Weight Loss and Muscle Mass

[Fightguard]

Here's my progress so far that I posted in another thread,
I lost ~20 pounds so far since the beginning of September...but it doesn't look like I've been losing from my fat belly...

At the end of this past June, my doctor weighed me at 231 lbs (my height is 5'8"). However, during July and August I had to have put on at least a few extra pounds since I ate a burger/fries/pop lunch at least a couple of times a week for those 2 months and didn't exercise. So by the end of August, I was probably hovering around 235 lbs., I suppose. That's the heaviest I've ever been in my life (I'll be 27 yrs. in a couple of weeks).
When September came around, I made the commitment to better myself...gave up all the crap I was eating/drinking and started cardio (running/aerobics/stair climbing) and light weight (dumbells) training, 5 days a week. I currently exercise 45 - 75 minutes a day, depening on my routine, but for the first couple of weeks I barely touched the weights.
This past Monday, I went to the doctor and I weighed in at 212 lbs. So I've lost around 20(+) lbs. in just over 7 weeks. So my rate of loss is ~3 lbs. a week.
My diet, I eat 6 or 7 small meals thoughout the day...nothing special (lean meats, chicken, fish, egg whites, fruits and veggies, rice (not everyday), and wheat bread) just no junk or fatty stuff. For snacks I'll have no-fat yogurt or unsalted nuts (almonds mainly). I do treat myself to desserts like pie or ice cream but not everyday. Finally, I'll have 1-2 servings of Protien shakes a day...1 serving after my workout and on days when I'm not exercising, I'll have a half serving in the morning and another half serving at night. Some days I'll have 1.5 or 2 servings of the shakes. The key is to never feel hungry and to never feel full (like, "let me sit back and unbuckle my belt" full).
Now, ~20(+) pounds lighter, I don't look all that different than I did over the summer (after all, I'm still overweight at 212 lbs)...like I said, I still have my fat belly which looks pretty much the same as it did before Sept. However, my face looks less chubby, my man-breasts have flattened down noticably, and the most significant change is that my A-S-S is smaller and less lardy...I used to have a huge butt! I could look down over my shoulder and see it easily...no joke :cheesygri I suppose all that stair-climbing fixed that. I guess it's time to add some sit-ups/crunches to the mix and get started on trimming the belly...

*edit* forgot about the water...I drink around 3-4 L of water throughout the day.

Thus far I'm losing around 3 lbs. a week...first off, is this a good rate of loss, given my starting weight??
Now,what I'm a bit concerned with with is how much of what I'm losing is fat, and how much is muscle....the fact that my belly hasn't really changed by the looks of it has got me thinking about this. My primary goal is losing weight and muscle development is secondary but I'd like to get some comments on how well I'm doing balancing out the two...
I workout 5 days a week, but it really breaks down as a 3-day cycle - exercise two days straight (first thing in the morning) then rest on the third day. Workouts range from 45 to 75 mins., depending on my routine. The shortest sessions are 30 min. cardio plus 15 min. doing a couple of dumbell exercises. The longest sessions are 40 min. cardio plus 35 min. dumbells.
I've got a bench a do all the dumbell excercises described here,
http://www.sport-fitness-advisor.com/dumbellexercises.html
however, I'm only working with light weights, 10 lbs. only...I do 20-25 reps per set, and 6 sets per exercise. I know my weights are light but my muscles do get fatigued and I do feel the "burn" during each set so I know I'm working hard.

[dealforme]

Thus far I'm losing around 3 lbs. a week...first off, is this a good rate of loss, given my starting weight??

It sounds good to me. As long you keep your fat & calorie consumption under control. You want to burn more calories than you intake and if you reduce the sugar intake will help as well.


I've got a bench a do all the dumbell excercises described here,
http://www.sport-fitness-advisor.com/dumbellexercises.html
however, I'm only working with light weights, 10 lbs. only...I do 20-25 reps per set, and 6 sets per exercise. I know my weights are light but my muscles do get fatigued and I do fell the "burn" during each set so I know I'm working hard.

This is fine as well. Since your objective is to loose weight then the low weight and high reps is fine since I consider this a toning type of weight training.

[sumfunny]

How many calories do you average per day?

You have to get bigger dumbbells try finding weights that will allow you to get so tired you cant do another lift after about 3 sets of 8 reps

Cut your protein shakes down to 1 max a day, its useless calories if your really not pushing yourself to build muscle

The Last place you put fat on (usually the tits on a guy) is the first place it comes off and the first place it comes on (stomach for guys) is the last place it will come off so keep at it.

[Fightguard]

This is fine as well. Since your objective is to loose weight then the low weight and high reps is fine since I consider this a toning type of weight training.
Thanks...so if I'm toning, as opposed to building my musclues, am I effectively maintaining my current muscle mass and not losing any of it through the rest of my workouts and diet??

[Fightguard]

How many calories do you average per day?

You have to get bigger dumbbells try finding weights that will allow you to get so tired you cant do another lift after about 3 sets of 8 reps

Cut your protein shakes down to 1 max a day, its useless calories if your really not pushing yourself to build muscle

The Last place you put fat on (usually the tits on a guy) is the first place it comes off and the first place it comes on (stomach for guys) is the last place it will come off so keep at it.
I'm eating healthy and eating less food than before...but I actually haven't been counting my calorie intake...

I do plan to get heavier weights...I just thought I'd wait untill I'm down to around 200 lbs. before I move on to bigger dumbells...I thought it was a good plan since I think I'm already getting a pretty good workout with the 10 lbs + high reps...So you think I should start with heavier weights now?

Finally, my proties shakes are 1 a day for the most part...I only take the extra 0.5/1 serving if I feel I didn't/wasn't getting enough with the rest of my diet (ie. don't have time to eat dinner/meal). It's 20 grams each serving...

[Fightguard]

Here's an example of my SMALL meals, spaced 2-3 hours apart throughout the day:

Breakfast 1) very small serving of oatmeal and an apple
Breakfast 2) 2 egg whites sandwiched in a single slice of wheat bread

Lunch 1) piece of pita bread, tuna, salad
Lunch 2) snack of yogurt and nuts, piece of fruit or carrot sticks

Dinner 1) small strip of chicken breast and vegetables, rice
Dinner 2) same as 1, but no rice

*If I have a seventh meal, it's a snack type.
*Dinner 2 becomes a snack type if I ate a bit more during Dinner 1.

[sumfunny]

if you can spare the time about 10 min 3 times a day, I'm sure you spend more on RFD go to

fitday.com and just track for maybe a week or so

you probably want some where around 2200- 2500 calories / day

as for the toning etc regarding the high reps to much and all your really doing is exhausting your arms and could possibly be starting to burn muscle through that. Just a thought though

[Fightguard]

as for the toning etc regarding the high reps to much and all your really doing is exhausting your arms and could possibly be starting to burn muscle through that. Just a thought thoughthis is the type of answer I'm looking for...thanks.
I'll look into fitday.com as well. Thanks again.

[Brandon]

this is the type of answer I'm looking for...thanks.
I'll look into fitday.com as well. Thanks again.

A good fitness community to visit is Finertia (http://www.finertia.com). I have a fitness journal there as well. I find it's great for getting advice as that is the focus of the whole community. A lot of people are based in the GTA. It's a good environment since everybody there is fitness conscious, so it really gets you motivated...well, atleast for me it does...haha

As well, someone mentioned Fitday which is pretty good, especially since it's FREE. I'm using it right now to monitor my caloric intake.

[H2O Boy]

Thanks...so if I'm toning, as opposed to building my musclues, am I effectively maintaining my current muscle mass and not losing any of it through the rest of my workouts and diet??
It's hard to say whether you are actually maintaining unless you frequently have body composition tests done (in a phase where you are losing fat). Here's the logic: while your weight program will not cause you to lose muscle mass, the fact that you are decreasing your mass (mostly fat) will. Don't forget that your body now lugs around ~20 fewer pounds at ALL TIMES. Consider this a continuous weight exercise throughout the day - a movement such as crouching down has 20 lbs less resistance than before. Same effect goes for all stabilizing muscles in your back, abs, etc.
I've gone through a mass decrease of about 22% and have experienced this myself, so maintaining that mass will require a bit more work (heavier weights) as you progress.

Best of luck to you!

edit: most of my losses were over a 2-3 year period ending about a year ago - very gradual but i'm still working at it. :)

[Ren]

It's nice to see another person learning the importance of staying fit. Last August I weighed in at around 225 pounds, but since then I've reached 190. I'm about 5'9". As you can see I still have around 20 pounds of fat to go ;) However, I've taken something of a different route from yourself. I started with weight training and moved on to cardio.... believe it or not I owe it all to DDR to get me started :lol:

I'm telling you this, because your missing something very important by just lifting 10 pound weights. They may tone a bit but you will not gain muscle. Even if it seems that gaining muscle now is counter-intuitive it actually is not. You see every pound of muscle increases the calories you burn daily by 25-50 calories. That may not seem like much, but 10 pounds of muscle = 250-500 calories more a DAY. You might want to try the heavier 20 or 25 pound weights.

The added muscle mass does have other advantages. I know it seems shallow, but when I look at my arms I'm filled with a little pride that it was my determintation and strength that got me whats there.

Right now I'm trying high intensity cardio, sprinting, during short bursts. From what I've read recently it's effects are better than long sessions, and it does little to affect muscle mass that long cardio sessions do.

Just curious though, what made you decide to start losing weight? Mine was well... I'll leave it at that.

[Fightguard]

Thanks for all the feedback...
I'm definitely looking into heavier weights immediately...after woking out this weekend, suddenly 25 reps/6 sets just isn't tiring me anymore. Definitely a psychological aspect comming into play here ;)

Ren, the decision simply came down to the fact that I need to live...
I have a ridiculously high blood pressure and diabeties is prevalent in my father's side of the family, with my father being the most severe case among them...simple decision that I finally realised that I need to take my health seriously.

[daimien]

you gotta eat 6 times a day bro. Make sure to train your metabolism to work faster. Don't use a scale. It will just mess with your head. If you have a tape measure then use it and make sure to measure each mucle or your belly.

I was size 36" a month ago and now i'm down to 33" waistline. The routine I did was the one BFL recommended but I switched to a different routine after 2 weeks (i think). If you want to lose fat then do cardio. Try to eat healthy and clean. How long are you planning to do a cutting cycle?

[Fightguard]

you gotta eat 6 times a day bro. Make sure to train your metabolism to work faster. Don't use a scale. It will just mess with your head. If you have a tape measure then use it and make sure to measure each mucle or your belly.

I was size 36" a month ago and now i'm down to 33" waistline. The routine I did was the one BFL recommended but I switched to a different routine after 2 weeks (i think). If you want to lose fat then do cardio. Try to eat healthy and clean. How long are you planning to do a cutting cycle?
I do eat 6 times a day...I made reference to this earlier, see my original post and a few posts above for an example of my diet.

Cardio? I do 30-40 minutes a day, 5 days a week...did you read my posts at all?? :razz: ;)

I'm not familiar with the term "cutting cycle"...can you explain please?
thanks.

BTW, just to update on my weight training situation...I bought a havier set of adjustable dumbells last week, so I'm now working with 20-25 lbs. in some exercises (eg. bicep curls) and 15 lbs. with others (eg. tricep kickbacks).

[daimien]

lol sorry bro, I'm too tired to go over all the posts but yes, now that you mentioned it. I seen your post :lol:

[stealth]

dont forget, a large part of what determines where your fat comes off of, and how much is......sadly, genetics.

[mainstream]

Wow, how do you guys find time to eat so many meals? I was (well still sort of am) one of those people who worked all day then came home and binged on whatever. I forced myself to start having breakfast (usually a meal replacement or protein drink) and a reasonably healthy lunch and supper. With that and gyming I've managed to drop 30 lbs though I still want to drop another 10-15. It's really slowed down though lately.. :\.

[Bing]

Congrats on your success. Looks like your are doing a lot of good things. I would suggest reducing the protien shakes and increase fruits, veggies, legumes and water intake. Just a few notes you should be aware of:

1) never use a weight scale or measuring tape as a measure of success unless it is used in conjunction with body composition (% body fat). When you don't notice changes on the scale or tape, your body will continue to change. Remember muscle weighs more than fat.

2) you want to train your body to utilize fat as a primary fuel source as long as possible before switching over to carohydrates. To do this, you must do cardo in 70-85% of your max heart rate (140-165 bps) for at least 20 mins, not including warm-up and cool-down. Slow and steady will not do the job. Cardo should be hard enough that you should just be barely able talk. Note- everyone target heart rate is slightly different and it will change, so try to keep track of it.

3) The most important part- the goal here is to get healthier and to live an active lifestyle. Losing the weight and inches are a biproduct of improved health. Remember, this is a lifestyle change. Make sure you are enjoying what you are doing. I would set more performance based goal, like reducing your 1 mile time, or train towards climbing the CN Tower etc. These goals are a lot more rewarding.

Again, congrats on you success and here's to a lifetime of good health :)

[bdckr]

2) you want to train your body to utilize fat as a primary fuel source as long as possible before switching over to carohydrates. To do this, you must do cardo in 70-85% of your max heart rate (140-165 bps) for at least 20 mins, not including warm-up and cool-down. Slow and steady will not do the job. Cardo should be hard enough that you should just be barely able talk. Note- everyone target heart rate is slightly different and it will change, so try to keep track of it.

That's actually not possible. Glucose, or some form of it, is your body's primary fuel source. When you're out of glucose/glycogen, your body converts protein or fat into glucose to use.

[Bing]

That's actually not possible. Glucose, or some form of it, is your body's primary fuel source. When you're out of glucose/glycogen, your body converts protein or fat into glucose to use.

You are correct in one aspect, I shoud of emphasized during aerobic exercise.

There are different energy systems that your body uses dependig on the demands you place on it. Each energy system requires a different energy source (i.e. creatine phosphate, stored glycogen or fat) and each has a different response time. In short bouts of exercise like lifting weights or running up the stairs yes you will use the quickest source of energy (CP and glycogen), but for aerobic exercise you want to train you body to utilize fat effiecently. You get 24X the amout of energy from 1 g or fat than 1g of glucose, but the key is to stay aerobic. The combustion of fats require more time, so as soon as you pass your anaerobic threshold (i.e. point where you can't talk), the demands on your body is so high you'll require a faster energy source, i.e. glycogen. The idea is to train that anaerobic threshhold as high as possible so you stay aerobic as long as possible before going anaerobic, therefore utilizing fat stores.

[bdckr]

You are correct in one aspect, I shoud of emphasized during aerobic exercise.

There are different energy systems that your body uses dependig on the demands you place on it. Each energy system requires a different energy source (i.e. creatine phosphate, stored glycogen or fat) and each has a different response time. In short bouts of exercise like lifting weights or running up the stairs yes you will use the quickest source of energy (CP and glycogen), but for aerobic exercise you want to train you body to utilize fat effiecently. You get 24X the amout of energy from 1 g or fat than 1g of glucose, but the key is to stay aerobic. The combustion of fats require more time, so as soon as you pass your anaerobic threshold (i.e. point where you can't talk), the demands on your body is so high you'll require a faster energy source, i.e. glycogen. The idea is to train that anaerobic threshhold as high as possible so you stay aerobic as long as possible before going anaerobic, therefore utilizing fat stores.

I'll address your other points later, but I'm sure I'm not the only here who would like to know how 9 kcal (or food cal) in 1 g of fat is 24X as much as 4 kcal in 1 g of glucose. Enquiring minds want to know.

[Bing]

On the molecular level, the measure of energy is ATP (Adenosine TriPhosphate). Every energy source (fats, carbs etc) is borken down into ATPs. Anaerobic metabolism (buring immediate CP then gylcogen) will produce as few as 2-30 ATPs, compared to aerobic metablism (burning of fats with the presences of oxygen) can produce as much as 100 ATPs.

A calerie is used to measure the amount of energy required to increase the temperature of 1 L of water 1 degrees celcius. It is a crude way to measure how your body metabolizes and utilizes fuel.

All this information is basic exercise physiology principle readily available in university text books and scientific journal, or google. Just be weary of getting info from fitness magazines, they are pretty good at filtering info so you hear what you want to hear. Remember their business is to make money.

[bdckr]

That's actually not possible. Glucose, or some form of it, is your body's primary fuel source. When you're out of glucose/glycogen, your body converts protein or fat into glucose to use.

My bad, I shouldn't have said that your body will convert "protein or fat into glucose." It should be only "protein."

...
2) you want to train your body to utilize fat as a primary fuel source as long as possible before switching over to carohydrates. To do this, you must do cardo in 70-85% of your max heart rate (140-165 bps) for at least 20 mins, not including warm-up and cool-down. Slow and steady will not do the job. Cardo should be hard enough that you should just be barely able talk. Note- everyone target heart rate is slightly different and it will change, so try to keep track of it....

The problem with this is that you can't "train your body to utilize fat as a primary fuel source...before switching over to carbohydrates."

Your body prefers carbohydrates. Your brain requires carbohydrates. Brain cells will die without a source of glucose.

Carbohydrates have an inhibitory effect on the use of triglycerides as fuel, so your body uses carbohydrates preferentially until carbohydrate stores are low.

That means when you have lots of carbohydrates, your body uses very little fat for energy. When your carbohydrates are low, your body uses fat.

There's no "training" your body to function differently. Use of triglycerides(TG)/fats will increase when carbohydrates are low. Period.

There are different energy systems that your body uses dependig on the demands you place on it. Each energy system requires a different energy source (i.e. creatine phosphate, stored glycogen or fat) and each has a different response time. In short bouts of exercise like lifting weights or running up the stairs yes you will use the quickest source of energy (CP and glycogen), but for aerobic exercise you want to train you body to utilize fat effiecently. You get 24X the amout of energy from 1 g or fat than 1g of glucose, but the key is to stay aerobic. The combustion of fats require more time, so as soon as you pass your anaerobic threshold (i.e. point where you can't talk), the demands on your body is so high you'll require a faster energy source, i.e. glycogen. The idea is to train that anaerobic threshhold as high as possible so you stay aerobic as long as possible before going anaerobic, therefore utilizing fat stores

Not exactly accurate.

The anaerobic pathways are the phosphagen energy system and the glycogen-lactic acid system. Agreed.

The “point where you can’t talk� is a rough guideline at best. The ability to talk is a sign that you have that much more lung capacity in addition to what you need to function aerobically

Of the three energy systems:
1) Phosphagen system lasts 8 to 10 seconds.
2) Glycogen-lactic acid system lasts 1.3 to 1.6 minutes
3) Aerobic system lasts as long as the nutrients last.

What are the nutrients for the aerobic system? Glucose, fatty acids (from TG) and amino acids (from protein). Not just fats, as you listed above.

So basically anything that you can do for more than 2 minutes continually is aerobic. Whether you can talk through it or not.

And to be perfectly clear, although amino acids can be used directly as a fuel source, glucose is still manufactured through gluconeogenesis (from protein) in order to supply what your brain requires.

On the molecular level, the measure of energy is ATP (Adenosine TriPhosphate). Every energy source (fats, carbs etc) is borken down into ATPs. Anaerobic metabolism (buring immediate CP then gylcogen) will produce as few as 2-30 ATPs, compared to aerobic metablism (burning of fats with the presences of oxygen) can produce as much as 100 ATPs.
ATP -- the most fundamental form of energy on a cellular level. Agreed.

Creatine phosphate (CP) and ATP are both part of the Phosphagen System for generating energy. Agreed.

Where your argument breaks down is here: your comparison of different processes

Of course anaerobic metabolism is less efficient. That has nothing to do with the fuel source. That has everything to do with the process.

Why compare aerobic (more efficient) metabolism of fat with anaerobic (less efficient) metabolism of carbohydrates? At best that's misleading. At worst that's intellectually dishonest.

That's like saying "If I sold my sports card at retail, I would get 24X as much as you selling your card at a garage sale. So my card is 24X more valuable than yours."

I agree that TG has more calories per gram than carbohydrates. 9 to 4. Not 24 to 1. Fat isn’t the only fuel for the aerobic system.

A calerie is used to measure the amount of energy required to increase the temperature of 1 L of water 1 degrees celcius. It is a crude way to measure how your body metabolizes and utilizes fuel.
But still a more accurate method (according to Guyton (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/072168677X/qid=1100615707/sr=2-1/ref=pd_ka_b_2_1/104-4114742-3688769)) than your misleading way of arriving at a 24 to 1 comparison. Compare aerobic metabolism of fat to aerobic metabolism of glucose and you get...drumroll please...ta da! 9 to 4.

“Each gram of fat contains 2.25 times as many calories of energy as each gram of glycogen.�


All this information is basic exercise physiology principle readily available in university text books and scientific journal, or google. Just be weary of getting info from fitness magazines, they are pretty good at filtering info so you hear what you want to hear. Remember their business is to make money.
Well thank you for pointing that out to me. I never would have thought of looking for accurate information. I took a look at Guyton’s Medical Physiology but I couldn’t find the chapter on intellectual dishonesty. It wasn't in the index either.

I think you should be wary of assuming that clarity and simplicity are the domains of fitness magazines. Or even assuming that they’re signs of ignorance. Accuracy doesn’t need to be complicated.

[ptxpress]

Hey,
Firstly, good for you on getting on track...What I'm about to describe is what I did to lose a significant amount of weight...I'm not saying it was right, but it worked for me, and the reason I am posting this is because my starting specs were about the same as yours. I am 5'8, weighed about 230 before, now I am at 180. My routine was simple. Cardio, cardio, and more cardio.

I worked out 5-6 days a week, consisting of 1 hour/day. 30 mins of that was the rowing machine (at full resistance) and 30 minutes on the eliptical. In terms of diet, I'm really not sure if eating 6 small meals a day is ideal for you at this point. 4 may be a lot more manageable. In either case, the key for me was, get dinner in by 6pm, and eat NOTHING after that hour. It's tough at first, but you get used to it. It took about 6 months to drop the weight, and since then I've been working with a fine balance of cardio/weights (It's been about 3 years, and still not gained it back).

The other thing you didn't mention in your post (at least I don't think you did, but I didn't read it that carefully) was what you are drinking other then water (if anything)...this is important b/c you can cut a lot of sugars out by getting off of pop, juice, and even in coffee.

Also, are you taking a multi-vitamin? This may be useful. I personally use the "MegaMen" from GNC and find it to be a pretty good product.

Hope that helps a bit.

[Fightguard]

bdckr and Bing...you guys lost me...but feel free to continue on ;)

ptxpress, thanks...I'm pretty much drinking water exclusively, but I will mix skim milk with my whey powder occasionally. Also, I'm not taking a multi-vitamin, thanks for the suggestion :)

[JoKeRr]

dude, i have like no fat. I'm 6-2'' and i weigh like 142 Ibs, even though i eat like a horse (can u say 5 drumsticks + 1 pound of rice for dinner), but I don't gain anything no matter what.. i started working out somewhat, and the most i've got to was like 145 (which is prob. all the water and stuff in my body at the time). guess I'm just one of those lucky skinny fellows, lol

[Bing]

I didn't think my reply would become a heated phyiological debate. I appologise to Fightguard for what has happened to his good news thread.

Yes, I do now realize my 24x note was missleading, but I was going off the top of my head when I replied initially. Now, I never said that the aerobic system solely uses fat stores as fuel source, of couse glucose, fatty acids and amino acids are also consumed.

Yes you can train your anaerobic threashold. Endurence athletes do it all the time. You can accurately determine yours with a VO2max test and use those results to establish your training program.

The “point where you can’t talk� is a rough guideline at best comment, was ment as a rough guideline. The ideas was not to coast through your cardio workout, but continually try to improve.

Thanks for the sarcasm, but I find fitness magazines misleading and oversimplified, but that's my opinion.

Again, congrats to you Fightguard on your success.

[bdckr]

I didn't think my reply would become a heated phyiological debate. You should never be surprised when people want to correct misinformation.
I appologise to Fightguard for what has happened to his good news thread.
Agreed. Abject apologies to Fightguard and props for the good work you’ve done so far.
Yes, I do now realize my 24x note was missleading, but I was going off the top of my head when I replied initially. Now, I never said that the aerobic system solely uses fat stores as fuel source, of couse glucose, fatty acids and amino acids are also consumed.
Each energy system requires a different energy source (i.e. creatine phosphate, stored glycogen or fat)...
Language lesson: i.e. (http://www.physics.uiuc.edu/Education/398IPR/Lectures/LatinTerms/tsld002.htm) = id est = “that is� or “in other words�

If you don't understand the abbreviations you're using, you probably shouldn't use them.

Yes you can train your anaerobic threashold. Endurence athletes do it all the time. You can accurately determine yours with a VO2max test and use those results to establish your training program. 2)you want to train your body to utilize fat as a primary fuel source as long as possible before switching over to carohydrates. Anaerobic threshold has to do with removing lactic acid. You can train this threshold. Agreed.

Nothing to do with “...train[ing] you body to utilize fat as a primary fuel source as long as possible before switching over to carbohydrates.� No matter how many unrelated (correct or incorrect) points you bring up (e.g. fats supply 24x more energy than glucose, anaerobic threshold is trainable, etc.), you’re forgetting that the original response was to this particular comment.

The “point where you can’t talk� is a rough guideline at best comment, was ment as a rough guideline. The ideas was not to coast through your cardio workout, but continually try to improve.

Thanks for the sarcasm, but I find fitness magazines misleading and oversimplified, but that's my opinion. All this information is basic exercise physiology principle readily available in university text books and scientific journal, or google. Just be weary of getting info from fitness magazines, they are pretty good at filtering info so you hear what you want to hear. Remember their business is to make money. You’re welcome.

I wasn’t sure what gift to get you after you had accused me of getting my information from fitness magazines, but I’m glad you liked it.

Now, I hope I’m not being overly sensitive – maybe you were directing that comment at someone else? If so, I still have the receipt, and I can return it if you don't want it.

Again, congrats to you Fightguard on your success.
Again, apologies, Fightguard. And again, props. Sorry for hijacking your thread.

Daimien’s and BrandonHum’s are closer to the typical replies and support that you’ll get at finertia (http://www.finertial.com). You might want to check it out.

[Bing]

I never thought it would get heated or at least thats how I interpreted you tone.


Language lesson: i.e. (http://www.physics.uiuc.edu/Education/398IPR/Lectures/LatinTerms/tsld002.htm) = id est = “that is� or “in other words�

If you don't understand the abbreviations you're using, you probably shouldn't use them.
thanks for correting my grammer


Anaerobic threshold has to do with removing lactic acid. You can train this threshold. Agreed.

Ss what is a good indicator of the AT?


I wasn’t sure what gift to get you after you had accused me of getting my information from fitness magazines, but I’m glad you liked it.

Now, I hope I’m not being overly sensitive – maybe you were directing that comment at someone else? If so, I still have the receipt, and I can return it if you don't want it.

It wasn't directed towards you, just a general comment. There is info in those magazines but you have to sift through the 15 min ab workout routines and protein shake ads and even then you still have to question it.

[bdckr]

Out of respect for Fightguard's thread, Bing, here's (http://www.finertia.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=737) a reply.

[Fightguard]

update time...
don't mind me...maintaining this thread in a public forum is actually helping me to keeping motivated :D

finally hit the 200lbs mark! been about 10 years since I've been under 200. dug out that old suit that I wore to my HS prom and it fits again :cheesygri

made some pretty good muscle gains too...starting to see definition in my arms - been killing my triceps weekly for the past month...
it's about time my waistline started trimming down too...tightened up a couple of notches in the belt.

Also, I let myself pig-out this weekend on sweets (desserts and chocolate) and I don't feel bad about it at all!!

[Joseph]

Congratulations on your progress, Fightguard! Keep on the good work!

[Forsaken_Angel]

ive lost 25lbs since september from eating one small meal a day :S, atleast your way is healthy for you. good work i know what its like to be a fatguy.

[bdckr]

update time...
don't mind me...maintaining this thread in a public forum is actually helping me to keeping motivated :D

finally hit the 200lbs mark! been about 10 years since I've been under 200. dug out that old suit that I wore to my HS prom and it fits again :cheesygri

made some pretty good muscle gains too...starting to see definition in my arms - been killing my triceps weekly for the past month...
it's about time my waistline started trimming down too...tightened up a couple of notches in the belt.

Also, I let myself pig-out this weekend on sweets (desserts and chocolate) and I don't feel bad about it at all!!Congratulations. Another 12 pounds in about 6 weeks. Nice job.

[smokeylovelove]

I think there are a couple problems I see here with your regimen. Number one: I Dont think you are eating the right Carbs....now dont get me wrong carbs are not the enemy so dont buy into that Atkins diet B.S. Some good sources of carbe which are fairly lower in the glycemic index are Oatmeal(Which i noticed you were eating) Yams or sweet potatoes, Dark Brown Rice and couscous. Now you can still eat the other carbs but I want you to understand that bread has a lot of unneccessary fillers in it; as for the apple, yes fruits are good for you but perhaps you should choose a fruit such as cherries, grapefruits, or melons, because apples are too high in sugar. Dont forget to eat lots of veggies(preferrably the dark green leafy kind, as carrots and corn are too high in sugar. Losing weight is dedication and its not going to happen overnight. You must stay consistent with cardiovascular exercise in order to reap its benefits and you MUST increase your weights. When you go to the gym to workout you should not be in there for longer than 1 hour as you will OVERTRAIN yourself and cause your body to fight against you. You must choose a couple body parts and do 3 max different exercises for each and work your muscles to FAILURE. Stay away from those machines, as much as they can help you tone a bit, you want to do COMPOUND exercises to tear your muscles and create bigger growth(Compound exercises force all your small muscles to work as well as the larger ones and everything benefits). When I say compound I mean Benchpress, Squats, Deadlifts, Straight Dumbell Curls, Incline Benchpress etc. Just remember, the more muscle you have on your body the more calories your boday needs to maintain that muscle meaning you will burn more. Please lose the ten pound weights and you will see dramatic changes. Also change up your exercises as this will shock your muscles...every week you can perhaps use the same exercises but maybe change the order up or the time of rest in between your sets; I dont want to see you hitting a plateau(Although sometimes it is inevitable). Try doing your cardio on an empty stomach in the morning, but AFTER your weight workout as you will burn all of your glycogen stores while lifting and leave your body with straight fat to burn. Remember to stay hydrated and drink lots of water(At least a gallon a day when you are active) And on a further note. Try using a meal replacement shake a couple times a day(just not before you go to bed) I use Labrada low carb shakes and they are great....with miniscule sugar and all the basic nutrients you need. These shakes are intented to replace only a couple meals to ensure you are eating at least 6 times a day; DO NOT SKIP A MEAL as your metabolism will work extra hard to burn all meals digested and eventually become a fuel burning machine!!!! I carry a cooler with me if necessary. Finally DONT FORGET TO TAKE YOUR VITAMINS. Regardless of whether you are a jacked up bodybuilder or an average Joe, your muscles will not grow if they are not getting all the nutrients pumped into them(believe me vegetables can lack vital nutrients due to overfarming and poor soil quality)
I hope this helps you and everyone else who reads this as I went from a 38' Waist, 35% bodyfat and 235 pounds, to a 30" Waist 8% bodyfat and 215 pounds in a couple years time.

YOU ARE DOING A FANTASTIC JOB KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK. STAY DEDICATED BROTHER, TRAIN HARD AND GOD BLESS!

P.S - Dont forget to have that cheat day once a week, but don't overdo it!!

[Fightguard]

I really appreciate the reply smokey...
few things...the foods I listed earlier were just one example so while it may not theideal daily intake, I'll will tell you that I am indeed taking in the right carbs as well :)
fruits...I eat alot of grapefruit...i love grapefruit!
veggies...eat the leafy greens daily too.
yep, I'm maintaining a regular eating schedule of 6 meals a day.

I should say though, I eat bananas regularly even though they are not on the ideal fruit list. I have to...as I also mentioned, my blood pressrue is through the roof (bad genes, predominant in family history - you can say I was born into having high BP) and I'm on medication for that. an effect of my medication is that it causes a potassium deficiency in my system...hence the bananas. yes, I could take a potassium capsule...however, I'm at very high risk for diabetes as well (again, strong family history of) and another capsule just adds extra work for my kidneys. that's also the reason why I'm reluctant to take Vitamins/meal replacements as well...God forbid should I ever become a diabetic, I need to preserve my kidneys (my dad is a severe diabetic with kidney disease).

My workout routine...I'n the past month or so, I've only gone over 1 hour maybe twice...I'm usually in 50 -60 minutes now, always in the morning on an empty stomach. I don't go to the gym, I workout at home with a bench and dumbells. For cardio, I run up/down my own stairs in the house, I run around the open space in my basement, and I dance to house music :cheesygri
Finally, I got new plates for my dumbells so i have up'd the iron and working to failure..eg. 20-25lbs each side for flys, curls...and even more weight for presses and rows. I stopped with the 10 lbs exclusively almost 2 months ago (see one of my ealier posts) :)

So...I covered some of the bases you've pointed out here but Cardio AFTER my weight routine?? First time I've heard of that...I'll admit I'm pretty clueless about alot of the biomechanics (is that the right term to use?) that come into play here...I'm not doubting you but I'd like to read up on that some more...have a link??

Again, I appreciate that you took the time to read my posts here and offer your feedback and motivation :D

PS. are you kidding me?!!? how can I forget the cheat day?!?! :razz: :cheesygri

[smokeylovelove]

Well I definitely don't think you should give up the bananas if you need them. Just make sure you are eating a protein with them just to keep your insulin levels stabilized!! As for the Cardio after working out...that is how I do it, and most SHOULD do it of they only have time to go the gym once. In your case, since you are working out at home....try this: how about you do your cardio in the morning on an empty stomach(but make sure if youre doing home aerobics that your heart rate stays at a fat burning level. Then wait 1 hour before you eat anything because once you are done your cardio, your body is still burning fat!! Have a few meals, then in the evening, I`d say around 4-6pm do your weight training...thus giving your body fuel will enhance your pump and cause greater gains(from a better workout). This method is used by many people who have time on their hands because I believe it creates the best results. Make sure you are waking up early so you can fit in all the meals though....set a wake up time every morning and do this at that time. Heck I used to wake up every morning at 4am and run in the blistering cold if I had to work at 6.....this made sure I had my cardio out of the way; gave a kickstart to my metabolism; and made sure I didnt cheat!! Now I do it the old gym way. Anyhow, I don`t want to regulate your diet or workout strategies for you because I am unaware of your health and the conditions you endure, so I believe if you want to get into this much further you should consult your physician, and get your Blood Pressure checked on a regular basis.

Checkout www.bodybuilding.com It is a fantastic website and will answer all of your questions!!

God Bless.

[Joseph]

Try doing your cardio on an empty stomach in the morning, but AFTER your weight workout as you will burn all of your glycogen stores while lifting and leave your body with straight fat to burn.

Are you suggesting him to FIRST weight train on empty stomach and then cardio? Sounded to me that's what you're suggesting. Additional exercising after an initial weight training session with low glycogen store in the body in the morning, is surly a quick way to speed up fat utilization, catabolism, and a possibility of hypoglycemia.

[smokeylovelove]

When I recommended doing his workout on an empty stomach, I didnt mean right up and right to the gym, I meant a couple hours after eating his first or second meal(depending on when he decided to wake up). I am well aware that doing a vigorous activity after your weight workout can lead to abnormal decrease of sugar in the blood (Hypoglycemia). I do not recommend doing a heavy cardio workout either; what I would suggest is he ingest a meal or two, wait 2 hours, go to the gym do his weight workout and then hit the cardio for 15-20 mins thus switching from anerobic to aerobic exercise. This is what I do....I do not necessarily think it is the best method, but for most people who dont have time and want to "Burn Fat" It is a proven method....studies show that you can burn up to 300% more fat doing cardio on an empty stomach. On final note, catabolism can be prevented by ingesting ample amounts of protein(1.1 grams per pound of body weight)

God Bless.

[Fightguard]

I workout first thing in the morning BEFORE my FIRST meal
25 mins cardio
25-35 mins weights

I'll have a glass of water with my meds right when i wake up.
I usually don't feel hungry right after i wake-up or during my workout...
if i do wake up feeling hungry, I'll have a cup of milk before my workout.

just for the record, my family members are hyperglycemic diabetics. My blood suger levels are normal but on the upper tier.

[smokeylovelove]

FightGuard, If you have the time...do your cardio right when you wake up before any meals, try doing something called High Intensity Interval Training(what I mean by this is say your jogging; go at a slow pace for a minute, fast pace for a minute, slow pace, and so on. This type of exercise shocks your body and always has it thinking what to do next.....then wait 1 hour before you eat anything thus allowing your body to BURN. Then eat a wholesome meal.....make sure this is a good meal full of Protein, carbs, Good fats. Eat all day then do your weights in the evening. This will definitely provide the best results in my opinion.

If you cannot because you have time constraints. Joseph is right, do not do both cardio and weights right smack in the morning without eating earlier....you will lose weight but it will be muscle catabolized weight.

[Fightguard]

Thanks Joseph and smokey...I'm definitely taking these suggestions to heart.
I'll keep my cardio routine in the morning after waking up...
if I move my weight routine to the evening, I can fit it in before or after my last meal...does it really matter??
so it's either

1) weights, protien shake, last meal

2) last meal, weights, protien shake

OR

same options as above but keep my protien shake in the morning after cardio

what do you suggest?

[Spampy]

Smokey is my personal trainer and he's amazing. Trainer with heart!!!!!