reason for that, but it's definitely there.

Any source you can provide to prove that there is a business enrollment boom?

Things haven't changed much in the world of undergrad business education....There are only limited number of spots available at the likes of Ivey, Queen's and Schulich...they have always had 2000+ applicants fighting for less than 200 spots.

[UWO Engineer]

Cut-offs are ridiculous nowadays, with an 83% - kids are scrapping to get into UTM Commerce. Some get '1st Year Studies in Business'.

Just get into Engineering, do the bare minimum, walk out with a degree with minimal exertion and financial impact.


Commerce isn't the lengths of what these guys are talking about; and a 83% will get you into UTM, comfortably.

And minimal exertion as an engineer....lol

Any source you can provide to prove that there is a business enrollment boom?

Things haven't changed much in the world of undergrad business education....There are only limited number of spots available at the likes of Ivey, Queen's and Schulich...they have always had 2000+ applicants fighting for less than 200 spots.

I believe he's talking about commerce and general business as opposed to specialized schools of business. In which case, he is correct in stating that there is an enrollment boom; those programs are only limited by their acceptance cut-off.

[adehbone]

Over the past two to three years, schools like Ryerson and Atkinson have invested heavily in expanding and adding value to their undergraduate programs. The reason is they see there is growing demand long-term in these areas, they are not simple ramping up during an "admissions boom" to scale back in 3 years time. There is various trends that show this:

-The death of liberal arts education in Canada. Besides McGill/Queen's/UBC and UofT, very few schools BA is respected anymore in this country, this is the exact opposite of top schools in the US and around the world. By simply looking at this site and how a 'BA' is viewed proves this fact.

-The move to a more knowledge based economy. Looking at positions at my school, I see almost every organization now wants a "Business Analyst", I have no idea what this title truly means nor applied to these jobs ever. But a commerce student is main requirement these positions want. The main job that these positions do has to with fixing and improving processes around organizational behavior aspects of both HR and supply chain.

-The need for analysts though the information age. Before you had people directly working on a production or you had people directly doing door-to-door sales. Now we have the internet, mass communication and machines that remove most these jobs. They need to be replaced by people analyzing data and trying to find solutions. Again commerce students are looked to fill this void.

There is various other examples and I am sure papers written on that can explain what I am saying. The point is these schools are investing in these areas because the demand is long-term. People who would before goto school to study a BA or BS, are now opting for commerce, because they want to fill these exact roles.

As for grading inflating, look all the Ivy League schools in the US, and the SAT you need to get in today versus 20 years ago. The competition is beyond intense, most schools are a straight up lottery. Same thing has occurred in Canada, I would say its not so much grade inflating more the fact that competition is intense these days.

I mean how much do you hear the examples these days of a brilliant guy in your high school class, dropping out taking night school at a college opening a trucking company 2 to 3 years later.

The idea of entrepreneurship does not cross most undergrad business kids brains till maybe around early 3rd to 4th year. I see this as one of the main reasons for competition in the fields of accounting and finance. I know people who did accounting till 3rd year, and finally the light went on in their heads to go into marketing/hr which they enjoyed way more. If these people chose their path early, you wouldn't see the crazy competition accounting has for summer jobs.

Lastly as for little exertion for engineers. Well if engineers could solve organizational behavour problems and leave their little 'box' they were always in. Then companies wouldn't need to hire associates at management consulting firms who are usually undergrad business kids to solve their million dollar problems.

[UWO Engineer]

Lastly as for little exertion for engineers. Well if engineers could solve organizational behavour problems and leave their little 'box' they were always in. Then companies wouldn't need to hire associates at management consulting firms who are usually undergrad business kids to solve their million dollar problems.

Huh....So similar logic suggests that

If rocket scientists are as smart as they claim to be then they should know how to drive an 18 wheeler and be well equipped to solve any electrical problem.

Does that make sense? Not really...seeing as they're two different subject matters. As for your million dollar projects....I haven't even graduated and I've worked on projects worth 25+ million.

[adehbone]

Crap nevermind. I misinterpreted your point. My apologies, its rather late :S.

[red120]

What's the cutoff for Schulich these days?
92 in my entrance year.. and from what I heard from 1st year kids, 92 this year as well.

So I think it's been fairly consistent over the past five years or so.

[can't get 'nough dealz]

hey people!!!!!

lol, i got into schulich with a flat 90!

its not ALL that!

i worked my ass of for it though, but we shouldnt make people think that our averages are astronomically high.

The cut-off last year was 90.5, this year, it went down to a 90.

[ansh12]

My Grade 11 avrg was 70's and grade 12 was 93.5. My choices were schulich, atkinson, UTSC and Waterloo. Didnt consider moving out of toronto so picked Schulich. You have a long time to decide. Just work on those grades and the rest will come. BTW i didnt even know about queens or ivey till march this year...lol Hopefully schulich was the right choice.

Ansh

[EbonyRose]

lol, I graduated high school during the dreaded double cohort and got into Schulich, Queen's, and Ivey. I went to Western's ACS program for two years, then decided not to go to Ivey, because I didn't like the atmosphere and people there. I seriously regret not going to Queen's commerce instead- so many scholarships wasted there! Ivey's only worth the $20K + tuition, if you can be in the top half of the class, because I know a lot of people in the bottom half, who are still jobless.

[commie]

I believe he's talking about commerce and general business as opposed to specialized schools of business. In which case, he is correct in stating that there is an enrollment boom; those programs are only limited by their acceptance cut-off.

He was quoting someone talking about WLU, Ivey,Queen's, and Schulich, and the fact that it takes 90+ to get in now...and in five years they will be lucky to get people with 85%.
I don't know what you mean by 'specialized school of business', but at least 3 of those schools will still have the high enrollment requirements in five years, as it has in the past 20 years.

There are plenty of good business schools that you can get in with an under 85% average.....Just not those 3 programs.

[Treylakes]

go to UTSG, get top grades, and go to Rotman to do your MBA. Min salary 100k per year.

No one is going to hand you a 100k per year job just because you obtained a MBA. You guys are all clueless.

[AirplaneKing]

No one is going to hand you a 100k per year job just because you obtained a MBA. You guys are all clueless.

Doesn't pointing out one post and using it to generalize for everyone in the thread make YOU the clueless one?

Just sayin'

[red120]

hey people!!!!!

lol, i got into schulich with a flat 90!

its not ALL that!

i worked my ass of for it though, but we shouldnt make people think that our averages are astronomically high.

The cut-off last year was 90.5, this year, it went down to a 90.
I've heard of people getting in past the cut off.

My friend in my year got in with 88 I think.. final wave? After people send in their cancellations for picking somewhere else, etc.

But it's rare..

[billdozer]

Worry about getting an undergrad and a job before you start contemplating an MBA.

I wouldn't tie your undergrad to a potential MBA. It goes undergrad -> job -> MBA, you've got to have the first two before you worry about the third.

Not quite. To get into the Jeffrey Skoll MBA program at U of T all you need to do is have a B+ average and pass the GMAT.

http://www.rotman.utoronto.ca/skoll/admission.htm

[alv077]

I thought MBA was meaningless without job experience...?

[OMV]

+1 to that :cheesygri do you go there? I'll be there next year.

Also the cutoffs for many universities went up this year. Work harder next year, i think you'll need mid 80s to low 90s

I'll be there toooo
Bba? :)

[p0rsche]

hey people!!!!!

lol, i got into schulich with a flat 90!

its not ALL that!

i worked my ass of for it though, but we shouldnt make people think that our averages are astronomically high.

The cut-off last year was 90.5, this year, it went down to a 90.

To add a truthful spin on the cutoff grades, last year I got into schulich with yes that's right, LESS THAN 90%, but I wrote a pretty darn good supplementary application though..:cheesygri (FYI, I was probably 0.5%-1% less than 90%)

[p0rsche]

No one can compare if one business school is better than another unless of course one has spent 4 years in each business school, so unless we can see ourselves in parallel dimensions at each school , we may never know which school is "better" by one’s standards, we can only take what others say and filter out the biases.

Anyways whatever school you guys or girls wind up in, just make the best out of it because in the end it is yourself that makes your success, not the school you go to. Believe me I try VERY HARD to live by the last sentence (I will start this year, last year, I just partied:) )

p0rsche

[sPiKyAZN]

No one can compare if one business school is better than another unless of course one has spent 4 years in each business school, so unless we can see ourselves in parallel dimensions at each school , we may never know which school is "better" by one’s standards, we can only take what others say and filter out the biases.

Anyways whatever school you guys or girls wind up in, just make the best out of it because in the end it is yourself that makes your success, not the school you go to. Believe me I try VERY HARD to live by the last sentence (I will start this year, last year, I just partied:) )

p0rsche

Very true words. After countless hours and hours of b-school researching I came to that conclusion as well. It's nice to have every advantage possible by being in a school like Schulich or Ivey, but in the end you are the biggest factor in your success.

[ovovov]

No one can compare if one business school is better than another unless of course one has spent 4 years in each business school, so unless we can see ourselves in parallel dimensions at each school , we may never know which school is "better" by one’s standards, we can only take what others say and filter out the biases.

Anyways whatever school you guys or girls wind up in, just make the best out of it because in the end it is yourself that makes your success, not the school you go to. Believe me I try VERY HARD to live by the last sentence (I will start this year, last year, I just partied:) )

p0rsche
i cant agree more.
i applied b school a few years ago, ended up with rejection. so i did a b.s degree. now i am doing all investment and insurance related work. i believe i get paid better than most of b school graduates in my age. lol
it is really yourself not school.

[sneakyhobbit]

hmm. if you think that your marks are going to stay around 83 for grade 12, you'll have no trouble getting into ryerson (i think the cutoff was high 70/low 80's this year?), mcmaster's business program (commerce). Schulich wants 90+, queen's 90+, ivey 90+, mcgill.. i believe 90+. Laurier's cutoff this year is 87 but next year they're changing things- they're going to include prereqs. in admission avgs. There's University of Guelph too. I don't know much about their business program, but my sister's friend is doing marketing coop there, and she's on her coop term with ibm atm!

[DeltasInTheSky]

No one can compare if one business school is better than another unless of course one has spent 4 years in each business school, so unless we can see ourselves in parallel dimensions at each school , we may never know which school is "better" by one’s standards, we can only take what others say and filter out the biases.

Anyways whatever school you guys or girls wind up in, just make the best out of it because in the end it is yourself that makes your success, not the school you go to. Believe me I try VERY HARD to live by the last sentence (I will start this year, last year, I just partied:) )

p0rsche

Yeah, but that doesn't really mean much. The best measure of how 'good' is a school is basically is the alumni of each school (e.g where do they work now). It's unlikely students go to B-School for the sake of knowledge, they go essentially to get a well-paying job. Whatever school has the most, generally means they are the better school.

[rey1867]

Yeah, but that doesn't really mean much. The best measure of how 'good' is a school is basically is the alumni of each school (e.g where do they work now). It's unlikely students go to B-School for the sake of knowledge, they go essentially to get a well-paying job. Whatever school has the most, generally means they are the better school.

The whole alumni reasoning only really matters if you're doing an MBA. For an undergrad all that matters is the companies that recruit from your school. If you look at it that way, then all the business schools are weak at something.

[kreuzberg]

P0rsche speaks the truth, please listen. People should choose their schools based on the experience. In reality, companies could care less where you got your bachelors degree! From the accounting side of things, the Big 4 do hire most from the larger business schools, but i hope you do know they also hire from BCIT (Tech institute) and even small colleges offering degree programs. They don't care about who taught your classes, they care about about what you made of yourself during your time at uni, such as extracurriculars... work experience... etc. and how you present yourself. Its all on you. NOT your university.

[DeltasInTheSky]

Yeah, but that doesn't really mean much. The best measure of how 'good' is a school is basically is the alumni of each school (e.g where do they work now). It's unlikely students go to B-School for the sake of knowledge, they go essentially to get a well-paying job. Whatever school has the most, generally means they are the better school.

The whole alumni reasoning only really matters if you're doing an MBA. For an undergrad all that matters is the companies that recruit from your school. If you look at it that way, then all the business schools are weak at something.

Which is pretty much what I said.

[rey1867]

Which is pretty much what I said.

There really isn't a huge correlation between the alumni of a school and whether they will recruit from there. Most companies will recruit from more than school.

If we go by your theory, then UofT should have the most companies recruiting because they have the largest alumni in Canada.

[DeltasInTheSky]

I don't know what else to say. My point is quite simple. Better schools have better alumni. By better, I mean that they are at more "popular" companies. That's all...

[mizermalice]

I don't know what else to say. My point is quite simple. Better schools have better alumni. By better, I mean that they are at more "popular" companies. That's all...

that's more or less only for grad schools. like rey said, for your undergrad, it's all about recruitment at your school. i was accepted to schulich and UTSG, but opt to go elsewhere. now i have a CA job paying me very well, while i have friends at UTSG commerce and schulich still working at eatons.

if you're trying to use alumni success as an indicator for the quality of a school, that would still default to their grad school. if you pursue a grad or professional degree, your undergrad is pretty meaningless in the grand scheme of things.

[adehbone]

Deltas has a point anyone who has reached out to alumni from a undergrad business school, would confess to this being true. rey1867, you will see this in your upper years.

As for "if you pursue a grad or professional degree, your undergrad is pretty meaningless in the grand scheme of things.". Tell that to all the Queen's commerce and Ivey HBA grads who did US mbas, but still will goto war for a Queen's commerce kid.

[anycee]

Deltas has a point anyone who has reached out to alumni from a undergrad business school, would confess to this being true. rey1867, you will see this in your upper years.

As for "if you pursue a grad or professional degree, your undergrad is pretty meaningless in the grand scheme of things.". Tell that to all the Queen's commerce and Ivey HBA grads who did US mbas, but still will goto war for a Queen's commerce kid.

+1
I agree.

[Code of Conduct]

Alumni does matter..even at the undergraduate stage. It's allowed me to get my foot in the door for pretty much anything career related (my school has a large accounting abased alumni presence). Not to mention that even MBAs associated with your school will look at your favourably (if you hold the undergrad).

[Sniper001]

hmm. if you think that your marks are going to stay around 83 for grade 12, you'll have no trouble getting into ryerson (i think the cutoff was high 70/low 80's this year?), mcmaster's business program (commerce). Schulich wants 90+, queen's 90+, ivey 90+, mcgill.. i believe 90+. Laurier's cutoff this year is 87 but next year they're changing things- they're going to include prereqs. in admission avgs. There's University of Guelph too. I don't know much about their business program, but my sister's friend is doing marketing coop there, and she's on her coop term with ibm atm!
About what you said in regards to Laurier...
When was this concept introduced? If its something introduced for the upcoming year, the cutoffs will decrease a notch... right?

[DeltasInTheSky]

that's more or less only for grad schools. like rey said, for your undergrad, it's all about recruitment at your school. i was accepted to schulich and UTSG, but opt to go elsewhere. now i have a CA job paying me very well, while i have friends at UTSG commerce and schulich still working at eatons.

if you're trying to use alumni success as an indicator for the quality of a school, that would still default to their grad school. if you pursue a grad or professional degree, your undergrad is pretty meaningless in the grand scheme of things.
Don't you think that goes hand in hand with where the alumni are now (where they are working?).

[jas54]

There are a number of combined Business courses with Laurier and U.Waterloo so there are lots of options, some one which can result in a double degree. Look into it! Good luck

[alv077]

Just wondering ...what alumnis can do for you as an undergrad?

[EH15]

Also entering gr. 12 here. Was wondering, are they mainly looking for avgs? I'm looking at business but my school (sh*t school in the middle of nowhere) cancelled my grade 12 accounting course. Then they screwed up the scheduling and I was forced to choose between an international business course or calculus. I chose for the latter. Will that hinder my chances right off the bat, having only one course in business throughout highschool (grade 11 accounting).

[sPiKyAZN]

Also entering gr. 12 here. Was wondering, are they mainly looking for avgs? I'm looking at business but my school (sh*t school in the middle of nowhere) cancelled my grade 12 accounting course. Then they screwed up the scheduling and I was forced to choose between an international business course or calculus. I chose for the latter. Will that hinder my chances right off the bat, having only one course in business throughout highschool (grade 11 accounting).

As long as you meet the pre-requisites universities don't care what electives you took. Aside, you might have a tough time for first year courses if you're lacking key knowledge. I think accounting starts off from the beginning though in uni.

[Code of Conduct]

People who didn't take accounting had a rough time in the first year accounting courses cause our school basically covered 2 years of high school accounting in 2 months. However, they all got through it and are just fine. Don't worry about not having business courses, some schools actually look at a calculus course more favorably than say...a standard business course in high school.

As for what an alumnus can do for you....this depends. Of course rarely will an alumnus give you a job just because you went to his/her alma matar BUT its a great way to make a connection in networking or interviewing situations. Also, my mentor is an alumni of my school..so that helped. =)

[sneakyhobbit]

About what you said in regards to Laurier...
When was this concept introduced? If its something introduced for the upcoming year, the cutoffs will decrease a notch... right?
here's the link:
http://cubic.wlu.ca/page.php?grp_id=65&p=1342

[Heresy]

Ivey (University of Western Ontario)
Queen's

Rotman (University of Toronto)
Schulich

[lhsonic]

Also entering gr. 12 here. Was wondering, are they mainly looking for avgs? I'm looking at business but my school (sh*t school in the middle of nowhere) cancelled my grade 12 accounting course. Then they screwed up the scheduling and I was forced to choose between an international business course or calculus. I chose for the latter. Will that hinder my chances right off the bat, having only one course in business throughout highschool (grade 11 accounting).


Look at the Universities you are interested in. They will have specific information on what they expect and what courses your average is based on, it's generally never everything. I don't know if they take Accounting into account anyways, they don't in BC.

To the OP: No offence, but 83% will not get you into a good university for business. You also have to see what brought your marks down. Was it that you just didn't try hard enough or if there was specific courses dragging you down. If it's the prior, take business at a easier to get into university and then transfer to a better one down the road if you wish and are able to. If it was a specific course, then make sure that course isn't an integral part of business in university unless you can be sure you can improve.

[zoltorg]

You may have to go outside ontario. 83% won't make it far there (unless you want Ryerson). McGill's business cutoff is always around 89-90%

[mizermalice]

if you're determined, do guelph or ryerson, work really hard, and get the grades to transfer into a better school.

[Kuroshio]

I'm in Queen's Commerce myself and am just entering first year at the end of this month. In grade 12 i nearly had a heart attack because my average increased by about 2 percent from my gr. 11 average i kept thinking that i can just flip a switch and set my mind to it, but it dosen't work that way. Before you all go on a rant about how i'm probably some kid with a 95% i'm not, i was accepted to Queen's Commerce with and 86.67% average.

That's right, below the cutoff. My advice to the OP and anyone else aiming for top tier schools is to try either way, I was (and still am) astounded at my acceptance to Queen's which in retrospect was mainly based on my outstanding extra curricular activities and application essays. The point is to be rounded, if you want Queen's get involved. They don't take people that are oblivious to anything other than book smarts, that is why I disprove when people say Schulich is on par with Queen's because that is what their acceptance criteria is based on (that's another story).

83% average you would get rejected, bump it up 5% and you will have a fighting chance, remember people with 95% averages get rejected from Queen's and have to settle for something else (cough Schulich)

Toss me a PM if you have any questions specific to Commerce and I'll try my best to answer them.

[Code of Conduct]

I'm in Queen's Commerce myself and am just entering first year at the end of this month. In grade 12 i nearly had a heart attack because my average increased by about 2 percent from my gr. 11 average i kept thinking that i can just flip a switch and set my mind to it, but it dosen't work that way. Before you all go on a rant about how i'm probably some kid with a 95% i'm not, i was accepted to Queen's Commerce with and 86.67% average.

That's right, below the cutoff. My advice to the OP and anyone else aiming for top tier schools is to try either way, I was (and still am) astounded at my acceptance to Queen's which in retrospect was mainly based on my outstanding extra curricular activities and application essays. The point is to be rounded, if you want Queen's get involved. They don't take people that are oblivious to anything other than book smarts, that is why I disprove when people say Schulich is on par with Queen's because that is what their acceptance criteria is based on (that's another story).

83% average you would get rejected, bump it up 5% and you will have a fighting chance, remember people with 95% averages get rejected from Queen's and have to settle for something else (cough Schulich)

Toss me a PM if you have any questions specific to Commerce and I'll try my best to answer them.

How the schulich application process works:

-You submit three essays detailing your extracurriculars, why you want to attend the school, etc.
-You also submit your transcript with minimum ~90-92% gpa depending on the year
-you are given either a 0, a 1, or a 2 score depending on where your GPA falls
-you are then given a 0, a 1, or a 2 score by an evaluator for your three essays (there actually may be 2 seperate evaluators which score you and average out that score)
-you're accepted if you get at least a 2 or higher but only if you have at least 1 in both (it's something to this effect, my memory is a little foggy though).

Regardless, you get the point...extracurriculars and "well-roundedness" is sought by all schools. There are always individuals that get in under the official cut-off point for GPA..that alone proves very little. =).

[Sniper001]

How the schulich application process works:

-You submit three essays detailing your extracurriculars, why you want to attend the school, etc.
-You also submit your transcript with minimum ~90-92% gpa depending on the year
-you are given either a 0, a 1, or a 2 score depending on where your GPA falls
-you are then given a 0, a 1, or a 2 score by an evaluator for your three essays (there actually may be 2 seperate evaluators which score you and average out that score)
-you're accepted if you get at least a 2 or higher but only if you have at least 1 in both (it's something to this effect, my memory is a little foggy though).

Regardless, you get the point...extracurriculars and "well-roundedness" is sought by all schools. There are always individuals that get in under the official cut-off point for GPA..that alone proves very little. =).
Quick question. When does the process of writing the extra-curriculars take place? And do you write EC's for just grade 12 or grade 10+11 as well? Or can you do it for all of your HS years? Let's just say there is an individual who took part in some extra curricular's in grade 11, but not as many as other students... and he/she took part in MANY more in grade 12. Would that matter? Because if the process is done earlier in the school year, he/she may not have as much to write about..

[Rishi]

83% average you would get rejected, bump it up 5% and you will have a fighting chance, remember people with 95% averages get rejected from Queen's and have to settle for something else (cough Schulich)

Toss me a PM if you have any questions specific to Commerce and I'll try my best to answer them.
Documentation please.

[Code of Conduct]

Sorry, I wasn't being too clear there =). You submit your essays at around the same time that you apply for universities..around mid/late february is the deadline I believe.

There are three questions which you have to answer in short essay format:

-One usually concerns your extracurriculars
-One usually discusses your aspirations in life (career and personal aspirations)
-And the last one usually covers why you want to go to Schulich

There really isn't any guildelines other than that on what you can or can not discuss in your answers. So if you wanted to, you can talk about extracurriculars you did 5 years ago. But just as in an employment situation, the more recent your experiences, the more weight they usually carry.

[Cowman1208]

I am going to just toss this out there because you will all fall off your chair laughing...
come to the University of Windsor Odette School of Business!
UofW business school (http://http://business.uwindsor.ca/)
(they call Windsor last chance U ... because we will take anyone :lol:)

[DeltasInTheSky]

I am going to just toss this out there because you will all fall off your chair laughing...
come to the University of Windsor Odette School of Business!
UofW business school (http://http://business.uwindsor.ca/)
(they call Windsor last chance U ... because we will take anyone :lol:)

Richard Peddie went to Windsor, so it's Diamond in the Rough U.:lol:

[mizermalice]

83% average you would get rejected, bump it up 5% and you will have a fighting chance, remember people with 95% averages get rejected from Queen's and have to settle for something else (cough Schulich)

Toss me a PM if you have any questions specific to Commerce and I'll try my best to answer them.

typical queen's student

[Kuroshio]

typical queen's student

And what is that supposed to mean?

Documentation? Visit studentawards.com and go on the forums, people talk about different schools and their applications stating their averages, extra curricular and acceptance. For those who don't feel like going there to stroke their e-peens it is also a good site for prospective students of any schools to get some tips and info on applications and specific schools

[nemesis1991]

i'm starting at western with pre-ivey status
i've heard that the rankings hover around ivey, rotman and schulich for the 3 best schools in ontario for commerce.
if you can pull your marks up to a high 80 you have a pretty good chance with all 3 schools. i got pre-ivey status with an 89.8.
it doesnt hurt to have some extra curricular such as juniour achievement either.

[Rishi]

And what is that supposed to mean?

Documentation? Visit studentawards.com and go on the forums, people talk about different schools and their applications stating their averages, extra curricular and acceptance. For those who don't feel like going there to stroke their e-peens it is also a good site for prospective students of any schools to get some tips and info on applications and specific schools
I hear the "95 average but rejected" line all the time, and it is always from students or staff at the school in question. You suggest that something other than high marks is required for admission @ Queen's but that is simply false. Sorry to disappoint, your school is not some elite nerd-free zone.

Cutoffs are always lower than advertised and are usually not even cutoffs, but admission averages.

[Kuroshio]

I hear the "95 average but rejected" line all the time, and it is always from students or staff at the school in question. You suggest that something other than high marks is required for admission @ Queen's but that is simply false. Sorry to disappoint, your school is not some elite nerd-free zone.

Cutoffs are always lower than advertised and are usually not even cutoffs, but admission averages.

Well than whoever told you that lied I heard it from other people who were rejected, why would they brag about being rejected or lie about it? Can't think of a reason? Well that is because there isn't one.

I didn't say anything about Queen's being nerd free or any of that BS, you putting words in my mouth just goes to show your own insecurities and prejudice against Queen's and it's students.I fail to see how anyone can still take you seriously in this discussion at this point.

[Rishi]

Well than whoever told you that lied I heard it from other people who were rejected, why would they brag about being rejected or lie about it? Can't think of a reason? Well that is because there isn't one.

I didn't say anything about Queen's being nerd free or any of that BS, you putting words in my mouth just goes to show your own insecurities and prejudice against Queen's and it's students.I fail to see how anyone can still take you seriously in this discussion at this point.
It's a called a paraphrase. Does Queen's offer English classes?

I don't dislike Queen's, in fact if you read my previous posts you will find that I have recommended it as one of the top engineering schools in this country. Unlike you, I am not under the illusion that it has incredible stringent standards that would cause someone to have to "settle" for Schulich.

[Kuroshio]

In terms of Commerce it is the most selective university in Ontario for admission, what i was saying is that once you have that 90% + you are pretty much guaranteed acceptance to Schulich, that is not the case with Queen's.

Don't believe me? Fine by me but keep it to yourself, you going off on a rant about Queen's has nothing to do with what the OP wanted to know, I am telling him to work hard if he wants to get accepted anywhere, not only Queen's. BTW, it is not a top school for engineering there are better ones.

[Code of Conduct]

=) I'm a little confused as to why you believe Schulich is GPA focused. I just laid out the application process for you.

[waitsui]

Yeah man, just follow what you think is right, and even if its not commerce, you can still accomplish great hights!! This is my story, I slacked off during highschool, and by gr 12, i knew it was time for hardcore studying managed to pull my avg to 75% in gr 12, and (btw this was like 3 years ago so cutoffs werent too high compared to nowadays). But I wanted to get into Architecture which cutoff is at about 80% and with a decent portfolio, I ended up getting into History and Theory of Arch at Carleton in Ottawa. It was just a sub for the arch program, and it was just about history of architecture, it wasn't the things I expected to do like drafting and autocad drawing. I stayed there for two years and work hard, now I got into Ryerson's Architecture, and I am pretty proud of myself working my ass off the last two years. By the end of the day, you just know everything you did and scarficed was all worth it. So remember kids, work hard, play hard!! AND never give up on your dream!

[LDN2012]

Ivey (biased, Im at Western!)
Other top schools:
Queens
Schulich
UofT St. George

[alv077]

Ivey (biased, Im at Western!)
Other top schools:
Queens
Schulich
UofT St. George

Seconded.

[mizermalice]

In terms of Commerce it is the most selective university in Ontario for admission, what i was saying is that once you have that 90% + you are pretty much guaranteed acceptance to Schulich, that is not the case with Queen's.

schulich: you have to write two storied essays and complete a EC form for a reason.


son, you got into Queens, not Harvard

[sPiKyAZN]

I'm in Queen's Commerce myself and am just entering first year at the end of this month. In grade 12 i nearly had a heart attack because my average increased by about 2 percent from my gr. 11 average i kept thinking that i can just flip a switch and set my mind to it, but it dosen't work that way. Before you all go on a rant about how i'm probably some kid with a 95% i'm not, i was accepted to Queen's Commerce with and 86.67% average.

That's right, below the cutoff. My advice to the OP and anyone else aiming for top tier schools is to try either way, I was (and still am) astounded at my acceptance to Queen's which in retrospect was mainly based on my outstanding extra curricular activities and application essays. The point is to be rounded, if you want Queen's get involved. They don't take people that are oblivious to anything other than book smarts, that is why I disprove when people say Schulich is on par with Queen's because that is what their acceptance criteria is based on (that's another story).

83% average you would get rejected, bump it up 5% and you will have a fighting chance, remember people with 95% averages get rejected from Queen's and have to settle for something else (cough Schulich)

Toss me a PM if you have any questions specific to Commerce and I'll try my best to answer them.

Are you bitter because Schulich rejected you or something? Most people I have met in Schulich in no way, shape or form go to Schulich because that's what they had to "settle" for. That's a pretty cocky statement.

Anyways, unlike you I'm not going to knock your program. I've got lots of respect for Queens commerce, it's definitely one of the top programs in Canada. I'm not saying Schulich is the best either, I think the difference between the big 3 are so negligible that it boils down to your personal skill. Anyways, I hope you'll be able to make $20,000 more than me when we graduate to cover the price gap (or about $45,000 if you include residence).

[mr_toast]

*cough* Ryerson Business Management FTW *cough*

[spazzamatic]

waterloo just built a brand new accounting building ;)

[UWO Engineer]

In terms of Commerce it is the most selective university in Ontario for admission, what i was saying is that once you have that 90% + you are pretty much guaranteed acceptance to Schulich, that is not the case with Queen's.

Don't believe me? Fine by me but keep it to yourself, you going off on a rant about Queen's has nothing to do with what the OP wanted to know, I am telling him to work hard if he wants to get accepted anywhere, not only Queen's. BTW, it is not a top school for engineering there are better ones.

You're going into commerce either way :lol:

[alv077]

waterloo just built a brand new accounting building ;)

Which the class of 2012 will not be the first to settle into because they went on strike. Pssh.

[Sniper001]

Ivey (biased, Im at Western!)
Other top schools:
Queens
Schulich
UofT St. George
Although that may be true, if you are going to make the list according to price (Highest to lowest):
Ivey
Queens
UofT
Schulich

So, in the end, the most "best+affordable" university to go to would be Schulich, since it is ranked above UofT and is cheaper than UofT. (And that Ivey + Queens double the tuition.) Oh, and one of the most common streams of business is accounting, don't quote me on this, but I'm 99.9% sure that Ivey doesn't offer the complete courses to become a CA. (Somebody correct me if I am wrong.)

[Code of Conduct]

Although that may be true, if you are going to make the list according to price (Highest to lowest):
Ivey
Queens
UofT
Schulich

So, in the end, the most "best+affordable" university to go to would be Schulich, since it is ranked above UofT and is cheaper than UofT. (And that Ivey + Queens double the tuition.) Oh, and one of the most common streams of business is accounting, don't quote me on this, but I'm 99.9% sure that Ivey doesn't offer the complete courses to become a CA. (Somebody correct me if I am wrong.)

Previously they did not and you would most likely have to goto Queen's for the bootcamp training but now they do.

[rey1867]

Previously they did not and you would most likely have to goto Queen's for the bootcamp training but now they do.

Do you have to spend more than 2 years at Ivey to get the 51 credits ?

[Code of Conduct]

^ This I'm not too sure about. I'll ask my friend and see.

[adehbone]

Ivey students like WLU, must go back for 4months to finish up there 51 hours....aka 4 more months of chilling.