Time for a Tune up: Need Recommendations

[Ozzy]

I think its time i did some major fluid changes in my car. Its got almost 62,000 km on it. Oil has been changed regularly but everything else has not.

So i need advice on what to change:

Transmission fluid
Coolant
Fuel system
Steering fluid
Brake fluid

what else is there. And do you recommend places like Mr.Lube or Canadian Tire?

Regarding engine oil changes, is it ok to constantly change from synthetic to regular oil. Or once you switch to synthetic, should you remain using only synthetic?

[seftonm]

Are you sure you need all that done? Some things like coolant or transmission fluid may not ever need doing.

[rchong]

DIY > A mechanic you can trust > Dealership

You can change back and fourth between synthetic and regular oil. But if you keep switching, why not just stick with the cheaper one?

What about spark plugs? Does your owner's manual state the change interval?

Transmission fluid - Depends on how you drive and how long you plan on keeping the car. Replacing isn't a bad idea at 62,000km because if you were to change it every 60,000km, after 4 changes you would be at 240,000km.

Coolant - A flush/refill would be a good idea to prolong the life of the cooling system assuming you're going to keep it until it dies.

Fuel system - BG44k and Techron are good cleaners but I doubt you need to do anything with only 62,000km.

Steering fluid - Check level and add proper fluid to the correct level if necessary. If you want to change the fluid, you could use a baster and empty out the reservoir and refill.

Brake fluid - As the brakes wear, fluid will go down. You probably won't need to add brake fluid but you can if you want. Brake fluid flush is a good idea after you change the brakes to keep the fluid relatively new. Remember to remove some brake fluid before changing brake pads/shoes.

[CRXGSR]

Are you sure you need all that done? Some things like coolant or transmission fluid may not ever need doing.

All fluids get dirty, and with dirt as a contaminent, it will increase the wear on parts.

Also, a note with brake fluid, is that it will absorb moisture overtime. This lowers the boiling point of the fluid and will lower it's performance. It's recommended to change every 2 years.

[adamtheman]

First thing first, take your car to Canadian Tire

For $29 they will do a FULL front end inspection. Includes EVERYTHING. I was amazed they check brakes, fluides, wheels, suspension, everything. They will tell you what you need done. Then you can shop around no pressure to buy at CDN tire because they are expensive.

[plucky duck]

Perhaps later down the road if you notice any drop in performance, mileage, or rough idling people have recommended to change the PCV valve, cleaning both the EGR valve and ports.

As for changing fluids, even if it isn't necessary or on the maintenance list of things to do I don't think it would hurt. Especially transmission and brake fluids.

As for engine oil, if you go with one stick with one, why the back and forth changes? If you have an older vehicle and suddenly switched to synthetic beware of oil loss and monitor the dipstick and add as necessary. Best not to do it on older vehicles.

[Pete_Coach]

First thing you do is check your owners manual and find the recommended change intervals for the fluids in your car. Yes, you can change these out early if you wish but it is more than likely an unnecessary expenditure.
As for rchong's comment "Transmission fluid - Depends on how you drive and how long you plan on keeping the car. Replacing isn't a bad idea at 62,000km because if you were to change it every 60,000km, after 4 changes you would be at 240,000km." Well, you can do math, if you wait for another 60,000 then your car will have 300,00kms on it...so what?
Tune-ups, as in the old days are not required anymore. All fluids in your car has a finite life determined by the maker of the fluid and then put into the maintenance program of your car (in the owners manual). Plugs, intake air filters, cabin air filters etc are also in there.
Some items on your care are time dependent (anti-freeze) and others are mileage dependent (engine oil) so look at your owners manual and see when they are due. Doing wholesale fluid changes is not required.

[plucky duck]

As far as fluid goes I'd rather depend on my own eyes than what the book says or what the maintenance interval or computer tells me.

The manual on my car never mentioned anything about oil buring, but it is a known issue and if I didn't check it once every two weeks to a month I'd have a fried engine. By the time the engine low oil light comes up I'm screwed also, another known issue.

Many things you'll come to learn about your vehicle over the life of your ownership is not mentioned in the manual.

I'd rather pay that extra $50 or so dollars and get it changed prematurely if for nothing else then simply for my own peace of mind.

Same with work done on my car, if I can I prefer to do it myself, cost aside.

[D-3vil]

By the time the engine low oil light comes up I'm screwed also, another known issue.

The engine oil light indicates loss of oil pressure, not low oil levels.

[B0000rt]

A "Tune Up" usually refers to changing the following things:
Spark plugs
Spark plug wires if needed
Distributor Cap & Rotor if you have them
Ignition Timing if you can
PCV Valve
Fuel Filter
Valve Adjustment if non-hydraulic valves

That's what a "Tune Up" involves. The other things you mentioned are rarely associated with a "Tune Up"

[ES_Revenge]

Steering fluid - Check level and add proper fluid to the correct level if necessary. If you want to change the fluid, you could use a baster and empty out the reservoir and refill.
A better way is the proper way, lol. For traditional hydraulic systems, usually you raise the front end of the vehicle and disconnect the return line to the resivoir or pump. Then position the line to catch the fluid and turn the steering wheel left to right while adding new fluid to the resivoir to flush out the old, eventually ending up with all new fluid and no air in the system. Specific procedures vary among various cars of course. This service should be done, ideally, every 2-5 years depending on the vehicle and conditions.

[ES_Revenge]

That's what a "Tune Up" involves. The other things you mentioned are rarely associated with a "Tune Up"
LOL yeah I was gonna say the same thing. I was like "huh I thought the title said tune up"...

As for the rest you might want to mention what car you have (as other people mentioned the owner's manual service intervals are the best thing to follow), and you might want to note what type of fluids are in it. For example, coolant intervals vary depending on what kind of coolant is in the car e.g. traditional, G-05, Dex-Cool, etc. are all different types of coolant which have different characteristics.

[Sonbuster]

A "Tune Up" usually refers to changing the following things:
Spark plugs
Spark plug wires if needed
Distributor Cap & Rotor if you have them
Ignition Timing if you can
PCV Valve
Fuel Filter
Valve Adjustment if non-hydraulic valves

That's what a "Tune Up" involves. The other things you mentioned are rarely associated with a "Tune Up"

you forgot the O2 sensor tsk tsk tsk

[seftonm]

All fluids get dirty, and with dirt as a contaminent, it will increase the wear on parts.

Also, a note with brake fluid, is that it will absorb moisture overtime. This lowers the boiling point of the fluid and will lower it's performance. It's recommended to change every 2 years.
VW G12 coolant after 300k kms looks very similar to new G12. Most people say don't bother changing it unless there is another problem that has contaminated it.

[B0000rt]

you forgot the O2 sensor tsk tsk tsk

Oxygen sensor isn't changed as per regular "Tune Up" schedules. It's changed when your ECU throws a code or if you fail emissions.

[Ozzy]

A "Tune Up" usually refers to changing the following things:
Spark plugs
Spark plug wires if needed
Distributor Cap & Rotor if you have them
Ignition Timing if you can
PCV Valve
Fuel Filter
Valve Adjustment if non-hydraulic valves

That's what a "Tune Up" involves. The other things you mentioned are rarely associated with a "Tune Up"


Your right, my mistake, so when do you recommend replacing these parts.

Alot of useful suggestions regarding the fluids, thanks everyone. I'm gonna get a tranny flush probably tomorrow. I was quoted about $160 at Mr. Transmission. Is this a resonable price?

[*pgguy*]

So what type of vehicle do you drive?

[Ozzy]

So what type of vehicle do you drive?


I've got a Buick Century :cry:

[B0000rt]

I've got a Buick Century :cry:

Year? 3.8L I assume?

[Ozzy]

Year? 3.8L I assume?

Its an 05 3.1L

[*pgguy*]

I've got a Buick Century :cry:

Does it use Dex-cool? Mine uses this coolant and does not require maintenance until 5 years or like over 200K.
I think they came stock with platinum plugs (NGK)? They're supposed to be good for at least 100K.

[BartBandy]

Does it use Dex-cool? Mine uses this coolant and does not require maintenance until 5 years or like over 200K.
I think they came stock with platinum plugs (NGK)? They're supposed to be good for at least 100K.

Do NOT leave Dexcool in that long. Take it our after two years, max, have the cooling system flushed thoroughly, and replace with the regular stuff.

Dexcool goes acidic after a couple of years. Google it.

[ES_Revenge]

Its an 05 3.1L

2nd Gen 3100 (LG8) motor.

Not sure of the trans but since it's a W-body it should be a 4T60, but could be a 4T45.

Trans fluid--80,000km severe but you could do it sooner 60,000km is a good time to do it. If you can afford it, use synthetic or even half synthetic (which is what I did on my car). 13L of synthetic can get expensive, 6L is a bit cheaper ;)

Coolant--240,000km interval. DEX is quite good in this respect. However what isn't good are the LIM gaskets on this engine. Only the 3900 (LZ8 and LZ9 engines) corrected this problem absolutely because they stopped routing the coolant return through the intakes (it goes down the "side" of the engine instead). So LIM failure might be in your furture, unfortunately. Changing the coolant earlier really has no bearing on whether the LIM will fail sooner or later or not, but changing it at around 120,000km (half what they tell you to) is not a bad idea either. Certainly unnecessary at 60,000km anyway.

Fuel System--no real service is required but occasional use of tank-added, over-the-counter fuel injector cleaner is not a bad idea. Use at every oil change or twice every oil change interval is a good idea. Unless you have fuel injector problems or are using suspect/bad fuel, nothing more is required. The tank-side fuel filter has no replacement interval, however replacement at around 100,000km is a good idea as well.

Power Steering--this engine should have a traditional hydraulic power steering system. I would recommend changing it every 2-3 years, regardless of kilometreage, especially to prevent freeze-up and foaming in cold winter temps of -30C or lower. Recommended fluid replacement is Valvoline SynPower semi-synthetic power steering fluid.

Brake Fluid--as for any car, every 2 years regardless of kilometreage. You can do it less frequently (some people never do it) but if you want optimally functioning brakes for maximum safety, definitely every 2 years. Recommended fluid for price/performance is either ATE SuperBlue or ATE TYP200, or Valvoline SynPower brake fluid. ATE stuff is harder to find, SynPower is widely available. All of these are DOT4 fluids, don't worry that your car specifies DOT3 as DOT4 is fully compatible and better than DOT3.

[ES_Revenge]

Do NOT leave Dexcool in that long. Take it our after two years, max, have the cooling system flushed thoroughly, and replace with the regular stuff.

Dexcool goes acidic after a couple of years. Google it.

Unproven nonsense. Google hits saying the same will only find people that complain about the LIM gasket (which is a legitimate complaint/problem) and then somehow attribute it to DEX (which is not a legitimate conclusion). DEX-COOL is a silicate free OAT coolant that is extended life. It lasts longer than traditional coolant because it has no silicates and it's corrision inhibition properties do not wear out as quickly.

There is no solid evidence linking DEX to the LIM problems yet people contiunally attribute it as the cause.

Never replace DEX "with the regular stuff" either. DEX is a silicate-free coolant and the cooling system (water pump, heater core, radiator, etc.) in the car is designed for a coolant without silicates. Silicates will decrease water pump life and possibly shorten the life of other components in the system. If you really feel the need to replace DEX with another coolant (if you want to believe the unproven, baseless nonsense about DEX ruining LIM gaskets) then at the very least use another silicate free or reduced silicate coolant, not the "regular stuff" :rolleyes:

[*pgguy*]

Do NOT leave Dexcool in that long. Take it our after two years, max, have the cooling system flushed thoroughly, and replace with the regular stuff.

Dexcool goes acidic after a couple of years. Google it.

No problems for me. On my second Dex-cool coolant which I changed couple years ago (about 7yrs total)

Also had changed my stock spark plugs (NGK Platinum) to NGK Iridium. I really like GM 3800 engine except for changing the spark plugs.

[DSTU]

I would follow what the manufacturer states in the Owners Guide.

Do not let any dealer say that they recommend above what the manufacturer specifies - its just a money grab.

One dealer said i needed to change my spark plugs at 30k, i politely told him that they are platinum and the manufacturer recommends they be replaced at 100-160k.

[VivienM]

Not sure of the trans but since it's a W-body it should be a 4T60, but could be a 4T45.

4T65-E. RPO M15.

[sunnybono]

DIY > A mechanic you can trust > Dealership

You can change back and fourth between synthetic and regular oil. But if you keep switching, why not just stick with the cheaper one?

What about spark plugs? Does your owner's manual state the change interval?

Transmission fluid - Depends on how you drive and how long you plan on keeping the car. Replacing isn't a bad idea at 62,000km because if you were to change it every 60,000km, after 4 changes you would be at 240,000km.

Coolant - A flush/refill would be a good idea to prolong the life of the cooling system assuming you're going to keep it until it dies.

Fuel system - BG44k and Techron are good cleaners but I doubt you need to do anything with only 62,000km.

Steering fluid - Check level and add proper fluid to the correct level if necessary. If you want to change the fluid, you could use a baster and empty out the reservoir and refill.

Brake fluid - As the brakes wear, fluid will go down. You probably won't need to add brake fluid but you can if you want. Brake fluid flush is a good idea after you change the brakes to keep the fluid relatively new. Remember to remove some brake fluid before changing brake pads/shoes.

Where did you buy your BG44k from??? And how much. I was quoted by a GM dealership $30/bottle!!!

sk

[rchong]

GM dealership. I use that stuff sparingly because it's expensive.

[Ironballz]

Fuel system - BG44k and Techron are good cleaners but I doubt you need to do anything with only 62,000km.


Do you know where I can get BG44K or Techron?

I don't recall ever seeing these at CT or Partsource.

[ES_Revenge]

4T65-E. RPO M15.

They put a 65 in a Century? Are you sure about that? I would have thought a 60 would be fine, especially considering the 60 is already overkill for the 3100 (even the LG8)... Then again it's not really an absolute certainty what trans and axle ratio/FDR is in any given car because it varies--to be sure you have to see the tag on the back of the trans...

The only reason I would think a 60 rather than a 65 in the Century is because of how they cheaped out the 99+ N-bodies with the barely-adequate 40 series transmissions. Though the Century is a W-body, it could never be equipped with an L36 engine, nevermind an L67 so why they would use a 65 is beyond me. Then again I know they stopped using the 60 (and only used the 65) at some point so I guess they just slapped in the 65 in place after the 60 was completely discontinued.

As for the E, I tend to leave that out now as GM has dropped it themselves (simply because they are all electronically controlled nowadays).

In any case 4T60 or 4T65, that trans should have no problems for the life of the vehicle, if properly maintained.

[Spidey]

Do NOT leave Dexcool in that long. Take it our after two years, max, have the cooling system flushed thoroughly, and replace with the regular stuff.

Dexcool goes acidic after a couple of years. Google it.

According to manuals Ive read, Dex-cool is a max of 5 years, not 2.

I usualy do my vehicles when the recomendations are.

One thing I have never did was a power steering flsuh. Even my mecahnic at the dealership said it was an unneccasry thing, and he worked there.

Its funny, Ive priced out a lot of different maintenance things, and although I dont get everything doen at the delearship, about 75% of the stuff I do get done is at the delership becaue they are cheaper than most places in town.

[Spidey]

Your right, my mistake, so when do you recommend replacing these parts.

Alot of useful suggestions regarding the fluids, thanks everyone. I'm gonna get a tranny flush probably tomorrow. I was quoted about $160 at Mr. Transmission. Is this a resonable price?

I got my van done at Nation Transmission. $114 tax in, with a filter replacement. Some places just chnage the fluid, but dont change the filter for some reason. Watch out for that

[Spidey]

First thing first, take your car to Canadian Tire

For $29 they will do a FULL front end inspection. Includes EVERYTHING. I was amazed they check brakes, fluides, wheels, suspension, everything. They will tell you what you need done. Then you can shop around no pressure to buy at CDN tire because they are expensive.

Hope that was all sarcasm :lol:

[B0000rt]

In any case 4T60 or 4T65, that trans should have no problems for the life of the vehicle, if properly maintained.
Actually, this transmission has a small problem with the Torque Converter Clutch Solenoid failing. What happens is when the transmission fluid warms up to operating temperature, the TCC Solenoid starts being funny and doesn't lock up or slightly locks up the clutch at highway speeds. What happens is either the you run at highway speeds on the torque converter only, or your car shudders under acceleration.

But it's one you can 'put off' so to say :D I've had this problem creep up on me about 2 years ago at 350,000kms. Changed the transmission fluid by just dropping the pan and swapping the filter and adding new fluid, problem went away. Fast forward 2 years and 50,000kms later, problem shows up again. Gonna drop the pan and do the same, if I decide to keep this car a little longer :D

[ES_Revenge]

Actually, this transmission has a small problem with the Torque Converter Clutch Solenoid failing. What happens is when the transmission fluid warms up to operating temperature, the TCC Solenoid starts being funny and doesn't lock up or slightly locks up the clutch at highway speeds. What happens is either the you run at highway speeds on the torque converter only, or your car shudders under acceleration.

But it's one you can 'put off' so to say :D I've had this problem creep up on me about 2 years ago at 350,000kms. Changed the transmission fluid by just dropping the pan and swapping the filter and adding new fluid, problem went away. Fast forward 2 years and 50,000kms later, problem shows up again. Gonna drop the pan and do the same, if I decide to keep this car a little longer :D

You know what I've never heard of this problem to tell the truth. I do know about the valve body leakage problem on earlier models where you could lose drive (having intermittent neutral) when trying to accelerate with the selector in D/4 but nothing other than that. The fact that you had it happen at three hundred and fifty thousand kms :eek: makes me wonder if it's really a "problem". I mean have you seen other people having this problem well ahead of that?

If a trans is going 350,000km without any problems I really wouldn't consider anything after that a problem--i.e. it doesn't owe you anything at that point! haha! It is unfortunate to see it another 50k down the road though I guess. But wow, in any case, that's a long while on that car!

[B0000rt]

Oh, I forgot to mention that the transmission was rebuilt at 275,000 kms :lol:

So I must assume it was a shoddy rebuild :( Oh well, drop the pan, change the fluid, don't worry for another two years :D

[VivienM]

They put a 65 in a Century? Are you sure about that? I would have thought a 60 would be fine, especially considering the 60 is already overkill for the 3100 (even the LG8)... Then again it's not really an absolute certainty what trans and axle ratio/FDR is in any given car because it varies--to be sure you have to see the tag on the back of the trans...

The only reason I would think a 60 rather than a 65 in the Century is because of how they cheaped out the 99+ N-bodies with the barely-adequate 40 series transmissions. Though the Century is a W-body, it could never be equipped with an L36 engine, nevermind an L67 so why they would use a 65 is beyond me. Then again I know they stopped using the 60 (and only used the 65) at some point so I guess they just slapped in the 65 in place after the 60 was completely discontinued.

As for the E, I tend to leave that out now as GM has dropped it themselves (simply because they are all electronically controlled nowadays).

In any case 4T60 or 4T65, that trans should have no problems for the life of the vehicle, if properly maintained.

My source was a GM service manual, and it says what I pasted. I think that you're right: the 4T65 simply replaced the 4T60-E for all W/G/H (if you call the 2000+ cars with H in their VIN H bodies, which is debatable) body applications.

Keep in mind the Century was essentially the base model Regal for all intents and purposes... and they may just have wanted to use the same basic transmission for all three powertrains offered. Who knows. I don't understand GM decisionmaking, do you? :)

[ES_Revenge]

Who knows. I don't understand GM decisionmaking, do you? :)

LOL Nope! My favourite recent one was the choice of going between what cars got the 3400 LA1 and what cars got the 3100 LG8 motor...

Like Pontiac Grand Am, Olds Alero, Chevy Impala & Monte Carlo (base), they got the 3400;

but,

Pontiac Grand Prix (base), Buick Century, Chevy Malibu got the 3100 instead.

Two N-bodies and two W-bodies got the 3400 while two other W-bodies and one other N-body got the 3100.

And, the engines were identical minus the displacement and were within 5hp and 10lb*ft of each other as well, lol. I mean why not just use one or the other for all of them?

Heard it was the fact that the 3400 cranks were more scarce or something but who knows. Anyway this is a bit OT hahaha.