Car driven by 15yr old boy slams into taxis, leaving one passenger dead + another.,,

[george benjamin]

This is happening to often to just ignore. Toronto police really are a$$holes in police chases. A couple have died in the past 2 years, including 2 teens yesterday.

http://www.thestar.com/News/article/220954

Two teens killed in crash TheStar.com - News - Two teens killed in crash
Car driven by 15-year old boy slams into taxis, leaving one passenger dead and another injured
June 03, 2007
Tamara Cherry
Staff Reporter

As investigators combed through the twisted wreckage left from an accident that killed two teens and critically injured another yesterday, a city councillor called for a review of policies surrounding police chases.

A 15-year-old boy was driving a stolen blue Acura being pursued by police when he smashed into two taxis and wrapped the car around a light pole at Finch and Islington Aves. just after 2 a.m. He was pronounced dead in hospital.

Two teenaged girls were in one of the taxis. A 16-year-old died at the scene, while a 17-year-old remains in critical condition. The Royal and Beck taxi drivers weren't seriously injured when they were struck as they drove eastbound on Finch. All three cars ended up in the westbound lanes.

It's not yet known if the boy was involved in a gun call police were responding to near Islington and Albion Rd. when he sped past them and the two marked cruisers began following him north on Islington.

"It's far too early at this stage in our investigation to be able to conclusively say what role the police played," said Rose Bliss, spokesperson for the province's special investigations unit, which is probing the incident.

Bliss wouldn't comment on whether the police had their lights or sirens on as they pursued the vehicle.

Calling the incident a "terrible tragedy," Councillor Howard Moscoe said the issue of police chases needs to be addressed.

"I'm not sure of the extent to which ... whoever was doing the chasing was not following the policy (governing police chases) – that's the first question," Moscoe said.

"The second question is, if he was following policy was it appropriate, and maybe the policy needs to be further reviewed."

This isn't the first time a police pursuit has ended tragically.

Last year, the SIU probed a high-speed police chase that left a 39-year-old man dead and three others injured when the car being pursued smashed into a taxi at Lawrence Ave. E. and Warden Ave. Two officers in a marked cruiser were conducting radar in the area when a car sped by. After they began following it, the car crashed into a taxi before jumping the sidewalk and smashing into a bus shelter.

A 22-year-old driver died after a car being chased by police following a break-and-enter in April 2005 smashed into his car.

In October 2004, a driver was killed after being thrown from his demolished car following a brief police chase on Lake Shore Blvd. W. near the CNE grounds. The car was speeding west when it sideswiped a tractor-trailer and crashed.

"If the person in the car was known to be engaged in a major crime or to be dangerous, there might be some justification," Moscoe said of yesterday's incident. "But there's almost no other justification for chasing a car at high speeds through the streets of Toronto."

The names of the victims haven't been released. Anyone with information about the crash is asked to contact the SIU at 416-622-1898 or 1-800-787-8529 ext. 1898.

[Stoe99]

I'm sorry, how is it the fault of the officers that these people commit crimes, refuse to pull over for officers when being instructed to, then proceed to drive at speeds well over the limit, crash and die?

You have no idea what you are talking about, or how police are trained, shut your mouth, and stop blaming the police.

How the **** can you even think that this is the fault of the police?

Tell me, how would you have pursued these cars differently, since you know so much about how the police did pursue these teens?

[KorruptioN]

It's the police's fault that these innocent bystanders died? Who decided to run in the first place, the police?

edit: Stoe99 = winner

[yao416]

Its so true that police SHOULD NEVER car chase driver
Cus when they get nervous they don't know what to do.

[Tijuana]

It's the police's fault that these innocent bystanders died? Who decided to run in the first place, the police?

edit: Stoe99 = winner

+1

[YnD]

This is happening to often to just ignore. Toronto police really are a$$holes in police chases. A couple have died in the past 2 years, including 2 teens yesterday.

http://www.thestar.com/News/article/220954

Two teens killed in crash TheStar.com - News - Two teens killed in crash
Car driven by 15-year old boy slams into taxis, leaving one passenger dead and another injured
June 03, 2007
Tamara Cherry
Staff Reporter


From what it states, this BOY is the one who crashed into the taxis.
The Cops were chasing... so what? He decided to not stop...how is that the cop's fault?

Just let him get away with the stolen car...so he could steal more and more.

Yah right buddy... well at least now he won't be stealing cars.

[noxe2]

These kids are out of control, and Stoe99 is right, its not the Cops fault. Stupid 15 yr old kid shouldnt have stolen the car in the first place (who probably has no driving experience), let alone try to think he's playing some NFS or GTA videogame where he can outrun the police.

The real question is how long till the mother comes out and blames this on the Cops too? Should've kept your kid disciplined lady

[rdtx2002]

Its so true that police SHOULD NEVER car chase driver
Cus when they get nervous they don't know what to do.

so it's better to let them steal the car?

how about NOT STEAL the car in the first place.

and the OP just proved what a stupid guy he is.

[cwb27]

Yeah, you're absolutely right, let's not blame the criminals for their actions... It's obviously the fault of the police when something goes wrong.


:?: :?: :?:

Give me a freakin break.... The thread title alone is practically trolling.

[TapemanPL]

everyone above except for the op has it right...i think the op is just a bad reader and doesn't understand what the article was saying...after only reading the headline i was like wth...it wasn't the police it was the 15 year old teen

[chickenbones]

You can't just say they can't do car chaes w/o know all the fact. If they chased the guy for 1 hour, and he was really reckless and they do not know if he committed any other crimes than speeding then sure maybe they should have called off the chase.

But it sounds like they were responding to a gun call, saw a speeding acura, decided to follow it. A SHORT distance later the acura crashed into the taxi cabs. I think they should at least give chase initially rather than just say oh well who cares let the car go.

[CSAgent]

What the hell are 15 year olds doing stealing cars already? They're not even old enough to get their license! In my opinion, this kid probably deserved it for doing something this stupid. Break the law and put the risk of others in danger in a situation like this, you're better off dead. :mad:

[MS_Project]

Why do Police even need to chase cars?

They can use a Police Helicopter to follow them in the air without risking other ppls lives.

[TapemanPL]

Why do Police even need to chase cars?

They can use a Police Helicopter to follow them in the air without risking other ppls lives.

toronto police don't have a helicopter for chases...i think they only have a very few for other uses

[CSAgent]

Why do Police even need to chase cars?

They can use a Police Helicopter to follow them in the air without risking other ppls lives.

It takes time - and cost resources like fuel, time to lift off, and manpower. A simple grand-theft auto is sometimes not considered worth the effort.

Plus, they need to track the target and acquire it before a helicopter can come and join the pursuit. Toronto is a 3.5 million people populace, with thousands of kilometers of road. How do you track something in a city with more than a million vehicles of all sorts if no one is tracking it in the first place.

Who has to track it first? Why, the police on the ground in the cruisers of course.

[YnD]

What the hell are 15 year olds doing stealing cars already? They're not even old enough to get their license! In my opinion, this kid probably deserved it for doing something this stupid. Break the law and put the risk of others in danger in a situation like this, you're better off dead. :mad:

Well since the Youth Protection Act will prevent us from knowing the identity at the moment.... if RACE is a factor in this then we can assume why a 15 year old would steal a car.

[infinite.chaoz]

Its so true that police SHOULD NEVER car chase driver
Cus when they get nervous they don't know what to do.

Thats gotta be one of the stupidest comment I have ever heard. So you think the punk crashed his car because the police got nervous during the chase? The police did everything according to the book, on the pursue. If these punks crash the car, they should be held accountable, not the police.

It is so true that young criminals SHOULD NEVER steal cars Cus when they get nervous they don't know what to do.

It is also true that stupid people SHOULD NEVER post Cus when they get nervous they make stupid comments.

[CSAgent]

Well since the Youth Protection Act will prevent us from knowing the identity at the moment.... if RACE is a factor in this then we can assume why a 15 year old would steal a car.

I thought about the RACE factor too, but I wasn't going to bring it up. The PC-mongers are everywhere... ;)

Unless - someone wants to play devil's advocate...

[edgedamage]

This is happening to often to just ignore. Toronto police really are a$$holes in police chases. A couple have died in the past 2 years, including 2 teens yesterday.

http://www.thestar.com/News/article/220954

Two teens killed in crash TheStar.com - News - Two teens killed in crash
Car driven by 15-year old boy slams into taxis, leaving one passenger dead and another injured
June 03, 2007
Tamara Cherry
Staff Reporter

As investigators combed through the twisted wreckage left from an accident that killed two teens and critically injured another yesterday, a city councillor called for a review of policies surrounding police chases.

A 15-year-old boy was driving a stolen blue Acura being pursued by police when he smashed into two taxis and wrapped the car around a light pole at Finch and Islington Aves. just after 2 a.m. He was pronounced dead in hospital.

Two teenaged girls were in one of the taxis. A 16-year-old died at the scene, while a 17-year-old remains in critical condition. The Royal and Beck taxi drivers weren't seriously injured when they were struck as they drove eastbound on Finch. All three cars ended up in the westbound lanes.

It's not yet known if the boy was involved in a gun call police were responding to near Islington and Albion Rd. when he sped past them and the two marked cruisers began following him north on Islington.

"It's far too early at this stage in our investigation to be able to conclusively say what role the police played," said Rose Bliss, spokesperson for the province's special investigations unit, which is probing the incident.

Bliss wouldn't comment on whether the police had their lights or sirens on as they pursued the vehicle.

Calling the incident a "terrible tragedy," Councillor Howard Moscoe said the issue of police chases needs to be addressed.

"I'm not sure of the extent to which ... whoever was doing the chasing was not following the policy (governing police chases) – that's the first question," Moscoe said.

"The second question is, if he was following policy was it appropriate, and maybe the policy needs to be further reviewed."

This isn't the first time a police pursuit has ended tragically.

Last year, the SIU probed a high-speed police chase that left a 39-year-old man dead and three others injured when the car being pursued smashed into a taxi at Lawrence Ave. E. and Warden Ave. Two officers in a marked cruiser were conducting radar in the area when a car sped by. After they began following it, the car crashed into a taxi before jumping the sidewalk and smashing into a bus shelter.

A 22-year-old driver died after a car being chased by police following a break-and-enter in April 2005 smashed into his car.

In October 2004, a driver was killed after being thrown from his demolished car following a brief police chase on Lake Shore Blvd. W. near the CNE grounds. The car was speeding west when it sideswiped a tractor-trailer and crashed.

"If the person in the car was known to be engaged in a major crime or to be dangerous, there might be some justification," Moscoe said of yesterday's incident. "But there's almost no other justification for chasing a car at high speeds through the streets of Toronto."

The names of the victims haven't been released. Anyone with information about the crash is asked to contact the SIU at 416-622-1898 or 1-800-787-8529 ext. 1898.
Douche.

[Prometheus]

Hope they release the name of this stupid 15 year old boy... In my opinion, this 15 year old boy got off lightly. At least he won't have to live the rest of his life knowing he killed an innocent girl and all the pain her family will now have to go through.

[GoiNGPoSTaL]

It's not like the police are smashing into cars to get the guy, while they try to limit the potential danger to others while chasing a criminal, they cannot account for everything (ie. driving ability). Might as weel blame the victims for getting hit. :rolleyes:

[Chr1s]

OP, add another one to the stats for the GTA

Priest killed in Police chase (http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/1999/03/22/policechase990322.html)
- November 2000

Fr. Ilce Miovski was a loved priest in the Macedonian community.

I think there needs to be something done so that it is a collaborative approach to catching the crook, not just 'engage in a high speed car chase.'
i.e. set up a road block, get a tracking device on the car.

These high speed road chases are destroying lives.

[vrus]

lol great. and people a few months ago were arguing why the police weren't doing high speed pursuits in the first place.

:rolleyes:

[Chr1s]

lol great. and people a few months ago were arguing why the police weren't doing high speed pursuits in the first place.

:rolleyes:

It's not like the police are smashing into cars to get the guy, while they try to limit the potential danger to others while chasing a criminal, they cannot account for everything (ie. driving ability). Might as weel blame the victims for getting hit. :rolleyes:

Perhaps if you knew someone that was killed in such a chase, you'd have a little more empathy.

[kevin01]

Perhaps if you knew someone that was killed in such a chase, you'd have a little more empathy.



The kid that was driving used to go to school with me for about 5 years. Man this is weird.

[izzyzz]

Yes, this is a great idea - stop the car chases. I got another one.

The cops don't know how to use guns. How many innocent bystanders have been hit by bullets during exchange of fire with the criminals?

But after reading this thread I know the solution -- take the guns away from police! Make them chase the cars on bicycles with wooden sticks as weapons. Think of the lives we're gonna save!

[Prometheus]

The kid that was driving used to go to school with me for about 5 years. Man this is weird.

Maybe you could provide us with some details about this him? (ie. Did he get in trouble often. Or was he a straight A student etc...)

P.S. I wonder if he has ever played game "Need For Speed"...?

[Prometheus]

Perhaps if you knew someone that was killed in such a chase, you'd have a little more empathy.

If this 15 year old boy had a little more empathy to the people in the taxi he smashed, we wouldn't have had such a terrible tragedy...

[vrus]

Perhaps if you knew someone that was killed in such a chase, you'd have a little more empathy.

nah, you'd have bias.

[gei]

People are way too quick to blame the police.

[cwb27]

IMO, people blame the police when they don't feel like taking responsibility for their own actions or acknowledging the actions of others.

[Zephyr22b]

OP, add another one to the stats for the GTA

Priest killed in Police chase (http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/1999/03/22/policechase990322.html)
- November 2000

Fr. Ilce Miovski was a loved priest in the Macedonian community.

I think there needs to be something done so that it is a collaborative approach to catching the crook, not just 'engage in a high speed car chase.'
i.e. set up a road block, get a tracking device on the car.

These high speed road chases are destroying lives.

how is a road block going to be effective if they don't know where the suspect is in the first place? the guy has to be followed

and how the hell are you going to put a tracking device on the car?!

[maebach]

Yeah, you're absolutely right, let's not blame the criminals for their actions... It's obviously the fault of the police when something goes wrong.


:?: :?: :?:

Give me a freakin break.... The thread title alone is practically trolling.

:arrowu:

[BelligerentDog]

I fail to see how it's the officers' fault. The kid stole a car, and was driving without a license, and then that kid crashed into a taxi and killed himself and a girl. Yeah, that's totally the fault of the police. Next you'll be jumping around blaming video games and "gansta rap."

[Ben31]

Just wondering...if someone steals something in a mall and there happens to be a cop and starts chasing...if the person running from the cop pushes other pedestrians along the way, hurting other consumers...then trips and breaks/sprains their ankle...is the cop to blame?....should cops not give chase then?

[MrDisco]

This is happening to often to just ignore. Toronto police really are a$$holes in police chases.
[/url]

Terrific. Another uninformed poster.

As an FYI police officers simply don't light up the cherries and take off on a whim. They have to obtain clearance from their controller who has to weigh the merits within seconds. The officers were responding to a gun call and they see a car speeding off from that location. Stands to reason they had a potential criminal trying to get away. Imagine the outcry if it were a killer speeding off and it came to light the police simply let him go. They can't win either way.

Why do Police even need to chase cars?
They can use a Police Helicopter to follow them in the air without risking other ppls lives.

QUOTE=TapemanPL;5169438]toronto police don't have a helicopter for chases...i think they only have a very few for other uses

TPS do not own choppers. They have agreements with other jurisdictions (i.e. Durham, York) to borrow theirs. (I can't even imagine what kind of red type they have to go through to request their use).

Bottom line? Toronto needs their own fleet for situations like this (not to mention they can be used in other applications like search&rescue).

I'm sick of police bashers and armchair detectives who second guess their actions. The blame here should fall squarely on that idiotic kid.

[Career07]

Just wondering...if someone steals something in a mall and there happens to be a cop and starts chasing...if the person running from the cop pushes other pedestrians along the way, hurting other consumers...then trips and breaks/sprains their ankle...is the cop to blame?....should cops not give chase then?

Technically, security guard can start chase if they have a verbal cue such as " help! robber!" or something similar also if the s/o knocks people over while chasing the s/o can get charged with assault. I suspect Police have similar chasing rules. Sadly not like in Hollywood movies mall chases. :cheesygri

Can do immediate chase if you witness theft and suspect leaves store/mall. In fact everyone reading this has the right to arrest others when they break the law. Know your rights people.


As for the article from the OP: if police stop chasing for fear of accidents happening, the criminals will have a great time and commit much more crimes knowing the police will not chase them once they get into their car. Total fault of the accident is the 15yr old and his stupid parents who are responsible for him because he is under 16/18.

[KorruptioN]

I'm sick of police bashers and armchair detectives who second guess their actions. The blame here should fall squarely on that idiotic kid.

/thread

Armchair detectives is a good way to describe a lot of the people in this thread.

[edgedamage]

Watch the kids mother sue because cars don't come with warning labels. "How would my A++ student and devoted church going son know driving fast would get him killed"

[Zephyr22b]

In fact everyone reading this has the right to arrest others when they break the law. Know your rights people.


citizens' powers of arrest are limited.

a citizen can arrest if they actually see another person commit an indictable offence.

a citizen can arrest if they are the owner of property, or have lawful authority from the owner, and finds someone committing any offence on or to their property.

a citizen can arrest if they see someone being chased by the police and believe that they committed a criminal offence

[and or]

Police doing high speed car chases is the same as if the bad guy was on foot and runs into a crowd and the police start shooting at him. Sure, it's the bad guy's fault, but the police still have to exercise judgement when there's a high risk of bystanders being killed.

[nickia]

I'm sorry, how is it the fault of the officers that these people commit crimes, refuse to pull over for officers when being instructed to, then proceed to drive at speeds well over the limit, crash and die?

You have no idea what you are talking about, or how police are trained, shut your mouth, and stop blaming the police.

How the **** can you even think that this is the fault of the police?

Tell me, how would you have pursued these cars differently, since you know so much about how the police did pursue these teens?

You are nuts!:mad:

The police car chased caused that teen to crash into another INNOCENT TAXI vehicle and killed TWO innocent people. So how does that sound like?:mad:

[Zephyr22b]

You are nuts!:mad:

The police car chased caused that teen to crash into another INNOCENT TAXI vehicle and killed TWO innocent people. So how does that sound like?:mad:

The police didn't do anything wrong. If they rammed the car and it sent it flying into the taxi, that would be a different story.

If the cops just ignored the car and let it go, we'd all be like "wtf? cops are so f**king lazy!!"

[aidzhsiah]

Just wondering...if someone steals something in a mall and there happens to be a cop and starts chasing...if the person running from the cop pushes other pedestrians along the way, hurting other consumers...then trips and breaks/sprains their ankle...is the cop to blame?....should cops not give chase then?

I think this is a totally different scenario.

By giving chase on foot, the policeman is not endangering any lives. In a high speed chase, a mistake could really kill someone.

In a situation where a high speed chase could occur, the police need to weigh out the cost and benefits of chasing down the criminal. A police officer has to be able to make a judgement call. Recovering a stolen car means nothing if they kill an innocent bystander.

Perhaps other things can be done - calling in the location, heading and plate numbers for other units to intercept him, waiting for a safer time to pursue the criminal, calling in a unmarked car to tail him (or tailing from a distance without sirens or lights) etc.

I'm not blaming the police - there's not any signs the police did anything wrong here - I'm just surprised at how many people think that it is 100% right for a policeman to chase down the criminal and that it's impossible for the police to have any responsibility to minimize the danger to others when trying to catch a criminal.

Stopping property crime should not mean it has to escalate into a life-threatening situation.

[firetrainer]

Remember they got a call about a shooting in the same area, so it wasn't just a property issue.

[bokep]

I'm not blaming the police - there's not any signs the police did anything wrong here - I'm just surprised at how many people think that it is 100% right for a policeman to chase down the criminal and that it's impossible for the police to have any responsibility to minimize the danger to others when trying to catch a criminal.
What did you expect the cops to do to "minimize the danger to others" in this situation? Reduce their speed?

Give me a break.

[Prometheus]

I'm just surprised at how many people think that it is 100% right for a policeman to chase down the criminal and that it's impossible for the police to have any responsibility to minimize the danger to others when trying to catch a criminal.

No one here has suggested that police have absolutely 100% no responsibility to minimize the dangers to the public during any sort of ?chase?...

[Prometheus]

IMO, people blame the police when they don't feel like taking responsibility for their own actions or acknowledging the actions of others.

Maybe it's just Dalton McGuinty and the Liberals way of thinking... Blame the police... I guess this isn't surprising because it will be difficult to blame the 15 year old boy (whose identity might never even be released).

http://www.thestar.com/News/article/221075

[Rembrandt100]

If anyone knows where they are going to bury this 15 year old prick let me know please. I would like to pour a bottle of good burbon on his grave. Of course I will pass it thru my system first.

Dave

[kevin01]

Watch the kids mother sue because cars don't come with warning labels. "How would my A++ student and devoted church going son know driving fast would get him killed"

he wasnt an A++ student

[bembol]

Cars can be replaced though. I thought pursuits weren't allowed since they can be very dangerous/kill like with this story.

There are other ways to deal with car theft.

[goffeebeans]

No one here has suggested that police have absolutely 100% no responsibility to minimize the dangers to the public during any sort of ?chase?...

Plus has anyone even considered that this took place at 2am in the morning? So its not like the streets were full of people or cars, meaning less risk of pursuing.

[thechampion116]

the only question i have in this was, how the boy obtained the vehicle? and Why the mother wasn't watching over the boy? I am not a parent, but from times seem to have changed and parents are becoming very liberal with kids and teens. I was always kept in check, and it seems parent dont keep their kids in 'check' these days. They let em run loose.

[stealth]

Police doing high speed car chases is the same as if the bad guy was on foot and runs into a crowd and the police start shooting at him. Sure, it's the bad guy's fault, but the police still have to exercise judgement when there's a high risk of bystanders being killed.

The prime directive of the police is to protect citiziens. There's a very good reason to believe that these 3 car thieves were endangering the public and themselves regardless of what the police may have or not have done.

There's been no good reason to evidence offerred to suggest that the police had done anything reckless or inappropriate. Sad that the media has distorted things so bad that people are more willing to belive a criminals story than the police.
As far as I'm concerned, the car thieves endangered their own lives as well as the general public's when they made this foolish move.

What if the cops had given up pursuit and the crooks killed someone in another accident, or ran over someone crossing the street? How much can we rely on the driving skills of a 15yr old pumped full or aderenaline (and possibly more than that?)?

This is BS. I suppose if they were holding up a store at gunpoint and a cop arrived on the scene and the crook shot someone it would also be the cops fault for making the gunman nervous?

[stealth]

Well since the Youth Protection Act will prevent us from knowing the identity at the moment.... if RACE is a factor in this then we can assume why a 15 year old would steal a car.

?:confused: What are you trying to say?

[aidzhsiah]

What did you expect the cops to do to "minimize the danger to others" in this situation? Reduce their speed?

Give me a break.If you read my post, I said that there may be other ways to appehend the criminals or reduce the danger of a chase. I'm not saying it's definitely applicible in this situation but there are alternatives to simply chasing a criminal down.

It's the same way as "gun safety" doesn't mean the police officer has to use a smaller bullet - there's protocol for when and when not to engage in a potentially life threatening chase.

No one here has suggested that police have absolutely 100% no responsibility to minimize the dangers to the public during any sort of ?chase?...Reading through the thread, most of the people who replied, have defended the police officer immediately, blamed the kid 100% and pretty much stated there is no way the police officer had anything to do with it. Even though the circumstances are still under investigation, they've pretty much absolved the police officer of any wrong doing or mistakes in judgement.

Just from the first few replies on the thread :

How the **** can you even think that this is the fault of the police?
It's the police's fault that these innocent bystanders died? Who decided to run in the first place, the police?
The Cops were chasing... so what? He decided to not stop...how is that the cop's fault?
These kids are out of control, and Stoe99 is right, its not the Cops fault.
Yeah, you're absolutely right, let's not blame the criminals for their actions... It's obviously the fault of the police when something goes wrong.

I'm not saying the police officers did anything necessarily wrong in this specific case. I'm just saying, that people shouldn't necessarily assume the criminal was 100% responsible for the fatal accident. There's scenarios where the police officer can escalate a situation to a level far more dangerous than it should've been.

It's like many people in this thread can't even imagine a situation where the police officer could have contributed to the incident.

[IronMac]

I'm just saying, that people shouldn't necessarily assume the criminal was 100% responsible for the fatal accident. There's scenarios where the police officer can escalate a situation to a level far more dangerous than it should've been.

Criminal stole car in the first place and, then, when the police came on the scene, they escalated their illegal situation by proceeding to flee.

Pretty simple to me.

[Corinthein]

This is happening to often to just ignore. Toronto police really are a$$holes in police chases. A couple have died in the past 2 years, including 2 teens yesterday.


Its so true that police SHOULD NEVER car chase driver
Cus when they get nervous they don't know what to do.

You're both idiots

[KorruptioN]

A third teenager has died.

http://www.citynews.ca/news/news_11649.aspx

[Happy13178]

If you read my post, I said that there may be other ways to appehend the criminals or reduce the danger of a chase. I'm not saying it's definitely applicible in this situation but there are alternatives to simply chasing a criminal down.



So what are these ways?

[billdozer]

A third teenager has died.

http://www.citynews.ca/news/news_11649.aspx

Damn. At least the 15 year old punk died as well. Otherwise he'd probably just have to do 20 hours of community service thanks to the wonderful YOA.

[stealth]

I'm just saying, that people shouldn't necessarily assume the criminal was 100% responsible for the fatal accident.

Lol...thats funny.
This is the sort of thing that paves the way for people doing criminal acts to be able to sue others when accidents happen during the commital of the crime. Basically turning a perpetrator into a victim.

[billdozer]

Lol...thats funny.
This is the sort of thing that paves the way for people doing criminal acts to be able to sue others when accidents happen during the commital of the crime. Basically turning a perpetrator into a victim.

QFT. I would love to beat up a criminal (potential mugger or something) to a bloody pulp or break all his limbs and for him to just TRY and sue me.

[BaboSo]

The police risk their lives everyday to protect us and all we do is blame them ... so pathetic.

[and or]

The police risk their lives everyday to protect us and all we do is blame them ... so pathetic.

Do you really believe there is no room for constructive criticism? Should we do away with Internal Affairs investigations?

[BaboSo]

Do you really believe there is no room for constructive criticism? Should we do away with Internal Affairs investigations?

I am not saying that, but it just seems that the police are almost in a no win situation. The police responded to a shooting, saw a car speeding away. So they have a armed suspect fleeing the scene. They chase the kid, the kid crashed in 2 taxis, killed 2 innocent people plus himself and the police are blamed. If the police didn't chase the kid, and somehow (assumption) the kid gets into an accident or just gets away and the police will be blamed for not doing their job.

People should give the police some slack. It's true that they are trained to handle things in stressful situations but they are still human.

[stealth]

Do you really believe there is no room for constructive criticism? Should we do away with Internal Affairs investigations?

Noones suggesting that. But in this case it seems that blame is being put on the police for simply being there.
I still belive that investigations should be prompted just cause. Should an investigation occur every time a cop writes a ticket for running a red light, to ensure they were being fair and not contributing to heightened emotions that could result in a fatality? Of course not. Its sickening the way the media tries to create sensationalism by protraying criminals as victims and police as criminals whose integrity must be called into question in every circumstance.

[killuminati]

I think this is a totally different scenario.

By giving chase on foot, the policeman is not endangering any lives. In a high speed chase, a mistake could really kill someone.

In a situation where a high speed chase could occur, the police need to weigh out the cost and benefits of chasing down the criminal. A police officer has to be able to make a judgement call. Recovering a stolen car means nothing if they kill an innocent bystander.

Perhaps other things can be done - calling in the location, heading and plate numbers for other units to intercept him, waiting for a safer time to pursue the criminal, calling in a unmarked car to tail him (or tailing from a distance without sirens or lights) etc.

I'm not blaming the police - there's not any signs the police did anything wrong here - I'm just surprised at how many people think that it is 100% right for a policeman to chase down the criminal and that it's impossible for the police to have any responsibility to minimize the danger to others when trying to catch a criminal.

Stopping property crime should not mean it has to escalate into a life-threatening situation.

Finally some sense in this thread... I wonder how old most of the people here responding are. I guess some of it is directed at the stupid title of the thread but the fact that the responses are putting zero responsibility on the police makes no sense.
The fact is innocent lives were lost during this chase and there was the possibility of other means of tracking the offender. Again I'm not blaming the police for this but at what cost do you put innocent lives at danger for the pursuit of a young offender. Think about the people killed becaues of this pursuit. Everyone is quick to place blame on someone, it was the kids fault, his parents fault, the police fault, etc... Fact is innocent people died and from that at least a look at procedure needs to be made. All kinds of investigations/reports will be made and blame will be placed but learning from this mistake and attempting to prevent it in the future is what I think needs to be the primary focus of this tradgedy.

anyways continue with the flames and blame.

[blexann]

The solution is to use helicopters in these situations.

[spm24]

Just wondering though i read this last night in the son how the 15 year old was in a stolen car was chased and ended up hitting 2 taxis cabs killing 2 people in the back seat of one.

not excusing the high speed chase or reason the girls died but the drivers condition seems to be better since usally taxi drivers are forced to wear a seltbelt. Seat belts for taxi passengers should be a must i am sure it might have prevented this from being 2 deaths .

any where does it say if anyone got seatbelts or not.

[stealth]

The solution is to use helicopters in these situations.

nah, you'll have the same people claiming the helicopters made the culprits nervous and provoked them to do something crazy.
Helicopters dont apprehend or stop criminals, they just prevent them from being able to hide/evade. Pursuit vehicles are still always used in conjunction. You could never have enough helicopters in the air 24hrs a day to effectively do this anyways. I hope it never comes to that point that we could justify these costs.

[stealth]

Just wondering though i read this last night in the son how the 15 year old was in a stolen car was chased and ended up hitting 2 taxis cabs killing 2 people in the back seat of one.

not excusing the high speed chase or reason the girls died but the drivers condition seems to be better since usally taxi drivers are forced to wear a seltbelt. Seat belts for taxi passengers should be a must i am sure it might have prevented this from being 2 deaths .

any where does it say if anyone got seatbelts or not.

not sure how they died but if it was from side impact, belts may not have made much difference. I get your point though. I always wondered why we dont have to wear belts in cabs, buses, etc.

[Menace]

This statement really pissed me off.

They should known about before joining the force. Don't forget they are paid to do their jobs. If I'm a sailer, I risk my life in the high sea to ship you the food/fruits, same goes with train enginer........etc.

The police risk their lives everyday to protect us and all we do is blame them ... so pathetic.

[kitbor]

The car thief deserved to die, the victim didn't. The polices did their job; end of the story.

[Menace]

Yes, the police just did their friggin job like everyone did his/her. Nothing glorified or ashamed about it.

The car thief deserved to die, the victim didn't. The polices did their job; end of the story.

[KorruptioN]

And now the OP has conceded defeat and edited his thread title.

[and or]

Next up - police using poison gas to stop a suspect in a crowd.

Bystanders are gonna die, but it's the perp's fault after all, and oh yeah, the police risk their lives every day.

Thank God for the new poison gas crime solution!

[thelefteyeguy]

the cops are at fault for not putting the safety of the public on their minds first.

Sure it's a crime to steal a car...but 2 innocent deaths...was it worth it?

[stealth]

Finally some sense in this thread... I wonder how old most of the people here responding are. I guess some of it is directed at the stupid title of the thread but the fact that the responses are putting zero responsibility on the police makes no sense.
The fact is innocent lives were lost during this chase and there was the possibility of other means of tracking the offender. Again I'm not blaming the police for this but at what cost do you put innocent lives at danger for the pursuit of a young offender. Think about the people killed becaues of this pursuit. Everyone is quick to place blame on someone, it was the kids fault, his parents fault, the police fault, etc... Fact is innocent people died and from that at least a look at procedure needs to be made. All kinds of investigations/reports will be made and blame will be placed but learning from this mistake and attempting to prevent it in the future is what I think needs to be the primary focus of this tradgedy.

anyways continue with the flames and blame.

What other means of tracking?
The problem with your point, and others in this thread is, you are adding hindsight info into what you assume the police would know when deciding to pursue. Do the police know when a car is stolen that its by a young offender? No. Do they know the thief only means to take it for parts, or a "harmless joyride" will drive it safely and responsibly, and wont use it in another crime? No. Do they know the drivers arent drunk/high? Do they know the thieves arent armed? No.
They cant assume any of these things, therefore they act based on what little facts they do have, and probabilities.
Funny how many are blamingthe cops, and completely overlooking the fact that the thief most likely had little driving experience (since a 15yr old cant even have gotten his license).
Bottom line is, blaming this accident on the cops is like blaming the person who steps out into the road in front of a drunk driver.

the cops are at fault for not putting the safety of the public on their minds first.

Sure it's a crime to steal a car...but 2 innocent deaths...was it worth it?

So we should just assume all car thieves are harmless, well intentioned, individuals with responsible driving skills, that just like free cars? What about drug dealers, maybe the same should apply to them? Let all thieves go about their business unineterrupted thusly PUTTING THE SFETY OF THE PUBLIC first?
And if the accident happened and the police were nowhere to be found, you'd be screaming that the police arent doing their jobs.

[YnD]

the cops are at fault for not putting the safety of the public on their minds first.

Sure it's a crime to steal a car...but 2 innocent deaths...was it worth it?

Blame the kid that stole the car. A 15 year old kid.

He killed his own "sistas" too. The cops were just doing their job.

[thelefteyeguy]

Blame the kid that stole the car. A 15 year old kid.

He killed his own "sistas" too. The cops were just doing their job.

so if one of your parents died in the accident...you'll have no ill will against the cop?

#1 mandate for the police is to protect the safety of the public...it's on their cars (mission statment) ...how is killing 2 innocent ppl fulfilling this?


the kid was brazed enough to steal a car...do you think he can even think straight and just stop the car if the cops are on him?....probably not huh?....so it's up to Cops who have been trained to properly assess the situation and stop the high speed chase.

[rdtx2002]

the cops are at fault for not putting the safety of the public on their minds first.

Sure it's a crime to steal a car...but 2 innocent deaths...was it worth it?

what public safety concerns are there at 2 in the morning? last i heard.. rush hour is from 7-9am and from 4-6pm.. not at 2am.

and besides.. the cops were investigating a gun call when they saw the car sped away from the same area. perhaps they are "assuming" that the car was a get-away car.

[thelefteyeguy]

what public safety concerns are there at 2 in the morning? last i heard.. rush hour is from 7-9am and from 4-6pm.. not at 2am.

so Toronto is dead at night at 2am...so how did the taxi get in the way...?

so it's ok to have different rules for the standard hour working public?...i do remember working late at night as a student...and also partying a night and taking a taxi home ....but if I die because the cops couldnt use some sense...it's ok?


in regards to your gun question...the cops can spin this all they want...but it's still not right.

[stealth]

so if one of your parents died in the accident...you'll have no ill will against the cop?

#1 mandate for the police is to protect the safety of the public...it's on their cars (mission statment) ...how is killing 2 innocent ppl fulfilling this?


the kid was brazed enough to steal a car...do you think he can even think straight and just stop the car if the cops are on him?....probably not huh?....so it's up to Cops who have been trained to properly assess the situation and stop the high speed chase.


You make no sense. Cops should allow someone who is brazen and cant think straight to continue driving like a maniac without regard for property or life?
Face it, the outcome would have been the same no matter what police did/didnt do.

We have vehicle and driver licensing for a reason. Cars can very easily be a deadly weapon.
If the cops see someone in public waving a deadly weapon e.g. sword or gun around, should they back off so they dont instigate the person who has no business to be in posession of this weapon, to use it? How does that fulfill the police mission statement?

If it happened to someone in my family, I would blame the culprit and be glad that the police at least attempted to prevent this by trying to control the situation.

[rdtx2002]

so Toronto is dead at night at 2am...so how did the taxi get in the way...?

i'm not saying Toronto is dead at 2am.. but it's also premature to think that there is a 'huge' public concern at 2am also.

if it was in broad daylight.. ok.. public concern to the nth degree.

[YnD]

Interesting point you guys bring up... who are these "innocent people" you speak of? The two passengers in the stolen car? How exactly are they "innocent"? Were they unwilling hostages who had their car jacked? Were they in the wrong place in the wrong time?

Frankly, if you willingly get into a car with a thief, you're just as guilty as them. The only difference is that they weren't driving.

The innocent people were the ones in the TAXI ( 2 girls) which the THIEF crashed into as a result of the chase. Keep in mind this kid was 15 and had no license (not legally at least). Wrong place at the wrong time.

The kid who stole the car... no respect for him at all...

[YnD]

You make no sense. Cops should allow someone who is brazen and cant think straight to continue driving like a maniac without regard for property or life?
Face it, the outcome would have been the same no matter what police did/didnt do.

We have vehicle and driver licensing for a reason. Cars can very easily be a deadly weapon.
If the cops see someone in public waving a deadly weapon e.g. sword or gun around, should they back off so they dont instigate the person who has no business to be in posession of this weapon, to use it? How does that fulfill the police mission statement?

If it happened to someone in my family, I would blame the culprit and be glad that the police at least attempted to prevent this by trying to control the situation.

Well said. Thats what I was trying to imply.

[talktwo]

You make no sense. Cops should allow someone who is brazen and cant think straight to continue driving like a maniac without regard for property or life?
Face it, the outcome would have been the same no matter what police did/didnt do.

We have vehicle and driver licensing for a reason. Cars can very easily be a deadly weapon.
If the cops see someone in public waving a deadly weapon e.g. sword or gun around, should they back off so they dont instigate the person who has no business to be in posession of this weapon, to use it? How does that fulfill the police mission statement?

If it happened to someone in my family, I would blame the culprit and be glad that the police at least attempted to prevent this by trying to control the situation.

+1

Interesting point you guys bring up... who are these "innocent people" you speak of? The two passengers in the stolen car? How exactly are they "innocent"? Were they unwilling hostages who had their car jacked? Were they in the wrong place in the wrong time?

Frankly, if you willingly get into a car with a thief, you're just as guilty as them. The only difference is that they weren't driving.

Me thinks you didn't quite read the full article ... the two innocent people they speak of are the girls who were riding in the taxi ... not in the stolen blue Acura ...

[15-20_God]

blame the police, blame the school system, blame society, hell blame me too since i probably caused it in some way. make sure blame is spread evenly amongst everything else except for the 15 year old thieves parent(s), who probably had no idea what her little angel of a son was up to at 2am on a saturday night.

an inquest should be held about her and her ilks parenting skills.

[Zephyr22b]

I'm not saying the police officers did anything necessarily wrong in this specific case. I'm just saying, that people shouldn't necessarily assume the criminal was 100% responsible for the fatal accident. There's scenarios where the police officer can escalate a situation to a level far more dangerous than it should've been.

It's like many people in this thread can't even imagine a situation where the police officer could have contributed to the incident.

I guess you could say that we're to blame too because we as a society have failed to show this kid what's right and wrong, causing him to get into crime...right?

#1 mandate for the police is to protect the safety of the public...it's on their cars (mission statment)
the cops are at fault for not putting the safety of the public on their minds first.
The police were investigating a gun call in the area when they saw the car speeding away. It is reasonable to believe that this person could've been involved with the incident. If that really was the gunman in the car, would the safety of the public not be at risk if the police let him get away??

[killuminati]

What other means of tracking?
The problem with your point, and others in this thread is, you are adding hindsight info into what you assume the police would know when deciding to pursue. Do the police know when a car is stolen that its by a young offender? No. Do they know the thief only means to take it for parts, or a "harmless joyride" will drive it safely and responsibly, and wont use it in another crime? No. Do they know the drivers arent drunk/high? Do they know the thieves arent armed? No.
They cant assume any of these things, therefore they act based on what little facts they do have, and probabilities.
Funny how many are blamingthe cops, and completely overlooking the fact that the thief most likely had little driving experience (since a 15yr old cant even have gotten his license).
Bottom line is, blaming this accident on the cops is like blaming the person who steps out into the road in front of a drunk driver.



So we should just assume all car thieves are harmless, well intentioned, individuals with responsible driving skills, that just like free cars? What about drug dealers, maybe the same should apply to them? Let all thieves go about their business unineterrupted thusly PUTTING THE SFETY OF THE PUBLIC first?
And if the accident happened and the police were nowhere to be found, you'd be screaming that the police arent doing their jobs.


So ensuing in a HIGH SPEED pursuit is the only thing these cops could and SHOULD have done???
How was this high speed pursuit supposed to end? If the driver was going to continue to speed away and make no attempt to stop, what does chasing him do? It can only end in a number of bad situations...here we saw it ended in the worst... I personally don't know what the cops should be doing when pursing a car thief, but clearly a high speed pursuit of someone unwilling to stop does not work.

Again I'm not blaming the cops in this situation for what happened because I think thats what they are trained to do but clearly this means of high speed chasing doesnt help accomplish anything positive... I'm not sure what the right way to approach this is, but that isnt my job to figure out.

[kurtblak]

The innocent people were the ones in the TAXI ( 2 girls) which the THIEF crashed into as a result of the chase. Keep in mind this kid was 15 and had no license (not legally at least).

It only became a "chase" AFTER the police engaged the 15 year old boy. The police have a responsibility to protect ALL citizens not just catch the bad guy. Big deal, a car is stolen and kid gets away. The only variable in this situation is that the police could have chosen not pursue once high speed was reached - they are after all supposed to be "professionals" - as opposed to a 15 yr old boy.

It's pretty simple to say blame the criminal and exonerate the police - but the police escalated a simple theft into a total fiasco. This is why many many other jurisdictions have rules AGAINST police chases. Too many innocent people get hurt due to the very volatile nature of car chases. It's not rocket science - a public street with police engaging in a high speed chase - total disaster waiting to happen.

Would you guys approve of cops pursuing a shoplifter down Yonge street with weapons drawn and firing shots?

If you disagree fine, but in all honesty think about how this situation would have ended IF the police did not chase the car? Would it have resulted in 2 teenagers dying? Or just another stolen car found a few days later.

[YnD]

I see what your arguing as well but without a chase...how would we as a society enforce:

-DRUNK DRIVING (Yes, RIDE is there...but when they spot a potential drunk driver they have to chase it and pull it over correct?)
-STREET RACING (These people you HAVE to chase... )

(The 2 scenarios mentioned above...kill enough people without any chases)

In regards to STOLEN CARS or CRIMINAL GETAWAYS...

We can either:
A) Chase them...knowing the risks at hand.... or use helicopters etc.
B) Let them roam free to steal more cars... rape more people...transport more drugs and weapons... etc etc.

IMO I still believe it was unlucky just due to the fact the THIEF was a 15 year old kid and probably lacked any experience in driving a car. Yes, the cops didn;t know this till AFTER the fact... so you can't really pass judgement on them for that.

For those that say..."Handle the situation different'y"... HOW?
If its just "Let him get away".... and they get away... kill someone...
You'll blame the cops for not "stopping" the criminal right?

It seems the Cops are at a Lose-Lose situation at this point.


It only became a "chase" AFTER the police engaged the 15 year old boy. The police have a responsibility to protect ALL citizens not just catch the bad guy. Big deal, a car is stolen and kid gets away. The only variable in this situation is that the police could have chosen not pursue once high speed was reached - they are after all supposed to be "professionals" - as opposed to a 15 yr old boy.

It's pretty simple to say blame the criminal and exonerate the police - but the police escalated a simple theft into a total fiasco. This is why many many other jurisdictions have rules AGAINST police chases. Too many innocent people get hurt due to the very volatile nature of car chases. It's not rocket science - a public street with police engaging in a high speed chase - total disaster waiting to happen.

Would you guys approve of cops pursuing a shoplifter down Yonge street with weapons drawn and firing shots?

If you disagree fine, but in all honesty think about how this situation would have ended IF the police did not chase the car? Would it have resulted in 2 teenagers dying? Or just another stolen car found a few days later.

[thelefteyeguy]

we need a cop in here to do add some info:

Drunk driver: cops are suppose to make an attempt to stop (ie sirens) if the driver speeds up, record licence plate...do not chase, ask for backup to follow less closely. Arrest at home.

Street racing...same as stolen car, record licence plate, arrest at home.

[Rocketo]

i do admit sometimes cops go overboard in judgement but like many of the posters say they did the right thing..fact of the matter is what happens if the 15 year old idiot drove away and the cops didn't pursue him ..and he stopped to rob a convenience store and then shoot the owner...

would you guys be saying ...the cops should have chased him before he caused more havoc? it's an unfortunate series of events that happened but really if cops were not to chase after criminals...you know how more frequent crimes would be committed based on the assumption that you can get away with it...

laws are there for a reason...and for those that are saying it's the cops' fault please be my guest and be a cop one day in your life and see how you would react to that situation knowing that if you let the perpetrator exit the scene of the crime would it be on your guilty conscious that he shot someone because you let him go...

makes me think of the spiderman scenario...

[edgedamage]

The police should sue the 15 year olds mother for not keeping tabs on the idiot.

[Zephyr22b]

So ensuing in a HIGH SPEED pursuit is the only thing these cops could and SHOULD have done???
How was this high speed pursuit supposed to end? If the driver was going to continue to speed away and make no attempt to stop, what does chasing him do? It can only end in a number of bad situations...here we saw it ended in the worst... I personally don't know what the cops should be doing when pursing a car thief, but clearly a high speed pursuit of someone unwilling to stop does not work.

Again I'm not blaming the cops in this situation for what happened because I think thats what they are trained to do but clearly this means of high speed chasing doesnt help accomplish anything positive... I'm not sure what the right way to approach this is, but that isnt my job to figure out.

The kid was speeding away while cops were investigating a gun call in the area. They had an obligation to investigate, so they followed him.

We don't even know for sure how long this chase lasted before the accident. It was said that the gun call was being investigated near finch and islington, the same area where the crash took place. It seems like there was a small time gap from the point where the police saw the car, to the point when the accident happened

They could've been assessing the situation and making a decision on whether or not to call it off during this timeframe and even if they weren't, they have to know where the suspect is first if they decide to take further action such as a road block or air support. Following the suspect was the correct initial response, imo.

[kurtblak]

would you guys be saying ...the cops should have chased him before he caused more havoc? it's an unfortunate series of events that happened but really if cops were not to chase after criminals...you know how more frequent crimes would be committed based on the assumption that you can get away with it...

No, you are thinking in only a simplistic black or white scenario. Police in other jurisdiction in Canada have clear guidelines by civic authorities of when to engage in a car chase and when to stop. Clearly the police failed to abide to the common sense that other Canadian cities have already codified.

This is why we have rules telling police they are NOT allowed to draw their guns in situations like chasing a shoplifter on a crowded street. It's a simple stopgap to prevent this sort of mess and in no way allows the "criminals" to take over the city. There is no slippery slope which gets created by letting one kid get away with a stolen car. That is "fear" talking and we know what happens when fear enters a tense scenario involving the public - mistakes are made and sadly lives are lost.

The logic of you saying "if we let this car thief escape without chase then ALL criminals will have superpowers" is as flawed as saying if women wear short skirts men will automatically lose all control and rape them. You're just being emotional and emotions don't the get job done. Professionalism, strict codes of conduct and police discipline are what we need. Cops are human after all, and that in it's very definition suggest the capacity for major flaws. But they are not 15 yr old boys - so they need to behave differently in my opinion.

[Rocketo]

No, you are thinking in only a simplistic black or white scenario. Police in other jurisdiction in Canada have clear guidelines by civic authorities of when to engage in a car chase and when to stop. Clearly the police failed to abide to the common sense that other Canadian cities have already codified.

This is why we have rules telling police they are NOT allowed to draw their guns in situations like chasing a shoplifter on a crowded street. It's a simple stopgap to prevent this sort of mess and in no way allows the "criminals" to take over the city. There is no slippery slope which gets created by letting one kid get away with a stolen car. That is "fear" talking and we know what happens when fear enters a tense scenario involving the public - mistakes are made and sadly lives are lost.

The logic of you saying "if we let this car thief escape without chase then ALL criminals will have superpowers" is as flawed as saying if women wear short skirts men will automatically lose all control and rape them. You're just being emotional and emotions don't the get job done. Professionalism, strict codes of conduct and police discipline are what we need. Cops are human after all, and that in it's very definition suggest the capacity for major flaws. But they are not 15 yr old boys - so they need to behave differently in my opinion.

Honestly..how did the cop know he was 15...it's 2am..can you clearly make out who is driving when you are chasing them...

[DualSoul]

Next up - police using poison gas to stop a suspect in a crowd.

Bystanders are gonna die, but it's the perp's fault after all, and oh yeah, the police risk their lives every day.

Thank God for the new poison gas crime solution!

What the heck are you smoking?

Anyways, I believe Zephyr22b alluded to it, but what's to say that had the police ignored the speeding car citing 'public safety', that it wouldn't have gotten into a crash anyways? Last I've noticed, even teenagers with licenses are pretty damned terrible drivers, so we're supposed to assume that the car jacker was some driving prodigy?

[Zephyr22b]

If you disagree fine, but in all honesty think about how this situation would have ended IF the police did not chase the car? Would it have resulted in 2 teenagers dying? Or just another stolen car found a few days later.
The kid was already speeding without the police chasing him, so who knows what could've happened.

and this chase wasn't about a stolen car. It was about a possible gunman who was speeding away from a nearby investigation. The police probably didn't even know the car was stolen until they ran the plates

[15-20_God]

So basically the police should act in hindsight and not engage in a pursuit if a member of the public may get hurt.

[Dragon120]

Street racing...same as stolen car, record licence plate, arrest at home.

Arrest at home? You mean like the poor Pakistani taxi driver who got kill while 2 teenagers were racing...yeah, let's just wait for them to finish the race then we'll arrest them at home & asked who won the race....

yeah, ok...:mad:

[rb]

Yes Police are at fault
McDonalds is to blame for Obese kids
Beer companies are to blame for alcoholics
Casinos are to blame for gamblers
and White People are to blame for all the poverty in the world

[billdozer]

Yes Police are at fault
McDonalds is to blame for Obese kids
Beer companies are to blame for alcoholics
Casinos are to blame for gamblers
and White People are to blame for all the poverty in the world

+1

[YnD]

Honestly..how did the cop know he was 15...it's 2am..can you clearly make out who is driving when you are chasing them...

He didnt. Barely saw anything. Nothing until the accident happened.

On another note:
Have you ever driven around downtown at night...and a black dude is crossing the street...especially in dark clothing.... I know it might sound bad to say this...but honestly its sometimes hard to see them if they are crossing the street with no crosswalk.

[Beradon]

Thief who caused all this havoc had his name released as Chevon Josephs, 15. I'm sure this punk was from the projects somewhere try to earn 'cash money' for some gang.


The victims were Monique McKnight, 16 and Aleisha Ashley, 17. RIP

The SIU will be looking at what fault if any the police had in this incident.
I feel pretty bad for the victims and the police were right in chasing this suspect.

[Thundercloud]

The police needs helicoptors.

[Emancipated]

Car chases often end up tragically. They need helicopters for an eye in the sky then nab them when they get into a house. Toronto probably doesn't have the budget for such a thing so these chases will continue until they change the protocol.

After a minute or two of cat and mouse, it becomes apparent the runner isn't going to stop at which point you should just call it off. Clearly, unless it's a car jacking with the passenger still in the car, risking by-standers life is not worth it.

[Lone_Prodigy]

The innocent people were the ones in the TAXI ( 2 girls) which the THIEF crashed into as a result of the chase. Keep in mind this kid was 15 and had no license (not legally at least). Wrong place at the wrong time.

The kid who stole the car... no respect for him at all...

Oops my bad... how could I have missed that? :(

[edgedamage]

And how else to you live up to your gansta idol? Gotta pay for that diamond grill somehow.

[aidzhsiah]

You make no sense. Cops should allow someone who is brazen and cant think straight to continue driving like a maniac without regard for property or life?
Face it, the outcome would have been the same no matter what police did/didnt do.

We have vehicle and driver licensing for a reason. Cars can very easily be a deadly weapon.
If the cops see someone in public waving a deadly weapon e.g. sword or gun around, should they back off so they dont instigate the person who has no business to be in posession of this weapon, to use it? How does that fulfill the police mission statement?

If it happened to someone in my family, I would blame the culprit and be glad that the police at least attempted to prevent this by trying to control the situation.That's an assumption and one no one has evidence that could back up. Just like not every drunk driver causes a fatal accident, just because an unlicensed teen was speeding, we can't be sure that he would've killed someone. I agree, he was likely a danger to others and himself, but you can't just make that assumption merely to absolve the police of responsibility.

I don't know if the taxi would've been hit without police, and nor do you. That's why there's an investigation to determine any role the police had in the accident (and why investigations for all police involved fatalities).

As for the waving deadly weapon scenario, I'm sure you've seen enough TV shows/movies to know that cops have protocols for this. It's not like "man waving knife = shoot him". They approach the situation carefully and try to diffuse the potential threat of violence. Shooting criminals, storming a hostage taker, etc are all last resorts after talking down/neogtiations/etc have failed.

In this case, it would be the equivalent of one of your family members being accidentally shot in a police crossfire after the police officer opened fire on a fleeing criminal.

I guess you could say that we're to blame too because we as a society have failed to show this kid what's right and wrong, causing him to get into crime...right?Actually, other people in this thread have already blamed his family.

In a perfect world, we'd all live in a crime-free utopia where everyone is nuturing and supportive of all their fellow humans. But in reality, unfortunately, it's not our job or responsiblity to ensure criminals are brought up right and established with clear morals. There's parents, educators, therapists, counselors etc for that.

However, it is the police's job to maintain public safety. That's their responsibility and that's why whenever a police incident causes a fatality, an investigation has to be done to ensure the police officer had made no judgements to needlessly cause that death.

i do admit sometimes cops go overboard in judgement but like many of the posters say they did the right thing..fact of the matter is what happens if the 15 year old idiot drove away and the cops didn't pursue him ..and he stopped to rob a convenience store and then shoot the owner...

would you guys be saying ...the cops should have chased him before he caused more havoc? it's an unfortunate series of events that happened but really if cops were not to chase after criminals...you know how more frequent crimes would be committed based on the assumption that you can get away with it...

laws are there for a reason...and for those that are saying it's the cops' fault please be my guest and be a cop one day in your life and see how you would react to that situation knowing that if you let the perpetrator exit the scene of the crime would it be on your guilty conscious that he shot someone because you let him go...

makes me think of the spiderman scenario...The problem with your scenario now is that you're prematurely assuming that a given criminal will commit more crimes and/or commit serious violent crimes. If that was the case, then every purse mugger, shoplifter, street corner drug dealer, etc has to considered a violent criminal.

The police have to do their best and have to address each crime as it happens. Our justice system can't let us assume and pre-emptively assign guilt for future crimes.

No one in this thread is saying that cops need to stop pursuing criminals. Even the people (like me) who claim possible police contribution to a fatal high speed chase, think that it's just necessary for police to follow their protocols and fulfill their civic responsibility not only to bring criminals to justice but to maintain the public safety while doing it.

To be honest, cops have a tough, tough job. I don't envy them at all.

[Mike_wang]

Its so true that police SHOULD NEVER car chase driver
Cus when they get nervous they don't know what to do.

LOL so you should let all criminals do whatever the hell they want to do just so they won't do anything irrational?

[TdotO]

I don't get it. A crime happened, police responded, unfortunately innocent bystanders got killed. Could this have been adverted. Sure, tell the automakers to make the perfect theft deterrent car.
Basically, the cops were doing their job. A criminal act was taking place and they did what they had to do in order to catch the thief. Innocent lives were lost and we point fingers.
There's a lot of what ifs and what abouts but we have to believe the cops know how to do their job and allow the cops to do their job. Once we start second guessing them and putting up stupid rules they need to follow they're gonna quit on us. Why bother chasing any criminal if it jeopordizes their job?
You say "well, the rules helps protect us" but at what cost? Sure, we stop the cops from pulling their guns, we stop the cops from giving high speed chases but how do we stop the crook? Write down the license plate of the stolen car????? How do you read the license plate of street racers going 160km/h from a standing position and in the dark? There's a crime that happened and some of you think the cops should stand down and investigate afterwards? Talk about making their job even more challenging.
It's difficult enough for cops to investigate crimes after the fact let's not make it harder for them by restricting what they can do in the moment.

[plymouthhater]

Thief who caused all this havoc had his name released as Chevon Josephs, 15. I'm sure this punk was from the projects somewhere try to earn 'cash money' for some gang.

http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/1782/screenshot229vy8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Though Josephs had been kicked out of school, those close to him were surprised to hear he was the driver of the stolen car being pursued by police.

"In terms of running from police and engaging with police, I've never heard of that," said a man who mentored Josephs and asked not to be named.

"A 15-year-old boy living in an area where ... peer pressure's available. He probably hung with the wrong crowd that said, `Here's a car, we want you to jump inside and take it from A to B.'"

For the past year, Josephs worked on his academic credits through a program for kids expelled from school. "He would talk back, he was disrespectful, but once you spoke with Chevon, he redirected his behaviour and corrected his attitude.

"He was on track ... He was making some changes," the man said. "He needed some direction, needed some guidance. ... I think he just got caught up in a bad situation that turned very, very tragic."

A friend close to Josephs described him as an avid basketball player and aspiring chef who cooked spaghetti for his friends and had an infectious laugh.

Contacted by the Star yesterday, Josephs' mother was too distraught to say anything other than, "He was a good kid."

http://www.thestar.com/News/article/221221

[AzN_RiverdaleCI]

Was the Acura automatic, or 5 Speed Manual stick-shift?

[edgedamage]

http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/1782/screenshot229vy8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Though Josephs had been kicked out of school, those close to him were surprised to hear he was the driver of the stolen car being pursued by police.

"In terms of running from police and engaging with police, I've never heard of that," said a man who mentored Josephs and asked not to be named.

"A 15-year-old boy living in an area where ... peer pressure's available. He probably hung with the wrong crowd that said, `Here's a car, we want you to jump inside and take it from A to B.'"

For the past year, Josephs worked on his academic credits through a program for kids expelled from school. "He would talk back, he was disrespectful, but once you spoke with Chevon, he redirected his behaviour and corrected his attitude.

"He was on track ... He was making some changes," the man said. "He needed some direction, needed some guidance. ... I think he just got caught up in a bad situation that turned very, very tragic."

A friend close to Josephs described him as an avid basketball player and aspiring chef who cooked spaghetti for his friends and had an infectious laugh.

Contacted by the Star yesterday, Josephs' mother was too distraught to say anything other than, "He was a good kid."

http://www.thestar.com/News/article/221221
Good kids don't steal cars. Parents who love their kids don't let them out that late at 15.

[Andy Bogart]

http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/1782/screenshot229vy8.jpg

He looks like Carmelo Anthony at 15 years old.

[KorruptioN]

Was the Acura automatic, or 5 Speed Manual stick-shift?

Likely automatic.

[sixer]

Parents Fault

[Dragon120]

[QUOTE= mother was too distraught to say anything other than, "He was a good kid."QUOTE]

Let me guess, this mother will join Jordan Manner's mother and sue the government...

Obviously these two mothers don't know **** about parenting...how can you say your kid is "good" when they live a thug life?

[billdozer]

Parents Fault

Wrong! It's the government's fault! Evil Conservatives! If everybody voted GREEN:D this would've never happened at all! SO VOTE GREEEEEEEEEEEEEEN EVERYBODY!!! GREEEEEEEEN LIKE THIS GUY!!! :D GREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEN
Come on Captain Planet, let's save the world! I'd kill for my kids future! Even myself!!!!!!

[wise]

This price for teen folly is too high

Jun 04, 2007 04:30 AM
Rosie DiManno

People who don't steal cars and flee from police: Murderers, bank robbers, violent offenders.

People who do steal cars: Teenagers.

Two are dead today and one, as of last night, was on life-support, her family gently advised to consider organ donation.

"How many innocent young lives are going to be taken, over and over again, because of police chases?'' wailed Jannett Scott-Jones, outside the critical care unit at Sunnybrook Health Sciences Centre.

Her beautiful 17-year-old daughter Aleisha Ashley – a blossoming dancer – was, according to the mother, "brain dead," that hideous term. For all intents and purposes, Aleisha "died'' when the taxi in which she was a passenger was slammed by a vehicle travelling at speed and pursued by cops early Saturday morning.

Aleisha's best friend, Monique McKnight, was killed instantly. The driver of the stolen car, 15-year-old Chevon Josephs, died in hospital a few hours later.

It is unknown, at this time, whether Josephs had any reason to run from police, other than the fact he was at the wheel of a stolen vehicle.

The speeding car had been spotted by officers in two marked cruisers that were responding to an earlier gun call in the area, around Finch and Islington Aves. Only about a kilometre separates the point where the already speeding car was first clocked and where the horrific accident occurred.

Perhaps Josephs had a gun. Perhaps he had drugs. Perhaps he saw police in the rear-view mirror and panicked. But there's been no indication as yet that police involved in the chase – however brief it might have been – had anything other than instinct to connect this blue Acura and the gun call.

The Special Investigations Unit, which probes all incidents where death or serious injury results from involvement with police, is investigating. But yesterday, the SIU was taking issue with original media reports involving speed, insisting they had no information thus far how quickly the vehicles were moving before impact. The blue Acura, though, was speeding to attract police attention, an SIU release stated.

Bottom line: You can't charge a corpse with any offence.

And, as is too often the case, the victims of such tragedies – even those whose behaviour has initiated the debacle – pay much too steep a price for their infractions.

"I'm just outraged about the whole situation," Scott-Jones told the Star, clutching photographs of her dead child and the teenager's friend, both of whom had lived under her roof until recently.

"Why is it that police have to chase in the middle of traffic, causing this boy to kill himself and kill my child? This boy did something wrong, but he didn't deserve to die because of it and my daughter didn't deserve to die because of it. Three people dead!"

Police chases – whether this incident meets the definition or not – are controversial. Even Premier Dalton McGuinty suggested yesterday that protocols covering them should be revisited.

As police well know, from statistics they have compiled over the years in Ontario, the overwhelming majority of cases involving chases show motorists being pursued were not serious offenders and most arose from property crimes.

When the issue was studied a decade age, only 0.5 per cent of the nearly 15,000 police chases that occurred over a six-year period resulted in homicide-related charges; just 1.4 per cent were for serious violent crimes.

By comparison, 35.8 per cent related to theft or possession, or both, of stolen property and 32.4 per cent were for Criminal Code traffic infractions. The vast majority of drivers were under the age of 25.

Yet those chases claim scores of lives, both the drivers and innocent bystanders.

For God's sake, stop it.


from http://www.thestar.com/columnists/article/221224

[Lone_Prodigy]

from http://www.thestar.com/columnists/article/221224

This article is heavily biased against the police, whether intentional or not. By interviewing the victim's family and the obligatory politician while the police investigation is ongoing, it leads to more knee-jerk reactions and outrage from the police. There's a good chance the investigation will turn up nothing condemning the police, which will of course prompt calls of public inquiries and more police responsibility.

My condolences to the victim's families, but I have to ask them: what were the two girls doing out at 2:00am in the morning?

And, as is too often the case, the victims of such tragedies – even those whose behaviour has initiated the debacle – pay much too steep a price for their infractions.

Oh yes, call the car thief a victim now. The reporter has no business deciding the price anyone should pay for an infraction: that's what the justice system is for.

That article disgusted me.

[hardcandy1911]

Problem is we have way too much freedom in this country.

Theyr are more laws to get you out of trouble than they are to get you into one.

[wise]

There's a good chance the investigation will turn up nothing condemning the police, which will of course prompt calls of public inquiries and more police responsibility.

I don't doubt this for a second. How often do the SIU turn up anything to charge the police anyways.

My condolences to the victim's families, but I have to ask them: what were the two girls doing out at 2:00am in the morning?.

I'm too lazy to check now but if I recall correctly they were leaving their aunt's house after watching tv.

Oh yes, call the car thief a victim now. The reporter has no business deciding the price anyone should pay for an infraction: that's what the justice system is for.

That article disgusted me.

I don't agree with looking at the individuals leading car chases as victims. I also usually dislike the majority of her work in her column. However, in this case I linked the article for the statistics. Regardless if police in this situation pursued correctly (assuming the thief might be armed and dangerous, etc), the majority of police car pursuits are unecessary risks to public safety. No different than discharging a firearm with innocent civilians around over a thief running away for example. Bystanders are often injured or killed from police car chases. The problem is determining if catching the criminal(s) is worth potentially killing innocent civilians. Should police pursue all vehicles that fail to stop? Should they only pursue those that they know are worth the risk? Or should they never pursue? The issue here is if the current practice is the best way to handle such situations or if it needs to be amended.

[YnD]

Good kids don't steal cars. Parents who love their kids don't let them out that late at 15.

At least this kid won't be stealing anymore cars, and potentially committing more crimes i.e murders, rapes, drug trafficking, firearms etc.

[Insane_Pikachu]

Damm..this sucks..one of the girls goes to my school...I don't really know her but I've seen her in the halls once.

[aidzhsiah]

I don't get it. A crime happened, police responded, unfortunately innocent bystanders got killed. Could this have been adverted. Sure, tell the automakers to make the perfect theft deterrent car.
Basically, the cops were doing their job. A criminal act was taking place and they did what they had to do in order to catch the thief. Innocent lives were lost and we point fingers.At this point in time, we're not sure that that loss in life couldn't have been averted. That's why there's the pending investigation.

The funny thing is in this case, that the people supporting the police are the ones pointing fingers. Almost everyone immediately just points and blames the criminal. I think in order to keep a fair and unbiased look at this situation, you must acknowledge at least the possibility that the police could have escalated the situation.

There's a lot of what ifs and what abouts but we have to believe the cops know how to do their job and allow the cops to do their job. Once we start second guessing them and putting up stupid rules they need to follow they're gonna quit on us. Why bother chasing any criminal if it jeopordizes their job?
The problem is that there are 'stupid rules' which cops need to follow. In most situations, cops already have rules, regulations and protocol they follow.

Cops aren't supposed to discharge a firearm or use lethal force unless they feel a real and immediate danger to someone's life, for instance. You're not supposed to search a house without a warrant, you're not allowed to question a suspect without an attorney etc etc

It's not that we think cops are incompetent, but these rules and regulations exist for a reason. There's reasons why cops aren't allowed to do whatever they want to stop criminals - it's to protect us, protect themselves (from legal repercussions) and the criminals (getting fair and appropriate punishment for their crime) and to uphold the integrity of the justice system. You can't allow cops to do whatever they want to stop a crime. Without rules and restrictions, why not just give them a rocket launcher ? Surely a flaming wreck can't engage in a high speed chase.

You can't give them all the freedoms and so you don't inconvenience them.

[Beradon]

from [URL="http://www.thestar.com/columnists/article/221224"]
"I'm just outraged about the whole situation," Scott-Jones told the Star, clutching photographs of her dead child and the teenager's friend, both of whom had lived under her roof until recently.

"Why is it that police have to chase in the middle of traffic, causing this boy to kill himself and kill my child? This boy did something wrong, but he didn't deserve to die because of it and my daughter didn't deserve to die because of it. Three people dead!"
Hmmm I wonder if the suspect wasn't from the same community as the female victim, the mother still have the same resentment for the police? Yes, blame it on the big bad Po-Po. :rolleyes:


At this point in time, we're not sure that that loss in life couldn't have been averted. That's why there's the pending investigation.

The funny thing is in this case, that the people supporting the police are the ones pointing fingers. Almost everyone immediately just points and blames the criminal. I think in order to keep a fair and unbiased look at this situation, you must acknowledge at least the possibility that the police could have escalated the situation.It is really simple. Cause and effect. If kid had stopped the vehicle then things would not have escalated. End of story.

Unfortunately the kid is a thug and comes from a culture of gangsta wannabes that feel the 'POleece' should done away with. Perhaps successfully fleeing from the police earns you more street cred in addition to stealing rides.

[and or]

Next up - police using poison gas to stop a suspect in a crowd.

Bystanders are gonna die, but it's the perp's fault after all, and oh yeah, the police risk their lives every day.

Thank God for the new poison gas crime solution!

What the heck are you smoking?


It's called Analogy - you should try some!

[infinite.chaoz]

Wrong! It's the government's fault! Evil Conservatives! If everybody voted GREEN:D this would've never happened at all! SO VOTE GREEEEEEEEEEEEEEN EVERYBODY!!! GREEEEEEEEN LIKE THIS GUY!!! :D GREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEN
Come on Captain Planet, let's save the world! I'd kill for my kids future! Even myself!!!!!!

Hes just mad because the car wasn't a hybrid.

Anyways, just heard that the punk was driving at 150+km/hr and the cop only around 100. Another reason why we can't blame to cops for doing their jobs since they have so little resources to work with, ie. a police chopper.

[TdotO]

Can you believe the mother of the two girls that died is blaming the police for her loss and not the kid that slammed into them? What is wrong with her? I bet you if the cops didn't chase after the kid and the kid still slammed into the taxi killing her daughter she would be the first to condemn the police for not doing something.

[TdotO]

It's not that we think cops are incompetent, but these rules and regulations exist for a reason. There's reasons why cops aren't allowed to do whatever they want to stop criminals - it's to protect us, protect themselves (from legal repercussions) and the criminals (getting fair and appropriate punishment for their crime) and to uphold the integrity of the justice system. You can't allow cops to do whatever they want to stop a crime. Without rules and restrictions, why not just give them a rocket launcher ? Surely a flaming wreck can't engage in a high speed chase.
But that's what I'm saying, we have these rules but the cops of our country know how to conduct their business. They know what is in the best interest of the public and know how to defend it without stepping on so many toes. Yet, here we are still debating whether or not we need more rules to make their job even more difficult.

[Beradon]

Can you believe the mother of the two girls that died is blaming the police for her loss and not the kid that slammed into them? What is wrong with her? I bet you if the cops didn't chase after the kid and the kid still slammed into the taxi killing her daughter she would be the first to condemn the police for not doing something.
Both the suspect and the victims come from the same community(black) and area(gang infested Scarborough). They don't hold the police in high regard.

[and or]

Hes just mad because the car wasn't a hybrid.

Anyways, just heard that the punk was driving at 150+km/hr and the cop only around 100. Another reason why we can't blame to cops for doing their jobs since they have so little resources to work with, ie. a police chopper.

If they were really chasing a car travelling at 150+km/hr while going at 100km/hr themselves, they wouldn't be chasing at all - they'd be in another neighbourhood. That same police press release claims they were keeping 100 meters back, too. Unless they have that new space-time bending technology in their squad cars, it sounds like there may be some issues with physics there. Nobody's better at making up stories than the police - they've heard them all and know what works, and back each other up till the end. And yes, I agree it's a tough job - that's all the more reason to keep it under strict regulation.

[and or]

Both the suspect and the victims come from the same community(black) and area(gang infested Scarborough). They don't hold the police in high regard.

That must be Scarborough West you're referring to, since the events took place at Finch and Islington.

(Though it does make for a revealing post about your own worldview.)

[TenzoR]

If they were really chasing a car travelling at 150+km/hr while going at 100km/hr themselves, they wouldn't be chasing at all - they'd be in another neighbourhood. That same police press release claims they were keeping 100 meters back, too. Unless they have that new space-time bending technology in their squad cars, it sounds like there may be some issues with physics there. Nobody's better at making up stories than the police - they've heard them all and know what works, and back each other up till the end. And yes, I agree it's a tough job - that's all the more reason to keep it under strict regulation.

They need to implement Automobile Black Box IMO. So actual data can be used rather then someone claiming this happens and what not.

[Beradon]

That must be Scarborough West you're referring to, since the events took place at Finch and Islington. Not from the area so I rather not use the slang Scarlem.

(Though it does make for a revealing post about your own worldview.)The feeling's mutal. I don't much agree with yours but thanks for coming out. No, judging by your past history, there's nothing positive your worldviews. *snicker*
;)

[kitbor]

It’s a wicked world we are living in.

I’m happy this car thief is dead. For the victims, I feel sorry for them. For the victim’s family, if they can’t see what really cause the accident then I have no sympathy for them. Let them live their misery life and see the tree not the forest.

[TenzoR]

It’s a wicked world we are living in.

I’m happy this car thief is dead. For the victims, I feel sorry for them. For the victim’s family, if they can’t see what really cause the accident then I have no sympathy for them. Let them live their misery life and see the tree not the forest.

there are no victims ...

well maybe the Police, since they are getting the blame for this ;)

[Beradon]

there are no victims ...

well maybe the Police, since they are getting the blame for this ;)I wouldn't be surprised if the victim's families held a protest march against Police brutality. Lawsuit against the police will be next. Taxpayers will be in line to foot the bill for a settlement. It never fails. ;)

[aidzhsiah]

But that's what I'm saying, we have these rules but the cops of our country know how to conduct their business. They know what is in the best interest of the public and know how to defend it without stepping on so many toes. Yet, here we are still debating whether or not we need more rules to make their job even more difficult.No one's asking for more rules... just that the existing rules are followed. That's why there's an investigation - to determine whether the officers acted within prudently according to these rules.

[DualSoul]

It's called Analogy - you should try some!

Try basing your analogy on some form of logic next time. You still haven't told me what you're smoking.

[Zephyr22b]

They got what they derserved. There is no point pointing finger at who's fault is it when the truth is that it's their own (all three decided to commit the act in the first place).

dude! only one of them was the suspect...the 2 girls were innocent. they were on their way home in a taxi cab when the suspect smashed into them.

[OceanDrop]

Both the suspect and the victims come from the same community(black) and area(gang infested Scarborough). They don't hold the police in high regard.

another poster has already mentioned this but i don't think you quite understood...the events did not take place in scarborough
and you have quite the ignorant viewpoint if you believe that scarborough is gang-infested (at least any more so than the rest of the GTA)

[TenzoR]

dude! only one of them was the suspect...the 2 girls were innocent. they were on their way home in a taxi cab when the suspect smashed into them.

wow I totally missed read that part, I thought I was read the two girls were in the stolen car with the guy :|

[billdozer]

If they were really chasing a car travelling at 150+km/hr while going at 100km/hr themselves, they wouldn't be chasing at all - they'd be in another neighbourhood. That same police press release claims they were keeping 100 meters back, too. Unless they have that new space-time bending technology in their squad cars, it sounds like there may be some issues with physics there. Nobody's better at making up stories than the police - they've heard them all and know what works, and back each other up till the end. And yes, I agree it's a tough job - that's all the more reason to keep it under strict regulation.

yeah man stick it to da man! f*ck the POlice coming straight from the underground! :lol:
word


/sarcasm

[and or]

yeah man stick it to da man! f*ck the POlice coming straight from the underground! :lol:
word


/sarcasm

My that's an interesting reply. Irrelevant, but interesting.

[Nemodigital]

At least this kid won't be stealing anymore cars, and potentially committing more crimes i.e murders, rapes, drug trafficking, firearms etc.
If it was only him that perished I wouldn't mind at all but that fact that he took down 2 people with him is the tragedy.