VW Passat vs. Mazda 6 vs. Honda Accord coupe vs. Nissan Altima

[cummer]

i've narrowed the list of cars down to

VW Passat (1.8 turbo) vs. Mazda 6, Honda Accord Coupe and Nissan Altima.

Which would you choose and why?

Keep in mind I am comparing the VW Passat 1.8 Turbo with the 6 cylinder from the japs.

Which one offers best value and why?

[Jovi]

i've narrowed the list of cars down to

VW Passat (1.8 turbo) vs. Mazda 6, Honda Accord Coupe and Nissan Altima.

Which would you choose and why?

Keep in mind I am comparing the VW Passat 1.8 Turbo with the 6 cylinder from the japs.

Which one offers best value and why?

Stay far away from any VW product.
They are at the bottom of the ratings by JD Power and Consumer Reports.

They have numerous problems and are not recommended by CR.

[yatko]

Passat, Mazda 6 -> You will have nothing but troubles in the long run
Altima-> Currently good value for your money and seems to be solid built but most likely less resale value than accord coupe
Accord-> Hands down proven, most reliable, best re-sale value and trendy vehicle(insurance rate might be high though)

Drive all four, make sure of the dealer warranty coverage, follow the forums for these models and most importantly, buy the car you like! Contact http://www.apa.ca for the best MSRP.

Good luck.

[gilboman]

Passat, Mazda 6 -> You will have nothing but troubles in the long run
Altima-> Currently good value for your money and seems to be solid built but most likely less resale value than accord coupe
Accord-> Hands down proven, most reliable, best re-sale value and trendy vehicle(insurance rate might be high though)

Drive all four, make sure of the dealer warranty coverage, follow the forums for these models and most importantly, buy the car you like! Contact http://www.apa.ca for the best MSRP.

Good luck.

i dont see where you are getting mazda in same group as the VW for reliability from??? there havent been any issues with the car..and the accord is not trendy for god sakes..its one of the ugliest cars on the road, the front is repulsive..the coupes rear is not as bad as the sedan, but overall still a very bloated droopy looking yacht styled car... as for resale..accord will have the higher resale..but u pay more upfront and get much less than the altima/mazda 6 for the same price.

[TenzoR]

Acura CL? hehe

[Venusia]

Stay far away from any VW product.
They are at the bottom of the ratings by JD Power and Consumer Reports.

They have numerous problems and are not recommended by CR.

I concur. My dad is very disappointed with his 1999 Passat. He's spent 5k in maintenance and repairs so far, and wishes he had leased it instead so he would have been rid of it by now. It's only worth about 13 500 now, so not worth it to sell at this point. He spent less money in 10 years on his 1989 Accord.

[danfromwaterloo]

Mazda makes a good quality product. I've had my Protege5 for almost 4 years now, and not a single major problem (brake pads, oil, and a new set of tires ONLY)

[warpdrive]

I'd buy a Mazda 6 Sport

- it's a hatchback that looks like a sedan. A hatchback will carry large sized loads (can easily put a bike in the back with ease) once you fold the seats down.
- Mazda 6 looks the best to me.
- nice discounts on them. If you shop around, you can get one for $500 over invoice.
- lower financing
- fun to drive
- for the most part, they are reliable cars (on Consumer Report's Recommended List)

Accord will be the most reliable, resale etc, but I dunno, every time I see one, it's being driven by some grey haired guy, it just seems to be bought by the older crowd.

Get the Mazda 6 in that electric blue colour and it's really really sharp.

I wouldn't get a Passat, more expensive parts, service don't combine well with poor reliability.

The Altima is a family car, it's big, feels heavy, and no as much fun to drive as the Mazda or Honda.

[Talamasca]

Personally, I think the Mazda 6 Sport is the nicest looking of the bunch. The Accord (along with the Camry) are the class leaders but they have a middle-aged dad styling to them.

[yatko]

Mazda makes a good quality product. I've had my Protege5 for almost 4 years now, and not a single major problem (brake pads, oil, and a new set of tires ONLY)


Protege is proven concept since it is on the market forever 3 platform, but old mazda 6's were very bad and I heard new ones are not as reliable as competition either.

[actng]

German engineering will smoke any japanese import of the same hp any day. Reliability reports are generalizations that may not hold true for you. All cars in the long run will have to be maintained and repaired. The difference is whether the maintenance is done at the right intervals. Since German engineering is more superior, they tend to push the car a little harder, which means the maintenance must be done at the time specified and would be less forgiving if you are late.

I'd pick a german car over any japanese import any day. VW is as good a place to start as any german manufacturer.

You should also be able to get a good deal from VW on the Passat. The current generation of VW is being discontinued (new model look coming out soon) so lots of dealers are starting to clear out their inventory to prepare for MK V.

[ccdude]

i've narrowed the list of cars down to

VW Passat (1.8 turbo) vs. Mazda 6, Honda Accord Coupe and Nissan Altima.

Which would you choose and why?

Keep in mind I am comparing the VW Passat 1.8 Turbo with the 6 cylinder from the japs.

Which one offers best value and why?
My Rating in this Order

Accord - hands down most reliable great resale I have a 200 w/135K Not a single problem so far

Nissan Altima - This is a good car that looks great. I used to own nissans and I never had a problem

Mazda 6 - It may be a Taurus in disguise But my 99 Mazda Protege is still serving me well and I assume the 6 is exponentially better. I had the chance to use one for the day when I took my protege in for a timing belt and it was allot of fun

VW Passat - VW is highly over rated and over priced. lots of problems over time and fairly expensive repairs.

[Cisco KId]

I would pick the Nissan first
The Accord second
Mazada then the VW

I say the NIssan cause less cost to service than Honda and it is a bigger car. If you are considering the V6 then hands down the Nissan. I have a Spec V Sentra (6 spd sport suspension 17" wheels and 175 hp) I love the car it plain out hauls and handles very well, reliability has been stellar and I am at 65K on a 2002 model.

Nissan will always give you the most power for the buck. Resale may not be as high as a Honda but it is improving and the Altima is a very solid car. Drives well and looks alot better. The VW is nice you can telll it is a German car but as others have said it has issues, many more than the others

Last the Nissan will come in the cheapest I bet. In this range thats why I would choose it

CK

[McLaren]

I have a '99 passat 1.8T, and have not had any major problems so far. Just regular oil changes and replaced the battery last year, although i do only have about 37k on the odometer. I've even added a computer chip to it to boost the turbo, so from 150hp -> 190-200hp now, just with a single chip!

So yes german cars are more expensive to maintain, but i think its worth it over those other bland vanilla japanese cars that everyone else has. If you're just looking for a car to go from A to B then get something else, if you want something enjoyable to drive, get something german.

[gman]

I have my unconventional view of all these cars. Since it is unconventional, you can ignore it. :cheesygri

I start with what I won't pick first and reason.

1. Accord. Too many Accord on the road. I don't like to buy a car that everybody has. If I have to, I will choose a color that is not common. Honda dealers, salemen and garage are jerks. Until their service get better, I don't even think about them.

2. VW. I hate VW in a passion. I just don't feel right sitting in one.

3. Mazda. I would have picked this if their dealer and salemen are not jerks.

4. Nissan. Altima sounds okay but I prefer a Maxima.

The Sentra I test drive years ago was a POS. It almost got me into an accident out of the dealership driveway because of its unexpected low (or no) power. The car did not move with 5 adults on it. Even a Neon was better than that, much better than that.

[temporalillusion]

I have a 2000 Passat and have been in or driven the other cars except the Mazda 6.

VW is down the list on JD Power initial build quality and dealer satisfaction ratings, so that's something to be aware of. That includes all models though and the Passat is built in Germany while the Beetle and Jetta are built in Mexico.

Consumer Reports did choose the Passat to be their recommended buy for a family sedan the second year in a row (tied with the Accord), so the comment about it being not recommended by CR is blatently wrong.

http://money.cnn.com/2004/03/08/pf/autos/CR_best_cars/

JD Power ratings for the Passat vary from year to year:

http://www.edmunds.com/used/2003/volkswagen/passat/100161570/ratings_jdpower.html?tid=edmunds.u.prices.vdpheade rratingslinks..0.Volkswagen*

All that said, drive all the cars and see which feels the best to you. I haven't been in a Mazda 6 (I like them though, would like to try one), but I've been in the rest and my Passat feels like a way better car, it's not even close.

Do your own research, drive them, look at your requirements and what the cars offer, look at REAL sources of information, not anecdotal evidence or opinions based on hearsay.

http://www.jdpower.com/cc/auto/auto.jsp

[warpdrive]

German engineering will smoke any japanese import of the same hp any day. Reliability reports are generalizations that may not hold true for you. All cars in the long run will have to be maintained and repaired. The difference is whether the maintenance is done at the right intervals. Since German engineering is more superior, they tend to push the car a little harder, which means the maintenance must be done at the time specified and would be less forgiving if you are late.


I have to take issue about your claim that German engineering is superior. Superior in what way?

I say this because I own an Audi A4 1.8T. And there are definitely aspects to it that could have been done better. The front suspension has a multi-link control arm arrangement that has bushings that tend to wear out fast and are not serviceable, and the control arms need to be replaced (alarmingly) regularly at a very high cost. This is superior engineering? What about the coil pack problem that plagued VW/Audi 1.8T engines, obvious a bad piece of engineering.

My heated mirrors continue to burn themselves out every two years, and my engine burns 1L of oil every 5000km (regular oil changes with synthetic oil done since day 1). So if this is superior engineering, give me the simpler engineering that doesn't do that.

My view on German cars: yes there is some good technology in there, but the cars are sometimes over-designed and overly complicated. Good engineering requires that the design be simple and elegant whereever possible, and overbuilt in other aspects where necessary. I feel the Japanese are better at playing this game, they have exceptional technology in their cars too, but they are better at applying the technology and design so that the stuff just doesn't break down as often. Good engineering means making a product with good specs AND is reliable.

A lot of people harp on the fact that the Mazda 6 has a Ford designed engine. Maybe it doesn't have 100HP/L, but it's a engine that has proven itself, basically it just works. It's not the best engine, but *nowadays* I'd rather take that engine over the rougher sounding, less powerful 1.8T engine in the same price range.

[Evil Techie]

i love the looks of nissan altima

more than accord, too many asians drive accord anyways
it gets a bit typical

[gilboman]

German engineering will smoke any japanese import of the same hp any day. Reliability reports are generalizations that may not hold true for you. All cars in the long run will have to be maintained and repaired. The difference is whether the maintenance is done at the right intervals. Since German engineering is more superior, they tend to push the car a little harder, which means the maintenance must be done at the time specified and would be less forgiving if you are late.

I'd pick a german car over any japanese import any day. VW is as good a place to start as any german manufacturer.

You should also be able to get a good deal from VW on the Passat. The current generation of VW is being discontinued (new model look coming out soon) so lots of dealers are starting to clear out their inventory to prepare for MK V.

i dont see where you get german engineering is superior from. Reliability reports dont lie in that japanese cars are consistantly way ahead of germans in terms of reliability. a Lexus for example is refined, have build quality the germans can only dream of, much higher quality materials, a lower price than the germans, and a superb engine with 6pd auto tranny as well. and get this, the electronics and rest of the car won't break down as frequently as germans. frankly, i dont see how one can say german engineering is better when they break down all the time. if this is the case... a daewoo,suzuki would have the best, since they breakdown even more often than the germans. most german automakers make good cars and i drive one...but i know that the japanese do a better job with quality and implementation of technology. heck just compare a NAVI on a german compared to a Lexus/Acura...difference is night and day.

[actng]

warpdrive & gilboman:

based on your posts, I can infer the criteria in which you evaluate cars. apparently, you were not able to infer the critiera in which I evaluate these cars.

for the two of you, and everyone else that agrees with you, I ***URGE*** you to go buy a Japanese Import. Preferably a Toyota Corolla for its reliability.

for the others who enjoy driving, hugging the curves and going a little faster than you should... and want to learn or know a bit about mechanics and want to work on their own cars or at least be actively involved in the maintenance program (and not just dump it off at the dealership), then a VW may be right down your alley as a starting point.


the superior german engineering comes in the engine. You pick your A4 1.8T and find an equivalent Japanese engine with 180hp and you'll quickly see where the german engineering outperforms the japanese. even my stock 115hp GOLF can outrun a 132hp CIVIC off the red lights on Steeles.

but like i said, if you want a car that you just drive from A to B... go pickup a jap import. you're right in their target market!

[gilboman]

warpdrive & gilboman:

based on your posts, I can infer the criteria in which you evaluate cars. apparently, you were not able to infer the critiera in which I evaluate these cars.

for the two of you, and everyone else that agrees with you, I ***URGE*** you to go buy a Japanese Import. Preferably a Toyota Corolla for its reliability.

for the others who enjoy driving, hugging the curves and going a little faster than you should... and want to learn or know a bit about mechanics and want to work on their own cars or at least be actively involved in the maintenance program (and not just dump it off at the dealership), then a VW may be right down your alley as a starting point.


the superior german engineering comes in the engine. You pick your A4 1.8T and find an equivalent Japanese engine with 180hp and you'll quickly see where the german engineering outperforms the japanese. even my stock 115hp GOLF can outrun a 132hp CIVIC off the red lights on Steeles.

but like i said, if you want a car that you just drive from A to B... go pickup a jap import. you're right in their target market!

this is so easy...

a Celica GTS with 180hp will totally rape a 1.8T (0-60 in low 6's and quarter mile in high 14's..those are more R32 territory numbers).. i'm so sorry that is just so easy..or how bout K20 from a RSX-S?

so a 180hp Japanese sport coupe will outhandle, outbrake and outhandle 240hp, 236lb/ft torque VW hatchback?


the VW golf can't handle at all... it doesnt even have 4 wheel independent suspension bwhaha..the rear is a torsion beam setup(except the R32 which finally has independent suspension).. besides..a golf is mexican..not german.

vw have NEVER had decent handling... you cant lump a VW POS and say it is similar to a BMW... even MB with RWD cant touch a FWD Acura (C320 compared to a TL or TSX)in terms of handling or speedwise

a BMW can handle wonderfully...a VW cant. its like the german version of the ford mustang... the golf/jetta platform is junk
a Celica GTS with 180hp totally rape a 1.8T (0-60 in low 6's and quarter mile in high 14's..those are more R32 numbers)..
i'm so sorry that is just so easy..or how bout K20 from a RSX-S?

my friend has a chipped VR6 golf with I/E/H and he can barely keep up with a STOCK 200hp RSX-S or 180hp GT-S

luckily he traded his POS in for a RSX-S since it the golf was consuming oil at an alarming rate, he uses synthetic oil only and each month he was pouring nearly $100 in synthetic oil to the damn thing, and not to mention the non function window motors and other electrical problems. This was a German Made golf too...i cant even imagine what the Mexican ones are like

BMW is the only german automaker to have good handling and great motors.

VW is junk. MB in terms of handling is second fiddle to BMW by a long shot and its engines are nowhere near Lexus/ACura/Infiniti levels in terms of hp/liter and refinement

[Tsukagi]

Mazda 6 SPORT!!
Why??? Beacuse it's A LOT of fun to drive. :cool:

[frankies]

to me a German car is a overrated product....i'd pick japanese cars anydays over german cars

[grant]

I can't believe people still buy VWs... it's like getting the (un)reliability of a domestic for the price of an import.

[gilboman]

I can't believe people still buy VWs... it's like getting the (un)reliability of a domestic for the price of an import.

VW only wishes it has the reliability of domestics..the domestics and koreans have made great strides in improving reliability which is evident in the past few year's dependability reports and initial quality as well. VW is always at the bottom of the pack.

VW has unreliability of a VW, price of an expensive import, but quality/performance a few notches below the cheapest japanese automakers cars.

[actng]

I'm sorry, I should've mentioned price as well as engine size when you do the comparison. Both the celica and rsx costs more than the GTI, not to mention insurance costs as well. You're also comparing non practical sports car like the RSX and celica to the Golf platform that has enough trunk space to move an entire dorm residence in one load.

But let me say again, if I were you, I would pick a jap import also. Your critiera fits you perfectly in that market. Just be aware that there are a ton of people that fit the german market but can't afford a beamer and a VW is prolly the cheapest place to start in Canada for entering the German market.

If we had more decent euro cars here, then you would see the appeal and fun in them. i.e. Peugeot 206...

Anyway, in a few years time, this conversation will be closer to being pointless as we see more convergence and partnerships between the US, Japanese and Euro manufacturers. The new Lotus Elise uses the Celica engine already and SAAB is made by GM... The recently new Volvo S40 is a mitsubishi under the covers...

this is so easy...

a Celica GTS with 180hp will totally rape a 1.8T (0-60 in low 6's and quarter mile in high 14's..those are more R32 territory numbers).. i'm so sorry that is just so easy..or how bout K20 from a RSX-S?

so a 180hp Japanese sport coupe will outhandle, outbrake and outhandle 240hp, 236lb/ft torque VW hatchback?


the VW golf can't handle at all... it doesnt even have 4 wheel independent suspension bwhaha..the rear is a torsion beam setup(except the R32 which finally has independent suspension).. besides..a golf is mexican..not german.

vw have NEVER had decent handling... you cant lump a VW POS and say it is similar to a BMW... even MB with RWD cant touch a FWD Acura (C320 compared to a TL or TSX)in terms of handling or speedwise

a BMW can handle wonderfully...a VW cant. its like the german version of the ford mustang... the golf/jetta platform is junk
a Celica GTS with 180hp totally rape a 1.8T (0-60 in low 6's and quarter mile in high 14's..those are more R32 numbers)..
i'm so sorry that is just so easy..or how bout K20 from a RSX-S?

my friend has a chipped VR6 golf with I/E/H and he can barely keep up with a STOCK 200hp RSX-S or 180hp GT-S

luckily he traded his POS in for a RSX-S since it the golf was consuming oil at an alarming rate, he uses synthetic oil only and each month he was pouring nearly $100 in synthetic oil to the damn thing, and not to mention the non function window motors and other electrical problems. This was a German Made golf too...i cant even imagine what the Mexican ones are like

BMW is the only german automaker to have good handling and great motors.

VW is junk. MB in terms of handling is second fiddle to BMW by a long shot and its engines are nowhere near Lexus/ACura/Infiniti levels in terms of hp/liter and refinement

[frogger]

The recently new Volvo S40 is a mitsubishi under the covers...
The old one was based on a modified Mitsubishi platform, the new one is based on the ford focus platform (as is the Mazda 3).

VW raised the bar on fit & finish in moderate priced cars with their Golf/Jetta/Passat about 6 years ago but that was about it. I remember reading posts about VW supplying thick tape for people to put on their door frames so their doors don't rattle on new Jettas, pretty funny. Their cars not built in Mexico are probably more reliable but if you are looking for performance and handling, there is far more bang for the buck elsewhere. The TL and especially the Legacy GT come to mind in the heart of the Passat price range for family sedans.

Of the cars listed in the original post, I would probably pick the Mazda and make sure I don't get the tacky spoiler and hope the metal look plastic trim on the center console doesn't scratch easy. I like the others too somewhat but the Altima seats I've tried were very uncomfortable and the Accord has very odd styling proportions and looks like a door ding magnet.

[warpdrive]

warpdrive & gilboman:

for the two of you, and everyone else that agrees with you, I ***URGE*** you to go buy a Japanese Import. Preferably a Toyota Corolla for its reliability.

for the others who enjoy driving, hugging the curves and going a little faster than you should... and want to learn or know a bit about mechanics and want to work on their own cars or at least be actively involved in the maintenance program (and not just dump it off at the dealership), then a VW may be right down your alley as a starting point.

........
but like i said, if you want a car that you just drive from A to B... go pickup a jap import. you're right in their target market!

That is kind of funny because I've owned VW and Audi (still own a Audi A4 1.8T, and owned a 1994 Corrado VR6), and I now own a Miata, and Subaru WRX which I've both used in Solo II events. I've topped out my Corrado at 235 km/h, and my Miata's Z rated tires are down to their wear bars after 20000 km of sprited driving. It's just funny that you assume I don't like driving. In terms of driving satisfaction (ignoring vanity factors like styling, prestige), I would easily put my Miata and WRX against much fancier German imports. Secondly, I have never found any VW product to handle particularly well. VW suspension design is geared too much toward comfort, too little suspension travel coupled with not enough roll stiffness in the stock suspension means that any serious driving should upgrade their suspension as their first mod.

Technology and engineering is useless if it's overly complicated for no reason, and overly complicated things impede reliability. I think the Japanese have better sense at designing an advanced engineered product without it breaking down....as a gross generalization.

Basically I used to be like you, I thought VW and Audi were the best, but since I've owned two of their products, I changed my mind. As far as BMW's are concerned, I like them, but they are severly overpriced. Mercedes product's are way below average in terms of reliability (a well known trend since Chrysler got involved)

[warpdrive]

i.e. Peugeot 206...


I dunno, I drove a Peugeot 206 and a 406 (separate trips to Europe), and they were pretty underwhelming. The gearshift was rubbery, and the car's weren't any more fun to drive than what Honda would give you for a similar price in a Civic or Accord.

[jahooligan]

why isn't the Toyota Camry up there. Camry would be a nice choice

[Menace]

Honda Accord!

In general, people don't care about the look of your car unless it is a $$$ car. As far as service goes, why do you have to go to the dealers? Sure, for warranty...etc, it's only the major services you need to go within the warranty period of 3 years, not for oil change. Bad salespeople? go to see Mohamed of Carhelpcanada ($50 membership), he knows some great dealers.

[akito925]

i've narrowed the list of cars down to

VW Passat (1.8 turbo) vs. Mazda 6, Honda Accord Coupe and Nissan Altima.

Which would you choose and why?

Keep in mind I am comparing the VW Passat 1.8 Turbo with the 6 cylinder from the japs.

Which one offers best value and why?

I'd say lease the vw passsat, and mazda 6, everyoney drives the honda and nissan.. lol

[akito925]

German engineering will smoke any japanese import of the same hp any day. Reliability reports are generalizations that may not hold true for you. All cars in the long run will have to be maintained and repaired. The difference is whether the maintenance is done at the right intervals. Since German engineering is more superior, they tend to push the car a little harder, which means the maintenance must be done at the time specified and would be less forgiving if you are late.

I'd pick a german car over any japanese import any day. VW is as good a place to start as any german manufacturer.

You should also be able to get a good deal from VW on the Passat. The current generation of VW is being discontinued (new model look coming out soon) so lots of dealers are starting to clear out their inventory to prepare for MK V.
i dunno where your getting your facts, but for the japanese cars, they put pretty much good technolgy into their cars like a nissan skyline?? now thats hp with fuel effecency!!

[Qube]

You HAD to bait people into a flame war, didn't you?

I'm a VW loyalist, but I'm not going to jump into the fray.

From a simplistic consumer point of view...

The Mazda6 gives you more bang for the buck than the Passat or Altima.
The Passat has better interior trimming than either of them.
The Altima is getting better, that's all I can say.
If you tweak and tune, you'll fall in love with the 1.8T on the Passat.

Regarding VWs... Unless you are going for the upper echleons (VR6, Wolfsburg, TDI, 1.8T), don't bother. For example, don't go for a low trim level VW (CL/GL for example). You'll get much better value elsewhere. Prime example is I'd rather shop for a Mazda3 Sport than a Golf GL 2.0. VW raised the bar in interior comfort when then moved to the Passat B4 platform (subsequently Golf/Jetta as well). Then they raised the prices :( Again, from a simplistic consumer view. Of course, I'm waiting for a late model Cabrio to purchase myself ;)

That's all the opinions I have.

[actng]

but you're still comparing sports cars with "normal" cars! The price:practicality of a miata can't be compared with the Golf platform. It's like me taking a SL55 and saying that it's better than the new 180hp Corolla. Of course it is!

As for the WRX, it's a subaru. It's a barebones car. Loud. Uncomfortable. Noisy. If you want to compare the WRX to a VW, consider the R32 and the TT. I'd say it fits somewhere in between the R32 and TT... closer to the R32.




That is kind of funny because I've owned VW and Audi (still own a Audi A4 1.8T, and owned a 1994 Corrado VR6), and I now own a Miata, and Subaru WRX which I've both used in Solo II events. I've topped out my Corrado at 235 km/h, and my Miata's Z rated tires are down to their wear bars after 20000 km of sprited driving. It's just funny that you assume I don't like driving. In terms of driving satisfaction (ignoring vanity factors like styling, prestige), I would easily put my Miata and WRX against much fancier German imports. Secondly, I have never found any VW product to handle particularly well. VW suspension design is geared too much toward comfort, too little suspension travel coupled with not enough roll stiffness in the stock suspension means that any serious driving should upgrade their suspension as their first mod.

Technology and engineering is useless if it's overly complicated for no reason, and overly complicated things impede reliability. I think the Japanese have better sense at designing an advanced engineered product without it breaking down....as a gross generalization.

Basically I used to be like you, I thought VW and Audi were the best, but since I've owned two of their products, I changed my mind. As far as BMW's are concerned, I like them, but they are severly overpriced. Mercedes product's are way below average in terms of reliability (a well known trend since Chrysler got involved)

[actng]

You HAD to bait people into a flame war, didn't you?

I just realized who started the post. I wouldn't have responded if I knew it was cummer stirring ***** up again.

[warpdrive]

but you're still comparing sports cars with "normal" cars! The price:practicality of a miata can't be compared with the Golf platform. It's like me taking a SL55 and saying that it's better than the new 180hp Corolla. Of course it is!

As for the WRX, it's a subaru. It's a barebones car. Loud. Uncomfortable. Noisy. If you want to compare the WRX to a VW, consider the R32 and the TT. I'd say it fits somewhere in between the R32 and TT... closer to the R32.

Why do you want to compare a Subaru to a TT? The Subaru is directly comparable to my own A4 if anything. The interior room, overall size, four doors, true full time AWD (not Haldex), sedan configuration. My Subaru is plenty comfortable, barely noisier than my Audi A4 1.8T at 70 mph. The sport seats are far superior in long distance comfort over my A4's Recaro made sport seats. The suspension is stiffer, but it's far more fun to drive also.

*IF* I didn't own two VW/Audi products in the past, I might have believed you, but I've heard this tirade before (German engineering being better blah blah), but there is very little sustance behind it.

Any true car enthusiast would understand that good and advanced engineering is not unique to German cars. To say so is pretty ridiculous.

[junkheap]

Just go to www.alldata.com and check out the service bulletins for each car to help you decide. Ive owned a mazda, honda, jeep, ford. Mazdas being the most fun to drive, honda being the most reliable, with the ford the least. The jeee(TJ), was extremely realiable as well, but those things are pretty much bulletproof. If i were to choose, i would pick the mazda honestly. I think it looks the best, as realiable as the others so far and i think its the cheapest.

My friends dad bought a 6(2.3L, with the wheels) recently, this was just before the 3 came out by a couple of months, and said the 6 was cheaper by far(than a simialr equipped 4 cyl honda)

Again if it helps you decide go to alldata.com

[cummer]

I just realized who started the post. I wouldn't have responded if I knew it was cummer stirring ***** up again.


i ask a question and once again i'm being blamed for stirring sh1t up????? What's up with you people. I ask a simple question and now suddently it my fault?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? WTF

[actng]

What're you doing back here anyway? When the mods banned you, you were all bitter and complaining about being banned and then said you don't need RFD and don't want to come back...



i ask a question and once again i'm being blamed for stirring sh1t up????? What's up with you people. I ask a simple question and now suddently it my fault?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? WTF

[Evil Techie]

hey hey
lets not bicker about the past

ppl do get heated when talking about things they are really into

id say that all of these 4 cars are pretty different
in terms of packaging, styles and the the engineering

accord coupe is a coupe
how is it suppose to be compared to Passat as a full size sedan?

perhaps read car & driver and check out their shoot out

[Jovi]

CR rates all VW's below average or well below average for reliability.