Mos Def insults U2 for allegedly not helping Katrina victims

[Webslinger]

Mos Def slams U2 for not supporting Katrina victims (http://www.contactmusic.com/new/xmlfeed.nsf/mndwebpages/mos%20def%20targets%20bush%20+%20bono%20in%20hard-hitting%20charity%20single)


""It's enough to make you holler out/Like where the f**k is Sir Bono and his famous friends now?/Don't get it twisted, man, I dig U2/But if you ain't about the ghetto, than f**k you too/Who cares about rock and roll when babies can't eat food?""

Umm . . .

I guess showing the Redcross contact information on the screens during U2's concert in Toronto on Monday means U2 doesn't care?

How about participating in two charity broadcasts (for Katrina victims/Redcross)?

1. http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/showthread.php?t=197359

2. http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/showthread.php?t=197069


What is this guy's problem?

[Wildfire]

What is this guy's problem?
George Bush hates black people.

[Headhunter]

Mos Def is wrong on this one, I think...he should be slamming Sean Penn and his PR fueled trip to New Orleans if anything.

[bluetroll]

he's an idiot.

[Montague]

Mos Def dun like white people. ;)

[Yaowsers]

They're so poor, and so black.

[Beradon]

*sigh* mos def is just perpetuating the stereotype of black people making every issue about race.

[fuhreal]

Met the dude, had a conversation with him, very respectable person.

I'm behind him....

[hyperion]

rap artist mentality - gotta sell ma recordz by bashing random peoplez and looking charitable

[ClubberLang]

that line is hardly a diss at all. he's simply saying that typical celeb philanthopists (in this case U2) better step up to the plate when it comes to assisting Katrina victims. You are all blowing his comments out of proportion.

[TheTik]

Mos def is cool but.....dissin bono is NOT cool :twisted: !

[Webslinger]

that line is hardly a diss at all. he's simply saying that typical celeb philanthopists (in this case U2) better step up to the plate when it comes to assisting Katrina victims. You are all blowing his comments out of proportion.


The point is they (U2) already have "stepped up to the plate". Mos Def is barking up the wrong tree--and is, obviously, clueless. A lot of people behind the MakePovertyHistory campaign also helped Katrina victims/the Redcross.

[ClubberLang]

The point is they (U2) already have "stepped up to the plate". Mos Def is barking up the wrong tree--and is, obviously, clueless. A lot of people behind the MakePovertyHistory campaign also helped Katrina victims/the Redcross.

this song was recorded and released ona mixtape days after katrina hit, before U2 was holding benefit concerts. the song is supposed to be a cathartic angry rant. if he really had beef with u2, he wouldn't have included the line "i dig u2". you're over reacting.

[ClubberLang]

another thing of note is that he begins the line by saying "it's enough to make you holler" which implys that the following statement is extreme and almost unreasonable. on top of that you have to determine whether Mos def is saying "f- u2" or is describing someone who is frustrated enough to say f-u2. i think people are sensationalizing and looking for a story where one doesn't exist.

[Webslinger]

this song was recorded and released ona mixtape days after katrina hit, before U2 was holding benefit concerts. the song is supposed to be a cathartic angry rant. if he really had beef with u2, he wouldn't have included the line "i dig u2". you're over reacting.

No. If you analyze those lines properly he is saying, while "I dig u2", where the hell is Bono now that Katrina victims need help? Mos Def is clueless and should have contacted Bono to find out whether he wasn't going to do anything before spouting off.

[ClubberLang]

/But if you ain't about the ghetto, than f**k you too


Did he accuse U2 of not caring...
Nope..

He said "IF" they are not about helping. then f them. the statement was NOT a personal attack on u2. it was a statement about celebrity philanthropists.

[Webslinger]

another thing of note is that he begins the line by saying "it's enough to make you holler" which implys that the following statement is extreme and almost unreasonable.

Again, no. Mos Def is using righteous anger to support his argument; there's nothing implied or otherwise that would suggest his reason for hollering is "unreasonable".

on top of that you have to determine whether Mos def is saying "f- u2" or is describing someone who is frustrated enough to say f-u2.

I feel this has no bearing at all on his lyrics. What I do believe is that this song reflects a knee-jerk reaction that he had--and as a result, Mos Def comes across as someone who is completely ignorant of the subject he's directing his anger towards in those lines. When I critique a subject in my professional writing, I usually do a little research first (sometimes I even contact the subject . . .).

i think people are sensationalizing and looking for a story where one doesn't exist.

And I think Mos Def would be well served to do a little research before lipping off.

[Webslinger]

/But if you ain't about the ghetto, than f**k you too

I am well aware of what Mos Def wrote.

Did he accuse U2 of not caring...

He's asking where Bono (and "his famous friends") is now that Katrina victims need help. He's the lead singer of U2.

Mos Def is also saying who cares about rock and roll (and the impression I get is this is a refernce to the Live 8 concerts) because Mos Def is also referencing Bono's famous friends, and that's most likely a reference to Bob Geldof, in particular. The reason I say Geldof is because he is the one who is actually a "sir"--and not Bono; it's, again, lamentable that Mos Def doesn't bother educating himself on the topic at hand. Bono is also a friend of Nelson Mandella's, who also made a small speech during the Live 8 shows. I guess Nelson Mandella should also be a target because he's one of Bono's famous friends? ;) If it also happens to be a reference to Bill Gates, then perhaps Mos Def should contact the Gates Foundation to see if it did anything for the hurricane victims. Mos Def participated in one of the Make Poverty History commercials, so one would think he would know a little better . . .

He said "IF" they are not about helping. then f them. the statement was NOT a personal attack on u2. it was a statement about celebrity philanthropists.

It's a criticism, in which, he clearly names Bono, the lead singer of U2. And if it's not a criticism, then the lines simply don't make sense.

I don't blame Mos Def's anger. However, in this case, it is sorely misplaced.

[ClubberLang]

Again, no. Mos Def is using righteous anger to support his argument; there's nothing implied or otherwise that would suggest his reason for hollering is "unreasonable".

It's enough to make you holler.. implies that x curcumstance is so harsh that it would warrant making an equally harsh statement. If you can't see that then you have a problem with the english language.


I feel this has no bearing at all on his lyrics. What I do believe is that this song reflects a knee-jerk reaction that he had--and as a result, Mos Def comes across as someone who is completely ignorant of the subject he's directing his anger towards in those lines. When I critique a subject in my professional writing, I usually do a little research first (sometimes I even contact the subject . . .).

it has total bearing on his lyrics. This is a typical mistake make by art/literature critics. If mos def says "its enough to make YOU holler" as opposed to it's enough to make "ME" holler then it's ridiculous to claim that he is personally telling u2 to f off. it's the equivalent of him telling a story and having a characther say "f-u2" and then personally accusing him of insulting u2.

I am not sure if you listen to alot of Mos Def, or rap music in particular. But it's a common feature of the music to make a statements in second or third narrative. It's important to distinguish between the voice of the author (narrator) and the statment being made. They are not the same.


And I think Mos Def would be well served to do a little research before lipping off.

:rolleyes: lipping off? are you a third grade teacher?

[ClubberLang]

The reason I say Geldof is because he is the one who is actually a "sir"--and not Bono; it's, again, lamentable that Mos Def doesn't bother educating himself on the topic at hand.

mkay... this clearly illustrates that the entire song has just zoomed over your head. The "Sir Bono" remark is tounge in cheek. :rolleyes:

[SergesPlace]

They're so poor, and so black.
That's classic!!!
http://www.artnet.com/artwork_images/256/124762.jpg

[Webslinger]

It's enough to make you holler.. implies that x curcumstance is so harsh that it would warrant making an equally harsh statement. If you can't see that then you have a problem with the english language.


Well, I've been known to grade a few university level English papers from time to time, so chances are, I'm probably more of an authority on that subject than you are.

I would suggest to you, in some cases, hollering would be a reasonable response to something that's severely unjust. And, this is the case here. Period. Otherwise, again, the lyrics are meaningless. If it's an unreasonable anger, then who cares except the common madman and children who can't read properly?


it has total bearing on his lyrics. This is a typical mistake make by art/literature critics. If mos def says "its enough to make YOU holler" as opposed to it's enough to make "ME" holler then it's ridiculous to claim that he is personally telling u2 to f off.

You can replace "you" with "a person"; it's a conversational device. It's informal and casual. "Being hit in the head with a baseball . . . well, that's enough to make you yell . . ." The implication here is that "you" equals the common, reasonable, man (it, in fact, includes both Mos Def and his audience). And if it doesn't, then again, the lyrics don't make sense. More importantly, Mos Def is pushing his own opinion by using "I"; that stanza is also a reflection upon him. He's not suddenly switching from an unknown narrator to author there.

it's the equivalent of him telling a story and having a characther say "f-u2" and then personally accusing him of insulting u2.

Oh, so Mos Def is just telling a story and criticizing the narrator? :rolleyes:

I am not sure if you listen to alot of Mos Def, or rap music in particular. But it's a common feature of the music to make a statements in second or third narrative.

person

It's "second or third person".


:rolleyes: lipping off? are you a third grade teacher?

No. Why? Are you?

[ClubberLang]

A little more context:

The song Katrina Clap is done over the beat from a track from some new Orleans artists that was called the "Magnolia Clap" by some rappers from the Magnolia projects of Lousianna...one of the poorest zones in America. The orignial song is them describing their neighbourhood. In the preface to the song Mos def states "this is for the streets.. the streets everywhere". The song is told from the POV of someone living in poverty of America's ghettos the type of poverty that is frequently gets little attention from American policy, NGO's and philanthropists.

[ClubberLang]

It's "second" or "third" person


That was a typo. You knew what i meant. and instead of attacking an obvious mistake.. why not respond to the actual argument about second and third person narrative :)

[Webslinger]

That was a typo. You knew what i meant. and instead of attacking an obvious mistake.. why not respond to the actual argument about second and third person narrative :)


I already have addressed this.

Sorry, while I knew what you meant, I wasn't positive you knew the correct wording.

But it's a common feature of the music to make a statements in second or third narrative.

If you think switching voice is specific only to rap music, you're sorely mistaken. But what's really happening here isn't an entirely different voice switch (in the conventional sense), because "you" also implies the narrator in those lines.

[ClubberLang]

Oh, so Mos Def is just telling a story and criticizing the narrator? :rolleyes:

]

The point isn't about whether he is criticizing the narrator. The point is that he is telling a story through SOMEONE ELSE's POV. Hence using the beat from a song by a group of NO rappers in which they describe their neighbourhood.

[Webslinger]

The song is told from the POV of someone living in poverty of America's ghettos the type of poverty that is frequently gets little attention from American policy, NGO's and philanthropists.

And again, the point is, if Mos Def doesn't sympathize with that perspective, why write about it? The narrator, then, can still be criticized for being clueless, regardless if you believe Mos Def is the narrator. Is Mos Def attempting to criticize the narrator? Unlikely

The narrator also uses "I". And "you" refers generally to every normal person (including Mos Def).

[Webslinger]

]

The point isn't about whether he is criticizing the narrator. The point is that he is telling a story through SOMEONE ELSE's POV. Hence using the beat from a song by a group of NO rappers in which they describe their neighbourhood.

So Mos Def is an impressionist, painting a picture about `how it is', in your opinion? He is, perhaps, an unbiased scientist, observing street life? He is neither a sympthazier--nor a critic, eh?

[ClubberLang]

So Mos Def is an impressionist, painting a picture about `how it is', in your opinion?

Taking into context the deliberate use of a beat by New Orleans rappers, the rest of the song lyrics that describe the aftermath of Katrina Mos Def is describing how people "in the streets" feel. They feel neglected. That's what I took from the song and the bono reference in particular.

here's a link to the full song..

http://www.odeo.com/show/download/227258/4/media.odeo.com.1.2.0.CDocumentsandSettingsdavidDes ktopMosDefKatrinaKlap.mp3

[Webslinger]

mkay... this clearly illustrates that the entire song has just zoomed over your head. The "Sir Bono" remark is tounge in cheek. :rolleyes:


I doubt it.

1) Bono and his famous friends are almost guaranteed to include Sir Bob Geldof.

2) It wouldn't be much of a slip to transfer "Sir" from Geldof to Bono.

If by "tongue in cheek" you mean "sarcastic", I agree that "Sir" is meant as an insult.

[ClubberLang]

He is, perhaps, an unbiased scientist, observing street life? He is neither a sympthazier--nor a critic, eh?

lol. i'd describe him as a journalist. take that for whatever you'd like.

[SergesPlace]

Guys, who the fcuk cares about what some has been rapper turn crappy actor has to say about anything anyway especially about Bono :lol: :lol:

[ClubberLang]

Guys, who the fcuk cares about what some has been rapper turn crappy actor has to say about anything anyway especially about Bono :lol: :lol:

dude's been in tony nominated y musicals. he wan an obie award from the village voice for his role. he's remarkably talented.

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0080049/bio

[SergesPlace]

dude's been in tony nominated y musicals. he wan an obie award from the village voice for his role. he's remarkably talented.

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0080049/bio
A tony nomination? well that changes everything. :lol:

[Webslinger]

Taking into context the deliberate use of a beat by New Orleans rappers, the rest of the song lyrics that describe the aftermath of Katrina Mos Def is describing how people "in the streets" feel. They feel neglected. That's what I took from the song and the bono reference in particular.


1. I agree with you completely here (in that these people probably feel neglected). However, that doesn't change the fact Mos Def is using "I" in that stanza, and, consequently, "you" (or `reasonable people in the same situation') also implies himself. Otherwise the switching of perspectives would be far too jarring (and just utter nonsense).

2. I suspect a lot of people "in the streets" resent Bono; and I can also understand that point of view. However, if Bono becomes their focus of hatred, I believe that anger is severely misplaced.

3. (And here's where we mostly differ) I strongly suspect Mos Def sympathizes with that point of view; I don't believe anyone is unbiased (if that's even possible . . . part of the human condition) when they paint or write poetry or fiction. Furthermore, I'd be very surprised, if, at the time of writing the song, that Mos Def knew any better (about the work U2 has done to help Katrina victims).

4. As such, I am still of the opinion Mos Def has made an error in judgment.




here's a link to the full song..

http://www.odeo.com/show/download/227258/4/media.odeo.com.1.2.0.CDocumentsandSettingsdavidDes ktopMosDefKatrinaKlap.mp3

Thank you. I've heard it already.

For what it's worth, I don't mind some of Mos Def's work.

[Webslinger]

lol. i'd describe him as a journalist. take that for whatever you'd like.


Journalism is never unbiased either (regardless of how much it pretends to be).

It's possible Mos Def will later backtrack, clarify what he meant (backtrack), or come out and apologize (backtrack), and you're certainly welcome to interpret those lines in whatever manner you wish. Anyway, I'm not going to bother discussing this anymore.

[fuhreal]

rap artist mentality - gotta sell ma recordz by bashing random peoplez and looking charitable


If you knew mos def, you wouldn't say that.

[Neovingian]

Guys, who the fcuk cares about what some has been rapper turn crappy actor has to say about anything anyway especially about Bono :lol: :lol:
FYI: Just so you have your facts straight. Mos' has been acting since like 94' way before he became a rapper. So there's no way he could be a has been rapper turned crappy actor.

Like the other dude said he's won Tony's, Screen actors Guild, and been nominated for Emmy's & he's not done yet. I guess all these various art & film academies just hand out awards to crappy actors just for the helluvit.

I'm sure what he said about Bono and or U2 was not meant to be taken literally, cuz he knows that would be career suicide. There's no need to disect his lyrics or break the isht down. He was just a bit heated & emotional and said some outlandish things.

[DJSINR]

U2 is by far one of the most supportive groups in the industry bringing awareness to the poor and helpless and the infected.

I think Mos Def and the rest of the funky bunch should sell the gold on their necks and in their mouths and send that to the hurricane victims.

Bling Bling ain't a thing. drop the game and stop trying to sell records by causing a political statement.

They knew Katrina was coming they were warned and they sat there, half of the people that went to the superdome didn't even bring anything with them,
they expecte to freeload.

DJSiNR

George Bush doesnt care about Midgets - Chris Rock

[yayawhoo2003]

I'm gonna take heat for this one but I am personally not a U2 or Bono fan.

The causes they support are great and they do alot of awesome things for alot of people, but I really cannot stand any of their music.

Getting back on topic, what Mos Def said was pretty ignorant, and not well thought out. U2 may suck musically but they sure would do whatever they could to help out the poor people from New Orleans and beyond.

Oh yeah and George Bush doesnt like anyone who cannot help him make money, win an election, keep him from looking dumb.

[Spike]

A tony nomination? well that changes everything. :lol:

http://forum.presence-pc.com/images/perso/pink_gay.gif

[johnnyepy]

who the heck is mos def never heard of him , is he in G-unit?
and u2 sucks such a bad band i rather listen to Hilary Duff.

[vessa]

Who cares about rock and roll, who cares about rap, who cares about country....when babies cant' eat!

Imagaine hearing babies cry in desperation because they are hungry. Imagine being that babies mother and watchign your baby starve?

WHO CARES ABOUT ANYTHING ELSE WHEN YOUR BABY IS STARVING?