<UPDATE July 30>HP Digital Entertainment P4 3.0GHz DVD+RW Wireless MC(hp refurb)

[Quince]

1305.46 canadian includes shipping and all taxes and duty from ecost

http://www.ecost.com/ecost/shop/detail~dpno~545023.asp


"featured" for 1999.99 plus taxes at future shop:

http://www.futureshop.ca/catalog/proddetail.asp?sku_id=0665000FS10052478&catid=22158&logon=&langid=EN

update july 30:

Price drop

Total Price: $1007.56 (to your door, all inclusive)

[Quince]

review:

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1759,1734313,00.asp

[Jon Lai]

I could build my own and cost less than 1000.

[stealth]

I would have thought so too, but when I did, based on a lot of boxing day special prices and factored in the cost of XP Media edition, Hauppage card, etc. I wish I'd just bought one that would work straight out of the box, probably is a lot quieter than what I built, and look a whole lot nicer as well. Worked out for me to be about $1000-1100., so all depends how you like to spend your time.

$1300. for a refurb though IMO is only warm.

[OrdG]

I just bought an HP 1195C media center refurb P4 3.2 DVDRW for $899 from FS...

[anonymous2]

Pic
http://img291.echo.cx/img291/7703/pic0ut.jpg

[Quince]

I could build my own and cost less than 1000.


Prove it.

Make sure its in a similar "home theatre" case and it has a portable hard drive.
And that you pay for the os.

And the rc and wireless keyboard.

[SENSEI]

Prove it.

Make sure its in a similar "home theatre" case and it has a portable hard drive.
And that you pay for the os.

And the rc and wireless keyboard.

I agree...if you factor in the cost of a NICE small case and a MCE compatible TUNER and VIDEO card you're looking much more than a grand.

Not to mention legit MCE runs about $150.

A friend pointed me over to a local Markham group start up for tips with MCE2005 and media centres...haven't heard of them before, but they got some cool products... SENSUZ MEDIA (http://www.sensuz.com)

[Jon Lai]

Prove it.

Make sure its in a similar "home theatre" case and it has a portable hard drive.
And that you pay for the os.

And the rc and wireless keyboard.

Let me follow the same specs to build this.

Sure, why not. Just get a SSF barebone that comes with mobo for ~$250, external hdd $99 (160G) internal $130 (200G) 512mb RAM $45, Bluetooth wireless set from M$ $65, DVD Burner $60, TV Tuner $70x2, 128mb $70 (PC Radeon 9600)

9-in-1 card reader, I can get a 14-in-1 for $15.

OS? Screw MMC, I'll use Redhat instead and run WINE for MediaPortal.

I believe that's $859 + tax = 987.85. Right under budget. I don't believe I'm missing anything.

[frogger]

$1000 bucks for something that doesn't do hi-definition recording?

[stealth]

Let me follow the same specs to build this.

Sure, why not. Just get a SSF barebone that comes with mobo for ~$250, external hdd $99 (160G) internal $130 (200G) 512mb RAM $45, Bluetooth wireless set from M$ $65, DVD Burner $60, TV Tuner $70x2, 128mb $70 (PC Radeon 9600)

9-in-1 card reader, I can get a 14-in-1 for $15.

OS? Screw MMC, I'll use Redhat instead and run WINE for MediaPortal.

I believe that's $859 + tax = 987.85. Right under budget. I don't believe I'm missing anything.

True, you could do something like that. But it sounds, and looks, and I'll even bet, acts a whole lot more ghetto than the HP.

[aquariaguy]

Let me follow the same specs to build this.

Sure, why not. Just get a SSF barebone that comes with mobo for ~$250, external hdd $99 (160G) internal $130 (200G) 512mb RAM $45, Bluetooth wireless set from M$ $65, DVD Burner $60, TV Tuner $70x2, 128mb $70 (PC Radeon 9600)

9-in-1 card reader, I can get a 14-in-1 for $15.

OS? Screw MMC, I'll use Redhat instead and run WINE for MediaPortal.

I believe that's $859 + tax = 987.85. Right under budget. I don't believe I'm missing anything.

What kind of warranty do u have?

[Quince]

I don't believe I'm missing anything.


MISSING: portable hard drive, wireless keyboard/mouse, video connection cables, plus your case does not compare and would look out of place in a
stereo rack.

So that would ad a few hundred dollars.

[gprime]

having a cpu helps too

[DieHardware]

Originally Posted by Jon Lai
I don't believe I'm missing anything.

having a cpu helps too

Yes one of those would help, lol :razz:

[Watson]

This is a great deal. To get this quality of components, plug and play functionality and a licensed/warrantied system you would not be able to do it.

I've built a couple of HTPC's and to get quiet/silent and cool running parts you can't do it for under $1000 for what this has.

The only probelm with this is that you can't add anything to it; there's no free slots. SO no you could not add an HD card to this.

[Jon Lai]

$1000 bucks for something that doesn't do hi-definition recording?

I believe there are TV Tuners that allow hi-definition recording.

True, you could do something like that. But it sounds, and looks, and I'll even bet, acts a whole lot more ghetto than the HP.

I don't bleieve HP makes good computers, I'd rather go with a Dell PC than a HP PC, honestly. And no, I believe building your own would have more superior performance than this HP one.

What kind of warranty do u have?
Labour on yourself, but the parts from the manufacturers.

MISSING: portable hard drive, wireless keyboard/mouse, video connection cables, plus your case does not compare and would look out of place in a
stereo rack.

So that would ad a few hundred dollars.

Um, I said external hdd $99 (160G) and Bluetooth wireless set from M$ $65. Turns out you weren't reading.

The case would depend what you choose. I've seen great barebones that would look very appropriate for a Hi-Fidelity setting.


having a cpu helps too

Did you not read? I said a SFF barebone. One of such barebone will include the case itself, a power supply, and a mobo that comes along with a CPU.

This is a great deal. To get this quality of components, plug and play functionality and a licensed/warrantied system you would not be able to do it.

I've built a couple of HTPC's and to get quiet/silent and cool running parts you can't do it for under $1000 for what this has.

The only probelm with this is that you can't add anything to it; there's no free slots. SO no you could not add an HD card to this.

Exactly. You're extremely limited by getting yourself this HP Mediacenter. The warrenty gives it some advantages, but if you're building your own, why need warrenty? You'll have mfg's warrenty on the parts, and after thats over, parts will be so much less expensive anyways.

True, the cooling will cost you something, I believe I did leave that out. You'd probably need an artic cooling system at around $100, bringing the price before taxes to just below $1000.

[elty]

Did you not read? I said a SFF barebone. One of such barebone will include the case itself, a power supply, and a mobo that comes along with a CPU.

Please tell me which SFF is that, dont tell me it is the Via C3 because that one for sure do not have the computing power to do the job well enough. I really want to find a P4/A64 class SFF that comes with board, CPU and case for $250 that can be purchased now.

[Jon Lai]

Please tell me which SFF is that, dont tell me it is the Via C3 because that one for sure do not have the computing power to do the job well enough. I really want to find a P4/A64 class SFF that comes with board, CPU and case for $250 that can be purchased now.

The cheapest barebones I've seen are at CC, but I'm sure there are cheaper ones elsewhere if they're on sale.

http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.php?do=ShowProdList&cmd=pl&id=BS.325

There's some decent barebones there, for $250 you can only get one that comes with a Celeron, however much faster than the 533Mhz that comes with this HP system.

[gprime]

The cheapest barebones I've seen are at CC, but I'm sure there are cheaper ones elsewhere if they're on sale.

http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.php?do=ShowProdList&cmd=pl&id=BS.325

There's some decent barebones there, for $250 you can only get one that comes with a Celeron, however much faster than the 533Mhz that comes with this HP system.

A SFF case w/ power supply, motherboard, AND a cpu faster than a 3GHz P4 for $250? wow.. I must be shopping in the wrong places.. ;D

[elty]

The cheapest barebones I've seen are at CC, but I'm sure there are cheaper ones elsewhere if they're on sale.

http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.php?do=ShowProdList&cmd=pl&id=BS.325

There's some decent barebones there, for $250 you can only get one that comes with a Celeron, however much faster than the 533Mhz that comes with this HP system.

what kind of Celeron you are using that is "much faster" than a P4 3.06 Ghz?

[Jon Lai]

what kind of Celeron you are using that is "much faster" than a P4 3.06 Ghz?

Actually this info is wrong, sorry. But youn don't really need such a fast processor anyways, anything from 2-3Ghz will do.

[zffarooq]

isnt the price amarican

[fatduckie]

Actually this info is wrong, sorry. But youn don't really need such a fast processor anyways, anything from 2-3Ghz will do.

Well, it depends on what you do in your HTPC.

If you just do recording with a hardware encoding tv tuner card, any cpu over 2-3 Ghz should do the job. However, most ppl will use HTPC as a video editting box as well. Celeron class CPU is much slower in this part.

It's difficult to build a HTPC less than $1k, especially if you're looking for a nice looking, fast, and QUIET system. The damnit Intel HSF is so loud.

My friend just built a HTPC about 2 months ago. The spec is following.

Athlon 64 2800+ S754 ($154)
Shuttle SK83G (has S-video out/sound/lan/on-board video/1394) ($279)
Sapphire Theatrix ($106)
200GB HD ($140)
Pionner DVD Writer ($79)
Internal card reader ($20)
Windows MCE2005 ($160)

Total $938 plus tax. Hopefully I didn't miss anything. I remembered he paid a little bit more somehow. The system is pretty quiet. I help him to put some WD40 in the bearing. However, there is no more PCI slots for expension. He wants to add an Audigy2 ZS but can't.

Just my 2 cents..

[diwana]

the O/S is a huge factor too....media center can be used by pretty much anyone in the family

[SENSEI]

Even the shuttle cases are too big for my entertainment system...
I've looked at hte HP centre and that thing si very deep and won't even fit on a regular shelf.

A TRUE HTPC will be smaller than a shuttle and just as powerful, the wave of the future are the MINI-ITX boards using P4 chips

DIWANA, I agree with you completely, yes there are LINUX boxes out there, yes Mediaportal works wonders, but teach my mom to record using a non-MCE system. MCE2005 is intuitve and easy to use....not to mention the extender abililiy with XBOX/XBOX360 and other units.

So far the smallest I've seen are:

BEBLU (http://www.beblu.net) UK
TRANQUIL (http://www.tranquilpc.com) UK
SENSUZ MEDIA (http://www.sensuz.com) Markham
HUSH PC (http://www.hushtechnologies.net/) UK

[Jon Lai]

Even the shuttle cases are too big for my entertainment system...
I've looked at hte HP centre and that thing si very deep and won't even fit on a regular shelf.

A TRUE HTPC will be smaller than a shuttle and just as powerful, the wave of the future are the MINI-ITX boards using P4 chips

DIWANA, I agree with you completely, yes there are LINUX boxes out there, yes Mediaportal works wonders, but teach my mom to record using a non-MCE system. MCE2005 is intuitve and easy to use....not to mention the extender abililiy with XBOX/XBOX360 and other units.

So far the smallest I've seen are:

BEBLU (http://www.beblu.net) UK
TRANQUIL (http://www.tranquilpc.com) UK
SENSUZ MEDIA (http://www.sensuz.com) Markham
HUSH PC (http://www.hushtechnologies.net/) UK

Shuttle cases too big? Where are you? For apartment settings maybe so, but most of us live in houses or towns anyways, right? The shuttles are like 8-10 inches wide and almost the same in height, that height is even less than my power amplifier (which is like a foot tall) Shuttles aren't big, its okay in size for me.

True, MCE is more user-friendly, as with all M$ products, but again, I always try to stay away from Microsoft, I use as little M$ products as possible. My sister does use Windows, but I'm mostly on a Linux box instead, and so if and when I've a Mediacenter, I'd probably run Mediaportal under a Linux box as well.

BTW, if Shuttle is too big for you, you can always get a Mac Mini.

[torontodragon]

Well, it depends on what you do in your HTPC.

If you just do recording with a hardware encoding tv tuner card, any cpu over 2-3 Ghz should do the job. However, most ppl will use HTPC as a video editting box as well. Celeron class CPU is much slower in this part.

It's difficult to build a HTPC less than $1k, especially if you're looking for a nice looking, fast, and QUIET system. The damnit Intel HSF is so loud.

My friend just built a HTPC about 2 months ago. The spec is following.

Athlon 64 2800+ S754 ($154)
Shuttle SK83G (has S-video out/sound/lan/on-board video/1394) ($279)
Sapphire Theatrix ($106)
200GB HD ($140)
Pionner DVD Writer ($79)
Internal card reader ($20)
Windows MCE2005 ($160)

Total $938 plus tax. Hopefully I didn't miss anything. I remembered he paid a little bit more somehow. The system is pretty quiet. I help him to put some WD40 in the bearing. However, there is no more PCI slots for expension. He wants to add an Audigy2 ZS but can't.

Just my 2 cents..


You missed the memory.

[Bordak]

Let me follow the same specs to build this.

Sure, why not. Just get a SSF barebone that comes with mobo for ~$250, external hdd $99 (160G) internal $130 (200G) 512mb RAM $45, Bluetooth wireless set from M$ $65, DVD Burner $60, TV Tuner $70x2, 128mb $70 (PC Radeon 9600)

9-in-1 card reader, I can get a 14-in-1 for $15.

OS? Screw MMC, I'll use Redhat instead and run WINE for MediaPortal.

I believe that's $859 + tax = 987.85. Right under budget. I don't believe I'm missing anything.

Any SFF case in the $250 range is low quality, or low performing. Period. I certainly hope you aren't planning to use the intigrated audio, I don't see a soundcard on your list.

What $99 external drive are you finding with 160 gig's space? Only one I can think of is the clearence Maxtor unit, and good luck finding them anymore, if so.

$45 ram is trash. We're building a media PC for your living room, not a el-cheapo welfare machine. $45 gets you one off's, or bargain bin brands. (Samsung "Select" is not a good ram)

$70 gets you a low end, feature lacking TV tuner. A decent Hauppage 250 series or above will normally be $100+ each.

Where are you getting a 9600 for $70? Even the garbage edition SE's with half the pipelines of a normal 9600 go for $100. The X300 PCIE unit, while not a beast, will outperform a nuditered 9600.

Also factor in the price of your remote, and then what your time is worth for setting up Redhat properly, and configering WINE. Oh, and factor in the cost of a GOOD soundcard that you left out.


Your price list would hold a lot more weight if you individually linked to each item on your list, right now I feel your prices are out of line from the norm, and some of them are, for lack of a better word, crap. I'm sure you can put together a decent machine for that price range, I'd like to see it.

Edit: Just reread, my tone comes accross as rude, wanted to let you know it is not my intent.

[Bordak]

BTW, if Shuttle is too big for you, you can always get a Mac Mini.

THe mini-Mac doesn't have the power to push any HD level content, to my knowledge.

[Jon Lai]

Any SFF case in the $250 range is low quality, or low performing. Period. I certainly hope you aren't planning to use the intigrated audio, I don't see a soundcard on your list.

What $99 external drive are you finding with 160 gig's space? Only one I can think of is the clearence Maxtor unit, and good luck finding them anymore, if so.

$45 ram is trash. We're building a media PC for your living room, not a el-cheapo welfare machine. $45 gets you one off's, or bargain bin brands. (Samsung "Select" is not a good ram)

$70 gets you a low end, feature lacking TV tuner. A decent Hauppage 250 series or above will normally be $100+ each.

Where are you getting a 9600 for $70? Even the garbage edition SE's with half the pipelines of a normal 9600 go for $100. The X300 PCIE unit, while not a beast, will outperform a nuditered 9600.

Also factor in the price of your remote, and then what your time is worth for setting up Redhat properly, and configering WINE. Oh, and factor in the cost of a GOOD soundcard that you left out.


Your price list would hold a lot more weight if you individually linked to each item on your list, right now I feel your prices are out of line from the norm, and some of them are, for lack of a better word, crap. I'm sure you can put together a decent machine for that price range, I'd like to see it.

Edit: Just reread, my tone comes accross as rude, wanted to let you know it is not my intent.

Sure, a soundcard. That costs what, $50? My current Soundblaster 5.1 costed around that price.

$45 RAM cheap? All you're doing is playing video most of the time, rarely any video editting. If I was to do video-editting, I'd be doing it on my Intel 3.4Ghz machine, and not in front of the television.

About the TV Tuner, sure, $70 might not give you a very high quality TV Tuner, but I don't think the one HP has here is of comparable quality to the Hauppauge 250 either. And BTW, the Tuners I'm looking at WILL include a remote.

How hard is it to find a 9600 128mb for $70? Check CC, they even have one for $51. Sure, 9600 isn't the best card out there, but again, I don't think HP will give you the best card there is either.

And about configuring Redhat and WINE, I've no problem with that. I've configured two Linux boxes myself and also a couple more for some friends. I don't believe configuring it into a MC will be very much difficult.

[Bordak]

Sure, a soundcard. That costs what, $50? My current Soundblaster 5.1 costed around that price.

$45 RAM cheap? All you're doing is playing video most of the time, rarely any video editting. If I was to do video-editting, I'd be doing it on my Intel 3.4Ghz machine, and not in front of the television.

About the TV Tuner, sure, $70 might not give you a very high quality TV Tuner, but I don't think the one HP has here is of comparable quality to the Hauppauge 250 either. And BTW, the Tuners I'm looking at WILL include a remote.

How hard is it to find a 9600 128mb for $70? Check CC, they even have one for $51. Sure, 9600 isn't the best card out there, but again, I don't think HP will give you the best card there is either.

And about configuring Redhat and WINE, I've no problem with that. I've configured two Linux boxes myself and also a couple more for some friends. I don't believe configuring it into a MC will be very much difficult.


If you are setting up the box to filter video streams, which is very, very often for any home theater application, the ram will be used quite heavily, and I personally would not rely on $45 ram for the job.

The PCIE X300 that comes in the Media center in question is faster then the low pipeline, low clockspeed 9600, going with the 9600 would be a big step back, it's about as fast as a ATI 9200 normal edition is most cases.

As for the configeration, while you may be able to do it, how many average system builders can? Setting up RedHat is not particularly hard, but getting your machine to play together nicely when you have 20 drivers from various manufacturers, and making sure they are all properly supported. Then having your menu systems and recording / streaming options set up. Time costs money, I know mine does, and I'm sure yours does. We might be able to set it up, but average Joe? Doubtful.

On a side note, media centers come with an optical in and out, and in some versions, a digital coaxial in, something not offered is inexpensive soundcards.

[bacid1]

question, i've never used one of these machines and im curious as to how it works with a expressvu receiver so that it can switch channels & record shows?

[TrEvOrLiCioUs]

Where is your DVI out? What about component? Compsite Audio? Optical Audio?

Look at this for a sec. I mean really look at it.

http://img69.echo.cx/img69/7713/back6eo.jpg

http://img69.echo.cx/img69/7661/back22go.jpg

http://img69.echo.cx/img69/254/back34cm.jpg




Those pics speak for themselves.

Can you do that?
If so how come ur not rich yet?

[fatduckie]

You missed the memory.

Yea. You're right. I missed memory. I was wondering why my price is a little bit less than my friend told me. He said it's appoximate $1000. Hehehe. :D



About the TV Tuner, sure, $70 might not give you a very high quality TV Tuner, but I don't think the one HP has here is of comparable quality to the Hauppauge 250 either. And BTW, the Tuners I'm looking at WILL include a remote.


Which one are you talking about with the remote that is compatiable with MCE2005?



Actually, I think it's no point to discuess here. We're comparing apple and orange now. Even though both are fruit, they have different tastes, shape, and even pricing. Same as both HP HTPC or low-end custom made HTPC. HP is no dout to be a better one. With MCE2005, nice remote, quiet, and realiable warrenty and technical support, a custom made HTPC is hardly to compare with it. It's easy to build a even low-end HTPC with $299 computer and add some components. However, they're different approach.

Always in my head: You pay what you get. There is no free lunch.

[Jon Lai]

Actually, I think it's no point to discuess here. We're comparing apple and orange now. Even though both are fruit, they have different tastes, shape, and even pricing. Same as both HP HTPC or low-end custom made HTPC. HP is no dout to be a better one. With MCE2005, nice remote, quiet, and realiable warrenty and technical support, a custom made HTPC is hardly to compare with it. It's easy to build a even low-end HTPC with $299 computer and add some components. However, they're different approach.

Always in my head: You pay what you get. There is no free lunch.

True, but $2k is definitely not worth it. All I was trying to point out was that.

[Quince]

update july 30:

Price drop

Total Price: $1007.56 (to your door, all inclusive)

[canuck_fan]

is it upgragable? What kind of video card does it have?

[Redscott]

update july 30:

Price drop

Total Price: $1007.56 (to your door, all inclusive)


I get this from E-cost to QC

Subtotal: $1069.58

Shipping:Standard - 5-14 business days $27.14
Handling: $15.43

GST / HST: $77.85

PST: $0.00



Total Price: $1190.00

How do you get $1007.56 (to your door, all inclusive) :?:

[Quince]

$699.00 $884.77 $0.00 $884.77



Subtotal: $884.77

Shipping:
Standard - 5-14 business days $30.51
Handling: $26.37

GST / HST: $65.91

PST: $0.00


Just did it again, the above is what it came to,
perhaps you added another item to get such a high sub total
price. u.s. price is 699:

http://www.ecost.com/ecost/shop/detail~dpno~545023.asp



Total Price: $1007.56

[Neil]

Anyone know offhand what's in the 545 that's been reviewed compared to the model 540 that is on sale?

[Dd_anon]

I get this from E-cost to QC

Subtotal: $1069.58

Shipping:Standard - 5-14 business days $27.14
Handling: $15.43

GST / HST: $77.85

PST: $0.00



Total Price: $1190.00

How do you get $1007.56 (to your door, all inclusive) :?:

I got 1017.62 for Vancouver BC

Subtotal: $884.77

Shipping:
Standard - 5-14 business days $39.91
Handling: $26.37

GST / HST: $66.57

PST: $0.00



Total Price: $1017.62

and I think there is only 1 left

[Hugh]

This looks like a pretty reasonable deal.

eCost is also selling the z545 cheap (US$845 vs. US$699). This appears to have a larger HD (200G vs 160G), a DVD+/-RW (instead of a + only) and a second TV tuner. http://www.ecost.com/ecost/shop/detail~dpno~545023.asp

What I don't like (from reading the review mentioned earlier (well worth reading)):
- warranty probably won't work in Canada. It is probably very short anyway because this is a refurb.
- no free slots
- no HD tuner. But the only HD tuners for computers only work off the air, not with cable or satellite. This may be a reason to hold off buying any HTPC.
- my experience with HP is that the quality is OK but the user serviceability is poor. Few BIOS upgrades, no support for Linux (i.e. disclosure of info to enable support). Support is clueless and drops balls (I haven't tried other support from other companies). I would not count on Myth supporting this hardware (I've not researched this).
- removeable HD is nice, but new cartridges seem to be very expensive (review talked about US$200). I am wary of proprietary things.
- P4 is not a CPU that I want in my living room. Centrino or Mobile Athlon would be nicer.

[blainehamilton]

I'd suggest staying away from these units. I've set up about 10 or so of the 540s and 545s and they have several shortfalls.

These units chug heat like you would not believe. Very poor air circulation results in audiable fan speeds and a huge heat spot in your entertainment centre.

The DVI and component video outputs are a pain in the ass to set up at higher resolutions. Setting up custom resolutions is a headache.

The keyboard is so uncomfortable and the trackball is useless. I seperate keyboard and mouse would have made more sense.

The portable media drive concept is a joke, overpriced desktop drives in an hp case that no retailers will stock anyways because customers laugh at the price when you tell them.

Subpar video card and lack of upgradability really hamper most perople from buying this unit. Putting in a standard pci wireless card would make sense for those who want pre-n or o or p or whatever wireless technology is tomorrows flavor. The proprietary x300 is the icing on the cake, idiots at hp couldnt add 2+2 and figure out entertainment centre = gaming = powerful video card. Telling customers their new 2000 dollar toy wont run battlefield 2 worth a damn isnt pleasant. A standard pci-e card with a dongle for the component and s-video outputs would be far prefered.
Ditto for the tv tuner(s), standard pci versions would have taken an extra 20 minutes to design in, but they had to screw the pooch and integrate those as well. Good bye to hd support ever.

Biggest problem: lack of clear support from HP. They really dropped the ball on this. The tech support for the most part is clueless about the unit. There is no dedicated support for the DEC when there should be. Better setup instructions for DVI and component are a requirement for the unit. One support tech's response for not being able to get component video out to a 56" dlp - use s-video instead, it should work fine.

HP needs to step back from this product and regroup its support teams and create specialists for this product. It's not a simple desktop and support cant be treated as such.

Now the good news. The second generation units address a lot of the above issues. The airflow has been improved to keep temps and noise down. The 555 addresses the video card issue with a geforce FX6600, hardly top of the line, but the unit would cost a lot more with an x850xt under the hood. HD support is present in the 555 with an hd over the air tuner. And I suppose wireless pre-n usb is an option with any unit, so long as you dont mind saturating your usb bus. But the problem is upgradability. PCI expansion, forget it. CPU upgrade, doubtful, but you could try. Hard drive? Again, buy a wd, maxtor, or acom data drive, you'll get double the capacity for half the price of the hp drive.


You have to admire HP for taking steps into a market few companies have feared to tread. The DEC is an impressive unit. It's sleek. It's well integrated. It's well featured for the most part.

And at this price, if you don't mind the headaches, is a deal.

The person who posted that they could built a simular machine for sub $1000 is high. No way:

P4 - $200
Mobo - $100
HD - $100
DVDRW - $50
Case - $100 (antec overture, closest I know, but no media controls or flourescent panel)
Ram - $60
Wireless - $50
Sound - integrated
WinXP MCE - $150
Keyboard - $50
Video - $100
Tv tuner with remote - $100
Cables - $25

Plus warranty, support, extra software and you're already over a grand.

On top of all this, don't expect the price on the 540 and 545s to drop much below $1500 in canada for clearance units. They look the same as the new ones and most people buy these things for the looks.

[Neil]

I'd suggest staying away from these units. I've set up about 10 or so of the 540s and 545s and they have several shortfalls.

These units chug heat like you would not believe. Very poor air circulation results in audiable fan speeds and a huge heat spot in your entertainment centre.

The DVI and component video outputs are a pain in the ass to set up at higher resolutions. Setting up custom resolutions is a headache.

The keyboard is so uncomfortable and the trackball is useless. I seperate keyboard and mouse would have made more sense.

The portable media drive concept is a joke, overpriced desktop drives in an hp case that no retailers will stock anyways because customers laugh at the price when you tell them.

Subpar video card and lack of upgradability really hamper most perople from buying this unit. Putting in a standard pci wireless card would make sense for those who want pre-n or o or p or whatever wireless technology is tomorrows flavor. The proprietary x300 is the icing on the cake, idiots at hp couldnt add 2+2 and figure out entertainment centre = gaming = powerful video card. Telling customers their new 2000 dollar toy wont run battlefield 2 worth a damn isnt pleasant. A standard pci-e card with a dongle for the component and s-video outputs would be far prefered.
Ditto for the tv tuner(s), standard pci versions would have taken an extra 20 minutes to design in, but they had to screw the pooch and integrate those as well. Good bye to hd support ever.

Biggest problem: lack of clear support from HP. They really dropped the ball on this. The tech support for the most part is clueless about the unit. There is no dedicated support for the DEC when there should be. Better setup instructions for DVI and component are a requirement for the unit. One support tech's response for not being able to get component video out to a 56" dlp - use s-video instead, it should work fine.

HP needs to step back from this product and regroup its support teams and create specialists for this product. It's not a simple desktop and support cant be treated as such.

Now the good news. The second generation units address a lot of the above issues. The airflow has been improved to keep temps and noise down. The 555 addresses the video card issue with a geforce FX6600, hardly top of the line, but the unit would cost a lot more with an x850xt under the hood. HD support is present in the 555 with an hd over the air tuner. And I suppose wireless pre-n usb is an option with any unit, so long as you dont mind saturating your usb bus. But the problem is upgradability. PCI expansion, forget it. CPU upgrade, doubtful, but you could try. Hard drive? Again, buy a wd, maxtor, or acom data drive, you'll get double the capacity for half the price of the hp drive.


You have to admire HP for taking steps into a market few companies have feared to tread. The DEC is an impressive unit. It's sleek. It's well integrated. It's well featured for the most part.

And at this price, if you don't mind the headaches, is a deal.

The person who posted that they could built a simular machine for sub $1000 is high. No way:

P4 - $200
Mobo - $100
HD - $100
DVDRW - $50
Case - $100 (antec overture, closest I know, but no media controls or flourescent panel)
Ram - $60
Wireless - $50
Sound - integrated
WinXP MCE - $150
Keyboard - $50
Video - $100
Tv tuner with remote - $100
Cables - $25

Plus warranty, support, extra software and you're already over a grand.

On top of all this, don't expect the price on the 540 and 545s to drop much below $1500 in canada for clearance units. They look the same as the new ones and most people buy these things for the looks.

Blainehamilton: Just to be clear, are you saying the HP 540 & 545 do not use standard PCI-E and PCI cards? I too wondered if the built-in video would be limiting and presumed it could be upgraded later. You are saying that is not the case?

I did go check one out that was set up as a home theater and found the keyboard/trackball quite useable.

You are saying also that the 540 & 545 will not even go on clearance below $1500 in Canada. Well I noticed Bestbuy has the 540 for $1599 regular and with this e-cost deal they are equivalent of about $900 Cdn.

[Hugh]

eCost is also selling the z545 cheap (US$845 vs. US$699). This appears to have a larger HD (200G vs 160G), a DVD+/-RW (instead of a + only) and a second TV tuner. http://www.ecost.com/ecost/shop/detail~dpno~545023.aspI seem to have gotten that link wrong. http://www.ecost.com/ecost/shop/detail~dpno~545020.asp

[Dd_anon]

The person who posted that they could built a simular machine for sub $1000 is high. No way:

P4 - $200
Mobo - $100
HD - $100
DVDRW - $50
Case - $100 (antec overture, closest I know, but no media controls or flourescent panel)
Ram - $60
Wireless - $50
Sound - integrated
WinXP MCE - $150
Keyboard - $50
Video - $100
Tv tuner with remote - $100
Cables - $25

Plus warranty, support, extra software and you're already over a grand.


The antec overture is not a fair comparison at all. These closest one I can think of is the AHANIX D-VINE MCE601B case.
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=14782&vpn=MCE601B-A&manufacture=Ahanix
It can be found on NCIX for $382.90

So this is definately a good deal especially with the case price added up together

[blainehamilton]

Where is your DVI out? What about component? Compsite Audio? Optical Audio?

Look at this for a sec. I mean really look at it.

http://img69.echo.cx/img69/7713/back6eo.jpg

http://img69.echo.cx/img69/7661/back22go.jpg

http://img69.echo.cx/img69/254/back34cm.jpg




Those pics speak for themselves.

Can you do that?
If so how come ur not rich yet?



No, it is not a standard PCI-E card. It fits in a standard PCI-E slot, but as soon as you try to replace it, you lose the built in component, svideo, and vga outputs. Plus some tailoring to the case might be required to make it fit.

Plus HP does not support cpu upgrades and does not suggest ram upgrades over 1GB. Otherwise you might not be inclined to replace it with a new DEC in 12 months time.

Here are the mainboard details, right from hp:

http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/document?dlc=en&lc=en&product=435775&lang=en&cc=ca&docname=c00307480

[Neil]

No, it is not a standard PCI-E card. It fits in a standard PCI-E slot, but as soon as you try to replace it, you lose the built in component, svideo, and vga outputs. Plus some tailoring to the case might be required to make it fit.

Plus HP does not support cpu upgrades and does not suggest ram upgrades over 1GB. Otherwise you might not be inclined to replace it with a new DEC in 12 months time.

Here are the mainboard details, right from hp:

http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/document?dlc=en&lc=en&product=435775&lang=en&cc=ca&docname=c00307480

Thanks for the info Blaine. The CPU & 1 GB ram limit seem like they wouldn't be a problem to me at least.
But being unable to change the video card seems like a more significant limitation.

How do you think the 540 or 545 would be at playing back 1080i transport streams? I built an HTPC that can playback DVD's at 768p just fine but can't playback the 1080i .ts files smoothly enough.

Incidentally, for the debate that's going on in the thread here, the HTPC I built cost about $900 and that was with finding some big discounts on certain parts and cutting a few corners here and there.

It is based on the Antec Aria box and while it's less powerful and 'consumer friendly' than this unit, it is more flexible for changes & expansion.

My input would be that while it's certainly possible to build an HTPC for less than these HP DEC's, it's also possible to spend more. And it can be kind of a hassle, those small components are harder to find and assemble.

You also have to plan carefully when it comes to on-board options and slots. Do you want good WiFi? Do you want FireWire? Do you want a theater-quality soundcard? How about tuner or tuner(s)? Each option will generally consume a slot, and I couldn't find a motherboard that had very many of these features on board, would fit the SFF, and was affordable.

[blainehamilton]

Great timing, I had one of the 540 units in store for servicing today.

Got to check out under the hood. Same as every other one I have looked at, noisy and hot.

The mobo has 4 DDR slots, I suppose 4x512mb or even 4x1gb should be fine in terms of memory upgrades. The stock 2x256 plus 2x512 or 2x256 upgrade would yield fine results.

The cpu and hs/fan is the same unit assembly the media centre models released at the same time use. (m1060n and m1070n) An upgrade to a newer socket 775 chip should be fine as long as a bios upgrade is available and done. Not sure if dual core is an option, I'm not sure what chipset requirements are needed for dual core.

The video is a standard PCI-E, the video card stock in the unit has extra headers and the vga, component, and svideo/composite leads are run off those headers with connector cables. Thus, upgrade the card and you lose the vga, component, svideo and composite outputs unless the card has a dongle cable with those options. The headers are proprietary so you cant just plug them into the new card.

The PCI slot on the mainboard is host to a riser card with 3 pci slots. Stupid hp. Stupid asus. Wouldn't it be better to use the 3 pci locations on the mainboard instead of bothering with this stupid riser card stuff. The wireless card and tuner(s) are standard pci cards. Only problem is the back panel plates are not standard.

Optical drive is standard, upgrade to a 16x8x16 dual layer with lightscribe would be a breeze, as will be blu ray.

Hard drive is standard, sata. Plus there is a second sata connection on the board, plus a second header on the ide cable that is connected to the optical drive. So possibly you could shoehorn 2 other hard drives in the unit, altho I cant see where you would fit them, and heat would be a serious issue.

I suppose if you gut the holder for the personal media rip off (i mean drive) you could fit 1 or even 2 drives in that space.

Biggest thorn in my butt is the non standard back panel plates. Would have been better, easier, and cheaper to just use standard pci-e and pci formats.

I still wouldn't pay $1500 for it. Even $1000 is a long shot, but that's because I already have a htpc built along with most of everyone else here.

[Neil]

Great timing, I had one of the 540 units in store for servicing today.

Got to check out under the hood. Same as every other one I have looked at, noisy and hot.

The mobo has 4 DDR slots, I suppose 4x512mb or even 4x1gb should be fine in terms of memory upgrades. The stock 2x256 plus 2x512 or 2x256 upgrade would yield fine results.

The cpu and hs/fan is the same unit assembly the media centre models released at the same time use. (m1060n and m1070n) An upgrade to a newer socket 775 chip should be fine as long as a bios upgrade is available and done. Not sure if dual core is an option, I'm not sure what chipset requirements are needed for dual core.

The video is a standard PCI-E, the video card stock in the unit has extra headers and the vga, component, and svideo/composite leads are run off those headers with connector cables. Thus, upgrade the card and you lose the vga, component, svideo and composite outputs unless the card has a dongle cable with those options. The headers are proprietary so you cant just plug them into the new card.

The PCI slot on the mainboard is host to a riser card with 3 pci slots. Stupid hp. Stupid asus. Wouldn't it be better to use the 3 pci locations on the mainboard instead of bothering with this stupid riser card stuff. The wireless card and tuner(s) are standard pci cards. Only problem is the back panel plates are not standard.

Optical drive is standard, upgrade to a 16x8x16 dual layer with lightscribe would be a breeze, as will be blu ray.

Hard drive is standard, sata. Plus there is a second sata connection on the board, plus a second header on the ide cable that is connected to the optical drive. So possibly you could shoehorn 2 other hard drives in the unit, altho I cant see where you would fit them, and heat would be a serious issue.

I suppose if you gut the holder for the personal media rip off (i mean drive) you could fit 1 or even 2 drives in that space.

Biggest thorn in my butt is the non standard back panel plates. Would have been better, easier, and cheaper to just use standard pci-e and pci formats.

I still wouldn't pay $1500 for it. Even $1000 is a long shot, but that's because I already have a htpc built along with most of everyone else here.

Thanks for the info. That sounds fairly proprietary, and if you say heat & noise are also noticeable, I think I'll hold off on this.