vehicles running on vegetable oil (Biofuels)

[riskit]

http://www.lovecraftbiofuels.com/

Lovecraft Biofuels sells vegetable oil conversion kits and conversion components for diesel cars, trucks, generators, or anything else that runs on diesel fuel! All of our conversion components come with a lifetime replacement guarantee, and have been extensively tried and tested. We strive to keep our products simple, effective, reliable and easy to install by anyone with basic mechanical skills. Our heat exchanger and heated filters are virtually indestructible, machined from solid aluminum stock by a machine shop with military, Lockheed, and Boeing jet experience.

[jr!]

I'd love to set something like this up here in the GTA w/ my Dad, who has over 40 years experience in the Diesel industry.

[Red_Army]

lol id rather spend the extra money on gas, to not have to smell like a fast food restauraunt on wheels

[Octavius]

lol id rather spend the extra money on gas, to not have to smell like a fast food restauraunt on wheels

Phht, if it saves me money I don't care what my car smells like (so long as it isn't burning oil).

If I have the option to pay $1.00 / Liter for gas....or $0.75 / Liter for "biofuel" that works pretty much exactly the same way, well, I'll go for the biofuel any day of the week.

Besides, other people will likely do the exact same ~ save money and "smell like a fast food restaurant on wheels". May as well conform and save some money while you're at it.

[stevethewheel]

My nephew has been doing this for a few years. There are lots of "backyard" setups in California where they filter the used restaurant oil.

It reminds me of homebrewing beer. You can do it yourself but it's fairly labour intensive so doing it as a group is better, and some people are part of a co-op where you can do less labour and pay instead.

He enjoys paying practically nothing for fuel - his used oil is free from the restaurant.

It is difficult to use in Canada because as the temperature drops the oil gets pretty thick. IIRC you have to have a heating system if the temp is below 10C, and it is recommended below 15C.

[NeilMcduck]

I would love to have a car that runs on veggie oil, but is it even possible to do with our sub-zero temperatures? The fuel lines would clog up faster than [insert overweight celebrity here]'s arteries.

[Impossibles]

Phht, if it saves me money I don't care what my car smells like (so long as it isn't burning oil).

If I have the option to pay $1.00 / Liter for gas....or $0.75 / Liter for "biofuel" that works pretty much exactly the same way, well, I'll go for the biofuel any day of the week.

Besides, other people will likely do the exact same ~ save money and "smell like a fast food restaurant on wheels". May as well conform and save some money while you're at it.

Biofuel is more expensive than pump gas.

[maniackjr]

Don't you have to have a permit with the government to form an agreement of non-fuel use. I don't think that restaurants would give you free fuel just to dispose their used oils. Perhaps they might, but you have to to find a place to filter the oil from contaminants and debris.

[stevethewheel]

Don't you have to have a permit with the government to form an agreement of non-fuel use. I don't think that restaurants would give you free fuel just to dispose their used oils. Perhaps they might, but you have to to find a place to filter the oil from contaminants and debris.

AFAIK you don't need a permit to use it. You might need a permit to sell it for use as a motor fuel (and remit taxes).

Yes restaurants will give you free used oil because they otherwise have to pay for disposal.

Yes you have to filter the oil to remove debris.

There are thousands of people using this already, it has been steadily gaining popularity (especially in California) for the past 5 years.

They claim that Rudolph Diesel actually used peanut oil as his fuel when inventing his engine, so really this is very old news.

If you want to find out more just google biodiesel.

[Thanh]

Phht, if it saves me money I don't care what my car smells like (so long as it isn't burning oil).

If I have the option to pay $1.00 / Liter for gas....or $0.75 / Liter for "biofuel" that works pretty much exactly the same way, well, I'll go for the biofuel any day of the week.

Biofuel savings are a scam. Demand for biofuel is causing skyrocketing cereals price. So bread, pasta, dairies, meat ... will be more expensive. You'll save 2$ on gas but your saving will be voided by increasing food prices.

[stevethewheel]

Biofuel savings are a scam. Demand for biofuel is causing skyrocketing cereals price. So bread, pasta, dairies, meat ... will be more expensive. You'll save 2$ on gas but your saving will be voided by increasing food prices.

That is true if the industry is taking farm product and turning it into fuel.

That is not true if the industry is recycling used vegetable oil. Of course there is not enough used vegetable oil available for an entire nation's need for motor fuel.

But let's face it, it's hard to compare when gasoline is $1.00 per litre and a cup of coffee is $4.00 per litre.

[st7860]

Biofuel savings are a scam. Demand for biofuel is causing skyrocketing cereals price. So bread, pasta, dairies, meat ... will be more expensive. You'll save 2$ on gas but your saving will be voided by increasing food prices.

+1

thats true. most people doing realise that continuing to burn gas or diesel is more friendly than using biofuels. to be greenest, take the bus instead.

[brunes]

That is true if the industry is taking farm product and turning it into fuel.

That is not true if the industry is recycling used vegetable oil. Of course there is not enough used vegetable oil available for an entire nation's need for motor fuel.

But let's face it, it's hard to compare when gasoline is $1.00 per litre and a cup of coffee is $4.00 per litre.

It's called supply and demand. If everyone and his uncle started wanting to use used vegetable oil to run their cars off of, all of a sudden McDonald's would be charging $2 / L for the stuff.

It doesn't scale. There are way more cars on the road than can be powered by used vegetable oil. Many many orders of magnitude more.

Aside from this, all current industrial means of producing biodesiel and ethenol are not only net energy liss but net carbon positive - they put more CO2 into the air than burning the equivalent gasoline does, because it requires so much energy and farm equipment to cultivate thre stuff.

The best hope for biodesiel and ethenol is the urrent research going into GMO alge that produces ethenol. This stuff could be spread out over any large area soaked in water and has around the same energy and carbon footprint as oil.

[Bullseye]

For people doing research, you want to search on 'waste vegetable oil', which is different from biodiesel.

It's free, you just need to make arrangements with a restaurant to pick it up. They will usually be happy to give it to you, as they currently have to PAY to get it taken away. Asian restaurants are best, better oil than fryer joints.

I did a lot of research on this, but have not yet done it. My problem is that all new diesels in Canada are either VW's (which I consider low quality), or unsuitable (pick ups). I looked into lder Toyota Land Cruiser diesels, but they lacked the safety features I want. I will likely still go ahead with this at some point, I heard more diesels are coming to Canada.

This site is one of the best I found;

http://www.greasecar.com/

You can drive your car down to a mechanic trained in installing their systems, and have the conversion done there. You'll need the heater, of course, unless you live on the west coast.

[stevethewheel]

For people doing research, you want to search on 'waste vegetable oil', which is different from biodiesel.

It's free, you just need to make arrangements with a restaurant to pick it up. They will usually be happy to give it to you, as they currently have to PAY to get it taken away. Asian restaurants are best, better oil than fryer joints.

I did a lot of research on this, but have not yet done it. My problem is that all new diesels in Canada are either VW's (which I consider low quality), or unsuitable (pick ups). I looked into lder Toyota Land Cruiser diesels, but they lacked the safety features I want. I will likely still go ahead with this at some point, I heard more diesels are coming to Canada.



Yeah, I have been talking about this with my nephew for so long I forget that there's a whole commercial side of biodiesel that is not about recycling.

From his experience the best diesels are older Mercedes which can be picked up for fairly cheap. The VW's are OK. Of course, they prefer older cars since that fits in with the recycle aspect of things (and his crowd does not have the money for new ones anyway)

[seftonm]

Modern high pressure direct injection systems are very sensitive to fuel quality, it would probably be best to get an older IDI engine if you are planning on running WVO for many years.

[nelsonmp5]

read a blurb in the costco magazine...
they say the emissions are better than gasoline.
looks like the major issues are filtering and logistics of getting the oil
once modified, these diesels can still run regular pump diesel with no ill effect

[stealth]

For people doing research, you want to search on 'waste vegetable oil', which is different from biodiesel.

It's free, you just need to make arrangements with a restaurant to pick it up. They will usually be happy to give it to you, as they currently have to PAY to get it taken away. Asian restaurants are best, better oil than fryer joints.

I did a lot of research on this, but have not yet done it. My problem is that all new diesels in Canada are either VW's (which I consider low quality), or unsuitable (pick ups). I looked into lder Toyota Land Cruiser diesels, but they lacked the safety features I want. I will likely still go ahead with this at some point, I heard more diesels are coming to Canada.

This site is one of the best I found;

http://www.greasecar.com/

You can drive your car down to a mechanic trained in installing their systems, and have the conversion done there. You'll need the heater, of course, unless you live on the west coast.

What are the emission outputs on these vehicles like? I'm concerned with people confusing renewable energy sources with those that are actually green/environmentally friendly.

[Bullseye]

What are the emission outputs on these vehicles like? I'm concerned with people confusing renewable energy sources with those that are actually green/environmentally friendly.

'Q Will a Greasecar fuel system reduce emissions?

A Yes. There is no sulfur content in vegetable oil which eliminates the first major carcinogen associated with diesel fuel. Vegetable oil plants absorb more carbon dioxide from the air during their growing cycle than is released when the oil is burned, this means that vegetable oil does not produce excess carbon dioxide in the atmosphere (this is referred to as carbon neutral). Due to a slightly cooler burn some studies have shown NOX reductions when burning vegetable oil. More studies are underway and results will vary depending on engine and tuning. As a sulfur free, bio-mass fuel vegetable oil emissions are less harmful to the environment and less toxic to people and animals. '

http://www.greasecar.com/faq.cfm

All WVO vehicles would have the same result as with the Greasecar example.

[nelsonmp5]

'Vegetable oil plants absorb more carbon dioxide from the air during their growing cycle than is released when the oil is burned, this means that vegetable oil does not produce excess carbon dioxide in the atmosphere (this is referred to as carbon neutral).

Um, you can't loose carbon, due to conservation of matter. Are you saying it get sequestered in the compost? After the oil is extracted.

[raxen]

Um, you can't loose carbon, due to conservation of matter. Are you saying it get sequestered in the compost? After the oil is extracted.

No. He's saying that there's no net output of carbon dioxide if you use biodiesel because the carbon dioxide released from combustion is taken up by the crops when they grow.

Biodiesel won't work. The biological footprint needed to produce it is immense. Also, government subsidies are driving the prices artificially low.

[nelsonmp5]

No. He's saying that there's no net output of carbon dioxide if you use biodiesel because the carbon dioxide released from combustion is taken up by the crops when they grow.

Biodiesel won't work. The biological footprint needed to produce it is immense. Also, government subsidies are driving the prices artificially low.

Ah yes, of course. Actually I do believe in it but I agree we don't have the infrastructure to support it today.
I thought we were talking diesels running on used vegatable oil, not biodiesel.

[PurpleTiger]

Biodiesel won't work. The biological footprint needed to produce it is immense. Also, government subsidies are driving the prices artificially low.
Depends. If you mean growing corn and soybeans, letting the government subsidize these inefficient crops for biodiesel, then yes, there is little hope. Canola is somewhat better.

There is a lot of promising research going on with algae... (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biodiesel#Yields_of_common_crops)

US Gal/Acre
corn 18
soybeans 48
canola 127
algae 819