.....

[SkeptiKal12]

.

[Crisqo]

What action did you want to take?

Your insurance company is covering for your repairs as well as your medical expenses, and you don't have to pay a thing, correct?

You have rental coverage with your policy I assume, so you are able to drive while your car is in the shop for repairs.

[aznxtambOy]

What action did you want to take?

Your insurance company is covering for your repairs as well as your medical expenses, and you don't have to pay a thing, correct?

You have rental coverage with your policy I assume, so you are able to drive while your car is in the shop for repairs.

That's what I'm thinking too. If it's not your fault for the accident then you don't have to worry as everything should be covered by insurrance no?

[SkeptiKal12]

1

[thephenom]

I am concerned about the depreciation on the vehicle which I am obliged to pay for. I feel its safety, structure and performance has been compromised. And I am concerned about the long term health of us involved. What I am really asking is, is there possibility for compensation regarding these two factors.

It's a lease, you don't own the car, so the lost in value actually belongs to the leasor since residual will be even lower. On the other hand, if the car was financed, I believe you can take action to get the value adjusted. But make sure you go to a BMW approved dealer since you do have to return the lease. For the safety and structure of the car, try to find out if there are frame damage, from the looks, it doesn't look so, so it's more cosmetic more than anything. Performance? What could be affected here, it doesn't seem like it did any damage to the drivetrain or suspension.

What type of long term injuries have you or your family sustained?

If you really want to pursue the best options, go to one of those auto accident consultant.

[diamond94]

As for the personal injury aspect, depending on how much of a impact it has had on you and the passengers in your car, you can always apply for accident benefits. If you’ve been out of work for more than a week, you can get income replacement benefits. If you can’t do your general housework, you can get housekeeping benefits. This applies to both you and anyone else who may have been in the car.

Again, its dependant on how serious your injuries are and if you’ve sustained the above losses/inconvenience. If you feel you have, then you’d apply for these benefits through your insurance company (forms can be found at http://www.fsco.gov.on.ca/english/forms/autoforms/claims/). You’d fill out the first form OCF-1 to kickstart the process.

I’ve worked at a personal injury firm for a couple years so I’m familiar with these things. Doesn’t sound like your injuries are too severe though so not sure exactly the extent of your injuries and the impact it has had. But like you said, you never know down the road exactly how some injury you may not take too seriously right now, keeps deteriorating and turns into something serious.

So think about it. You don’t have to go through a lawyer to get the Accident Benefits and can do it yourself. But, it would help to have representation when they start screwing you around and withholding benefits.

[Tomy]

what if op wanted to buy back the car in the first place..

now he lost half the value if he buybacks at the "agreed" price.. from what you're saying.. the contract's residual value will significantly decrease since the accident occurred?

actually on a side note... it sucks to get into an accident if the car isn't written off.. since regardless of lease/finance/100% owned.. ur left with a car that's half in value.. when you're not the one who caused the accident.

that's gonna suck.

It's a lease, you don't own the car, so the lost in value actually belongs to the leasor since residual will be even lower. On the other hand, if the car was financed, I believe you can take action to get the value adjusted. But make sure you go to a BMW approved dealer since you do have to return the lease. For the safety and structure of the car, try to find out if there are frame damage, from the looks, it doesn't look so, so it's more cosmetic more than anything. Performance? What could be affected here, it doesn't seem like it did any damage to the drivetrain or suspension.

What type of long term injuries have you or your family sustained?

If you really want to pursue the best options, go to one of those auto accident consultant.

[BartBandy]

On May 8th my family and I were involved, in what I would consider, a major car accident.

The picture says it was a minor accident. Your rear quarter panel, rear bumper, and trunk lid are all a bit mangled, your rear window is now pretty gravel, and your taillight is broken. There is probably a little bit of damage below the surface as well. I can believe it's still $16K in damage, but it's still a minor accident.



Shortly after the police showed up, my mom left to see a doctor while I remained to take care of what had happened. To this day I still feel pain in my neck from the impact.

Really? From that? You have a very good head restraint on a 335i. Very supportive seats. I'm not calling you a "liar", but I'm skeptical. "Fragile", if nothing else.

You didn't mention the airbags, and I don't see any in the picture. I assume they didn't discharge. You have 2-stage airbags in that newish 335i, and they didn't even discharge at the lowest setting.

I mean, in terms of impacts and g-forces, you can do much worse in typical jostling on a go-kart track.



The estimated damage to the car is $16,000 and as far as I know it is going to be repaired. Since the car is a lease I was told that I have no option but to remain making the monthly payments while they fix the car to working order. I feel unsafe driving it now even if they do fix it, and the car will never be the same again.

Life is not fair and I understand that but I wanted to ask the opinion of the members on what I should do (and can do) to try and remedy this situation so I don't end up losing big in the end? The car's value has obviously been impacted greatly (BMW 335) and as far as I know I am still forced to pay the same price for it. Me and my mom have missed work, lost sleep, are/were in pain and lost time because of this and we did absolutely nothing wrong.

"Forced"? Did BMW Canada rear-end you? Of course you have to keep making payments on it, and of course it is going to be repaired. That's the insurance company's call, and $16K is a lot less than a new 335i. Again, that's a minor collision. It's bodywork. I'd be shocked if the frame was bent in any way. It will drive fine. It probably drives fine right now. A bit loud with the missing rear window, but you can call it a quasi-convertible.

Be glad you're leasing it - you can walk away. BMWs usually don't make for great lease buyouts. The residuals are high.

As for your pain, lost sleep and missed work...



I am willing to take any legal action I can.

You were leasing a 335i. And you're asking for legal advice on RFD. What's wrong with this picture?

[SkeptiKal12]

2

[SkeptiKal12]

3

[thephenom]

what if op wanted to buy back the car in the first place..

now he lost half the value if he buybacks at the "agreed" price.. from what you're saying.. the contract's residual value will significantly decrease since the accident occurred?

actually on a side note... it sucks to get into an accident if the car isn't written off.. since regardless of lease/finance/100% owned.. ur left with a car that's half in value.. when you're not the one who caused the accident.

that's gonna suck.
Insurance only guarantees the work to bring the vehicle back to its original shape. If everything is not fixed, ie safety, structure, parts fitment, performance, then they have to do it right again. From that sense, you are getting back a car that is in mint condition. The rest is in your head.

The real loss comes in when one try to sell the vehicle because buyers tend to pay less for a vehicle involved in an accident even if it's repaired to a full 100%. As a lessee, you don't bear this loss since you're driving a vehicle good as new. Upon the end of the lease, you could give it back to the lease company without any monetary loss incurred.

I know it sounds like you got shafted, but that's how it goes. If you own the vehicle, then I think you can probably file a diminished value claim. I've read it online before, some states in the US require insurance company to compensate the lease company for the loss, but if you buy it back, you get the credit. So it might be worthwhile to see if the insurance company offers this.

If the OP wants to buy it back, which he doesn't, he can probably work out a deal with BMW Canada too.

[thephenom]

It'd be hard to guestimate the extend of the damage from just a picture. The rear passenger door couldn't be opened and was actually shifted rotationally from the impact, which lead me to estimate that a major repair was needed. $16,000 would cover more then just trunk and bumper replacement.

Long term injuries can't be determined acutely.... so who knows how my back will feel 1 or 2 years down the road.

I would obviously return the car at lease end (if the decision to keep making payments is made) but fear what they might say when I do turn it in.

What does it mean when you say it shifted "rotationally"? Your door can't open probably because the rear quarter panel is jammed into it.

$16k isn't all that much considering the price of OE BMW parts and professional labour. Just paint alone on BMW are expensive since they have an insane amount of colour coating on the cars. And for your rear quarter panel, that trim goes all the way to the front door. There are still the trunk wall lining they got to fix. I'm just saying, for 16k, it's probably not sub-frame damage. It could be, but probably not.

The only way out from making payments is to get someone to takeover your lease, or take a penalty to return the car early. It's not BMW's fault you got into accident even not at fault, much like it's not their fault if someone has to leave the country for work and want to turn the car in. That's why you take the car to the BMW-approved body shop to get the work done. You should call up the lease company and ask for such. Then they can't complain about the car not being "in-shape".

[D-3vil]

You didn't mention the airbags, and I don't see any in the picture. I assume they didn't discharge. You have 2-stage airbags in that newish 335i, and they didn't even discharge at the lowest setting.

I don't think airbags are supposed to deploy when hit from the back ...

[Tomy]

I know it sounds like you got shafted, but that's how it goes. If you own the vehicle, then I think you can probably file a diminished value claim. I've read it online before, some states in the US require insurance company to compensate the lease company for the loss, but if you buy it back, you get the credit. So it might be worthwhile to see if the insurance company offers this.


that's good to know for future ref.. can anyone expand more info on this....

[thephenom]

that's good to know for future ref.. can anyone expand more info on this....

Might want to inquire about it with your insurance agent next time you meet with them since I haven't seen anything related on the CDN side.

[ChrisBa]

unless i am really reading this wrong, it seems like the OP is trying to take advantage of this situation..

im very confused as to why legal action is required when it doesnt even seem like the insurance company has gotten involved yet..


most people would wait for the insurance company to do there thing and come back and refuse something for someone to consider legal action or whatever...

[BartBandy]

most people would wait for the insurance company to do there thing and come back and refuse something for someone to consider legal action or whatever...

Not at RFD. Here, we look at litigious avenues first.

[BartBandy]

I am the consequence of someone else's careless actions....
Look, I don't care how drunk your father got your mother that night.


...and am trying to acquire as much knowledge to defend myself financially, legally and medically. I believe I have a right to.

I am just collecting as much information as possible, yes even on RFD and yes even with a BMW...
RFD is a crappy source of good advice on anything legal or mechanical. Everyone here seems to know exactly how to proceed with any situation, education and personal experience be damned. Coming here for advice is worse than going into court armed with an afternoon of watching "Judge Judy".

[SkeptiKal12]

Look, I don't care how drunk your father got your mother that night.



RFD is a crappy source of good advice on anything legal or mechanical. Everyone here seems to know exactly how to proceed with any situation, education and personal experience be damned. Coming here for advice is worse than going into court armed with an afternoon of watching "Judge Judy".

I'll lease you a BMW so you won't be quite so pissed.


Thanks for the input.

[pintobean]

I am the consequence of someone else's careless actions....

Look, I don't care how drunk your father got your mother that night.
Damn BartBandy...did someone pee in your cereal this morning?
There's no need to be such an obnoxious jerk :mad:



I think the OP may have worded his questions a little poorly and is now getting attacked for that...I don't think that's fair. Please step back and look at it from the OP's position before passing judgement on him.

For his sake, I will try and rephrase his question for those that don't understand what he meant...

Let's suppose for a minute that the OP made a $10,000 down payment on the car.
In addition to that, let's assume that he is making payments of $500/month for a 5 year lease term.
Finally, let's assume that the buy-out amount at the end of his lease is $20,000.

So what the OP is concerned about is that at the end of the 5 year lease term he will have paid $40,000 towards that car and his only options will be to give it back and walk away, or to pay $20,000 and keep it.

The OP's dillemma here is that due to the accident, the value of the car at lease end will probably be much less than the $20,000 buy-out price. And as a result of this, everyone is telling him to just return the car and walk away. What they are not considering is that if he does this, he will then be left with absolutely nothing to show for the $40,000 that he paid into the car for 5 years.

So the OP is asking if anyone has any suggestions as to what he could do in this case. Is there any way for him or BMW to be compensated for the loss in value so that he can pay less than $20,000 and still keep the car?

If anyone has an answer to this, please share it here.

Thanks.

[cwb27]

LOL, OP, you edited all your posts out... But everyone quoted you?? Spitting into the wind I see..

[thephenom]

Damn BartBandy...did someone pee in your cereal this morning?
There's no need to be such an obnoxious jerk :mad:



I think the OP may have worded his questions a little poorly and is now getting attacked for that...I don't think that's fair. Please step back and look at it from the OP's position before passing judgement on him.

For his sake, I will try and rephrase his question for those that don't understand what he meant...

Let's suppose for a minute that the OP made a $10,000 down payment on the car.
In addition to that, let's assume that he is making payments of $500/month for a 5 year lease term.
Finally, let's assume that the buy-out amount at the end of his lease is $20,000.

So what the OP is concerned about is that at the end of the 5 year lease term he will have paid $40,000 towards that car and his only options will be to give it back and walk away, or to pay $20,000 and keep it.

The OP's dillemma here is that due to the accident, the value of the car at lease end will probably be much less than the $20,000 buy-out price. And as a result of this, everyone is telling him to just return the car and walk away. What they are not considering is that if he does this, he will then be left with absolutely nothing to show for the $40,000 that he paid into the car for 5 years.

So the OP is asking if anyone has any suggestions as to what he could do in this case. Is there any way for him or BMW to be compensated for the loss in value so that he can pay less than $20,000 and still keep the car?

If anyone has an answer to this, please share it here.

Thanks.
If he feels "ripped" off pouring $40k into a car and walk away with nothing, then he chose the wrong option since that's what a lease essentially is. Pay your share of usage and depreciation.

And the answer has been posted here:
http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6831465&postcount=11

Essentially saying, in the US, there are some states that has diminished value claims, but that only applies to the OWNER of the car. If it's a lease, the lease company gets compensated since they are stuck with a lower resale.

[BartBandy]

Damn BartBandy...did someone pee in your cereal this morning?
There's no need to be such an obnoxious jerk :mad:
Not that I'm aware. The skim milk wasn't the tastiest, however.



I think the OP may have worded his questions a little poorly and is now getting attacked for that...I don't think that's fair. Please step back and look at it from the OP's position before passing judgement on him.

For his sake, I will try and rephrase his question for those that don't understand what he meant...

Let's suppose for a minute that the OP made a $10,000 down payment on the car.
In addition to that, let's assume that he is making payments of $500/month for a 5 year lease term.
Finally, let's assume that the buy-out amount at the end of his lease is $20,000.
I see where you're going with this, but you can make the hypothetical much more simple by supposing the OP owns the car.


So what the OP is concerned about is that at the end of the 5 year lease term he will have paid $40,000 towards that car and his only options will be to give it back and walk away, or to pay $20,000 and keep it.

The OP's dillemma here is that due to the accident, the value of the car at lease end will probably be much less than the $20,000 buy-out price. And as a result of this, everyone is telling him to just return the car and walk away. What they are not considering is that if he does this, he will then be left with absolutely nothing to show for the $40,000 that he paid into the car for 5 years.
Consider my better example - that the OP owns the car. Now what? Insurance pays for repairs, doctors treat the injuries, and insurance deals with the injuries with the help of lawyers.

The car is fixed and worth less on the open market, but that's how it always is. Just because this is a lease doesn't change anything. In fact, the OP is better off than if he/she owned the car, because they can walk away. Unless that neck injury flares up.


So the OP is asking if anyone has any suggestions as to what he could do in this case. Is there any way for him or BMW to be compensated for the loss in value so that he can pay less than $20,000 and still keep the car?
Quick answer - call BMW. They may laugh at you, but they will at least laugh in a German accent.

Look, the OP was focusing on his/her injuries, talking about legal options, and calling this a major collision. That's an insult to anyone who has been in a major collision. This is an issue to be dealt with through insurance, and lawyers only if it comes to that. I have a difficult time trusting anyone whose thoughts go to legal action within hours of a collision.

And now I see the OP has cut and run, editing out the original post and picture. My guess is he/she found a lawyer, told the lawyer about the thread, and the lawyer told her to kybosh it pronto. The last thing you need is a thread highlighting your litigious intentions wandering around the internet.