Rafer Alston Traded For Mike James!!!!!!!!!!

[rdtx2002]

bye bye Rafer

Source: Fan590

Sportsnet Link (http://www.sportsnet.ca/nba/article.jsp;jsessionid=NBLGJLAIJHLD?content=200510 04_124400_5148)

[Yaowsers]

Who? and who?

[Fobulous]

NO WAY! wow thats crazy... James is a bit more stable i believe

[gilboman]

great job babcock... we get more spare parts for our best PG in years.

[rdtx2002]

great job babcock... we get more spare parts for our best PG in years.

to be fair.. Rafer and James have silimar numbers.. and James is less of a headcase.. and we got rid of the long term contract.

it was a great job babcock

[Fobulous]

Rafer and James have silimar numbers.. and James is less of a headcase.. and we got rid of the long term contract.

it was a great job babcock

Agreed with all your points rdtx!

Does anyone know exactly how long James contract is for? i'm fairly certain his $'s is less as is the # of yrs remaining.

[spike-spiegel]

great job babcock... we get more spare parts for our best PG in years.

Ya stats wise Alston might have been a bit better, but it sounds like James is better on defense and less of a headcase. Kinda important for a point guard.

I am glad the six-year contract is off the hook. But I suspect Raptors have to pay some of Alston's contract.

I was willing to give Alston another chance this year since he has talent and hope his head on right. But he'll be a nice backup PG in Houston. That's what I think he is: a PERFECT backup PG because he can bring energy off the bench and can score at times.

And they just took the pictures at training camp yetsterday too...

[spike-spiegel]

Agreed with all your points rdtx!

Does anyone know exactly how long James contract is for? i'm fairly certain his $'s is less as is the # of yrs remaining.


http://www.tsn.ca/nba/news_story.asp?id=138711

James' contract has two year remaining. And probably much less $4 or 6 that Rafer got. That was a ridculous contract by Babcock.

[wesleyw]

Does anyone know exactly how long James contract is for? i'm fairly certain his $'s is less as is the # of yrs remaining.

He has two years left on his contract, how much $ not exactly sure

[babysham]

He has two years left on his contract, how much $ not exactly sure

$3.4 mill and $3.7 mill respectively.

I like this trade. We get rid of Alston's bad attitude and his contract, and replace it with a similar type player with a shorter contract, a better attitude, and much better defense.

[yayawhoo2003]

Hope james can score...I know hes a good defender. Bye Bye Rafer we'll miss your poor shot selection and bad attitude

[rdtx2002]

Agreed with all your points rdtx!

Does anyone know exactly how long James contract is for? i'm fairly certain his $'s is less as is the # of yrs remaining.

James has 2 years left.. 3.4 and 3.7

[rdtx2002]

I am glad the six-year contract is off the hook. But I suspect Raptors have to pay some of Alston's contract.



Raptors don't have to pay any of the Rafer contract.. completely off the books

[SwiZz]

noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

i liked rafer =(......i think he was going to do really great this year....

dam....i guess its a good trade overall....

but who the heck saw this one coming!?!? :-0

there was so many articles yesterday in the paper with rafer quoting about how he's looking to do well this season and how they straightened everythign out......then KABOOM...outta nowhere he gets shipped off...im suprised this stayed so quiet...

[B40]

$3.4 mill and $3.7 mill respectively.

I like this trade. We get rid of Alston's bad attitude and his contract, and replace it with a similar type player with a shorter contract, a better attitude, and much better defense.

I agree...Alston was too risky to have for that long...

He was set to make $3,850,000 $4,200,000 $4,550,000 $4,900,000 $5,250,000

So we save about $1M over the two years and don't have the risk of paying Alston $4.5-5M for 3 years...

Alston is a good player, he just needs to get his head and emotions in check.

[NDman]

What does this really say about Sam Mitchell? Does it mean Mitchell wins (hence Rafer got traded), or Mitchell admits defeat that he just can't coach/tame Rafer? I'd say the latter

[FuNPoLiCe001]

i love this deal

i was secretly hoping that Alvin could come back this year, and then we could ship Alston to Phoenix for their trade exception and one of the 1st rounders from Phoenix, but this will do.

We lose Alston - no D, mediocre play maker, bad shot selection, CRAZY, LONG contract, for James - plays good D, also a mediocre play maker, also bad shot selection, but not crazy, and with a much shorter deal.

Here's hoping that Calderon can play, and give us two different looks at PG.

[rdtx2002]

What does this really say about Sam Mitchell? Does it mean Mitchell wins (hence Rafer got traded), or Mitchell admits defeat that he just can't coach/tame Rafer? I'd say the latter

if Rafer is going to cause a problem.. you move him.. simple as that.. it's not about Mitchell's coaching ability whatsoever..

wait til Rafer comes up to Van Gundy.. that'll be interesting

[Headhunter]

Decent deal in a bad situation, unload Babcock's terrible contract for a usable guard with his head on right.

[sleepyguy]

good stuff... i give the raptors 2nd last now instead of dead last.

[rdarkman68]

good stuff... i give the raptors 2nd last now instead of dead last.

Cool... now all we need is to get rid of the formerly Nets William sisters. We would be out of the lottery!

[bluetroll]

good, the time bomb is outta here!

[ji2o0k]

babcock was insane to give Alston that type of contract in the first place. So he did a good job of getting rid of it.........

hopefully he can right the many wrongs he has committed in the past as well...........good luck babcock you need it.

[spike-spiegel]

Cool... now all we need is to get rid of the formerly Nets William sisters. We would be out of the lottery!

But we WANT to be in the lottery. Let's face it, Raptors even if they could make the playoffs they'll be struggling to get in especially in the now-very competitive East.

I would enjoy it just as much to see the young players develop for the years ahead and get a lottery pick and watch the Raptors struggle to make the playoffs. With more cap space and high picks, Raptors can climb back up to respectibility.

[gilboman]

But we WANT to be in the lottery. Let's face it, Raptors even if they could make the playoffs they'll be struggling to get in especially in the now-very competitive East.

I would enjoy it just as much to see the young players develop for the years ahead and get a lottery pick and watch the Raptors struggle to make the playoffs. With more cap space and high picks, Raptors can climb back up to respectibility.

this is assuming babcock makes reasonable moves. that guy is more crazy than rafer :lol:

[pd0x]

probably means we can bring over ukic sooner now...sweet.

[NDman]

Decent deal in a bad situation, unload Babcock's terrible contract for a usable guard with his head on right.
I'd be much happier with the following change in your sentence:

"Decent deal in a bad situation, unload Babcock's terrible contract." :cheesygri

[gilboman]

probably means we can bring over ukic sooner now...sweet.
:confused: he signed multi year contract in spain. the raps didnt pony up the money to bring him over. so this trade has no bearing on bringing him over.. also we signed calderon as backup already.

[demha88]

mike james who mike james james

[mallik]

I liked Rafer and was hoping that he would be able to put his "crazy" ways behind him this season, but this looks like a pretty good trade for both teams. His contract wasn't that bad though. It was long yes, but he made around 3.5M last season and will make a little over 5M in his final year.

I wonder how Rafer and Van Gundy are going to get along. If there's anybody that's more hot-headed than Mitchell, it is Mr. Van Gundy. They're probably going to need an Octagon for those two in Houston.

Looks like Babcock might know what he's doing.

[NDman]

Babcock just wants to make sure what he said in last month will happen ("We will win less games this year"). The hole in the backcourt is huge. There better be a follow up move for that. Mike James is a decent player, but I am not sold that he is a starter calibre.

[CanadianCool]

babcock get J. Will now, i think nobody has signed him yet.

[spike-spiegel]

:confused: he signed multi year contract in spain. the raps didnt pony up the money to bring him over. so this trade has no bearing on bringing him over.. also we signed calderon as backup already.

Does Ukric have a opt-out clause? I hope so cause I want to see this guy play for the Raptors. If anything, James could play as a starter and act as a mentor to Josh Calderon.

[SwiZz]

babcock get J. Will now, i think nobody has signed him yet.

J Will isn't going to be in NBA this season. He said he needs more time to get better. I read that somewhere. So he's not signing with anyone this season.

[Headhunter]

Does Ukric have a opt-out clause? I hope so cause I want to see this guy play for the Raptors.
There's always a buy-out, but that's his only path to the NBA until his Spanish contract expires.

[wesleyw]

IMO, Rafer is an excellent second point guard, but his style does not work as a primary point guard. As previous poster has saidm he brings energy off the bench, and can be quite effective with his playing style against another team's second unit.

[mallik]

Does Ukric have a opt-out clause? I hope so cause I want to see this guy play for the Raptors. If anything, James could play as a starter and act as a mentor to Josh Calderon.

Apparantly there is a buy-out option for the first 2 years. After the second year, he can leave without compensation to the team.

[spike-spiegel]

IMO, Rafer is an excellent second point guard, but his style does not work as a primary point guard. As previous poster has saidm he brings energy off the bench, and can be quite effective with his playing style against another team's second unit.

That's why he did well in Miami the year before Babcock signed him. I think Babcock knew Alvin couldn't play and was desperate to get a point guard of starter caliber. It was a hit-or-miss but with a six-year contract.

[wanted]

mike james who mike james james

http://www.nba.com/media/act_mike_james.jpg
http://www.nba.com/playerfile/mike_james/?nav=page


I'm Mike James b*tch :lol:

[bluetroll]

this is his master plan to trade VC back to Toronto, so we can throw tomatoes at him every home game.

[FuNPoLiCe001]

I think alot of you guys are overrating Alston and underrating James. James was a key part of the pistons bench that murdered the Lakers 2 years ago. He's proven that he can be a great guard off the bench, bringing a good change of pace, energy, defense and 3 pt shooting - essentially the same things that Rafer does well, but James doesn't have the contract or the head ache associated with Rafer.

My guess is that Jay Williams deciding not to sign with a team this year forced this trade to happen. Houston had been pursuing Williams with Sura out, and with that option gone and alot of other FA's signed, this suddenly became their best option. I am not convinced that they will do well after this trade though. James posted great numbers for them as a starter last year with Sura out, and there's the question of how Alston will mesh with
a) Van Gundy's defense 1st philosophy
b) T-Mac's ego and slacking

T-Mac was great in the playoffs last year, but it remains to be seen whether he can carry over the same effort on both ends of the floor. So if T-Mac starts sucking on D, and Van Gundy lets him off on it but rails Alston - how is that going to make Rafer feel? Will he threaten to quit again? It's like Alston and Vince or Alston and Rose again, except I think that T-Mac is more immature than those 2 and won't handle it as well.

Also, Ukic supposedly has an opt-out, NOT a buy-out, but a player opt-out after 2 years. Which would be when Mike James' contract expires, which makes this deal even better from the Raptor's standpoint cause they'll have a spot and money for Ukic and still be able to bring James back if he is needed.

[frogger]

Aw man I was waiting for Alston to drop a dumbell on Calderon in the weight room this year!

Glad to be rid of him. Listening to a 4M a year guy whine like he did, ugh.

[Headhunter]

I'm Mike James b*tch :lol:
Damn, beat me to it!

[Hanniganite]

Didn't see this coming...
I was optimistic about Rafer and the Raptors this year but hey, can't argue with getting a shorter, cheaper contract for a similar player, who is steady if unspectacular.

[Anessa]

he can take this street balling tricks and get benched by JVG :cheesygri

[dmatthew]

Mike James was a fantasy monster when he started on the Bucks

I'm drafting him in the 10th round

lol

[gilboman]

well...Mike James has proved he's probably even dumber than RAfer and definitely not as talented

you should hear what he said about the trade..i'm sure he'll fit in well :lol:

"I don't play for the name on front of the jersey, I play for the name on the back"

just what we need, a player only interested in himself and blatantly saying so :(

[NDman]

So who gets the ball in Houston? TMac will eventually get pissed when Rafer hoists up ill-fated 3, instead of TMac himself doing it. :cheesygri

[rdtx2002]

well...Mike James has proved he's probably even dumber than RAfer and definitely not as talented

you should hear what he said about the trade..i'm sure he'll fit in well :lol:

"I don't play for the name on front of the jersey, I play for the name on the back"

just what we need, a player only interested in himself and blatantly saying so :(

who cares what he says.. as long as he produces.. it doesn't matter.

Jalen speaks out alot too.. so...

[Capt.]

Right now I'm not sure what to think about this trade. I don't mind James. I also like the fact that the Raps freed up some precious cash.

Oh, think of the alley-oops that rafe will sendin to Tmac! Should be good.

[sfu_lifer]

Finally a Babcock move that I agree with.

[ch1zo]

i think this is a great trade for the raptors organization.
its kinda ironic how yesterday on the chuck swirsky show they had an interview with him saying how hes passes last yrs arguments and how hes excited for the coming season with raptors.

[B40]

Finally a Babcock move that I agree with.

Watch Alston tear it up in Houston and everyone will start blaming Babcock again :lol:

[kingsley69]

good riddance rafer. good job fagcok. but it dont still make up for tradin away this years mvp accordin to chuck for nothing.

[Hanniganite]

well...Mike James has proved he's probably even dumber than RAfer and definitely not as talented

you should hear what he said about the trade..i'm sure he'll fit in well :lol:

"I don't play for the name on front of the jersey, I play for the name on the back"

just what we need, a player only interested in himself and blatantly saying so :(

I saw that on Sportsnet and I think you're looking at it wrong. He was talking about how the NBA is like a business and he was sorta responding to the fact that he'd been traded. He said he plays for the name on the back because you never know if you're gonna be traded and what team you're playing for. If you look at the sentence you posted on its own, yeah it looks bad but being selfish wasn't what he was saying at all. Probably not the greatest choice of words by James, but also a misinterpretation by you.

[gilboman]

just what we need, another guy bitter to be here. :lol:

maybe he can hookup with eric williams and decide to tank once he gets here and complain to the media :lol: :lol:

he's already ahead of eric in terms that he's already said he plays for himself and not the team ;)

[numb555]

I'm a Babcock basher and forever will be for the Haffa pick, the VC trade for basketballs/Zo's enormous contract which we had to buy out. But i gotta commend Babcock for this trade, at least he's helping my favourite team in the West w/ a decent point gaurd which the Rockets needed! Good Job Babcock!

[gilboman]

I'm a Babcock basher and forever will be for the Haffa pick, the VC trade for basketballs/Zo's enormous contract which we had to buy out. But i gotta commend Babcock for this trade, at least he's helping my favourite team in the West w/ a decent point gaurd which the Rockets needed! Good Job Babcock!

thats true...houston solidfy their team with a playmaker in alston to compliment Tmac and Yao. and all they had to give up was a sparepart journeyman in james.

[Panda_Bear]

Rafer's gonna suck in Houston for sure. They'll be booing his selfish nature. Rafer doesn't pass the ball, and gets caught up in egotistical one on ones.

James will fit in well with the Raps.

Can't wait to see how this pans out. Good job Babs. Slowly renewing my faith.

[gilboman]

Rafer's gonna suck in Houston for sure. They'll be booing his selfish nature. Rafer doesn't pass the ball, and gets caught up in egotistical one on ones.

James will fit in well with the Raps.

Can't wait to see how this pans out. Good job Babs. Slowly renewing my faith.

skip to my lou can pass and did pass last year just look at the stats.

you seem to miss the one important thing, as unstable as alston was, he was a starting PG with the skills to fit that role.

the raps now have NO starting PG, but an inexperienced euro guy and a journeyman. who's gonna start at PG??? :lol: :lol: might as well be Arujo :lol: :lol:

trading alston only makes sense if we have something resembling a starting PG or atleast a plan to get someone to start at PG, but of course we dont.

[SwiZz]

Yes, I didn't want to see Alston go, but in the long run this is a great move.

The thought of how much capspace + young players we'll have in the next 2 years is going to be crazy. Jalen Rose and Mo Pete's contracts will be done with. So will Mike James'. Who?? Mike Jamess!!!

From Hoopshype.com LINK: http://www.hoopshype.com/salaries/toronto.htm

Players - Signed through

Aaron Williams - 2005/2006
Jalen's - 2006/2007
Mo Pete - 2006/2007
Mike James - 2006/2007
Alvin Williams - 2007/2008
Matt Bonner (how long was his contract, like 2-yr?)
Eric Williams (doesn't show on the page)
Loren Woods (Not sure)
Pape Sow (Not sure)

Can anyone volunteer to do the math as to how much money we'll have free after the 2006/2007 season? I dont know how to calculate this properly...

But yea, by then perhaps we can sign a good decent centre in Jamal Magloire (for not a crazy amount, cause I'm sure he wants to play in Toronto), we'll have 2 good PG's in Ukic and Calderon, Bosh will hopefully be doing 20 ppg/10 rbds a game.....Pape Sow will be a Ben Wallace Type player, and I hope they'll resign Mo Pete, cause I like him.

Charlie V and Jey Grahm will be great by then, and we'll have a bunch of younger players through the lotteries that we'll be in for the next two years...

Okay, so a lot of what I'm saying might not be true. But one can hope. =P....someone do the math please!!

[SwiZz]

trading alston only makes sense if we have something resembling a starting PG or atleast a plan to get someone to start at PG, but of course we dont.

That's okay though! Charlie V says he can play the point! Done and done! :)

[actyper]

Rafer's good
James sucks
Trade is good for the future
sucks now
starting pg will be the Jap dude.

[thelefteyeguy]

Yes, I didn't want to see Alston go, but in the long run this is a great move.

The thought of how much capspace + young players we'll have in the next 2 years is going to be crazy. Jalen Rose and Mo Pete's contracts will be done with. So will Mike James'. Who?? Mike Jamess!!!

From Hoopshype.com LINK: http://www.hoopshype.com/salaries/toronto.htm

Players - Signed through

Aaron Williams - 2005/2006
Jalen's - 2006/2007
Mo Pete - 2006/2007
Mike James - 2006/2007
Alvin Williams - 2007/2008
Matt Bonner (how long was his contract, like 2-yr?)
Eric Williams (doesn't show on the page)
Loren Woods (Not sure)
Pape Sow (Not sure)

Can anyone volunteer to do the math as to how much money we'll have free after the 2006/2007 season? I dont know how to calculate this properly...

But yea, by then perhaps we can sign a good decent centre in Jamal Magloire (for not a crazy amount, cause I'm sure he wants to play in Toronto), we'll have 2 good PG's in Ukic and Calderon, Bosh will hopefully be doing 20 ppg/10 rbds a game.....Pape Sow will be a Ben Wallace Type player, and I hope they'll resign Mo Pete, cause I like him.

Charlie V and Jey Grahm will be great by then, and we'll have a bunch of younger players through the lotteries that we'll be in for the next two years...

Okay, so a lot of what I'm saying might not be true. But one can hope. =P....someone do the math please!!


it's good and all for the long run BUT 2 yrs of poor b-ball just wont cut it esp in Toronto.

a decade of poor Jays has really killed the team. Most Torontian's don't even know one player on the Jays.

[mallik]

Can anyone volunteer to do the math as to how much money we'll have free after the 2006/2007 season? I dont know how to calculate this properly...


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0703/v2patel/salaries.jpg


After next season, they barely have any salaries comitted. I don't know how Jalen is going to support his family after this contract expires. I wonder how much he'll get in his next contract.

[B40]

After next season, they barely have any salaries comitted. I don't know how Jalen is going to support his family after this contract expires. I wonder how much he'll get in his next contract.

Support his family? What are you kidding me? He'll get at least $3-5M and players always try really hard in their last contract year..

Oh my, how is he going to support his family after making $15M for two years and have to go down to $5M after? Poor guy.

[SwiZz]

Support his family? What are you kidding me? He'll get at least $3-5M and players always try really hard in their last contract year..

Oh my, how is he going to support his family after making $15M for two years and have to go down to $5M after? Poor guy.

I think after his stint with the Raptors he'll be courted by a playoff contender who's trying to win the championship. Probably Miami.....or Dallas hehe...

[Panda_Bear]

Some ppl really dont know basketball. James is a better player than Alston. He averaged more points and stuff last season than Alston did, and last season was Alston's best year as a Raptor.

If you ever saw James play in Milwaukee, you would have been impressed. I'm surprised the Raptors never tried to get him last year, when Houston picked him up.

Also, who said the Jap guy is gonna start then? He already signed with another team!! You guys really dont keep up to date on your sports.

Before you post, actually read up on the facts and current ongoings of the NBA.

[Panda_Bear]

Wow, after Rose's contract expires, the Raps will be in a solid position financially..... Aaron Williams and Lamond will also expire after this season!!!

Thats 8 mill cleared up.

Looking at the salary sheet, Hoffa totally doesnt deserve the 3 mill he's making. No wonder he doesnt mind ppl booing. I could take the crowd booing me every night if I made close to 3 million a season too..

[Headhunter]

Wow, after Rose's contract expires, the Raps will be in a solid position financially..... Aaron Williams and Lamond will also expire after this season!!!
The Raptors will have to fill up that salary by acquiring players via trade; guess no one wants to sign in a clean, multicultural, low crime metropolis anymore... :|

[Ziggy007]

The Raptors will be in good cap shape assuming no stupid trades to take on salary.

Some of Jalen's salary will go towards upping Bosh.

Can't wait for the days when Zo's $4M comes off the books. The guy screwed our cap for three years without even playing a single game for us...

[spike-spiegel]

well...Mike James has proved he's probably even dumber than RAfer and definitely not as talented

you should hear what he said about the trade..i'm sure he'll fit in well :lol:

"I don't play for the name on front of the jersey, I play for the name on the back"

just what we need, a player only interested in himself and blatantly saying so :(


I saw this when Sportsnet interviewing him. You misinterpretated him and he worded it wrong. He was just saying he understands NBA is a business and that he can't get caught up in the team he plays for (name in the front). According to all reports, this guy is hard-worker that fits Mitchell's team. He could provide some veteran prescence for the young guys and maybe Ukric when he comes over. He's similar to Boogie Williams without the knee problems, I think.


I'm liking the cap space for a couple years from now but what free agents will be available then? If we could resign Bosh with some of that money as well. I think Lakers were free up cap space and rebuilding for 2007.

[frogger]

I think Mitchell knows James pretty well from his days as an assistant with Milwaukee.

[gei]

After next season, they barely have any salaries comitted. I don't know how Jalen is going to support his family after this contract expires. I wonder how much he'll get in his next contract.

Say the average Canadian makes $50,000 USD a year (although in reality it is considerably less), then Jalen rose should have enough to support his family for the next 320 years.

[Hanniganite]

Some ppl really dont know basketball.
You guys really dont keep up to date on your sports.

Before you post, actually read up on the facts and current ongoings of the NBA.

Couldn't agree with you more.

[Capt.]

Some ppl really dont know basketball. James is a better player than Alston. He averaged more points and stuff last season than Alston did, and last season was Alston's best year as a Raptor.

Before you post, actually read up on the facts and current ongoings of the NBA.

You should take your own advice. Rafer averaged more points and more assists than James last year. I can't remember exactly, but Rafer was around 15 points 6 assists. James had about 12 points 3 assists average. Stop raggin on other people when you don't have the facts straight yourself.

[frogger]

Rafer took WAY too many shots last year for a PG, especially 3 pointers, not for a good percentage either.

[FuNPoLiCe001]

You should take your own advice. Rafer averaged more points and more assists than James last year. I can't remember exactly, but Rafer was around 15 points 6 assists. James had about 12 points 3 assists average. Stop raggin on other people when you don't have the facts straight yourself.


Not that facts tell everything, but Rafer also played more minutes than James. Rafer average 14.2 and 6.4 in 34 minutes, while James averaged 11.8 and 3.6 in 25 minutes. If you extrapolate James's minutes to 34 minutes like Rafer, he actually averages 16 and 5. So more points but less assists which isn't surprising since Houston played him as a combo guard. You also have to look at the fact that James shot a better percentage (44.1 2pt and 38.7 3pt) compared to Alston (41.4 2pt and 35.7 3 pt), so James is a more efficient shooter and scorer. James would also be a superior rebounder than defender than Alston if you looked at the rebounding stats and the opponent FG%.

Are they the same player? No. Alston is probably a more creative passer and can push the break better. But James is a better shooter, plays much better D and isn't as bad of a player as you're trying to make him out to be. There really isn't any data to suggest that Rafer is a superior player to James, only that they're different players with different styles and I'll take a guard that can shoot, defend, and can make the entry pass over Rafer and his mental problems.

Maybe next time you should take your own advice.

[mallik]

Not that facts tell everything, but Rafer also played more minutes than James. Rafer average 14.2 and 6.4 in 34 minutes, while James averaged 11.8 and 3.6 in 25 minutes. If you extrapolate James's minutes to 34 minutes like Rafer, he actually averages 16 and 5. So more points but less assists which isn't surprising since Houston played him as a combo guard. You also have to look at the fact that James shot a better percentage (44.1 2pt and 38.7 3pt) compared to Alston (41.4 2pt and 35.7 3 pt), so James is a more efficient shooter and scorer. James would also be a superior rebounder than defender than Alston if you looked at the rebounding stats and the opponent FG%.

Are they the same player? No. Alston is probably a more creative passer and can push the break better. But James is a better shooter, plays much better D and isn't as bad of a player as you're trying to make him out to be. There really isn't any data to suggest that Rafer is a superior player to James, only that they're different players with different styles and I'll take a guard that can shoot, defend, and can make the entry pass over Rafer and his mental problems.

Maybe next time you should take your own advice.

Excellent points. I think that James isn't thought of too highly in this trade because he has been described as a "jouneyman player" and he's been on a bunch of teams.

[frogger]

If Alston was any better, he wouldn't have bounced around as much as he has either.

[Anessa]

Rafer took WAY too many shots last year for a PG, especially 3 pointers, not for a good percentage either.

Rafer threw up too many bricks from 3pt land...agree with you totally and he always insisted on battling Rucker style with the opposing PG.

[futureshop.ca_is_the_best]

Does this mean no more And1 mixed tape tour game in Toronto?

[Eternia]

Although this trade may not help this problem but...why did our PG think he deserved as many shots as our best player (Bosh)? But anyways, I hope we will see fewer unforced 30 foot bombs at the basket this year.

[gilboman]

Although this trade may not help this problem but...why did our PG think he deserved as many shots as our best player (Bosh)? But anyways, I hope we will see fewer unforced 30 foot bombs at the basket this year.

b/c our best player cant take all the shots :lol: or that our best player cant score outside of 12ft?

[Eternia]

b/c our best player cant take all the shots :lol: or that our best player cant score outside of 12ft?
I didn't say Bosh should take all the shots but he definitely needs some more touches throughout games. And why would you say he can't score outside of 12 feet when it's his 10-17 foot jumper is what opens up his game. He and Rose were the few players on this team that actually didn't have to camp outside the 3-point line to score.

[Capt.]

isn't as bad of a player as you're trying to make him out to be. There really isn't any data to suggest that Rafer is a superior player to James, only that they're different players with different styles and I'll take a guard that can shoot, defend, and can make the entry pass over Rafer and his mental problems.

Maybe next time you should take your own advice.

I didn't offer any advice other than get the facts straight, which I had. My numbers were clearly stated as being around the right area. Also I never suggested James was a bad player at all. Where did you get that from? All I said was Rafer's numbers were higher.

That's a fact, not an opinion. Also you can't assume James' #s would have been higher if he'd played as much as Rafer. That's all theoretical. Who knows what would happen. Sure they'd probably be higher, but it's not guaranteed.

[Ziggy007]

You can't base a players skill level purely on his numbers. We are a btter off team without Alston, both on the court and off the court (cap wise)

[gilboman]

I didn't say Bosh should take all the shots but he definitely needs some more touches throughout games. And why would you say he can't score outside of 12 feet when it's his 10-17 foot jumper is what opens up his game. He and Rose were the few players on this team that actually didn't have to camp outside the 3-point line to score.

bosh is ineffective once they double him. and he doesnt hit jumpers outside of 12ft unless he's wide open. with Bosh last year, it was either he got it or he didnt depending on what the defence gives.

[gilboman]

You can't base a players skill level purely on his numbers. We are a btter off team without Alston, both on the court and off the court (cap wise)

you cant say this at all until you've seen the raps play this year ;)

[Anessa]

i think bosh got stronger so that's a good thing for his post game. i remember him getting abused by people like brendan haywood last yr.

[Headhunter]

i think bosh got stronger so that's a good thing for his post game. i remember him getting abused by people like brendan haywood last yr.
It's the extra hair... :razz:

[B40]

Let me go back in this thread and make a list of people who said this was a bad trade :lol:

[B40]

Babcock just wants to make sure what he said in last month will happen ("We will win less games this year"). The hole in the backcourt is huge. There better be a follow up move for that. Mike James is a decent player, but I am not sold that he is a starter calibre.

You sold yet? :lol:

[Irb]

LOL

I saw this thread title from the main forum page and I said out loud "what the ****? We're getting Rafer back?!!!"

I had no clue he was traded away for Mike James :lol: :lol: :lol:

[B40]

You should take your own advice. Rafer averaged more points and more assists than James last year. I can't remember exactly, but Rafer was around 15 points 6 assists. James had about 12 points 3 assists average. Stop raggin on other people when you don't have the facts straight yourself.

:lol:

[Mintmaster]

Let me go back in this thread and make a list of people who said this was a bad trade :lol:
Don't jinx it! Rafer was doing well at the beginning of last year, especially with his shooting percentage.

BTW, for all you fact junkies, shooting percentage wins games, PPG doesn't. Each team gets nearly the same number of possessions per game, until you take rebounds into account. You waste possessions with missed shots and turnovers, and waste your opponent's possessions with steals.

The most important offensive statistic you can show is points per possession: PTS / (FG Attempts + Turnovers - Steals + 0.4 * FT attempts). The 0.4 varies, but is approximately right (I think SI said 0.44), because generally a pair of free throws costs a possession, but "and 1" throws don't. Even this metric has limitations, such as a player's effect on teammate's efficiency (through assists, drawing double teams, etc), pulling down the other teams efficiency (blocks, contesting shots, etc), and the effect of rebounds. But this is way more important than points per game.

Anyway, go James! Go Raps!

[Anessa]

It's the extra hair... :razz:

Like Duncan :!:

[gei]

great job babcock... we get more spare parts for our best PG in years.

another brilliant observation by our friend gilboman :cheesygri

[Panda_Bear]

Hahah, that was funny comment, but its true.

Ppl like Gilboman who dont know ball make comments like this. I knew James was good from the days he was Michael Redd's back up.

[gilboman]

another brilliant observation by our friend gilboman :cheesygri

yup...much more accurate than yours since you couldnt even see in your face what a crappy team we have.

we trade away our only PG for a rent a SG for this season

[gilboman]

Let me go back in this thread and make a list of people who said this was a bad trade :lol:

yup... we lose mike james this year and will look for another PG in the offseason :lol:

[frogger]

LOL the troll is at it again with the anti-raptor logic.

[mallik]

yup...much more accurate than yours since you couldnt even see in your face what a crappy team we have.

we trade away our only PG for a rent a SG for this season

You love to throw out the red herrings, don't you.

Whatever you want to classify James as, he is way better than Alston in every way.

But now you're saying that the fact that James' contract is up at the end of this year is a negative? You would rather have Alston and his contract for the next 5 years? :lol:

[Anessa]

yup... we lose mike james this year and will look for another PG in the offseason :lol:

Better than having Mr Pouty Airball Playground legend :lol:

[Hanniganite]

we trade away our only PG for a rent a SG for this season

That's very true...but I dont' think the Raptors are entirely out of luck. They can try using that Spanish power forward...what's his name...Calderon. Yeah, Calderon...they can experiment with him at the point. That way, losing their only PG wouldn't be such a big deal!

[gman]

we trade away our only PG for a rent a SG for this season

Well, various sport site classified James as PG.

e.g. http://www.sportsline.com/nba/players/playerpage/275597

[Panda_Bear]

Calderon will be decent, he just needs experience and time.

And Roko may join us next year, we'll see.

But I think next year James may not resign with Toronto. But thats fine, the rookies will just need to step up more than ever. We are sacrificing wins right now for their experience, so hope it pans out.