PC or MAC laptop?

[gurshan]

Our elementary school is being provided with 5 laptops for our staff/students to use. We are given the choice of pc's or mac's and the spec's are as follows:

For the Mac: 12" iBook M9846LL/A 1.33 GHz 512/40 GB HD: DVD-ROM, CD-RW, wireless care (APX)

For the PC: 15" HP Compac Business Notebook PR124UA, Intel Celeron M360J 1.4 GHz, 256 MB DDR SDRAM (1x256MB/w 1 free slot), 40 GB 42000rpm HD, 48xCD-RW/DVD-ROM drive
We will be up-grading the RAM on the PC to the equivalent of the MAC.

Cost of each is not a concern, as the district is paying for them. Which would be a better choice? Any recommendations would be appreciated.
Thanks.

[Cafe_333]

Considering you mentioned elementary school, the choice is easy - go for the PC. Better support and easier to find compatible software that will work on it as well. I wouldn't suggest a MAC unless a person knew what they were doing on it. Plus the PC laptop has a bigger lcd screen providing better ease of use for educational purposes.

[nfs2]

I disagree. From the laptops you mentioned the iBook wins hands down. I mean come on, an HP celeron vs a new iBook?

iBooks are very popular with schools because they are so reliable and Mac OS is easy to use. Mac isn't some obscure linux, you dont need to be a pro to use it.

I cant even believe theres a debate here :confused:

EDIT..

If this were vs say, a thinkpad, my answer *might* be different. But that HP laptop is junk.

[itsmypostoffice]

take time to consider TDSB's licensing agreements with manufacturers & software distributors. what is the final licensing cost to get these laptops into classrooms? will school funds cover upgrades and new licensing? often, it's not the best machine that wins out but a large number of competing factors and existing agreements.

EDIT: does your school have a designated IT contact person? does s/he have time & resources to support and maintain your new purchase? furthermore, how will these laptops compliment your current curriculum? processing speed is not an issue because you can purchase desktops for improved savings.

[MrWizard]

The HP laptop may be junk, but it is for an elementary school, so you don't really need high-end performance. Given that most of the kids and staff have windows machines at home, I would say go with the Compaq. The Apple IS a better machine, but a lot of people are probably not familiar with the OS, and while it isn't rocket science, it does take some getting used to.

If the laptop is going to be moved around and not be near a wall socket, the Apple is probably a better choice because of the better battery life, but if the laptop is going to be away from a wall for less than 2 hours, the HP is fine.

[Double_H_F]

Alienware with dual monitors on each one.

[BeaverLiquor]

out of those i'd take the ibook any day

but for a windows based machine how aboot a thinkpad? since rugrats are going to use it also.

[Oversized Rooster]

It only makes sense to use PC machines throughout the education system. This is what students will have to use later on in life anyway. Let's face it - aside from the handfull of Mac-lovers, everybody uses PCs.

Say you go work for CIBC, or a brick-layer...they will both be using PCs as you very well know. The day when larger companies start using Macs is the day when you should switch.

Until then, only use one if it's your hobby. Else, a PC will do you much more good in any other situation. Let's not even talk about software support and general compatability.

The argument that Macs are stable is irrelevant in this case. These laptops will be running at most MS Word and Sesame Street stuff. Windows can easily handle that without dying.

[nfs2]

But its not like they want these laptops to teach kids how to use computers! This isnt 1995, every one of those kids already has a windows box at home.. Im assuming they want to do their schoolwork on them (book reports, taking notes or whatever else) and the point is NOT to teach them how to use a computer. The added experiance using a mac would be just another plus

I do own a mac but im not a fanboy, id actually rather a thinkpad over an ibook, but in this specific case the ibook wins.

[gurshan]

Wow, I appreciate all the responses! Our school has a mac lab with 25 e-macs for classroom use as well as older macs and pcs in each of the classrooms. So although most of the kids have pc's at home, most are also familiar with the mac OS. We als have a technical person who comes to service the computers when we need so thats not a problem.

The students will use computers for basics such as websurfing, word processing, etc, but also for video/photo editing as we have bought new equipment for that.

My preference is for PC's because of my comfort level, however many of the teachers are more comfortable with mac because they are mainly used in our school district. I'm more curious as to what will get better performance both long term and short term and which might be more easily upgradeable in the future. Thanks again.

[nfs2]

The HP just sucks! Man im sorry but really, im gonna feel really bad for those kids if they end up with it.

Are there no other windows alternatives? I mean seriously, if you try video editing on a 1.4ghz celeron.. Well it aint happenin.

[supernerd]

The HP just sucks! Man im sorry but really, im gonna feel really bad for those kids if they end up with it.

Are there no other windows alternatives? I mean seriously, if you try video editing on a 1.4ghz celeron.. Well it aint happenin.

The build quality of HP laptops usually sucks, but I wouldn't dismiss it just because of the cpu. The celeron M 1.4 has the exact same processing power (just less L2 cache) as a Pentium M 1.4, which is pretty much on par with the G4 1.33.

although really, i dont think hardware is an issue for either machine (both have comparable performance, and both are laptops so upgradability is limited on both). you should probably base your decision on how the machines will be used, how it will inter-operate with your existing systems, and if the applications you need/want are available on either machine.

[Evil Baby]

I voted pc not actually looking at what you had posted, but after seeing the two optoins I would have to say go for the ibook and I hate macs.

The macs are going to become a lot les bogged down with spyware/virus's than the HP's.

I dont' know if Encarta would run on the mac, I assume it would but if not that is the only advantage I could possibly see, unless you wanted to use open office instead of MS office.

[batcave]

Mac all the way!

It's a consumer device and its used for what it was made for.

Here's an article about Mac from the wsj:

http://ptech.wsj.com/archive/solution-20051130.html

[Groovetube]

both are good pieces of hardware (not 100% sure on HP but I'll give it the benefit of the doubt) but OS wise, the mac by leaps and bounds. Far less time fooling with anitivirus this and that, spyware this blah blah, windows is far easier to screw around than OS X, there's less problems in general. I don't know of too much in the way of software that can't be had on mac. I run both platforms in my shop, and I'll give you one guess which is the most reliable and has the most software. By a mile.
:)

[kingsley]

My advice would be to ask the guy who will be fixing the laptops which OS he prefers.

[nfs2]

Also think about the fact that these are school kids, and the laptops will probably be bumped around and mishandled quite a bit.

If you want a good amout of laptops left working by years end, get the iBook or at least a thinkpad.

[Groovetube]

My advice would be to ask the guy who will be fixing the laptops which OS he prefers.

if it were me, and wanted a little job security, I'd say windows in a heart beat.
:)

[matkun]

My preference is for PC's because of my comfort level, however many of the teachers are more comfortable with mac because they are mainly used in our school district. I'm more curious as to what will get better performance both long term and short term and which might be more easily upgradeable in the future. Thanks again.

Neither will be upgradeable really, laptops aren't designed to be. At best you might be able to add a bit of ram, or add an external drive, which won't be good for laptop type stuff and will get easily lost, since these are kids.

I'd say go for the Macs. Kids are less likely to try and load their own software on it, it will get less bogged down with spyware since people just don't really bother to code viruses/spyware for Macs because of the piddly market share.

Will have to call the IT person in less often since Macs are built to be idiot (and in this case, kid) proof, more or less. And any IT guy worth his salt should be able to troubleshoot more then one OS.

[milhaus]

If you're interested in allowing kids to do their own photobooks, DVDs, movie editing etc. then the Mac hands down. Basically, if you want a laptop that you can do the "cool" stuff with easily, then get the iBooks. There is *nothing* on the PC side as easy to use and well integrated as iLife, especially the 06 version. Even Michael Scott from The Office uses iMovie for his best presentations. :cheesygri They're a little underpowered right now, but my 1.33 Ghz Powerbook is still fine for all that.

Also, I don't think the "not enough software for the mac" argument is applicable in this case; hopefully, they won't be used for gaming, bittorrent, or specific business applications. In many cases, the software argument boils down to this: you can have one application which does a certain task in OSX, or fifteen to choose from in Windows that do the same task. But if you've got one app that works well, why the hell do you need 15 ones you'll never use? Choice isn't always an advantage.

If you're only interested in Word, Excel, and other basic applications, then go the Windows route.

[Sonbuster]

stay away from celeron.

and it also has horrible resale value.

[bfurtado]

If you're interested in allowing kids to do their own photobooks, DVDs, movie editing etc. then the Mac hands down. Basically, if you want a laptop that you can do the "cool" stuff with easily, then get the iBooks. There is *nothing* on the PC side as easy to use and well integrated as iLife, especially the 06 version. Even Michael Scott from The Office uses iMovie for his best presentations. :cheesygri They're a little underpowered right now, but my 1.33 Ghz Powerbook is still fine for all that.

Also, I don't think the "not enough software for the mac" argument is applicable in this case; hopefully, they won't be used for gaming, bittorrent, or specific business applications. In many cases, the software argument boils down to this: you can have one application which does a certain task in OSX, or fifteen to choose from in Windows that do the same task. But if you've got one app that works well, why the hell do you need 15 ones you'll never use? Choice isn't always an advantage.

If you're only interested in Word, Excel, and other basic applications, then go the Windows route.

While I agree with milhaus's argument, you can get word, excel and the office quite for Mac. Just so there's no confusion

Brian

[john widow]

Yes, you are right, kids these days "KNOW"how to use the PC.
But if you bring a PC, into the SCHOOL. You'll have to follow the ways of the SCHOOL.

So you can't just tune your PC @ home, get nod32, antivirus, get zone alarm firewall......and have everything secure and stable as a bomb.

@ school, you need to have paid to use software, like net nanny, a firewall, norton antivirus, programs to restart back to default settings...etc....
This kind of stuff, you wont really know how to use, and at schools, kids mess with things.

Maybe the mac could be better.

[phuviano]

Going from those specs. The mac would win performance wise.

It does make sense to get the Hp for a school because most kids these days already know how to use a laptop with a windows environment. Let's ask this question though??? is school not for learning?? Everyone knows OSX beats windows hands down as an OS. I think getting the mac would at least give the kids an opportunity to experience what OSX can do. Its not hard to learn OSX. Its very easy to learn the OS. At least this option would give the kids an opportunity to see what else is out there.

Anyways, everyone's got their own opinion. Everyone's free to express their own opinions.

[john widow]

i'VE NEVER USED A MAC let them.....let those kids not suffer.

[Deal]

The students will use computers for basics such as websurfing, word processing, etc, but also for video/photo editing as we have bought new equipment for that.

My preference is for PC's because of my comfort level, however many of the teachers are more comfortable with mac because they are mainly used in our school district. I'm more curious as to what will get better performance both long term and short term and which might be more easily upgradeable in the future. Thanks again.


As mentioned by a previous post, laptops aren't very upgradeable. Just get a platform that serves your purposes now and perhaps couple of years down the road.

As such my vote is for the Mac, especially when you consider Apple's excellent suite of applications, which are best of class.

Common productivity tasks like word proc, email, browsing is easily covered on both platforms either by open source or MS products.

But the difference is clear when it comes to creating richer content.

That means recording music, editing videos, creating blogs and podcasts, and web pages.

Apple's suite of apps in all those categories simply have no comparison when it comes to ease of use and feature set.

Apple owns the video, photo and music editing field, while its latest version of Garageband and iWeb makes creating podcasts and web pages incredibly simple and intuitive.

I mention the importance of rich content because these are going to be everyday skillsets expected, if not required, for the next gen of computer users.
Communications are only going to get richer. To be able to craft your own multimedia message would simply be an advantage.

[bfurtado]

Think about future cost too.

Updating anti virus software, and video/audio editing software that is not included. You may not be chosing these systems to do that but the ibooks have hundreds of dollars worth of multimedia software included that windows machines don't. Thus if you chose to explore these options down the road, their inclusion saves lots of money. Also, Apple's developer tools are also included, thus if you were in the market to teach basic programming you would, again, have all that is necessary. I mention these points because it further solidifies the ibook as the most complete out of the box solution. A high school in my town chose 30 ibooks over windows machines mainly because of its included developer tools for its computer science students. Now, they are using them for video/audio editing and creating a school podcast.
More ibooks may be on the way. You simply don't get that out of box creativity with windows

Brian

[bfurtado]

Apple just announced a media event scheduled for Feb 28th. Could be rumoured new iBooks. May not be true but wait until then - could be surprising.

Brian

[baileyr]

but also for video/photo editing

Since this is part of the requirements - that makes the answer is easy. Mac.