Buying a used car story......

[jcl]

Okay so the wife and I purchased a used 2001 civic from a couple 2 days ago.....

Car is great, clean, low kms, good deal, has warrenty up to 160kms which my wife is currently transffering to us, hopefully!

The problem is, the struts are ****ed, and teh sellers didn't mention a word to us, and got it saftied by his neighbour the day of the sale.

So we called them today, and asked them about the struts, and she said oh i thought it wasnt a safety issue or something and honda said they needed to be replaced soon, when she brought the car into honda to be serviced under warrenty a week before we bought it, why didn't honda replace the struts?

I'm so pissed, they know we have two kids, and we had them in the new car, and they didnt mention ONE word about the struts or any other problems...

law suit in the making?

[15-20_God]

caveat emptor on buying a used car.
if a law suit were filed for every used car sale that went bad......

[bunga]

simple answer, Honda extended warranty doesn't cover struts

and if they're leaking, it's still possible to pass safety, if you have concerns about the safety test, call the ministry and ask them where you can take it to have it inspected

while you're having the car inspected, check on the compliance bushings (the bushings closest to the front of the car on the lower control arm where it meets the frame), I'll bet you $20 that they're starting to crack if not completely broken apart

[jcl]

simple answer, Honda extended warranty doesn't cover struts

and if they're leaking, it's still possible to pass safety, if you have concerns about the safety test, call the ministry and ask them where you can take it to have it inspected

while you're having the car inspected, check on the compliance bushings (the bushings closest to the front of the car on the lower control arm where it meets the frame), I'll bet you $20 that they're starting to crack if not completely broken apart

wow, very nice...

are you 100% sure the warrenty doesnt cover the struts, because I see in the carfax report they were replaced at 40,000

[Kurtz7834]

You have no legal recourse, unfortunately.

Most auto experts advocate never buying a used car without having it fully inspected by an independent mechanic.

I would add in a qualifier though - unless you 100% trust the seller.

Even if the seller is 100% honest though sh*t sometimes happens to old cars shortly after the transaction and it's sometimes noone's fault.

The only recourse you MAY have is that I assume this car was certified by a mechanic and it sounds like maybe it shouldn't have with this strut problem. I don't know enough about the rules though and if that's a major safety issue. Maybe a trained mechanic can help out and comment here if any are reading.

[jcl]

Well we found the car on craigslist, it was on trader as well...

The sellers are young couple with 3 kids, and they wanted to upgrade the vehicle to something bigger, they seemed very honest and friendly, and I had no reason to suspect any problem.

The day of buying the vehicle, we were driving on the 401, and everytime we went over a bump it would make a rattling noise, like a machine gun.....

They knew about this, and they failed to say anything, very nice.....and now i hear the warrenty doesnt cover struts? man o man, people these days.

[bunga]

110% it's not covered, honda extended never covers struts

those '01 Civic struts are junk, they were likely replaced at 40k km with the same junk, there wasn't an updated part till 2004 I think

if you're lucky, you may find a dealer that will goodwill the struts for you, but unlikely since you just bought the car

wow, very nice...

are you 100% sure the warrenty doesnt cover the struts, because I see in the carfax report they were replaced at 40,000

[jcl]

Oh man, I'm upset, but boy my wife is going to snap, this shoudl be interesting, after all shes paying for this car. :P

[jcl]

110% it's not covered, honda extended never covers struts

those '01 Civic struts are junk, they were likely replaced at 40k km with the same junk, there wasn't an updated part till 2004 I think

if you're lucky, you may find a dealer that will goodwill the struts for you, but unlikely since you just bought the car

That's insane struts needing to be replaced twice, and the car is 2001, with only 109,000kms, wtf?

My acura has 180kms, still going strong on its first struts.

[Andro]

That's insane struts needing to be replaced twice, and the car is 2001, with only 109,000kms, wtf?

My acura has 180kms, still going strong on its first struts.

so this only happenes when you go over speed bumps, this creaking sound? are you sure these are struts?

[konfusion666]

on that particular vehicle, if you hear a creak/rattling/vibration only when you go over bad parts of the road, or driving on rough roads....

... couldn't it just be the infamous "dashboard rattling problem"... which can affect a car by any manufacturer (except maybe Lexus ;)

[jcl]

so this only happenes when you go over speed bumps, this creaking sound? are you sure these are struts?

Well I only drove the car once, it's my wifes car, she said if she goes over bumps its like a clattering noise, but if the roads are smooth,there is no noise........she also adds that the rear is very bouncy, but I think that's common in stock rear civic suspension...

[jcl]

on that particular vehicle, if you hear a creak/rattling/vibration only when you go over bad parts of the road, or driving on rough roads....

... couldn't it just be the infamous "dashboard rattling problem"... which can affect a car by any manufacturer (except maybe Lexus ;)

I'll take the car for a spin tonight ,she said it sounds like its coming from underneath somewhere, and its annoying. she was very happy to get the car, but that just spoiled her mood.

[jerryhung]

Remind me to not ever buy from private seller

I love used cars, but used cars from dealers only (not private independent dealers either).
BMW certified series on used cars offers some comfort, I imagine other companies have something similar too (like Honda used cars, Toyota used cars, etc.)

[jcl]

Remind me to not ever buy from private seller

I love used cars, but used cars from dealers only (not private independent dealers either).
BMW certified series on used cars offers some comfort, I imagine other companies have something similar too (like Honda used cars, Toyota used cars, etc.)

The car is in great shape, its a nice car, but this one problem...i dunno i hope we can sort it out without having to dish out anymore money, **** we just paid $600 on taxes at the ministry yesterday.

[konfusion666]

on a 2001 civic there are lots of possible sources for rattling/vibration, so rule out the common owner's-fault ones: when on your test drive, close all windows including sunroof and roof panel... turn off the radio, take your shiat out of the glovebox... and make sure the spare tire in the back doesnt have anything jiggling around (like the jacks).

if your in toronto it should be trivial to find a "bad" road since that's like 90% of them... even in the suburbs like Vaughan, hell the roads are even worse up there ;)

and yes the rear is very bouncy on this generation of the Civic. i dont know if its supposed to be like that because of the double-wishbone suspension.

anyways, the front struts leaking ARE a common problem with '01 civics, so really there isn't anything particularly unusual with your story...

[jcl]

on a 2001 civic there are lots of possible sources for rattling/vibration, so rule out the common owner's-fault ones: when on your test drive, close all windows including sunroof and roof panel... turn off the radio, take your shiat out of the glovebox... and make sure the spare tire in the back doesnt have anything jiggling around (like the jacks).

if your in toronto it should be trivial to find a "bad" road since that's like 90% of them... even in the suburbs like Vaughan, hell the roads are even worse up there ;)

and yes the rear is very bouncy on this generation of the Civic. i dont know if its supposed to be like that because of the double-wishbone suspension.

anyways, the front struts leaking ARE a common problem with '01 civics, so really there isn't anything particularly unusual with your story...

So I've read....

Besides the owner knowing about them, and not saying a word, and letting our two infants go in the back seat, while being parents themselves...grr.

I'm sure my wife will take care of the situation accordingly, she wont let this go down like this.

[arahaman]

My shadow (http://toronto.craigslist.org/car/148097872.html) and cavalier needed brand new front and rear shocks....my sister busted the rears flying over a speed bump :mad:

Anywho...If the car is bouncin then it needs shocks/struts....if its makin a creakin noise then it may be your ball joints or bearings, and a car needs shocks/struts to be saftied, when i sold my cavalier i had to put in brand new ones all around to get it saftied....and I wouldnt drive it on the highway until it gets fixed especially if it needs new balljoints...I drove my car once on the highway when the rear shocks were completely gone (dont ask why) and i was going eastbound on the 403 --> 401 ramp and I almost lost the rear end going over a bump....Sorry about the bad luck

[jcl]

My shadow (http://toronto.craigslist.org/car/148097872.html) and cavalier needed brand new front and rear shocks....my sister busted the rears flying over a speed bump :mad:

Anywho...If the car is bouncin then it needs shocks/struts....if its makin a creakin noise then it may be your ball joints or bearings, and a car needs shocks/struts to be saftied, when i sold my cavalier i had to put in brand new ones all around to get it saftied....and I wouldnt drive it on the highway until it gets fixed especially if it needs new balljoints...I drove my car once on the highway when the rear shocks were completely gone (dont ask why) and i was going eastbound on the 403 --> 401 ramp and I almost lost the rear end going over a bump....Sorry about the bad luck

We don't believe the noise is from the ball joints, when turning, theres no sounds...

It's more of a clattering noise, when going over a bump...

[bunga]

see my post, either struts or compliance bushings

I'll bet you money that the bushings need to be replaced

[jcl]

see my post, either struts or compliance bushings

I'll bet you money that the bushings need to be replaced

Well the wife just called, shes out with her mother/mother's friend shopping, she said with the weight in the car, the car didn't do it AT ALL, going over bumps too.....

I asked her to describe the sound when she's alone, she said "it sounds like those things on the road when your exiting the 401 E to the 400 N" lol

In other words, it sounds like rumble-strips...

[TrevorK]

So I've read....

Besides the owner knowing about them, and not saying a word, and letting our two infants go in the back seat, while being parents themselves...grr.

I'm sure my wife will take care of the situation accordingly, she wont let this go down like this.

Leaking struts don't neccessarily pose a safety issue.

The lesson to be learned here is, always get the car inspected at a shop you pick, and that you trust, before purchasing.


The seller doesn't legally have to do anything - they might, out of the kindness of their heart, but legally their obligation is nothing to you.

[jcl]

Leaking struts don't neccessarily pose a safety issue.

The lesson to be learned here is, always get the car inspected at a shop you pick, and that you trust, before purchasing.


The seller doesn't legally have to do anything - they might, out of the kindness of their heart, but legally their obligation is nothing to you.

Thanks for clarifying that for me, come on man.

[phillbert]

asymetric information man. does the civic use macpherson struts in the rear? if so, check the top mount. might have been installed inproperly.

[jcl]

asymetric information man. does the civic use macpherson struts in the rear? if so, check the top mount. might have been installed inproperly.

hell if i know, lol

[xtremedrunk]

The 7th gen civics have the macphersons up front but not in the back. The rear has a compact double wishbone setup. After reading this I wasn't suprised as I've read this is quite common with the 2001's. As I recall the main update to the 2002 models was to fix all the problems related to the suspension in the 2001 models. Not much you can do if it was sold as is.

[DISH]

Rule #1 when buying a used car. Do not trust the seller. Have everything verified by a trusted 3rd party.

Didn't you test drive the car ? Had a full inspection by a mechanic ?

It's only struts. That will set you back a $400-$500. Consider this as a cheap lesson.

[jcl]

Rule #1 when buying a used car. Do not trust the seller. Have everything verified by a trusted 3rd party.

Didn't you test drive the car ? Had a full inspection by a mechanic ?

It's only struts. That will set you back a $400-$500. Consider this as a cheap lesson.

My wife trusted the lady, i trusted her judgement, goes to show you, you can't trust ANYONE. i hate ppl seriously.

[dalinxz]

true struts should last long unless the car is driven badly, my car has original struts, 88 honda accord and one of the front ones and one of the back ones is just starting to go but just starting. btw car has 181000km

[Azxster]

LoL, your comparing your old rustbuckets to the modern cars.

Honda barely makes $ on car sales... so how else do they survive? Through service. If they make perfect cars, how is Honda going to operate?

[Amuthini]

i suggest you go to this website www.7thgen.com, go to the canadian buy and sale section, there is a full stock suspension for sale for only 100 bucks. you'll find that many of those people who mod their civic's suspension are selling their stock suspension for pretty cheap. and if you do decide to buy new shocks, don't replace em with that oem civic crap, get tokicos or kyb's i believe they have lifetime warranties. btw clattering noise over bumps might not be your shocks, sounds more like ball joints or something

[Dukes]

So I've read....

Besides the owner knowing about them, and not saying a word, and letting our two infants go in the back seat, while being parents themselves...grr.

I'm sure my wife will take care of the situation accordingly, she wont let this go down like this.


Are you the women in this relationship? I am confused. You sound like a clueless chick or a ten year old.

[Anessa]

So I've read....

Besides the owner knowing about them, and not saying a word, and letting our two infants go in the back seat, while being parents themselves...grr.

I'm sure my wife will take care of the situation accordingly, she wont let this go down like this.

Is your wife going to go all Jack Bauer on her butt? :lol:

[superdsi]

When you buy a used car. Always have it checked by your mechanic.
If the car is already certified tell the owner to certify it again.
They pay, you take it to your garage. Very basic stuff.

Didn't understand the comment about "they knew you had children."

If the owner sold the car to you with a defect but you were single it was all right. You must have one of those signs "Baby on Board."

[b0rk]

Oh man, I'm upset, but boy my wife is going to snap, this shoudl be interesting, after all shes paying for this car. :P

Sorry, but I couldnt continue to read the remainder of the thread if you have this mentality. I'm not married yet, but who in the right mind thinks like that? Especially when you said you have two kids, there's no "my money" and "her money" -- only "our money". What comes in is used for the family and what goes out comes out of the family.

I hope your car breaks apart. Shame on you.

[veryhuman]

Oh man, I'm upset, but boy my wife is going to snap, this shoudl be interesting, after all shes paying for this car. :P

:lol: wasnt it your idea to get the civic instead of the suzuki?

Sorry, but I couldnt continue to read the remainder of the thread if you have this mentality. I'm not married yet, but who in the right mind thinks like that? Especially when you said you have two kids, there's no "my money" and "her money" -- only "our money". What comes in is used for the family and what goes out comes out of the family.

I hope your car breaks apart. Shame on you.

hahaha jokes!

[cooljack]

Sorry, but I couldnt continue to read the remainder of the thread if you have this mentality. I'm not married yet, but who in the right mind thinks like that? Especially when you said you have two kids, there's no "my money" and "her money" -- only "our money". What comes in is used for the family and what goes out comes out of the family.

I hope your car breaks apart. Shame on you.


LOL totally agree here. Maybe his marriage is not healthy as what we all thought?

[belgiangenius]

That's insane struts needing to be replaced twice, and the car is 2001, with only 109,000kms, wtf?

My acura has 180kms, still going strong on its first struts.

Honda changed the Civic suspension in '01.

Previous models had the infamous double wishbone design at front and rear, typically found on expensive sport sedans.

In '01 they went with cheap struts, like most of the competition. The suspension is one reason I purchased my '96 Civic and the change of design is one reason I've never purchased a Civic since....that and the fact that the 01-06 models have all been uckin fugly.

[Eduardo]

LoL, your comparing your old rustbuckets to the modern cars.

Honda barely makes $ on car sales... so how else do they survive? Through service. If they make perfect cars, how is Honda going to operate?

That's funny, my "rustbucket civic" a 1993 had barely any repairs, the most major was when the knob on the heater busted off and I had to replace the whole unit.

Honda's reliability is well noted in comparison to many other manufacturers, me thinks they must be making their money elswhere.

[Tiberius]

If you can document that they had the car in at the dealership a week before the sale AND WERE INFORMED that the struts were shot - and they did not inform you of that... it gives you a little amunition.

Secondly, if you can get the car inspected ASAP and are told it should not have passed a safety/certification due to the shocks...

Then you would have a case to come back and them claiming the car was not in good enough shape to pass safety - and that in turn comes back to the mechanic who passed the car.

Overall - you are likely SOL... sorry... You can make a fuss about it and perhaps threaten to take legal action or whatever on the people who sold you the car - but I don't think you have a leg to stand on.... so the best you could hope for is that they would throw a small chunk of change your way to help pay for the new struts (maybe ask for them to pay for that repair... and then suggest 50/50... and just see if you can get anything out of them "in good faith".... since I'm guessing they were aware of the strut issue beforehand and must have a "little" guilt about it - but legally, I think they are sitting pretty)

[jcl]

Sorry, but I couldnt continue to read the remainder of the thread if you have this mentality. I'm not married yet, but who in the right mind thinks like that? Especially when you said you have two kids, there's no "my money" and "her money" -- only "our money". What comes in is used for the family and what goes out comes out of the family.

I hope your car breaks apart. Shame on you.

lol, is all i have to say :)

[jcl]

Are you the women in this relationship? I am confused. You sound like a clueless chick or a ten year old.

Sorry, but I can get brash :)

[jcl]

Sorry, but I couldnt continue to read the remainder of the thread if you have this mentality. I'm not married yet, but who in the right mind thinks like that? Especially when you said you have two kids, there's no "my money" and "her money" -- only "our money". What comes in is used for the family and what goes out comes out of the family.

I hope your car breaks apart. Shame on you.

It was a joke, take it easy!

[jcl]

[QUOTE=veryhuman]:lol: wasnt it your idea to get the civic instead of the suzuki?

Haha, u got me there...

[jcl]

LOL totally agree here. Maybe his marriage is not healthy as what we all thought?

Beautiful marriage, not a problem, thanks for your concern.

[jcl]

If you can document that they had the car in at the dealership a week before the sale AND WERE INFORMED that the struts were shot - and they did not inform you of that... it gives you a little amunition.

Secondly, if you can get the car inspected ASAP and are told it should not have passed a safety/certification due to the shocks...

Then you would have a case to come back and them claiming the car was not in good enough shape to pass safety - and that in turn comes back to the mechanic who passed the car.

Overall - you are likely SOL... sorry... You can make a fuss about it and perhaps threaten to take legal action or whatever on the people who sold you the car - but I don't think you have a leg to stand on.... so the best you could hope for is that they would throw a small chunk of change your way to help pay for the new struts (maybe ask for them to pay for that repair... and then suggest 50/50... and just see if you can get anything out of them "in good faith".... since I'm guessing they were aware of the strut issue beforehand and must have a "little" guilt about it - but legally, I think they are sitting pretty)

Thanks for the response, very helpful, if not we'll just pay for the repair, and get a pair of aftermark suspension...

[jcl]

Just to notify anyone that cares, took it down to honda and yes indeed, the struts are shot...and they have been for awhile.

So the car shouldn't have passed a safety.

[ratface]

The seller arranged his own safety through a 'neighbour' and made sure you knew his/her family situation while you were making the deal? Sound like a curbsider (http://www.readersdigest.ca/money/used-car.html) to me. Have you had any contact with them since?

[dgmorr]

Just to notify anyone that cares, took it down to honda and yes indeed, the struts are shot...and they have been for awhile.

So the car shouldn't have passed a safety.

Shocks are not part of a safety cert. Only the springs are.

You could always try to go after the mechanic that safetied the car, but again, the shocks are not part of the certificate whether you think it's safe with or without blown shocks.

[jcl]

The seller arranged his own safety through a 'neighbour' and made sure you knew his/her family situation while you were making the deal? Sound like a curbsider (http://www.readersdigest.ca/money/used-car.html) to me. Have you had any contact with them since?

Yes we have.

[jcl]

Shocks are not part of a safety cert. Only the springs are.

You could always try to go after the mechanic that safetied the car, but again, the shocks are not part of the certificate whether you think it's safe with or without blown shocks.

Ah, I'm just going by what Honda told us yesterday, they said the car shouldn't have passed safety with the struts blown.

I found a guy online that works at Honda willing to install a pair of his old struts for $150.

[belgiangenius]

Ah, I'm just going by what Honda told us yesterday, they said the car shouldn't have passed safety with the struts blown.

I found a guy online that works at Honda willing to install a pair of his old struts for $150.

Struts are a wear component, to some extent. There is no point in buying used ones. You'll just have to replace them much sooner, again.

[dgmorr]

Ah, I'm just going by what Honda told us yesterday, they said the car shouldn't have passed safety with the struts blown.


Take a look at the actual safety certificate and look in the suspension area. Ask another mechanic to deem it 'not roady worthy'. Then you'll have grounds for a lawsuit.

Your car uses Macpherson struts as opposed to shocks. I doubt they have a different certificate, but you may be able to argue that since the strut is a structural piece, it could be unsafe, etc etc.

[jcl]

Struts are a wear component, to some extent. There is no point in buying used ones. You'll just have to replace them much sooner, again.

Very good point, but we don't really have the money at the moment, and the car NEEDS struts ASAP, guy offered us OEM struts installed for $150, so im thinkinhg i'll do that until they go, and later on down the road i'll have the money to put some aftermarkets....

[dgmorr]

Very good point, but we don't really have the money at the moment, and the car NEEDS struts ASAP, guy offered us OEM struts installed for $150, so im thinkinhg i'll do that until they go, and later on down the road i'll have the money to put some aftermarkets....

Why do you absolutely need them? You can always drive around on blown shocks, but I hope you like a bumpy ride.

[jcl]

Why do you absolutely need them? You can always drive around on blown shocks, but I hope you like a bumpy ride.

Um because they are blown, thats why we need new ones? lol...

[frankeng2003]

I think you got off very cheap. Buying from private is always better than buying from a used car dealership. Last week, I was talking to an aquantance, and he told me that his friend is in the used car business. Turns out that his friend is making a lot of money buying cars from the US and selling them in canada. His friend bought a whole bunch of salvage vehicles from the New Orlean flooding, cleans them up and then sell em. Just imagine buying a car that had been flooding with salt water. It does hell to all the electrical connections, plus going to rust all over. Avoid buying any cars from the USA.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jcl
Ah, I'm just going by what Honda told us yesterday, they said the car shouldn't have passed safety with the struts blown.

I found a guy online that works at Honda willing to install a pair of his old struts for $150.

[dgmorr]

Um because they are blown, thats why we need new ones? lol...

If you're so strapped for cash, you don't absolutely need new ones. Wait until you can afford a brand new set as opposed to buying used.

[jcl]

If you're so strapped for cash, you don't absolutely need new ones. Wait until you can afford a brand new set as opposed to buying used.

Makes sense, can you recommend some?

[phillbert]

also, i dont think you have much recourse against the mechanic who certified your car. i read somewhere in the MTO website that you are SOL when it comes to these situations. how old are the used struts for $150? usually you replace struts as a set i.e. front and rear, because having newer struts on one end of the car will compromise handling greatly.

[Narci]

I'm a bit perplexed at this situation. Your bought a car and now your strapped for cash? Please say you or your wife have auto insurance. Did you not factor in car expenses when you purchased a used vehicle? What happends if the engine dies or you need new tires cause of a flat?

It's like buying a 10 year old house with all the money you saved up and not having any money left for furniture.

[jcl]

I'm a bit perplexed at this situation. Your bought a car and now your strapped for cash? Please say you or your wife have auto insurance. Did you not factor in car expenses when you purchased a used vehicle? What happends if the engine dies or you need new tires cause of a flat?

It's like buying a 10 year old house with all the money you saved up and not having any money left for furniture.

Don't pop a blood vessel bud!

[jcl]

Just an update for some of you happy campers, yes it was indeed the front struts needing replacement, got new struts installed for $400 even.

Good to go, thanks all!

[mtharvey]

Even priests are dishonest when selling cars. both buyers and sellers are nuts when it comes to buying/selling used cars. private sellers are much more dishonest than people who do it as a business.