what would you do...(pretty crazy)

[kuba]

A buddy ordered some RAM ($50) for his laptop, from a store in in the states.
They shipped it to him, when he opened the box, there were some really high end computer parts and 3ipods. The stuff easily costs over $2500 total.

They called him, but he didn't answer yet, not knowing what to do (yet).

He said he was thinking of keeping it, I told him not to (telling him, how would he feel if his order of a couple of thousand, went to someone else's house).
His argument was, not his fault, the store is responsible and will deal with that customer by paying him back fully or shipping him a new shipment.

My buddies and I are sort of split on this.
Some say give it up, others say screw it and keep it.
What would you guys do?

I told him he'll go to jail if he doesn't...lmao

Doh, forgot to add, he said if they call, he'll just admit to getting his RAM and deny everything else. His words "prove it".

[Evil Baby]

I assume that's highly illegal and could end up costing your friend. It's like buying a high end BMW off the Hell's Angels for dirt cheap price and then trying to claim to the cops later on you didn't know it was stolen.

[bmwmini]

Tell him to respond to the phone and ask what they want. If he realizes that they (the store) have realized their mistake, then he is liable to send them back. If they have not realized their mistake, well then he can take a shot at corporate greed and have fun with his products if he feels like it.

If the store knows however, and wants it returned, then legally he MUST send it back. Otherwise do with it what he wills.

[Donkey_boy]

I would return it as it aint his to keep....never know for returning it could get the original ram for free or get free item or store credit.....plus if he has any contience he will feel alot better by doing so! :D

[Siefer999]

i say if they dont contact him about the stuff, then he can keep it

if they do contact him for the items, they will arrange for shipping and will get the stuff back whether your friend likes it or not

[kuba]

I assume that's highly illegal and could end up costing your friend. It's like buying a high end BMW off the Hell's Angels for dirt cheap price and then trying to claim to the cops later on you didn't know it was stolen.

I agree to send it back, but your analogy f'in sucks.
Hells Angels selling a BMW?
wtf? hahaha
Try again bud.

[masterhapposai]

Here's the truth:

He can say he never recieved it, as long as he didn't sign anything.(it may still work even without a signature)

Not that he should, but he can.

Then they can get $ back on it if there was insurance on the shipping.

Everyone happy in the end.

We, as customers have been scammed this way for years, I know for fact, I've seen it happen. Companies regularly pull the "uhh we didn't get it", when you know they did. Happens often with those companies where you have to send DVDs/products back to get out of the contract, like Columbia House or whatever.

[Siefer999]

was this from ca.buy.com? :lol:
EDIT: :arrowu: laughter above=inside joke if anybody is wondering

[red_roses101]

Keep it for the time being, if the Cops or any people of that nature get invovled, then give it back.

[bmwmini]

Keep it for the time being, if the Cops or any people of that nature get invovled, then give it back.

I thought I post a lot at 10.99 posts per day, but your 14.27 posts per day alongside you claiming to be female baffles me.

:confused:

[m77m7]

I would return it but make them "earn" it back by giving you your item free for all the hassle it will take to return it to them. Its not much of one but you can say it is like you work when the post office is open....etc.

[koft]

A buddy ordered some RAM ($50) for his laptop, from a store in in the states.
They shipped it to him, when he opened the box, there were some really high end computer parts and 3ipods. The stuff easily costs over $2500 total.

They called him, but he didn't answer yet, not knowing what to do (yet).

He said he was thinking of keeping it, I told him not to (telling him, how would he feel if his order of a couple of thousand, went to someone else's house).
His argument was, not his fault, the store is responsible and will deal with that customer by paying him back fully or shipping him a new shipment.

My buddies and I are sort of split on this.
Some say give it up, others say screw it and keep it.
What would you guys do?

I told him he'll go to jail if he doesn't...lmao

Doh, forgot to add, he said if they call, he'll just admit to getting his RAM and deny everything else. His words "prove it".

Well, sometimes when the company ships such a order, they will have tracking number. Is it worth the time and effort to go thru being potentially prosecuated for $2K worth of stuff. I presumed that your friend will lie under oath as well. I am sure the company will compensate your friend with something, ie. discount on the product, etc.. As well, they will give your friend back the shipping cost to send it back to them. Beside, I presume they have your friend Credit card number!

[GuiltySpark]

Honestly....I'd keep it. I know it's not the right thing to do...but THEY screwed up. If somehow they try to get it back...I would just deny deny deny.

Realistically: Just give it back and ask for the Ram for free for your honesty...I think you'd deserve that.

[john widow]

Use it as much as you can while u have it......if they call answer, if they want it back, give it back...But ask for something in return, as being a good samaritan and by giving it back, something like.......2x the ram. :) or a free ipod.

[MadCow]

If the items are listed on the packing slip that came with the box, and your friend signed for it then his lying about not receiving them will catch up to him and bite him in the ass.

As nice as it would be to keep the items, the company will be able to track them to his house. As to what they can do to your friend, I'm not entirely sure. A collection agency might be contacted? I don't know...

[TN_]

if i were u? i'd get better friends

if i were him? let them know i got the wrong order

[Captin Howdy]

Sell it to me =D!

would keep it most likely...

What if the company sent him a empty box, do you think they would give him the item if he asked?

[D-Sisive]

honestly i'd keep it, thats not very honest of me hah

i got some stuff from usa td for some reason when i ordered from canada td

i just kept both orders and both td was none the wiser...

[bigredlemon]

they could sue you in court for the return of the items, or alternatively the value of those items. And in addition, the cost of their legal fees too.

[Wulf]

My advice would be to phone them and ask how they want to handle it.... honesty pays off long term

[kuba]

If the items are listed on the packing slip that came with the box, and your friend signed for it then his lying about not receiving them will catch up to him and bite him in the ass.

I didn't ask him about that, but since you brought it up, I called him up now and asked him. He said the the packing receipt just showed the price and the 2 units of RAM. Nothing else. The other item he forgot to mention was a pocket digital camera. He won't tell me by who, but said it was a 6megapixel and it's slim. mmk this gets better and better, I'm gonna go over and check this stuff out. :D

[MadCow]

I didn't ask him about that, but since you brought it up, I called him up now and asked him. He said the the packing receipt just showed the price and the 2 units of RAM. Nothing else. The other item he forgot to mention was a pocket digital camera. He won't tell me by who, but said it was a 6megapixel and it's slim. mmk this gets better and better, I'm gonna go over and check this stuff out. :D

Well, well... :lol: Hopefully he isn't lying to you about the items not being listed on the slip.

The situation is left up to your friend's ethics and morals then.

[rayesyn]

thats what i'd do 4 sho :D

Keep it for the time being, if the Cops or any people of that nature get invovled, then give it back.

[Gold Monkey]

My advice would be to phone them and ask how they want to handle it.... honesty pays off long term

Couldn't have said it better myself. Accidents happen and I know if I was on the other end and accidently did that I would want it sent back. Hopefully the person who screwed up on the other end doesn't lose their job over this.

[mrG]

I'd never feel right ripping off a company.

[yuwing8]

If the 2 units of ram = 4ipods + digital camera + computer stuff...

Someone should post it up on hot deals! :twisted:

[Siefer999]

If the 2 units of ram = 4ipods + digital camera + computer stuff...

Someone should post it up on hot deals! :twisted:
yea,where did he order from?

[flyingdutchman]

Just return it man...it saves trouble and imagine urself in the opposite place!

[jayisthebest88]

My computer is hungry, my computer's "mother" has recently died, It has no brothers or sisters, It has no "fans" so it gets really lonnely, no one knwos my computer, it is a loner,it works 24/7, The only payment it receivs is dust. For only a little more then a dollar per day, u can help restore the life in this poor poor computer, please please, find it in your heart to sponsor this computer.

[Evil Baby]

I agree to send it back, but your analogy f'in sucks.
Hells Angels selling a BMW?
wtf? hahaha
Try again bud.


I didn't make it up. That's something that actually happened, and happens a fair amount

[Alvito]

i think you should ask the store for 300 dollars for shipping and handling.

that way you come out on top still.

[CanadaBoy]

You are not responsible for other people's mistakes.

[module]

You are not responsible for other people's mistakes.

EXACTLY. They cannot send you to court, you didnt commit any credit card fraud or any such illegal attempt to get something for free.

If the company messed up then its their own fault, theyr responsible for their sh*t. Dont try and send it back and expect free ram or a credit, these guys will not even care.

The bottom line is this; realistically you didnt receive what you paid for which is the ram, if you got something else then why should that be related to the ram? If there was a mixup then only the company would know.

For all you know, you never got the RAM and thats the bottom line. If you received something else then thats a different story.

[nickia]

if the company is big enough, I'd say to keep it

[Steeve Urkel]

IF I was the original person who ordered the items and still didn't have them after a couple weeks I'd be quite pissed!

Esp, if there was some great deal I was trying to get.

My last order from Future Shop was stolen and someone faked my signature, so I'm out of the item that would have been free after rebate!

The post office was supposed not NOT safe drop stuff as I've had mail stolen where i live.

So, if your friend didn't sign for the package there is no proof it was delivered.

As for my package, it says it went to Missasauga....I live in Ottawa- that was the second shipment they screwed up :mad:

But on another note:
I know someone who supposedly got a "free" laptop from Dell.
They placed an order last year and Dell was late sending out the computer.
The person canceled or something like that, but 2 weeks later some laptop shows up at their house and their Visa was never charged.
I was only told this- so not sure if it was the US dell or Canadian one....

[bug]

If the packing slip only lists the items he ordered then they have no way of proving those extra items were in the box. If that's the case, they don't have a leg to stand on.

[AzNCrAzYcOoLeR]

id say keep it. if they realized their mistake fast enough they couldve canceled the shippment

[junglebass]

LOL all the people saying give back give back, easier said than done, if ud get the package id bet most will keep it :twisted:

[kuba]

lol exactly.

Well I just got from my buddies, after seeing all the crap, I would be tempted to keep it to.
Damn damn damn...hahah ****, tough call, considering the receipt in the box was actually for the RAM, and nothing else billed on his credit card.
I'd be torn, but it's easier said than done.

[Rosico]

The person who did order this is likely being taken care of - I doubt they would screw that person over.

As for me, I'd call them back and ask if you could return some items for credit ;)

[Happy13178]

Answer to this is real simple, whether you agree with it or not. If you sent the items to a store, how quick would they be to return it? 6 weeks? 6 months? Ever? If the store in question is Staples, FS, BB, or one of the big chains, I'd say keep it. How many times have you seen threads about them randomly screwing people? Do you think that if you return the items, they'll mend their ways? Not a chance.

[Bree]

I thought I post a lot at 10.99 posts per day, but your 14.27 posts per day alongside you claiming to be female baffles me.

:confused:

Maybe she's just bored.

Anyway, keep it unless the company phones and asks about the shipping mistake. Otherwise, it's his gain. And no, avoiding calls from the company doesn't count. And, remind him what goes around comes around.

[Badman]

You are not responsible for other people's mistakes.

Thats the best post in this topic so far. People fail to relize that the company made it thier mistake and they should be punished for it(loose $2500).

Keep it and just relax cuz stuff like this happens all the time but nothing is ever done.

[CanadaBoy]

Thats the best post in this topic so far. People fail to relize that the company made it thier mistake and they should be punished for it(loose $2500).

Keep it and just relax cuz stuff like this happens all the time but nothing is ever done.

Woo hoo! The two sweetest words in the English language: de-fault! De-fault! De-fault!

-Homer Simpson

[Kasakato]

"I thought it was one of them buy ram-get a free iPod offers"

[kuba]

He got the call a few minutes ago, he doesn't answer uknown numbers.
Was left a message.
He returned the call, and called me just now to tell me about it.
He left a voice message.

I'll keep you guys posted.
I'm starting to agree with some of you guys, because it's a well known store and it's big enough that it's online sales are doing well to.
I'm sure they've screwed around with people.
So what goes around comes around, maybe this is their turn to bite it? lol

Its resellerratings(.com), are not the greatest, but they're above average.
No, it's not newegg, newegg just f'in rocks, period. Fast, and amazing customer service. But it's fairly well known for computer geeks.

[SkiLLz]

Plead ignorance. It's only screwing over a large business (the person who really ordered that stuff won't be affected if the stuff gets returned or not), so nothing to lose sleep over.

[Nav]

What if your friend received a pen (or something else, which is worth less than his order), would he still keep it because the company made a "mistake" and its their fault, or would he return it for the correct order?

[UrbanPoet]

just tuck it away in a corner for a few months and see what happens.....
Then when ayr past.Free stuff. :o

[Shaner]

Two wrongs doesn't make a right, but it does sometimes make you feel good.

Do the terms corporate greed mean anything to you? Corporations have been squeezing us for absolutely every last possible penny for a long time now. They could easily make profit and not screw us around, but they don't. They try to maximize their profits by any means necessary, which usually means screwing most of their customers.

I say screw them back. You won't often get that chance, so take advantage of it when you do. It doesn't make it right, but it does feel good.

[CHINAdeals]

i say tell em ..report it..mabbe they won't even ask you send it back lol?

[Handa]

A buddy ordered some RAM ($50) for his laptop, from a store in in the states.
They shipped it to him, when he opened the box, there were some really high end computer parts and 3ipods. The stuff easily costs over $2500 total.


Sorry if it's already answered, but did he receive the RAM that he originally ordered as well? If not he can say that he didnt receive his product and in lieu of the situation he is still waiting for the company to send him his product.

He ordered RAM and was visited by the iPod fairy... so in reality he should be compensated for his lost time and not getting what he paid for.

Ok, now as a reality check he should call the company (still assuming he didnt receive his RAM) and tell them he didn't receive his RAM...He SHOULD tell them about the items he DID receive. I would. But that's just me :|

[kuba]

wooohoo update.

Went to pick up my buddy to go chill downtown, anyways, they called him 3 TIMES!!!
First time, the lady sounded sorta rude, saying...
"Hi you called?"
him: Ya i'm returning your call
her: What's your order #?
him: tells her
her: Did you get your shipment?
him: yes
her: okay, puts him on hold, comes back a minute later, says okay thanks.


We're about to order some food in the drive-thru, it's her again.
her: There was an error in the shipment, your box has some stuff has some camera and other stuff
him: Well, my buddy picked up the box, i haven't seen him yet, so I don't know what's in it.
her: Well don't open it and we'll arrange for a UPS pick up now.
him: Hold on, what if my stuff is inside it, i'm not going to ship it out, if my things are in there.
her: They're not. Let's arrange a pick up now
him: No, I'm at work, right now and busy. I'm going to get my box later this week and I'm opening it, to get my stuff
her: Don't, it's not your stuff, we have to ship it to the proper customer
him: You mean, you haven't taken care of your customer yet? and you're making him wait for stuff he paid for and according to you, i have it?
That's crazy, I'm still opening the box to check if my RAM is in there.
---my buddy is pretty lippy, but i could hear her and she was f'in rude.
You can tell she wasn't going to get him any deal or slack----
He told her, I'll call you, when I open the box and if the stuff is in there, I'll call you guys.
She STILL INSISTED he doesn't open the box and she'll arrange for a pick-up today.
He told her, his buddy is at work, and he won't talk to him till later tonight.

She called AGAIN!!! like 15minutes later and insisted he doesn't open the box and just to arrange a pick-up or to call his friend who has the box.
He said, "uhhh no. that's a privacy issue and I'm not going to give you his #, you're bothering me at work and I'm dealing with a customer"...
I was pissing myself, because we were with our gf's. :lol:

So now we're wondering how they're so sure they have proof he has it?
I'm kinda on the boat that he keeps the **** because she's so ****in bitchy and annoying and very demanding. With that arrogant New York accent, sounds a lot like Rosie Perez, that whiney *****.

I'm for keeping it, but his gf said, they know you have it, so watch it.
**** it, tuck the **** away for awhile, deny, deny, deny.

I was for returning it, but after hearing what a ***** she was to him, without offering anything. pfff...screw you guys. :D

[Handa]

wooohoo update.

Went to pick up my buddy to go chill downtown, anyways, they called him 3 TIMES!!!
First time, the lady sounded sorta rude, saying...
"Hi you called?"
him: Ya i'm returning your call
her: What's your order #?
him: tells her
her: Did you get your shipment?
him: yes
her: okay, puts him on hold, comes back a minute later, says okay thanks.


We're about to order some food in the drive-thru, it's her again.
her: There was an error in the shipment, your box has some stuff has some camera and other stuff
him: Well, my buddy picked up the box, i haven't seen him yet, so I don't know what's in it.
her: Well don't open it and we'll arrange for a UPS pick up now.
him: Hold on, what if my stuff is inside it, i'm not going to ship it out, if my things are in there.
her: They're not. Let's arrange a pick up now
him: No, I'm at work, right now and busy. I'm going to get my box later this week and I'm opening it, to get my stuff
her: Don't, it's not your stuff, we have to ship it to the proper customer
him: You mean, you haven't taken care of your customer yet? and you're making him wait for stuff he paid for and according to you, i have it?
That's crazy, I'm still opening the box to check if my RAM is in there.
---my buddy is pretty lippy, but i could hear her and she was f'in rude.
You can tell she wasn't going to get him any deal or slack----
He told her, I'll call you, when I open the box and if the stuff is in there, I'll call you guys.
She STILL INSISTED he doesn't open the box and she'll arrange for a pick-up today.
He told her, his buddy is at work, and he won't talk to him till later tonight.

She called AGAIN!!! like 15minutes later and insisted he doesn't open the box and just to arrange a pick-up or to call his friend who has the box.
He said, "uhhh no. that's a privacy issue and I'm not going to give you his #, you're bothering me at work and I'm dealing with a customer"...
I was pissing myself, because we were with our gf's. :lol:

So now we're wondering how they're so sure they have proof he has it?
I'm kinda on the boat that he keeps the **** because she's so ****in bitchy and annoying and very demanding. With that arrogant New York accent, sounds a lot like Rosie Perez, that whiney *****.

I'm for keeping it, but his gf said, they know you have it, so watch it.
**** it, tuck the **** away for awhile, deny, deny, deny.

I was for returning it, but after hearing what a ***** she was to him, without offering anything. pfff...screw you guys. :D

Wow.

First of all, he did a good job in responding to what she said with a very likely story (still considering that he wants to keep the items). She is being very rude for representing the people that made the original mistake. Although, they know he has those items because he either signed for the package or they know it was delivered to him, so they're irritated that he isnt co-operating with them.

two things he can do, as a dissatisfied customer who never received his original order and is going through all this "hassle":

a) return the items that aren't his, and then wait for his ram. refuse to pay for the ram and return it, which will cost them money. (a direct, unopened UPS return from the customer back to seller costs the seller, not the customer).

b) return the items ONLY after he has received his ram/reimbursement for all the "trouble" they've caused.

All of the above is still assuming I'm on his side and I'm considering the seller to be at fault.

[Happy13178]

what company is this?

[Happy13178]

Two wrongs doesn't make a right, but it does sometimes make you feel good.

Do the terms corporate greed mean anything to you? Corporations have been squeezing us for absolutely every last possible penny for a long time now. They could easily make profit and not screw us around, but they don't. They try to maximize their profits by any means necessary, which usually means screwing most of their customers.

I say screw them back. You won't often get that chance, so take advantage of it when you do. It doesn't make it right, but it does feel good.

Totally agree. Would they go out of their way to help you if positions were reversed? Would they be helpful in resolving things? Having dealt with many of the major chains, the answer is a resounding NO (with a few noteable exceptions, but they're extremely rare).

The company can take the hit, or UPS can take the hit (god knows they've screwed up enough peoples' days), but not your buddy. Is this company dealing with the other customer properly? Are they sending him the items he paid for? Nope, they're making him wait until they gets their stuff back and THEN sending it to him. Bad form in every respect. Screw them, and maybe they'll get their act together next time. Doubtful, but maybe.

[kuba]

Nope, we all decided (girls included) best thing to do, let them ****in sweat it out.

He's gonna pretend he didn't get the package till next week.
They can't accuse him of anything, it's just timing and scheduling.
He has the items, but his personal life is keeping him from getting the box.

Let the OTHER customer who isn't getting his **** get more pissed at them as a company and hopefully give them a negative review (and bad word of mouth advertising, the worse kind, which in itself is worth the money).
ASSUMING, they didn't send him his items yet, and really are waiting for this shipment.


She said that the other customer is waiting for his products, until this box is shipped back. That's really nice customer service. She mentioned the weight of the box, so that's how they might know (as I assume boxes are scanned, which contains the weight, another way of tracking...? hmmm interesting).

Either way, she was one rude *****.

[CanadaBoy]

Two wrongs doesn't make a right, but it does sometimes make you feel good.

Do the terms corporate greed mean anything to you? Corporations have been squeezing us for absolutely every last possible penny for a long time now. They could easily make profit and not screw us around, but they don't. They try to maximize their profits by any means necessary, which usually means screwing most of their customers.

I say screw them back. You won't often get that chance, so take advantage of it when you do. It doesn't make it right, but it does feel good.

Tell him to keep em, And if OP's friend goes to jail @ KP, Shaner can bust him out :cheesygri

[CanadaBoy]

wooohoo update.

Went to pick up my buddy to go chill downtown, anyways, they called him 3 TIMES!!!
First time, the lady sounded sorta rude, saying...
"Hi you called?"
him: Ya i'm returning your call
her: What's your order #?
him: tells her
her: Did you get your shipment?
him: yes
her: okay, puts him on hold, comes back a minute later, says okay thanks.


We're about to order some food in the drive-thru, it's her again.
her: There was an error in the shipment, your box has some stuff has some camera and other stuff
him: Well, my buddy picked up the box, i haven't seen him yet, so I don't know what's in it.
her: Well don't open it and we'll arrange for a UPS pick up now.
him: Hold on, what if my stuff is inside it, i'm not going to ship it out, if my things are in there.
her: They're not. Let's arrange a pick up now
him: No, I'm at work, right now and busy. I'm going to get my box later this week and I'm opening it, to get my stuff
her: Don't, it's not your stuff, we have to ship it to the proper customer
him: You mean, you haven't taken care of your customer yet? and you're making him wait for stuff he paid for and according to you, i have it?
That's crazy, I'm still opening the box to check if my RAM is in there.
---my buddy is pretty lippy, but i could hear her and she was f'in rude.
You can tell she wasn't going to get him any deal or slack----
He told her, I'll call you, when I open the box and if the stuff is in there, I'll call you guys.
She STILL INSISTED he doesn't open the box and she'll arrange for a pick-up today.
He told her, his buddy is at work, and he won't talk to him till later tonight.

She called AGAIN!!! like 15minutes later and insisted he doesn't open the box and just to arrange a pick-up or to call his friend who has the box.
He said, "uhhh no. that's a privacy issue and I'm not going to give you his #, you're bothering me at work and I'm dealing with a customer"...
I was pissing myself, because we were with our gf's. :lol:

So now we're wondering how they're so sure they have proof he has it?
I'm kinda on the boat that he keeps the **** because she's so ****in bitchy and annoying and very demanding. With that arrogant New York accent, sounds a lot like Rosie Perez, that whiney *****.

I'm for keeping it, but his gf said, they know you have it, so watch it.
**** it, tuck the **** away for awhile, deny, deny, deny.

I was for returning it, but after hearing what a ***** she was to him, without offering anything. pfff...screw you guys. :D

Don't return it, now matter how persistent she tries to be. They f*cked up and they should pay for it, not you. Tell him to keep them. Merry Christmas from the rich, greedy corporate bastards. :)

[YnD]

Obviously, keep it packed safely away for a few months waiting to see if anyone contacts you about it. Then keep it!

[kuba]

HOLY CRAP THIS GETS BETTER...he showed me a Nikon D70s camera, that also came in the box.
He didn't wanna show me right away, because he wanted to see how I would react without it, in the box.
He's right, I would have said keep it from the get go, geeezus.
lol

[15-20_God]

now how do you guys differentiate this between stealing?

[Badman]

lol funny story, and the moral of the story is to keep whatever you get :lol:

[kuba]

now how do you guys differentiate this between stealing?

Stealing, s-t-e-a-l-i-n-g
Someone else's fcuk up, S-o-m-e-o-n-e e-l-s-e-'-s f-...
you get the idea... ;) lol

[15-20_God]

Stealing, s-t-e-a-l-i-n-g
Someone else's fcuk up, S-o-m-e-o-n-e e-l-s-e-'-s f-...
you get the idea... ;) lol

like when I pick up your lost wallet or your gf is passed out drunk on my couch? i guess that gives me carte blanche to do whatever the hell i want.

[computer01]

I'm kinda on the boat that he keeps the **** because she's so ****in bitchy and annoying and very demanding. With that arrogant New York accent, sounds a lot like Rosie Perez, that whiney *****.


Man... I was on the fence until that comment. Damn, that voice is annoying!

Honestly though, one way or another, the stuff should be returned. If I had received the phone calls that your friend received though, I'd be asking to speak to the highest ranking person at the company and demanding a few things:

First and foremost: A genuine apology for the rudeness of the employee.
Secondly: An apology for their mistake which cost me time and patience.
Thirdly: An immediate shipment and proof of tracking of my original order - price to be negotiated for the hassle.

If they weren't willing to accommodate my requests, then it would just be another week before I could go and pick up the package. We'd soon see who would cave first.

[MadCow]

Since you said the packing slip only contained the RAM that your friend ordered, I would have told the rep on the phone that "I have received my package and everything I ordered is in it. I have the packing slip to prove it." I would then procede to hang up and block the phone number.

Problem solved.

[kuba]

like when I pick up your lost wallet or your gf is passed out drunk on my couch? i guess that gives me carte blanche to do whatever the hell i want.

"Like"!, someone did a few years ago (wallet) and I never saw it again.
Secondly, you wouldn't get anywhere near my gf if you tried.
If you did, well, "like", I'll let you use your imagination as to what would happen.
Drunk gf analogy bad, wallet good.

[drucillica]

Wow i'm surprised at the responses here. Then again, this is RFD.

Something similar happened to me recently. I ordered something from overstock.com and I got my order along with someone else's order. I contacted overstock.com and sent the other person's order back without giving it a second thought.

[module]

Dont be greedy though, if you plan on keeping the things just resell it here on RFD and dont open the package or it loses its value.

With the money you make you can buy the ram locally for a bit more but at least you have your ram plus some money.


And in this case, this isnt stealing, not when something is given to you. Well at least in this case its not stolen merchandise. You shouldnt be held responsible for their mistakes. And to prove how low their customer service is, we now can see that that shipment you received which was suppose to goto another customer isnt going to be sent out until you send in your stuff.

At that rate, the company will probably have to hold off production if theyr going to be holding off sh*t like that.

[kuba]

Man... I was on the fence until that comment. Damn, that voice is annoying!

Honestly though, one way or another, the stuff should be returned. If I had received the phone calls that your friend received though, I'd be asking to speak to the highest ranking person at the company and demanding a few things:

First and foremost: A genuine apology for the rudeness of the employee.
Secondly: An apology for their mistake which cost me time and patience.
Thirdly: An immediate shipment and proof of tracking of my original order - price to be negotiated for the hassle.

If they weren't willing to accommodate my requests, then it would just be another week before I could go and pick up the package. We'd soon see who would cave first.

Ya ethically this is the right way to go about it, but the way rep was on the phone (he was on speakerphone and we were all nodding our heads thinking "what a bit*h").
Think we're gonna let them sweat it out for a bit.
Talked to a buddy at a store that also does e-commerce and he said, they have insurance for these things when being shipped, so that might play into it for the store.
We'll see what happens.

[15-20_God]

"Like"!, someone did a few years ago (wallet) and I never saw it again.

crappy feeling that somoene else wrongfully kept something of yours ain't it?

Secondly, you wouldn't get anywhere near my gf if you tried.
If you did, well, "like", I'll let you use your imagination as to what would happen.

i was using an example. i wouldn't want to get within 10 ft. of your 'girl'friend. my imagination tells me you guys are related.

[kuba]

Dont be greedy though, if you plan on keeping the things just resell it here on RFD and dont open the package or it loses its value.

With the money you make you can buy the ram locally for a bit more but at least you have your ram plus some money.


And in this case, this isnt stealing, not when something is given to you. Well at least in this case its not stolen merchandise. You shouldnt be held responsible for their mistakes. And to prove how low their customer service is, we now can see that that shipment you received which was suppose to goto another customer isnt going to be sent out until you send in your stuff.

At that rate, the company will probably have to hold off production if theyr going to be holding off sh*t like that.


My buddy said he doesn't plan on selling it at all.
What happens if he does sell it and someone takes it in for repair, serial # gets listed and could be traced right? For the camera.
The iPods, no biggie, he's got 5 to deal with, 3 from them, 2 from his family (his brother and his own).

[kuba]

crappy feeling that somoene else wrongfully kept something of yours ain't it?

Ya but I got over it. ;)

i was using an example. i wouldn't want to get within 10 ft. of your 'girl'friend. my imagination tells me you guys are related.
...says the guy whose avatar looks like the family that may have coined and originated the term "inbreeding".

[Rosico]

Word to the Kuba: have fun going toe to toe with 15-20 God ...

I'd love to see a pic of all the box and the loot.

[kuba]

Hope your "word"ing me wasn't being facetious ;)

[najibs]

...says the guy whose avatar looks like the family that may have coined and originated the term "inbreeding".

That'll surely awaken the gawd. This should be interesting :cheesygri

[kuba]

Awww look groupies with brown noses. :)

[15-20_God]

Ya but I got over it.

but like a rash in an inconvenient place, some things you're better off never experiencing it at all.

...says the guy whose avatar looks like the family that may have coined and originated the term "inbreeding".

kuba is an old family name of ours.

[kuba]

but like a rash in an inconvenient place, some things you're better off never experiencing it at all.

True, but $hit happens.
What's the old adage, "nice guys finish last..."?

kuba is an old family name of ours.
Well that being said, you started with the insult, yet, it comes full circle and bites you in the a..., to your admission of "kuba" being an old family name.

A wise man once said..."doh"!

[najibs]

Awww look groupies with brown noses. :)

I bet you've already brown nosed your buddy to get one of the free ipods, eh?

[surge]

return it all. just out of morale. what's wrong with people these days?

[TenzoR]

problem with these situation is, if everything works out fine, you get away with some nice new stuff, but if everything else goes wrong, you'd be kicking yourself on why didn't you just return it in the first place

it's up to your friend to decide if it's "worth" the risk

[kuba]

I bet you've already brown nosed your buddy to get one of the free ipods, eh?

Wow, so creative. Too bad, I never cared for iPods or any other portable music devices...huh ;)

[15-20_God]

True, but $hit happens.
What's the old adage, "nice guys finish last..."?

and the bad ones end up in jail?

Well that being said, you started with the insult, yet, it comes full circle and bites you in the a..., to your admission of "kuba" being an old family name.

you could be my sister three times removed. do you have a mullet too?

[najibs]

Wow, so creative. Too bad, I never cared for iPods or any other portable music devices...huh ;)

whatever floats your boat, my friend.

[Rosico]

ha ha ha, back on topic in off topic:

what company was this that he ordered from?

[kuba]

and the bad ones end up in jail?
George Bush, President of the most powerful nation in the world, possibly one of the biggest crooks.
Wait, most politicans are to begin with, to name a few.

you could be my sister three times removed. do you have a mullet too?

Mullet, me? You kidding? Give some nutjub a chance to pull on it, if things get ugly in grappling match? Not a chance.

[najibs]

Give some nutjub a chance to pull on it

:lol:

[m77m7]

Can't the friend say as soon as he got the package, he didn't open it and shipped it to a friend in (put overseas destination here) as a gift with some nice wrapping paper?? :)

I would only return it if they compensated me for the trouble very generously.

[15-20_God]

George Bush, President of the most powerful nation in the world, possibly one of the biggest crooks.
Wait, most politicans are to begin with, to name a few.

so monkey boy has been stealing ipods too?


Mullet, me? You kidding? Give some nutjub a chance to pull on it, if things get ugly in grappling match? Not a chance.

if it comes down to a street fight i'll certainly be tugging at something, and it won't be your hair. i fight dirty. and that's another reason why i don't fight chicks.

[kuba]

Monkey boy isn't stealing iPods, but perhaps his daughters are.
He's got his hands in oil, (price gouging oil prices, or at least helping OPEC make their cut), something a lot more worse than petty iPod theft.

[FuNPoLiCe001]

now how do you guys differentiate this between stealing?

"Stealing cable is wrong. But cable companies are big faceless corporations that make it alright."

If it were me I don't think I'd keep it though. What if Joe Schmoe who made the shipping error gets fired over this and he really needed the job? And the dollars involved (it sounds like you're talking about several thousand dollars worth of stuff) make it risky from a legal stand point.

I wonder what'd happen though if you took say...one of the ipods before getting UPS to pick it up. They'd probably accuse you of stealing, but you could always blame it on their shipping error. :confused:

[NiMSo]

There was another thread describing a lost wallet, and questioning what people would do. In that case, it seems most people blabbed on about returning everything, etc. and that it was the right thing to do.

Now, in this thread, many people are saying it's their (the company's) mistake, so that justifies keeping it. Umm, WTF? So, in a situation where it's a wallet, and it was the owner's mistake of losing it, then it was wrong to keep it. But if a company makes a mistake, it's OK?

I think that's wrong. No matter who's at fault, the fact of the matter is that you are keeping something that you rightfully understand is not yours!!! Especially if they realized the mistake and are asking you about it. What? You're going to boldy lie about it? That makes it so much worse...

[steve.m]

be nice..... send them a thank you card.

[danfromwaterloo]

A buddy ordered some RAM ($50) for his laptop, from a store in in the states.
They shipped it to him, when he opened the box, there were some really high end computer parts and 3ipods. The stuff easily costs over $2500 total.

They called him, but he didn't answer yet, not knowing what to do (yet).

He said he was thinking of keeping it, I told him not to (telling him, how would he feel if his order of a couple of thousand, went to someone else's house).
His argument was, not his fault, the store is responsible and will deal with that customer by paying him back fully or shipping him a new shipment.

My buddies and I are sort of split on this.
Some say give it up, others say screw it and keep it.
What would you guys do?

I told him he'll go to jail if he doesn't...lmao

Doh, forgot to add, he said if they call, he'll just admit to getting his RAM and deny everything else. His words "prove it".

There's no way of knowing for certain that what he received is not RAM. Therefore, he'll never get busted.

That being said, it's no different than stealing. Just because you can get away with it, doesn't make it okay.

If you could kill someone and get away with it would you?

Same thing, only less extreme.

[Riffer]

What' the problem?

They offered to have UPS pick it up.

Tell your buddy to send it back.

$2500 worth of stuff isn't worth your soul.

[ratface]

$2500 worth of stuff isn't worth your soul.

+1

Treat others the way you would want to be treated.
You will feel much better in the long run.
Unless you think the purpose of life is to collect as many ipods as possible.

[Happy13178]

"Stealing cable is wrong. But cable companies are big faceless corporations that make it alright."

If it were me I don't think I'd keep it though. What if Joe Schmoe who made the shipping error gets fired over this and he really needed the job? And the dollars involved (it sounds like you're talking about several thousand dollars worth of stuff) make it risky from a legal stand point.

I wonder what'd happen though if you took say...one of the ipods before getting UPS to pick it up. They'd probably accuse you of stealing, but you could always blame it on their shipping error. :confused:

There's dozens, if not hundreds, of Joe Schmoes working at these companies that need to be fired. If they really needed the job, they'd do better. As for the legal standpoint, ever hear of the term "possession is 9/10ths of the law"? If they can't prove it, and they won't compensate buddy for their stupidity, they get nothing.

If you want to confuse them, send back the box with a random other item in it, like a USB hub or something. See what they say.

[15-20_God]

As for the legal standpoint, ever hear of the term "possession is 9/10ths of the law"?

yes, if i hit you over the head and took your jordans, legally they would belong to me because I am in possession of them.

[ratface]

The CSR was probably being evasive because she was afraid that if you knew the contents of the box, you would be more likely to try to keep it. Looks like those fears were justified.

Also, it's possible that they have already taken care of the other customer, but are telling you that he is waiting for the return perhaps hoping you will be more sympathetic to him 'an individual' than to their company.

[Happy13178]

yes, if i hit you over the head and took your jordans, legally they would belong to me because I am in possession of them.

Yes, and self defence laws would let me shoot you in the head in return.

[oldburger]

Do Not send that box back to them.
I will be very dissapointed in you if you do. If God didn't want you to have that nice stuff, he would have never made the shipper send it to you. It's your's, end of story. Next time they call, tell them that you recieved your order, and you will leave them a good review, thanks.

[15-20_God]

Yes, and self defence laws would let me shoot you in the head in return.

yes, and common law would allow me to sue you for everything you have, so in the end i would have all your money and your shoes.

[kuba]

This is getting a bit stretched, however, sue him for what?
He was acting in self defense, you initiated the the contact (hitting on head).
Case closed.

[15-20_God]

This is getting a bit stretched, however, sue him for what?
He was acting in self defense, you initiated the the contact (hitting on head).


excessive force causing permanent injury and loss of income.

[kuba]

You knock someone on the head, may be deemed to be excessive as well.
Like I said, you instigate a knock to the head (for no reason), the judge more likely than not, will laugh at tell you to get get out of the courtroom. "NNNext!".

[15-20_God]

You knock someone on the head, may be deemed to be excessive as well.
Like I said, you instigate a knock to the head (for no reason), the judge more likely than not, will laugh at tell you to get get out of the courtroom. "NNNext!".

I think the judge would be more likely to think that shooting someone in the head is too excessive and will force the defendant to be my butler and I will be laughing. I rest my case!!

[najibs]

I think the judge would be more likely to think that shooting someone in the head is too excessive and will force the defendant to be my butler and I will be laughing. I rest my case!!

I think you two just need to scrap it out.

[15-20_God]

I think you two just need to scrap it out.

i've already stated earlier that i don't fight chicks. i'll wrestle with them though.

[kuba]

You've also inadvertently admitted to inbreeding.
http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3812453#post3812453

As for Najibs, well, I think there's a lot more brown than just his nose.
I won't say anymore than that. You can figure it out for yourself right Najib. ;)

[kingsley]

If you want to confuse them, send back the box with a random other item in it, like a USB hub or something. See what they say.

haahhaa this is an awesome idea. Yeah, take all the stuff out, go to futureshop and buy three cheap routers and send that back to them.

[kuba]

Or put the actual RAM inside the box and send it back.
The thought has crossed his mind. Not a bad idea actually.

[kuba]

I couldn't help it. Your girlfriend wanted it in the poop shoot.

Najib, you didn't quite get it, try again, simpleton. ;)
Or are you gonna make some petty "you want an iPod" comment again?
Very weak (minded?).

[najibs]

Najib, you didn't quite get it, try again, simpleton. ;)
Or are you gonna make some petty "you want an iPod" comment again?
Very weak (minded?).

Exactly, I didn't get it, but your girlfriend certainly did.

[farooq7]

If the packing slip only lists the items he ordered then they have no way of proving those extra items were in the box. If that's the case, they don't have a leg to stand on.

What do you mean they have nothing to stand on..... They now have something better and its this message board hahah, bud I think you just screwed your friend over.

[15-20_God]

You've also inadvertently admitted to inbreeding.
http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3812453#post3812453

i thought i made it quite obvious. i guess i have to talk easy much more now for some people to get things and use short words.

[ynot]

now how do you guys differentiate this between stealing?
Agreed.

He's been contacted and they obviously know what he has received. He should return the items, then when his item is received, reject it and never deal with the company again.

[x86asm]

You should return it but at the stores expense. I ordered samples of some mirochips from some company and they sent me some huge ass roll of some chips I didn't ask for. Some lady called me back from the company and told me that they will send someone to pick it up and man did they act fast.

[ynot]

My buddy said he doesn't plan on selling it at all.
What happens if he does sell it and someone takes it in for repair, serial # gets listed and could be traced right? For the camera.
The iPods, no biggie, he's got 5 to deal with, 3 from them, 2 from his family (his brother and his own).
Why's it matter if the serial number is traced? According to you and your friend, it's not stolen and he's under the impression that he's entitled.

[ynot]

Yes, and self defence laws would let me shoot you in the head in return.
Good luck with that defence.

[batman321123]

Do Not send that box back to them.
I will be very dissapointed in you if you do. If God didn't want you to have that nice stuff, he would have never made the shipper send it to you. It's your's, end of story. Next time they call, tell them that you recieved your order, and you will leave them a good review, thanks.

LOL. It's a sign from God, dammit.

Anyhow, I've realized that opinions are really split in this thread (it should have a poll) as opposed to the wallet thread. I think the reason for that is because many people dislike corporations for one reason or another. I never read the whole thread, but did the OP mention which company the goods came from?

[Steeve Urkel]

Or put the actual RAM inside the box and send it back.
The thought has crossed his mind. Not a bad idea actually.

Lol,

that would be good.
Then the company couldn't accuse him of not sending the package back!

I think this is why companies have insurance for and why customers should always insure their packages when they buy stuff!

I haven't had any major orders screwed up myself....but did just receive an item I ordered from FS that I paid for 2 months ago.
My Visa was credited because the shipment was "lost in transit".

I'm not going to bother updating the store as it will just be more of a headache..the item was supposed to be free after rebate anyways, so no big deal there.

But if some store sent me a bunch of items I didn't order I'd probably send part of it back....maybe....depending what the receipt said.

Hopefully the company won't go and charge your buddy's credit card...that could get nasty if they have his CC # on file.

then i guess he could always file for unauthorized charges.... :lol:

keep us updated anyways ;)

[Steeve Urkel]

What do you mean they have nothing to stand on..... They now have something better and its this message board hahah, bud I think you just screwed your friend over.

For all you know this could be a "hypothetical situation" or a what if...

Also, he didn't name the company so what can they really do?

there are thousands of computer stores out there... ;)

[15-20_God]

I think this is why companies have insurance for and why customers should always insure their packages when they buy stuff!


Can you elaborate on that? I always thought shipping insurance only applied when an item was damaged during transit or if a package were lost. I didn't know insurance also covered shipping errors to a traceable address.

[van]

It's a moral dilemma. Obviously the right thing to do would be to return it (and I wouldn't deal with anyone on here that thinks otherwise). It wasn't his to begin with and he's a scum bag for keeping it, period. And by the store calling, looks like they are already aware of the miss-shipment. If he paid by CC, they might charge him for the items if they aren't returned.

[module]

They cannot charge him for something he didnt purchase. They already collected for the ram, any other charge is illegal on the coorperate's end of the side.

What, you think companies can charge you for as much as they want whenever they want? They can only process the charge based on its transaction, what excuse do they have?

"We've sent out the incorrect package, charged him for the ram, and still didnt receive the ram"....Yeah real smart

[van]

...I think that's wrong. No matter who's at fault, the fact of the matter is that you are keeping something that you rightfully understand is not yours!!! Especially if they realized the mistake and are asking you about it. What? You're going to boldy lie about it? That makes it so much worse...

Exactly.

[123]

In Ontario, for example, the Consumer Protection Act says that a recipient of something he didn't request (an unsolicited good) is free to do whatever he wants with it (keep it, destroy it, etc) with no legal obligation whatsoever. But the first exception to the definition of an "unsolicited good" states "does not include goods that the recipient knows or ought to know are intended for another person". While this doesn't mean that it's a criminal act to refuse to cooperate with them and return the package, I don't see why a judge wouldn't side with the company considering they offered the UPS pick-up (and assuming your friend wouldn't go as far as lying in court).

[scottmcl]

Keep 1 ipod...

Ship the rest back!!!!!

[m77m7]

In Ontario, for example, the Consumer Protection Act says that a recipient of something he didn't request (an unsolicited good) is free to do whatever he wants with it (keep it, destroy it, etc) with no legal obligation whatsoever.
Have a link to that?

[kuba]

Well, another buddy suggested, just claim it was stolen from the car, which, what if, that genuinely did happen? lol

Or someone mentioned, WHAT IF, he actually did get the bag and they were still calling and harassing him, claiming he had the stuff and he really didn't?


The other thing, he cancelled his credit card, called them up and said he lost it at a bar. So no fear of being charged anything extra.

The manager of the store, called him twice the other day, left messages.
Buddy returned the calls, talked to him and the guy was much more pleasant to deal with.
Basically my buddy still admitted to not knowing the contents of the box, because he hasn't had time to see it yet. But he did tell the manager, that if the contents he claims are in the box, he'll call him early next week and tell him. *playing that nice guy role*

The manager said the box was mislabelled.
Wrong, because remember, the invoice was for the $50 RAM, the labels were fine, it's the contents that were wrong.

It's tough
3 iPods (don't know the sizes, don't care, didn't ask)
SanDisk mp3 player
a $700 camera (said $600, but it's actually $700)
3 high speed CF cards
an enermax 500W power supply
nvidia graphics card (dunno which one)
4 sd cards
1 sony memory stick duo pro card 4gigs
and a couple of other things.

[aquariaguy]

It's tough
3 iPods (don't know the sizes, don't care, didn't ask)
SanDisk mp3 player
a $700 camera (said $600, but it's actually $700)
3 high speed CF cards
an enermax 500W power supply
nvidia graphics card (dunno which one)
4 sd cards
1 sony memory stick duo pro card 4gigs
and a couple of other things.

Haha yea right. Nice story. Such random things all at once. Hmm..

[kuba]

...and you're a ******.

[frankies]

^ LOL :lol:

Well if I was your friend, I'd definitely keep the items

[kuba]

It's honestly a tough call, because of the "what if" scenario...
meaning, do they have anything else to prove that he definitely has these items in his posession.
He can tuck this $hit away for a few months and say, look I got my RAM, what do you want from me? Simple enough, but at the same time, complicated if it gets to be that way.

[van]

The manager said the box was mislabelled.
Wrong, because remember, the invoice was for the $50 RAM, the labels were fine, it's the contents that were wrong.


One of thier shippers probably screwed up and placed the invoice packing slip on the wrong box. So the other guy got the ram and your buddy got his stuff. This happened a couple of times at the company I used to run. It was when we hired new shippers, and one of the screw ups involved several items on pallets costing major money. Luckily we had honest people on the recieving end and all was returned intact.

[aquariaguy]

...and you're a ******.

And we all know it's not your "friend", it's really you. Karma's a biaaaaatch.

[rajab04]

Just forget it. friendship is more valuable to me.

[123]

In Ontario, for example, the Consumer Protection Act says that a recipient of something he didn't request (an unsolicited good) is free to do whatever he wants with it (keep it, destroy it, etc) with no legal obligation whatsoever.
Have a link to that?

Yep.

http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/DBLaws/Statutes/English/02c30_e.htm#BK14

No supplier shall demand payment or make any representation that suggests that a consumer is required to make payment in respect of any unsolicited goods or services despite their use, receipt, misuse, loss, damage or theft.

And here's the definition and the first exception:

In this section, “unsolicited goods or services” means,
(a) goods that are supplied to a consumer who did not request them but does not include,
(i) goods that the recipient knows or ought to know are intended for another person

[mrG]

It's honestly a tough call, because of the "what if" scenario...
meaning, do they have anything else to prove that he definitely has these items in his posession.
He can tuck this $hit away for a few months and say, look I got my RAM, what do you want from me? Simple enough, but at the same time, complicated if it gets to be that way.

Come on, admit it, it was you and not your friend. :cheesygri

And now that you know it's not legal, just return it. You had your fun.

[killbillvol1]

WTF's so difficult about this? Do the right thing and return the stuff, just make sure they pay for shipping.

[LeeBear]

You can argue all you want about morals, but I think the guy should keep the package. The company has no grounds to sue him because it was there mistake and you didn't do anything wrong. If the delivery person had giving you the wrong package that was address to someone else and you signed for it and kept the goods then you'll have a problem, but since the package was addressed to you(or your 'friend') it's not theft.

Another reason to keep the package is the old saying nice guys finish last. If you try to do the good thing and return the package you are going to risk paying custom/duties taxes since this company is so nice to arrange a UPS pickup they could very arrange it that the shipper (you/friend) handles the custom/duties and you end up with a huge ass bill later on. Also if I'm correct you didn't get your RAM that you order? This company is so kind to offer to pick up there stuff back but did they offer to get your RAM to you in as speedy a manner? To me it looks like the company has forgetten that you are a customer as well and has made no effort to get your order to you, they just want the order they messed up on back. Why should you care if they don't care?

-LeeBear

[m77m7]

What ended up happening here?

[awestruck]

He probably ran out of ideas on how to continue his story.

[Spray]

I'd do the same thing I'd do if I found someones wallet...return it. This is a company trying to make money, pay their employees and try to turn a profit. Your friend stealing $2500 of THEIR merchandise puts a dent on their turnover.

and have you ever though on the person who screwed up the shipping on their end? I'm sure his job is in the balance and he's just praying the person will have the good decency to send it back.

It's really no different than walking up to the store window, breaking it and stealing the merchandise. It's theft plain and simple.

[CheapScotsman]

Its pretty obvious from this thread that a lot of people are having trouble with basic moral values.

If I read this thread correctly, the guy ends up with some items that have serial numbers on them ... and I'm not getting the warm and fuzzy that the shipping invoice has these serial numbers on them... What to prevent the store from calling the cops, reporting the serial numbers stolen, telling the cops that it was an inside/outside job; the inside guy has been handled but the outside guys is the receipient?

Not only that, they have his credit card number and coudl probably reek some good havoc on his credit rating ... or add him to one of the growing credit card black ball sites.

Not only that, if the store in the States gets a judgement against your buddy (and $2500 in some states might be over small claim court action) and can get it elevated to the state/federal level ... boy, I sure wouldn't want to be your buddy and try and cross the border ... he will never know what hit him.