Nikon D1X or D200?

[sfu_engineer]

Hey fellow RFD photographers,

I have the chance to acquire a used Nikon D1X for a low price of around $450 and was wondering if that would be a decent upgrade to my Nikon D200. I realize that the D200 is a lot newer and probably has better features. But I really like the "pro" level body of the D1X, generally shoot "studio-ish" portraits and use low ISO, prefer the 1/500th of a second flash sync compared to 1/250th, and would also get the difference in cash between selling a D200 and grip to be used on more LENS!

I normally shoot people photography and use either studio flash systems or off camera Nikon SB-25's/26's speedlights on manual so I wouldn't miss i-TTL at all. Usually would be using low ISO so the slightly(?) higher noise wouldn't be too bad for me.

Can anyone who has used either the D1X and/or the D200 comment on them?

Thanks!

[KorruptioN]

The only worthwhile thing I can see on that D1X is the 1/500 flash sync... otherwise you're stepping down to slower performance, lousy high-ISO performance (not an issue for you, I guess), and poorer battery life. How's the condition?

[craftsman]

One of the big things is that the D1X is two generations out. Check out this comparison with the D2X - http://www.millhouse.nl/d2x.html. Given that the D200 has a lot of the improvements that the D2X has over the D1x (like comparing the D100 to the D200), you might want to stick with the D200...

[CSAgent]

Why do you even need 1/500 flash sync? Surely you're not using hotshoe flash in the studio right?

[2000fordfocus]

In studio environment, 1/500s will not give you much benefit! Assuming you a using 100% strobe and 0% ambient... In such case, even 1/10s sync is enough to freeze the fastest object.

ISO 100 or lower is like to have through... but is no deal breaker!

[rubberband]

Keep your D200. It outperforms the D1x in virtually every way.

Or feel free to sell it to me at a fantastic discount.. I'm thinking of the same order as that ~$100 18-70 you sold a while ago. Yeah, that's the ticket. :lol:

[AirTimid]

In a studio, the D1X would probably still be fine. Don't forget, you can get a 10mp interpolated file because of the funky pixel shape. I just sold my D1X for the D200. I miss the D1x, but I do think the D200 is an upgrade. As for the slower performance comment, that doesn't seem to matter in your case, d1x is 3FPS while D200 is 5FPS. D1X does focus faster (cam1300 vs cam1100) in most situations. I think the D200 may be better in low light focusing, and produces a less noisy file, probably about a half to full stop better ISO. I think the best thing you could do, if you can, is to take a couple of raw pics with the D1X, play with the file and compare it to similar pics taken with the D200. I will admit, the D200 produces a cleaner file, but the D1X has more character. There is just something about the D1X images I like. Some call it more film like, I don't know. I also don't know the type of photographer you are. Some people love the ultra plastic look and hate any hint of grain/noise, while others think noise/grain add character. I fall somewhere in the middle. Hope this helps.

Elroy

PS if you have a lot of older screw driven lenses, the D1X will definitely focus those faster. I've heard the D1X has the strongest motor of all the nikon DSLR's. Also, the D1X built quality stomps the D200 like a red headed step child. Battery life is kinda bad, but if you don't chimp much, you can probalby get about 300 RAW files on a charge. D1X after market batteries are cheap and perform better than the Nikon branded ones.

[sfu_engineer]

In a studio, the D1X would probably still be fine. Don't forget, you can get a 10mp interpolated file because of the funky pixel shape. I just sold my D1X for the D200. I miss the D1x, but I do think the D200 is an upgrade. As for the slower performance comment, that doesn't seem to matter in your case, d1x is 3FPS while D200 is 5FPS. D1X does focus faster (cam1300 vs cam1100) in most situations. I think the D200 may be better in low light focusing, and produces a less noisy file, probably about a half to full stop better ISO. I think the best thing you could do, if you can, is to take a couple of raw pics with the D1X, play with the file and compare it to similar pics taken with the D200. I will admit, the D200 produces a cleaner file, but the D1X has more character. There is just something about the D1X images I like. Some call it more film like, I don't know. I also don't know the type of photographer you are. Some people love the ultra plastic look and hate any hint of grain/noise, while others think noise/grain add character. I fall somewhere in the middle. Hope this helps.

Elroy

PS if you have a lot of older screw driven lenses, the D1X will definitely focus those faster. I've heard the D1X has the strongest motor of all the nikon DSLR's. Also, the D1X built quality stomps the D200 like a red headed step child. Battery life is kinda bad, but if you don't chimp much, you can probalby get about 300 RAW files on a charge. D1X after market batteries are cheap and perform better than the Nikon branded ones.

I found a good article here that discusses the D1X vs D50/D70/D200 here:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/readflat.asp?forum=1021&thread=18213188&page=1

It also takes about the "film like quality" and the faster screwtype lens focusing.

Keep your D200. It outperforms the D1x in virtually every way.

Or feel free to sell it to me at a fantastic discount.. I'm thinking of the same order as that ~$100 18-70 you sold a while ago. Yeah, that's the ticket. :lol:

You will be first to know if I end up selling it! ;-) I was surprised how difficult it was to sell that quality kit lens. I got rid of it to get another lens and am surprised how much I miss AF-S and it's fast and silent focusing.

In studio environment, 1/500s will not give you much benefit! Assuming you a using 100% strobe and 0% ambient... In such case, even 1/10s sync is enough to freeze the fastest object.

ISO 100 or lower is like to have through... but is no deal breaker!

Why do you even need 1/500 flash sync? Surely you're not using hotshoe flash in the studio right?

Hey 2000fordfocus/CSAgent. The 1/500th of a second flash sync is great for hotshoe flash outdoors. I recently did a photoshoot outdoors with a couple off camera flashes as well as a long 80-200mm F2.8 lens. Perhaps it is me and how I am not used to this lens but sometimes I thought the 1/250th shutter speed I had was not enough to handhold the "beast". Also 1/500th would hopefully be able to darken the background more while keeping the subject lit as I personally like that style more. The only way I can do that now is with a smaller aperture but that means I would need to fire my flash at higher output levels causing waste of batteries and refresh time. I do agree with you and 2000fordfocus that 1/500th flash sync in a studio is not as useful though.

I find outdoor portraiture more dynamic and fun than in studio stuff. Here are some photos taken at the University of Toronto campus in -10 C weather last week that show the basic premise of my people photography:

http://iconphoto.ca/photos/demetri/SFU_5307_original_edited_edited.jpg

http://iconphoto.ca/photos/demetri/SFU_5314_original_edited_edited.jpg

http://iconphoto.ca/photos/demetri/SFU_5358_original_edited_edited.jpg

[CSAgent]

Spencer, have you used reflectors before? Using under corridors for portraits is a great idea as it provides a soft diffused light environment - and you can use reflectors to catch the sunlight and lift shadows (under the eyes esp.) without using a flash.

I primarily use a flash in outdoor portraits when I want to add a catchlight in the eyes without Photoshop (which I see is lacking from the ones you took, some constructive criticism there for you.)

You don't really need 1/500 sync to handle the telephoto lense, just mount it on a tripod with its collar? Batteries are a dime a dozen these days so that should not even be a factor, I carry 2 sets, quad AAs of rechargeable with me on all my shoots and I walk away from the shoot with the second set half used only. If I need more, I have another 2 set of Energizer Lithiums as backup. I bought the ones I have now in the Energizer back in October. I've shot 4-5k images since then and I still haven't opened them yet.

Some things for you to think about if you're basing your purchase around syncing and flash disposables. ;) Besides, for portraits, are your subjects moving around at an incredibly fast speed that you need to sync them at 1/500th? Just lower the ISO to 100 or 50, bump up the flash exposure bracketing and at F2.8, its more than wide enough to capture all the light!

[sfu_engineer]

Keep your D200. It outperforms the D1x in virtually every way.

Or feel free to sell it to me at a fantastic discount.. I'm thinking of the same order as that ~$100 18-70 you sold a while ago. Yeah, that's the ticket. :lol:

I am selling the D200 now in a package with extra batteries, grip, and 30gb photobank! Hopefully moving on to a D2X... hopefully.


Spencer, have you used reflectors before? Using under corridors for portraits is a great idea as it provides a soft diffused light environment - and you can use reflectors to catch the sunlight and lift shadows (under the eyes esp.) without using a flash.

I primarily use a flash in outdoor portraits when I want to add a catchlight in the eyes without Photoshop (which I see is lacking from the ones you took, some constructive criticism there for you.)

You don't really need 1/500 sync to handle the telephoto lense, just mount it on a tripod with its collar? Batteries are a dime a dozen these days so that should not even be a factor, I carry 2 sets, quad AAs of rechargeable with me on all my shoots and I walk away from the shoot with the second set half used only. If I need more, I have another 2 set of Energizer Lithiums as backup. I bought the ones I have now in the Energizer back in October. I've shot 4-5k images since then and I still haven't opened them yet.

Some things for you to think about if you're basing your purchase around syncing and flash disposables. ;) Besides, for portraits, are your subjects moving around at an incredibly fast speed that you need to sync them at 1/500th? Just lower the ISO to 100 or 50, bump up the flash exposure bracketing and at F2.8, its more than wide enough to capture all the light!

I have thought of reflectors but I find it harder to hold them than flashes on a lightstand. To get the right angles with reflectors I need to sucker my girlfriend or sister into holding them for me and boy is that hard.

Again I realize I have failed to capture those catchlights in the eyes, they ALWAYS seem to allude me! :(

The D1X actually has a electronic shutter allowing it to go up to INFINITE flash sync speeds when firing flashes from your PC-sync. Just like the D50 it can go 1/1000 and up with ease! This would be amazing for creative compositions outside when you want to use F2.8 AND flash outdoors and aren't stuck with using smaller apertures like F8-F22.

Regarding not wanting to fire flashes at 1/1 full power it isn't just because of battery life but also recharge time. It really sucks to have to wait up to 7 seconds between shots when doing a portrait session as sometimes a pose or moment appears that will dissappear if the model and photographer have to wait.

[CSAgent]

See, this is why you go Canon - our 580EX Mk II recharges uber fast. It also has a built in catchlight reflector. ;) Hahahahaha...

They sell reflector holders when you don't have an assistant, or just prop it up against a rock, or a tree, or a chair. Quit making excuses to not use a reflector! :razz: :cheesygri

[sfu_engineer]

See, this is why you go Canon - our 580EX Mk II recharges uber fast. It also has a built in catchlight reflector. ;) Hahahahaha...

They sell reflector holders when you don't have an assistant, or just prop it up against a rock, or a tree, or a chair. Quit making excuses to not use a reflector! :razz: :cheesygri

I think all the Nikon flashes have the built in catchlight reflector. At least on the SB800, SB25, and SB26 which I have used.

And .. why is it you are now selling your Canon 5D to get a piece of the Nikon action eh??? :D

[2000fordfocus]

Some things for you to think about if you're basing your purchase around syncing and flash disposables. ;) Besides, for portraits, are your subjects moving around at an incredibly fast speed that you need to sync them at 1/500th? Just lower the ISO to 100 or 50, bump up the flash exposure bracketing and at F2.8, its more than wide enough to capture all the light!

Hey CSAgent, you just remind me that I hate my D50 ISO settings! Whenever the sun is all out and with D50's ISO 200, even at 1/500s sync, I can't use any of my fast lens at large aperture, say f2.8~~ if only i have iso 50 and 1/500s sync... I guess I should look for a shade next time~

1/500s sync is very useful indeed! I did a outdoor wedding once using only 1/500s at iso200! all the shoot were meter at like f10 and above!

[sfu_engineer]

Hey CSAgent, you just remind me that I hate my D50 ISO settings! Whenever the sun is all out and with D50's ISO 200, even at 1/500s sync, I can't use any of my fast lens at large aperture, say f2.8~~ if only i have iso 50 and 1/500s sync... I guess I should look for a shade next time~

1/500s sync is very useful indeed! I did a outdoor wedding once using only 1/500s at iso200! all the shoot were meter at like f10 and above!

I think if you connect your flash with a PC-sync cable or some non-TTL method you can get your flash sync even higher than 1/500!

Read the Strobist article here:
http://strobist.blogspot.com/2007/05/hacking-your-cameras-sync-speed-pt-1.html

Here is an excerpt from the article:
Back to the D70s, here is how to fake out the sync. It couldn't be simpler: All you have to do is make the camera think there is not a flash connected. Then it will not arbitrarily limit your shutter to it's nominal sync speed of 1/500th of a second, which is a pretty good sync speed to start with.

As long as there is not a TTL-capable flash connected to the camera - either on the hot shoe or with a TTL cord - you are good to go. So, if you are using a Pocket Wizard or a sync cord, your flash will sync above 1/500th.

This is one case where a PC cord trumps trumps the PW, as the electronics inside a PW will slow down the upper limit on this trick. But even with the Pocket Wizards, I can sync well above 1/1000th of a sec. I do not know if this will work with a Gadget Infinity remote. (It probably won't.) But I know it will work with a PC cord (and a required hot shoe adaptor in the case of a D70s.)

[sfu_engineer]

Also due to financial difficulties I am pretty much for sure getting a D1X now! I am super excited though as I feel like using an older body will make me develop my technique better.

I am a poor unemployed student. Someone please buy my Nikon D200 so I don't have to eat anymore instant noodles.

[rubberband]

Also due to financial difficulties I am pretty much for sure getting a D1X now! I am super excited though as I feel like using an older body will make me develop my technique better.

I am a poor unemployed student. Someone please buy my Nikon D200 so I don't have to eat anymore instant noodles.

$1k for a D200 w/ grip, 2x batteries and an 8GB cf card is amazing. You'll sell it real quick. I'd buy it but I think if a D200 appeared next to the D80, D50 and F90x I'd be sleeping on the couch for the foreseeable future. :|

I'll go away and see if I can find a buyer for a few bits of kit I don't use much any more. Maybe if it's still for sale afterwards it was meant to be.