Mandatory Winter Tires in Quebec as of 15th Nov 2008

[imoo2u]

Quebec motorists will be required to swap their summer tires for winter ones starting next winter, under a provincial law passed yesterday. As of Nov. 15, 2008, drivers will have to equip their vehicles with snow tires from that day each year through to April 15.

http://www.cbc.ca/consumer/story/2007/12/20/quebec-snowtires.html

If all-season tires are not allowed, then man!!! $h@t all the way to those Quebec provincial govt for non-consultations as far as I know that they didn't tell/inform or leak whatever they want to enact. Guess have to spend more $$ changing all tires to winter ones and then back to 'normal' ones. The tire business people must be happy esp tire installers are damn happy for they will charge more $$ when seasons kick-in.

IMO, what's waste of $$ overall. One should use common sense and be more extra careful driving esp in winters. I always drive carefully on the roads everytime no matter what seasons and keep eyes open/look out/distance for those 'reckless' motorists and pedestrians who never learn how to 'behave'. Some even never learn from mistakes .. they ought be banneded for good.

[najibs]

IMO, what's waste of $$ overall. One should use common sense and be more extra careful driving esp in winters.

Clearly you DONT have common sense if you're using summer tires in snow.

The money spent is peanuts compared to the amount of money that will be saved on fender benders because of people who don't bother changing their tires. Doesn't matter how much common sense or driving skill you have. If you use the wrong tires you ARE more vulnerable to get into an accident. That's a fact.

Race car drivers don't use slick tires in rain do they? Even though they have a lot of driving skill, they STILL put on rain tires for when it rains for their OWN safety AND the safety of the OTHERS on the track. Common sense.

[boxingday]

Quebec motorists will be required to swap their summer tires for winter ones starting next winter, under a provincial law passed yesterday. As of Nov. 15, 2008, drivers will have to equip their vehicles with snow tires from that day each year through to April 15.

http://www.cbc.ca/consumer/story/2007/12/20/quebec-snowtires.html

If all-season tires are not allowed, then man!!! $h@t all the way to those Quebec provincial govt for non-consultations as far as I know that they didn't tell/inform or leak whatever they want to enact. Guess have to spend more $$ changing all tires to winter ones and then back to 'normal' ones. The tire business people must be happy esp tire installers are damn happy for they will charge more $$ when seasons kick-in.

IMO, what's waste of $$ overall. One should use common sense and be more extra careful driving esp in winters. I always drive carefully on the roads everytime no matter what seasons and keep eyes open/look out/distance for those 'reckless' motorists and pedestrians who never learn how to 'behave'. Some even never learn from mistakes .. they ought be banneded for good.

You could be extra careful with summer tires in snow it will not make any defference.Some would even say your beeing reckess useing summer tires.

[bionicbadger]

I'd be in favour of other provinces requiring this too.

[imoo2u]

BTW, I use ALL-SEASON tires. This set should be pretty good instead of 2 separate sets (and eco-friendly ie less tires). On top, I make sure my AS tires have visible threads and in good condition. I have and still driving on all-season wheels since I got my first car. One just has to be more careful driving no matter what on the road not like some road users for they think that they are 'kings' or queens' of the road.

[mart242]

all-season = NO season. Winter tires are much better.

I hope all other provinces that get lots of snow do the same.

[Firebot]

BTW, I use ALL-SEASON tires. This set should be pretty good instead of 2 separate sets (and eco-friendly ie less tires). On top, I make sure my AS tires have visible threads and in good condition. I have and still driving on all-season wheels since I got my first car. One just has to be more careful driving no matter what on the road not like some road users for they think that they are 'kings' or queens' of the road.

All-Season tires are useless in snow, even worse if you think they offer an extra safety cushion when they don't.

http://www.bchighway.com/myvehicle/allseasonsnowtires.html

http://www.cbc.ca/consumers/market/files/cars/tires/index.html

[mart242]

Wow. quebec is also banning cell phones use in car! I'm sure their accident rates will drop due to winter tires + no cell phones. Come on Ontario, do the same!

[mlc2000]

This from the same province that has mandated that gas station fill in a report everytime they want to raise the price of fuel and must give the reason for the increase. Brilliant !

Why can't the feds do this stuff?

I've been say for year that winter tires should be mandatory here.
If not, u should get a break on your insurance for using winter tires.

[bokep]

great move, i hope other provinces follow.

[hugh_da_man]

I think they should also require a winter and summer driver's license. You should be required to receive both winter and summer driving instruction and you should be required to pass a test driving under winter conditions.

Most of the accidents I see have nothing to do with the tires and more to do with the terrible drivers.

[NLI10D]

so how does this affect those motorist on Nokian WRs?

[circa76]

hmm.. I'm going to be driving into Montreal and Quebec city close to New Years time.

This shouldn't apply to me since my plates will read Ontario, but I'm not all that convinced that the Quebec cops will care... this could get interesting.

[hugh_da_man]

hmm.. I'm going to be driving into Montreal and Quebec city close to New Years time.

This shouldn't apply to me since my plates will read Ontario, but I'm not all that convinced that the Quebec cops will care... this could get interesting.

You're screwed...just remember to yell "Don't taze me bro!".

[imoo2u]

I think they should also require a winter and summer driver's license. You should be required to receive both winter and summer driving instruction and you should be required to pass a test driving under winter conditions.

Most of the accidents I see have nothing to do with the tires and more to do with the terrible drivers.

+1 It is always the person behind the wheel. Accidents are caused by careless person(s), not the vehicles or tires used.

[circa76]

You're screwed...just remember to yell "Don't taze me bro!".

damnit, I'm going to have 3 other people with me.. if any cop pulls me over.. the video taping starts!

If I kick the bucket after being tazed, hopefully the video makes it as evidence!

[hugh_da_man]

damnit, I'm going to have 3 other people with me.. if any cop pulls me over.. the video taping starts!

If I kick the bucket after being tazed, hopefully the video makes it as evidence!

You'll have your 15 minutes of YouTube fame. Hopefully you speak french as well or else they'll have good reason to taze you.

[dark169]

If your going to have the state subsidize your insurance you have to expect the state to force insurance claim saving measures onto the people. Never mind the sales tax generated...

[Firebot]

+1 It is always the person behind the wheel. Accidents are caused by careless person(s), not the vehicles or tires used.

I agree to a point, but I would categorize a person driving with faulty breaks, or all-season tires in the dead of winter as such a careless person.

[hugh_da_man]

I agree to a point, but I would categorize a person driving with faulty breaks, or all-season tires in the dead of winter as such a careless person.

When do the faulty brake inspections start? I hadn't heard about that one.

[ronny1980]

I doubt they will enforce it unless you get into an accident and the cop sees you without winter tires.

Its pretty damn hard to spot winter tires in the thick of snow.

[Ebola]

I give this thumbs down.


All that's going to happen is people are going to think they are even more impervious to winter weather, and drive worse.

Just like people in 4 x 4's.

It's the way you drive. You can't stop on a dime when there is 2 inches of snow on the road.

All season or winter tires... between the two there isn't much difference as long as they are in good shape.

[Jin-n-Juice]

hmm.. I'm going to be driving into Montreal and Quebec city close to New Years time.

This shouldn't apply to me since my plates will read Ontario, but I'm not all that convinced that the Quebec cops will care... this could get interesting.

Effective Nov 15, 2008.

[JAC]

All-Season tires are useless in snow, even worse if you think they offer an extra safety cushion when they don't.

http://www.bchighway.com/myvehicle/allseasonsnowtires.html

http://www.cbc.ca/consumers/market/files/cars/tires/index.html

Balls. My AS do just fine in snow.

[ronny1980]

They should do a study to see who are more likely to get involved in an accident, those with or without winter tires.

This kinda parallels with the study re: people with the driver's ED certificate get into more accidents.

[circa76]

Effective Nov 15, 2008.

Damn... misread the title! :lol:

oh well, I'm a little more at ease now

[cipher]

From the article, it seems like they just want to prevent people from using SUMMER tires in the winter. I think they will allow all-season tires in the winter.

[effie]

I wonder if this will mean that the price of winter tires will go up now.

[Menace]

Make sure you put it on youtube.com.

Thanks bro ;)

damnit, I'm going to have 3 other people with me.. if any cop pulls me over.. the video taping starts!

If I kick the bucket after being tazed, hopefully the video makes it as evidence!

[boxingday]

I give this thumbs down.


All that's going to happen is people are going to think they are even more impervious to winter weather, and drive worse.

Just like people in 4 x 4's.

It's the way you drive. You can't stop on a dime when there is 2 inches of snow on the road.

All season or winter tires... between the two there isn't much difference as long as they are in good shape.

Its does have some to do with what type of tires you have.People with summer tires are just asking for trouble.

[Jin-n-Juice]

Damn... misread the title! :lol:

oh well, I'm a little more at ease now

I still think you should put on your winters though! :)

[Quick_lude]

Balls. My AS do just fine in snow.

I'll bet you my winters will do better.
There have been countless tests on how winter tires outperform AS tires in the snow/slush/ice etc, I'm surprised people still dispute this. :shrug:

Even if your stopping distance is reduced by 2 feet, that can be a difference between a collision or you driving home safely.

[TenzoR]

All season or winter tires... between the two there isn't much difference as long as they are in good shape.

Granted, it's the driver that counts the most but to say there isn't much difference is just pure ignorance ..

http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/safety/topics/wintertires.htm

[mart242]

Even if your stopping distance is reduced by 2 feet, that can be a difference between a collision or you driving home safely.

It's reduced by way more than 2 feet! The nay sayers will always be saying "but I'll leave more room between my car and the car in front of me"...

[gill2k]

I'm surprised this is not mandatory in Manitoba.

[tkyoshi]

so how does this affect those motorist on Nokian WRs?

It has a snowflake symbol meaning it's certified for severe winter conditions making it an approved winter tire. So this won't affect them at all.

[JAGpilot]

With the increase of FWD cars the need for snow tires is not a necessity. If you drive carefully when the roads are very snowy/icy you will be fine. The thing I find more stupid are people who drive RWD cars in places were we get snow. Most people I see stuck in snow have their rear tires spinning. It is STUPID to buy a RWD car in provinces that get snow. The main weight of the car (engine) is on the front wheels and that is where you need to have the power at the wheels for the best traction.

[IoannI]

I think this law is kinda silly. Honestly, why should they force one to change their tires if that person doesn't want to? They shouldn't. Some people buy all season tires so they are not changing there tire every few months. What about the people who can't afford to just buy a new set of tires?

[t_garp]

Props to Quebec on this one. You wouldn't believe the number of accidents and deaths that could have been prevented if people just had winter tires on their car.

Yes, it sucks upfront to have to pay $350-800 for a second set of tires, but I'd rather you have them than see you cheap ass sliding through an intersection and T-Boning me!!!!

Winter tires should be a safety think and people should be incented to get them, sorta like getting an anti-theft immobilizer installed on your car, you should get an insurance rebate as you are safer.

[najibs]

I think this law is kinda silly. Honestly, why should they force one to change their tires if that person doesn't want to? They shouldn't.

Then they shouldn't be driving because they're a hazard on the road and are endangering other peoples lives!

Some people buy all season tires so they are not changing there tire every few months.

All season tires are useless in snow. They're a bit better than summer tires, but still useless in snow.

What about the people who can't afford to just buy a new set of tires?

HAHAHAHAHA!!!! If you cannot afford tires, then you shouldn't own a car in the first place! That's like saying "what about people who can't afford an oil change?"

Ionanni...with all due respect, your excuses and reasoning are simply pathetic!

[mart242]

With the increase of FWD cars the need for snow tires is not a necessity. If you drive carefully when the roads are very snowy/icy you will be fine. The thing I find more stupid are people who drive RWD cars in places were we get snow. Most people I see stuck in snow have their rear tires spinning. It is STUPID to buy a RWD car in provinces that get snow. The main weight of the car (engine) is on the front wheels and that is where you need to have the power at the wheels for the best traction.

Yeah, we all know that in winter, the main problem is accelerating.. braking isn't important at all..

[IoannI]

Ionanni...with all due respect, your excuses and reasoning are simply pathetic!

What excuses are you talking about? And why is my reasoning pathetic? I think you guys are pathetic honestly. And honestly, think about what I said. A lot of people put on all season tires either because they want a tire that can do for both seasons or because they have more important things to worry about then chaning their tires to winter tires.

[najibs]

What excuses are you talking about? And why is my reasoning pathetic? I think you guys are pathetic honestly. And honestly, think about what I said. A lot of people put on all season tires either because they want a tire that can do for both seasons or because they have more important things to worry about then chaning their tires to winter tires.

Precisely THOSE excuses you keep on brining here! Yes another useless statement. Dude, you don't seem to understand that it's not an understatement when people say "your life is riding on your tires."

What exactly are those other "more important things" than the safety of you, your family, and the passengers in your car??? It's people like you that think they're invincible on the road.

[mart242]

What exactly are those other "more important things" than the safety of you, your family, and the passengers in your car??? It's people like you that think they're invincible on the road.

The dude is only 18.. of course he IS invincible! Aren't most noob male drivers like that?

[1yellowdog]

It's a great idea and I wish it were mandatory in Ontario too.
I have had snow tires ever since I almost killed myself on a slippery road one winter, I fooled myself into thinking I was safe riding on All Seasons. The difference is like night and day. All I can say is when I go out to work some mornings and see 5 or 6 cars off the road in a ditch, I can't understand how it is possible for them to go off the road like that when I am driving on my snow tires. I have the snow tires on their own rims so it's only a 45 minute wait to get them switched over Spring and Fall, it's a bit of an investement up front but so worth it in my opinion. It's not just all about the extra cost.

[P90Puma]

With the increase of FWD cars the need for snow tires is not a necessity. If you drive carefully when the roads are very snowy/icy you will be fine. The thing I find more stupid are people who drive RWD cars in places were we get snow. Most people I see stuck in snow have their rear tires spinning. It is STUPID to buy a RWD car in provinces that get snow. The main weight of the car (engine) is on the front wheels and that is where you need to have the power at the wheels for the best traction.

What a pile of nonsense.

Anyways, My issue with this law is the dates. What if it is 15+ deg celcius in april? Yea right I am going to be wearing down my snowtires.

I don't believe a law like this should be in effect, and if it is, at least make it somewhat reasonable.

[najibs]

The dude is only 18.. of course he IS invincible! Aren't most noob male drivers like that?

Heh, I guess that explains why he thinks he knows it all. :lol:

[thephenom]

Sounds like a good idea to improve overall road safety, but also stupid since there are all-seasons tires that do very well in snow such as the TripleTred.

[Ziggy007]

This is funny because in my opinion after driving through Quebec (mainly Montreal) when I visit my family is they just don't sald / sand anything and barely plow the snow.

Think of this as government tax, you pay for better tires instead of the government paying for better road.

I remember last time I was out at my uncles throughout his entire subdivision of streets there was a sheet of ice no thinner than 1.5 inches across the entire road. I was dangerous like no other road I drove on. I didn't believe it so I acutally chipped a small part out of the middle of the road to verify it.

I asked my uncle and he said the last storm was a week ago, they just never bother to salt anything. What a joke.

PS: My girlfriend did manage to put her four wheel drive Pathfinder in the ditch on that trip lol. :razz:

Quebec motorists will be required to swap their summer tires for winter ones starting next winter, under a provincial law passed yesterday. As of Nov. 15, 2008, drivers will have to equip their vehicles with snow tires from that day each year through to April 15.

http://www.cbc.ca/consumer/story/2007/12/20/quebec-snowtires.html

If all-season tires are not allowed, then man!!! $h@t all the way to those Quebec provincial govt for non-consultations as far as I know that they didn't tell/inform or leak whatever they want to enact. Guess have to spend more $$ changing all tires to winter ones and then back to 'normal' ones. The tire business people must be happy esp tire installers are damn happy for they will charge more $$ when seasons kick-in.

IMO, what's waste of $$ overall. One should use common sense and be more extra careful driving esp in winters. I always drive carefully on the roads everytime no matter what seasons and keep eyes open/look out/distance for those 'reckless' motorists and pedestrians who never learn how to 'behave'. Some even never learn from mistakes .. they ought be banneded for good.

[Gee]

This is a dumb law.

First. People that own cars should have 2 sets of tires regardless of the law. Consider this.

If all tires are rated to last 100,000 kms, and you drive 25,000 kms per year.

If you just use all season tires, then they would last 4 years before a new set is required

If you use Summer tires for 6 months, and winter tires for 6 months. The two sets of tires should last 8 years.

What is the difference? You will loose a few dollars twice a year to swap the tires. For the safety factor, it is worth the few dollars.

Here is where it gets stupid.

What if you don't own the car? I personally lease all my cars. I drive them for a few years and then return them. I have no interest in owning cars. So, if I was forced to buy a set of Snows that I would only use for a few seasons, at the end of my lease, I will have a set of tires that I have to sell.

The law is stupid. But for people that own their cars, if you are using all seasons and think you are saving money, well you are just kidding yourself. If you are keeping your car beyond 6 years, then a set of summer and snows cost the same as driving on all seasons.

[Trooper8111]

Until I used winter tires, I thought that all-seasons were just as good.

Especially here in Quebec where snow removal is slow, you'll never get up to the RVH with regular tires or get out of the snow banks you just parked into.

Putting on snow tires is just common sense. Now if we can only lower the legal limit for blood alcohol.

[P90Puma]

If you use Summer tires for 6 months, and winter tires for 6 months. The two sets of tires should last 8 years.


Tires don't last 8 years. Not while maintaining any decent grip.

My summers are done in 2 years at BEST, period. My 40!!!! treadware race tires are not even worth talking about in terms of life.

Oh well, gotta pay to play.

[Stickee]

^^^

I think the point was that it doesn't really cost more to run winter tires. If a set of tires lasts 2 years. Then 2 sets of tires will last 4 years.

In either case, you're buying two sets of tires every 4 years.

[ES_Revenge]

^^^

I think the point was that it doesn't really cost more to run winter tires. If a set of tires lasts 2 years. Then 2 sets of tires will last 4 years.

In either case, you're buying two sets of tires every 4 years.

Exactly. Since any set of tyres is on the car for only half the year, they'll last twice as long as if they were on the car for the whole year. That's on average of course and considering 6 month periods of on/off (in reality it could be different depending on weather), but techical nitpicking aside the point is the same--tyres aren't on the car all the time so therefore they will last longer than if they were.

Personally I think it's a good law. At least Quebec makes laws that contribute to better road safety (though the mention of no salt and sanding is counter-productive); unlike Ontario that just makes up laws to please people that have no clue about road safety in the first place and just smile and nod as the government adds in stupid meaningless cash grabbing regulations instead of doing anything for safety.

[mart242]

At least Quebec makes laws that contribute to better road safety (though the mention of no salt and sanding is counter-productive);

Believe me, they salt and sand the roads plenty in Quebec.. well, the largest cities / towns anyways.

[michelb]

This is a dumb law.

First. People that own cars should have 2 sets of tires regardless of the law. Consider this.

If all tires are rated to last 100,000 kms, and you drive 25,000 kms per year.

If you just use all season tires, then they would last 4 years before a new set is required

If you use Summer tires for 6 months, and winter tires for 6 months. The two sets of tires should last 8 years.

What is the difference? You will loose a few dollars twice a year to swap the tires. For the safety factor, it is worth the few dollars.

Here is where it gets stupid.

What if you don't own the car? I personally lease all my cars. I drive them for a few years and then return them. I have no interest in owning cars. So, if I was forced to buy a set of Snows that I would only use for a few seasons, at the end of my lease, I will have a set of tires that I have to sell.

The law is stupid. But for people that own their cars, if you are using all seasons and think you are saving money, well you are just kidding yourself. If you are keeping your car beyond 6 years, then a set of summer and snows cost the same as driving on all seasons.

^^^

I think the point was that it doesn't really cost more to run winter tires. If a set of tires lasts 2 years. Then 2 sets of tires will last 4 years.

In either case, you're buying two sets of tires every 4 years.

Exactly. Since any set of tyres is on the car for only half the year, they'll last twice as long as if they were on the car for the whole year. That's on average of course and considering 6 month periods of on/off (in reality it could be different depending on weather), but techical nitpicking aside the point is the same--tyres aren't on the car all the time so therefore they will last longer than if they were.

Personally I think it's a good law. At least Quebec makes laws that contribute to better road safety (though the mention of no salt and sanding is counter-productive); unlike Ontario that just makes up laws to please people that have no clue about road safety in the first place and just smile and nod as the government adds in stupid meaningless cash grabbing regulations instead of doing anything for safety.


This is flawed logic; many summer or all-season tires last 100k, most winter tires are only good for 20k-40k (and this will probably go down significantly if you use them from beginning of November until end of April (law says must be on until Nov 15th-April 15th, so realistically, you'll be using them 6 months/year or more (realistically, you won't be able to get them changed right on those dates).

While I won't even try to disagree that new winter tires are not better than all-season, there is certainly a point where used winter tires are not as good as good all-seasons (remember that winter tires will wear much faster). How many people will buy new winter tires every year or two - that's probably how often an average driver will need to buy them if they are using them 6+ months / year.

With this law, people will be driving on 3-4 year old winter tires with tons of wear, so not only will the traction not be as good as the AS, they'll get worse mileage and in November and April when it's warm out, their warm/dry/wet traction will actually be way worse than cars on AS and summers !!!

IMO, if they want to force snows, they need to do it like areas in BC and the US that require snows or chains when there's snowfall (i.e. you can use your summers/AS but if there's snow, you need snows or chains ...).

[romsan04]

Quebec motorists will be required to swap their summer tires for winter ones starting next winter, under a provincial law passed yesterday. As of Nov. 15, 2008, drivers will have to equip their vehicles with snow tires from that day each year through to April 15.

http://www.cbc.ca/consumer/story/2007/12/20/quebec-snowtires.html

If all-season tires are not allowed, then man!!! $h@t all the way to those Quebec provincial govt for non-consultations as far as I know that they didn't tell/inform or leak whatever they want to enact. Guess have to spend more $$ changing all tires to winter ones and then back to 'normal' ones. The tire business people must be happy esp tire installers are damn happy for they will charge more $$ when seasons kick-in.

IMO, what's waste of $$ overall. One should use common sense and be more extra careful driving esp in winters. I always drive carefully on the roads everytime no matter what seasons and keep eyes open/look out/distance for those 'reckless' motorists and pedestrians who never learn how to 'behave'. Some even never learn from mistakes .. they ought be banneded for good.

Bring this to Ontario. I dont understand why it is not the law here yet.

[mart242]

With this law, people will be driving on 3-4 year old winter tires with tons of wear, so not only will the traction not be as good as the AS, they'll get worse mileage and in November and April when it's warm out, they're traction will actually be way worse than cars on AS and summers !!!


But these same idiots would be driving with bald AS tires in winter anyways..

[Narci]

I've always used winter tires when I was living in Toronto. I still use winter tires in Vancouver.

The biggest misconception for people about winter tires is:

"My all seasons can drive through the snow alright"

Winter tires are not only about snow, it's about temperature too.

Winter tires have a lower freezing point as opposed to All Seasons. Lower freezing point means they can remain softer at lower temperatures. All season will turn into a frozen hockey puck way before a winter tire will when it gets cold out.

In Vancouver, if you want to drive out to Whistler, there is a possiblity you can get turned away by the police from going if you do not have winter tires on.

This law is great but it's going to be a burden on people. If Quebec has this law, they should at least offer to subsidize partial cost of winter tires.

[romsan04]

I give this thumbs down.


All that's going to happen is people are going to think they are even more impervious to winter weather, and drive worse.

Just like people in 4 x 4's.

It's the way you drive. You can't stop on a dime when there is 2 inches of snow on the road.



Yea sure, unfortunately only in NA all season term exists. Everywhere else in the world its winter or summer tires.

And by saying

All season or winter tires... between the two there isn't much difference as long as they are in good shape.

You are no better than those in 4x4 ignorant drivers.

This is a dumb law.

First. People that own cars should have 2 sets of tires regardless of the law. Consider this.

If all tires are rated to last 100,000 kms, and you drive 25,000 kms per year.

If you just use all season tires, then they would last 4 years before a new set is required

If you use Summer tires for 6 months, and winter tires for 6 months. The two sets of tires should last 8 years.

What is the difference? You will loose a few dollars twice a year to swap the tires. For the safety factor, it is worth the few dollars.

Here is where it gets stupid.

What if you don't own the car? I personally lease all my cars. I drive them for a few years and then return them. I have no interest in owning cars. So, if I was forced to buy a set of Snows that I would only use for a few seasons, at the end of my lease, I will have a set of tires that I have to sell.

The law is stupid. But for people that own their cars, if you are using all seasons and think you are saving money, well you are just kidding yourself. If you are keeping your car beyond 6 years, then a set of summer and snows cost the same as driving on all seasons.

Dumb law?? I would say dumb comment.

It does not matter if you own the car or not, you still obligated to maintain it. Change oil, put gas in it, change breaks and tires if they are worn. Unfortunately for people like you $200-300 a year for safety is too much.

[romsan04]

I think this law is kinda silly. Honestly, why should they force one to change their tires if that person doesn't want to? They shouldn't. Some people buy all season tires so they are not changing there tire every few months. What about the people who can't afford to just buy a new set of tires?

I think mandatory insurance for cars is silly too. I am the best driver in the world. Why should I pay for insurance?? If someone hit me, they would have to pay for the damages, if I hit them, I'll pay.

[1yellowdog]

I think mandatory insurance for cars is silly too. I am the best driver in the world. Why should I pay for insurance?? If someone hit me, they would have to pay for the damages, if I hit them, I'll pay.


Sorry but I don't trust that you have the sufficient funds to compensate me in the event of an accident. Nothing personal.

Having snow tires is just good common sense. It's like the seat belt law, I wore a seat belt before it became mandatory and couldn't understand all the cry babies that didn't like that it was law. Some people need laws like this because they don't have any common sense.

[astroboi]

Running a Summer/Winter setup IS more expensive that All Seasons. Good All Seasons have almost double the treadwear life of a Summer or Winter tire. So over the span of 120,000 kms you'll use 1 set tires for All Seasons vs. 2 sets of tires for the Summer/Winter setup (assuming 60,000 kms life for both Summer and Winter tires and 6 months use of each type a year). You will either have to buy a second set of rims (>$200) and pay $25 to have them switched twice a year or you can opt to have the tires removed, reistalled and rebalanced at a cost of $80 twice a year.

BTW, I'm running Kumho KW11 winters on steelies right now and have Goodyear F1 GS-D3 summer tires on rims as well.

[new_vr]

I think we are over-legislated as it is, but the idea is a good one

[michelb]

I think it's a bad idea. I think if you want people to have winter tires because it's safer, you should also give them the option of driving with nylon spikes or chains (both of which are way better than winter tires in the snow / ice).

Alternatively, I think a better solution would be to have minimum thread depth requirements on all-seasons (i.e. you can use them in the winter but they have to be more than a certain depth (might as well have this on snows as well)) or have a 'conditional law' where you're required to have snows when there's more than X cms of snow have fallen (Ottawa has a similar law for overnight parking; you are not allowed to park on streets when more than 7 cms of snow falls until the street has been cleared).

What if someone has a car that they never drive in the snow but will use in the winter when the roads are clear - you can easily argue that over the winter, during 50% or more of driving days, the roads are actually clear and dry - why can't people that only drive then use all season tires?

I agree that 'summer' only tires should not be used in the winter but there are some all-seasons that do quite well in the winter (I'd be curious to see tests between the worst (or used) winter tires vs very good (or new) all-seasons).

[beerbaron105]

BTW, I use ALL-SEASON tires. This set should be pretty good instead of 2 separate sets (and eco-friendly ie less tires). On top, I make sure my AS tires have visible threads and in good condition. I have and still driving on all-season wheels since I got my first car. One just has to be more careful driving no matter what on the road not like some road users for they think that they are 'kings' or queens' of the road.

you must be new to Canada, in Canada there are 3 types of tires sold:

1. summer tires
2. winter tires
3. 3-season tires

[downloader]

Yeah its about time!

[warpdrive]

most winter tires are only good for 20k-40k

bullocks. I'm on my fifth season (8000-10000km per season), and my winter tires still outgrip any all season tire in the snow (and I should know because we have a second car with 1 year old all-season tires). We just got a HUGE dump of snow here in Ottawa and I had plenty of time to drive in deep thick snow to compare. My winters even on its fifth season are still very good. I'd say most winter tires are ok for at least 30000km, maybe 40000

[ES_Revenge]

This is flawed logic; many summer or all-season tires last 100k, most winter tires are only good for 20k-40k (and this will probably go down significantly if you use them from beginning of November until end of April (law says must be on until Nov 15th-April 15th, so realistically, you'll be using them 6 months/year or more (realistically, you won't be able to get them changed right on those dates).
Actually it's not flawed logic just because you happen to say so :rolleyes:

First of all most summer tyres do NOT last 100,000km. Good summer only tyres usually have treadwear numbers in the 300 or lower range; the all seasons with high mileage warranties are usually much higher, often in the 600+ range. It's clear from that comment you've probably never driven in snow or ice on summer only tyres, it's a wild-ride and not in a good way.

Furthermore I would say there are some all-seasons with high treadwear ratings. Many all-seasons have no treadwear warranty just as do summer and winter tyres, and they have treadwear rating numbers quite a bit below the high-mileage all-seasons.

Winter tyres it depends, but no treadwear is not as good. My previous set of winter tyres, I drove for at least 40,000km I believe (on half the year for 4 years) before I replaced them. If I had had a craptastic all-season on there the whole year that would have been 80,000km for those 4 years and that would have been near the end of the life of those tyres (Perhaps one more year could have come out of an all-season but they are so craptastic anyway, why would I put up with a crap tyre summer and winter for that many years? Are you joking me?)

My summer tyres actually lasted one season more than the winters, so at least 50,000kms there, which was pretty decent given the phenomenal grip compared to any all-season and the relatively low 280 treadwear rating.

So there we have 4-5 years of driving on two sets of tyres with around 90,000km of driving on them.

Again it doesn't matter that the winter and summer tyres last a shorter time on their own, combined they last the same time an all-season would, in terms of years/kms. If I had a set of all seasons for those 4-5 years they would have done the same ~90k kms and been pretty much worn out at that point, assuming an all season with a 100,000km warranty/treadwear rating (I know there are ones higher than that but it's just for example).

I believe I missed the part where the person said it doesn't actually cost more, because in many cases it does. All-season tyres are cheaper than summer tyres as well, for the most part. But you get what you pay for--there's a reason why they are relatively cheap. What I was more talking about was the time the tyres last, in terms of years. The winter/summer setup may have cost more, but I was waaaay happier in the summer and a lot safer in the winter than I ever would have been on an all-season. All-season tyres are for suckers, sorry. No one that actually drives a car would buy an all-seaon; no one that really knows about tyres would ever buy an all-season either. They're garbage plain and simple. There might be the rare one or two that performs well in a multiple of condions but really the majority of them perform poorly in all conditions yet not poorly enough to be undriveable. (E.g. Not as bad as a summer tyre in cold/snow/winter but nowhere near as good as a winter tyre; not as bad as a winter tyre in summer, but nowhere near as good as a summer tyre.)

While I won't even try to disagree that new winter tires are not better than all-season, there is certainly a point where used winter tires are not as good as good all-seasons (remember that winter tires will wear much faster).
I would say that's incorrect. Though I must agree winter tyres wear more quickly in terms of kms, even a worn winter tyre seems to perform better than a partly worn all-season. Because once the sipes are gone, but there's still tread depth most winter tyres essentially are all-seasons treadwise but have a compond that is more effective at lower temperatures. Since the compound is still better in the winter, the tyre remains better in the winter. Once you've run down the tread though yeah it's not going to be that great, but that doesn't happen in a year, in most cases (see my example above).

How many people will buy new winter tires every year or two - that's probably how often an average driver will need to buy them if they are using them 6+ months / year.
I disagree here as well. Depending on the winter tyre you select this is not necessarily true. Winter tyres can easily last several years depending on the tyre and the mileage put on them, per year.

With this law, people will be driving on 3-4 year old winter tires with tons of wear, so not only will the traction not be as good as the AS,
Again the worn winter tyre will be better (until the tread is really done) than the partly-worn all-season. All seasons simply don't have the compound, it's pretty cut and dry.

they'll get worse mileage and in November and April when it's warm out, their warm/dry/wet traction will actually be way worse than cars on AS and summers !!!
Some winter tyres have decent wet/dry traction, it depends. Some winter tyres flat out suck in dry/wet conditions even in the cold, you're right. But to me, if you live in the city, these are the wrong winter tyres to purchase--you have to be careful when selecting a winter tyre for your needs, by all means.

The added safety during the majority of conditions in winter, if you select the right tyre, definitely outweighs the rare occasions when they would be worse (e.g. in dry conditions where danger is much less in general). But I would have to agree that April/November seems a little stupid for dates. It should just be determined on a year-by-year basis because as we all know it can be snow free and warm until January, or you can get dumped on in November--the weather is never for sure especially in this day and age!

IMO, if they want to force snows, they need to do it like areas in BC and the US that require snows or chains when there's snowfall (i.e. you can use your summers/AS but if there's snow, you need snows or chains ...).
If you use a full set of summer tyres in snow, on purpose (chains or not) then you're just asking for trouble.

[Acrossenger]

A good thing coming out of this is for people who rent cars. Finally we can get a rental car with snow tires. Almost worth while to rent from Quebec and drive back to Ontario.

[WHO]

Just because a law is passed doesn't mean cops will enforce it (unfortunately). It's also an infraction to change lanes or turn without using your flasher... yet just look at cabs they never use turn signals yet never get ticketed.
Cops associations (union reps) already publicly announced they won't be "enforcing" this law. Do you really think they'll change their drink & drive, seatbelt, or radar operations to do winter tire check operations? It's part of their jobs to prioritize what's important to enforce and they'll put this law in the "least important" file.

I guess it will at least entitled them to give a ticket to dumbasses without winter tires when they are called to a traffic accident site. If you crash, when the cops get there, if you don't have winter tires on, they will ticket you. That's about it. It's already too late since the crash already happened, but it puts more money in the govnt's pockets.

[WHO]

A good thing coming out of this is for people who rent cars. Finally we can get a rental car with snow tires. Almost worth while to rent from Quebec and drive back to Ontario.

Rental companies charge extra 12$/DAY for winter tires. Don't think they will stop doing that.

Imagine, you rent the car for a week and the tires are paid, the rest is pure profit, baby! yeah!

[anycee]

Rental companies charge extra 12$/DAY for winter tires. Don't think they will stop doing that.

They will stop doing that. The reason that can do this is a small group of people demand winter tires, if everyone is forced to use them then the rental car companies must compete with each other and the price increase should be minimal.

[Narci]

This law is awesome for insurance companies.

Get into an accident, no winter tires, your at fault (at least 50/50).